Will The Actual Calvinists Here Please Stand Up?

[bluejean_bible]

This is not unidirectional; both sides of this debate tend to be dismissive of the other side.

Not everyone on CC does this, but it's a topic which, in a general sense, is accompanied by a fair amount of animosity.

.

Not all are like that,agreed. My remarks addressed those who are of that mindset.

 

[Aaron56]

What would they call you?

Child of God, dear one, brother, saint, elder, or any other greeting they used in their epistles.

 

[Mem]

My post was clear and able to be understood by those of a mind.
I believe you are still confused. You have my sympathies and prayers.

How nice of you.

 

[Magenta]

Someone is able to be knowledgeable about a doctrine without ascribing to the doctrine.

I think you mean subscribe. If it were not true, nobody would be able to explain or understand error, such as with Catholicism.

A Calvinist here used to call me a free willer because I could explain Arminianism, and so did on occasion.

But I can and also do explain Calvinism on occasion. Just as I can and do explain Molinism on occasion.

Knowing where other major sects and isms stand can be helpful in defining your own stance, in seeing the differences.

What is unfortunate is in how others mislabel people. For instance, I do not believe the natural man has free will, and I do not believe the Bible teaches that the natural man does have a will that is free when he is said to be captive to the will of the devil and a slave to sin. It is Jesus Who sets us free of this. But because I believe that, right away some people jump to saying I believe people are bots. LOL. I can speak to someone for months about this and they will still say, but you claim people don't have a choice. Eh? I have never said any such thing. People make choices out of their nature. And someone who considers himself a pretty great teacher immediately accused me of blaspheming God by ascribing hatred of humanity to Him. I have no idea where he got that idea. My every post proclaims God's love. There seem to be a lot of cookie-cutter Christians here, which is unfortunate. People who have no way of distinguishing between the natural man and the spiritual man. The egregious error they make is ascribing to the natural man qualities and abilities only the spiritual man possesses. But they cannot even see that they do this. They are actually Pelagians, and to hold to their beliefs they must deny a lot of what the Bible actually says about humanity. They will then call those they disagree with, Calvinists... whether they are, or are not.

 

[bluejean_bible]

I think you mean subscribe. If it were not true, nobody would be able to explain or understand error, such as with Catholicism.

A Calvinist here used to call me a free willer because I could explain Arminianism, and so did on occasion.

But I can and also do explain Calvinism on occasion. Just as I can and do explain Molinism on occasion.

Knowing where other major sects and isms stand can be helpful in defining your own stance, in seeing the differences.

What is unfortunate is in how others mislabel people. For instance, I do not believe the natural man has free will, and I do not believe the Bible teaches that the natural man does have a will that is free when he is said to be captive to the will of the devil and a slave to sin. It is Jesus Who sets us free of this. But because I believe that, right away some people jump to saying I believe people are bots. LOL. I can speak to someone for months about this and they will still say, but you claim people don't have a choice. Eh? I have never said any such thing. People make choices out of their nature. And someone who considers himself a pretty great teacher immediately accused me of blaspheming God by ascribing hatred of humanity to Him. I have no idea where he got that idea. My every post proclaims God's love. There seem to be a lot of cookie-cutter Christians here, which is unfortunate. People who have no way of distinguishing between the natural man and the spiritual man. The egregious error they make is ascribing to the natural man qualities and abilities only the spiritual man possesses. But they cannot even see that they do this. They are actually Pelagians, and to hold to their beliefs they must deny a lot of what the Bible actually says about humanity. They will then call those they disagree with, Calvinists... whether they are, or are not.

No, I meant what I said. Thanks.

 

[Magenta]

No, I meant what I said. Thanks.

as·cribe
attribute something to
Ascribe means to attribute a quality or a characteristic to someone or something.

sub·scribe
express or feel agreement with
Subscribe means to formally agree to be part of something.

Your sentence is then an incomplete idea.

Someone is able to be knowledgeable about a doctrine without ascribing to the doctrine.

What are they ascribing to the doctrine?

 

[PaulThomson]

Even as a newish member here I can't miss how some people's Bible point of view can be dismissed by someone else as being Calvinist.

It's the C word that some appear to think if invoked completely eliminates a person's point of view.

So I got to thinking. I wondered how many here are actually Calvinist? Or,would they even admit it what with the levels of animosity that surrounds just the implication of being one.

So, a poll arrives. Anonymity follows your selection of poll answers. Just as a way to find out if John's teachings are about in our community. Or,if the label of Calvinist is something else.

Thank you for your participation, if you choose to answer.

Anyone who quotes some theological authority other than the scripture itself to prove their theological claims, has a team and has not heard the the Bible and Holy Spirit teach them directly. They are to some degree a sectarian, an X-ist or X-ian.

 

[Gideon300]

I actually see his point:

The disciples were first called Christians in Antioch. That word was only used by Peter and by Luke in Acts. Peter uses the word to write this: "Yet if anyone suffers as a Christian, let him not be ashamed, but let him glorify God in this matter." which I understand to mean "Even if they disparage you by calling you Christian, rejoice because they associate you with Him". Then, Luke recounts the use of ”Christian” by King Agrippa, the last Herodian ruler, in his conversation with Paul.

It wasn’t until the 2nd century that the church, fully ensconced in Roman tradition, began using the term to describe themselves.

In the scriptures, we are called “sons of God”, "Children of God", "believers", "saints", etc. In none of the epistle greetings do the writers refer to the readers as "Christians". We are children of God. It is the only identity that signifies our lineage, standard of living, and birthright. We are made sons in Christ. We are not merely “followers of Christ” or “little Christs” according to the Roman tradition. We are His body: the flesh and bones of the only Begotten of the Father.

So no, because of the way I see it, "Christian" does not work for me. That’s why I do not call myself a Christian. There’s pretty good evidence that if Paul, Peter, or John wrote a letter to me, they wouldn’t call me a Christian either.

Do a word search. The word Christian is used 427 times. It is not in the negative either. The word Christian is helpful. "Believer" is all very well, but believer in what? The Greek word "Christianos" literally means "follower of Christ". It was commonplace in Paul's day, and Paul used the word routinely in the epistles. Do as you please, but Paul most certainly would have called you a Christian.

As an aside, a messianic Jew I follow does not call himself a Christian. I have no less respect for him. "Christos" is simply Greek for "anointed" which is the meaning of Messiah.

I don't know what evidence you have against the early church use of the word Christian. I use the Bible myself. I find nothing there to support your claims. Sure other terms are used. That does not invalidate "Christian".

 

[Magenta]

Do a word search. The word Christian is used 427 times. It is not in the negative either. The word Christian is helpful. "Believer" is all very well, but believer in what? The Greek word "Christianos" literally means "follower of Christ". It was commonplace in Paul's day, and Paul used the word routinely in the epistles. Do as you please, but Paul most certainly would have called you a Christian.

Not sure where you are getting all that. When I look it up, it says Christian is used 3 times and never by Paul.

Acts 11:26, Acts 26:28, and 1 Peter 4:16 <= in a few minutes the Logos software will kick
in and you can hover over the links that will be inserted to see the verses involved.

 

[bluejean_bible]

as·cribe
attribute something to
Ascribe means to attribute a quality or a characteristic to someone or something.

sub·scribe
express or feel agreement with
Subscribe means to formally agree to be part of something.

Your sentence is then an incomplete idea.

Incorrect.
Ascribing to a doctrine means attributing or accepting a set of beliefs or principles that are part of a particular system of thought or teaching. It involves recognizing and adhering to the ideas established by that doctrine.

What are they ascribing to the doctrine?

This might assist your understanding so to realize my observation was correctly worded. If not,so be it.
Does the Catholic Church believe in or ascribe to the doctrine of the inerrancy of scripture?


https://www.quora.com/Does-the-Cath...to-the-doctrine-of-the-inerrancy-of-scripture

 

[Magenta]

Incorrect.
Ascribing to a doctrine means attributing or accepting a set of beliefs or principles that are part of a particular
system of thought or teaching. It involves recognizing and adhering to the ideas established by that doctrine.

That is subscribe. I already gave the definitions in post #46.

 

[bluejean_bible]

That is subscribe. I already gave the definitions in post #46.

I did see that.
As I said, I posted what I intended to say and it was correct.

I wish you the best.

 

[Magenta]

I did see that.
As I said, I posted what I intended to say and it was correct.

I wish you the best.

I will ascribe to you reluctance to admit when you are wrong.

You may have intended to say it but that does not make it right.

But I understand. You have been found to be wrong more than once in one day in the same
thread by the same person. It's a bad look for you and you do not wish to subscribe to it.

 

[bluejean_bible]

I will ascribe to you reluctance to admit when you are wrong.

You may have intended to say it but that does not make it right.


But I understand. You have been found to be wrong more than once in one day in the same
thread by the same person. It's a bad look for you and you do not wish to subscribe to it.

You're wrong again.

You give a bad look for what calls itself Christian.
And yet what you really are shows itself. It takes just a very little push to make the mask fall.

 

[Magenta]

You're wrong again.

You give a bad look for what calls itself Christian.
And yet what you really are shows itself. It takes just a very little push to make the mask fall.

I am sorry you feel that way. I will leave you with your bitterness.

 

[bluejean_bible]

I am sorry you feel that way. I will leave you with your bitterness.

The bitterness is all you my dear.

I wished you the best,and you attacked me repeatedly.

Don't project your personality on others. It's a bad look.

 

[Magenta]

The bitterness is all you my dear.

I wished you the best,and you attacked me repeatedly.

Don't project your personality on others. It's a bad look.

Telling you the truth is not attacking you. Your refusal to admit the truth is just sad.

Then you resort to lying. It is a bad look for sure. Shame on you.

But I will not respond further. You love your lie too much to be moved from it.

 

[Blade]

Why divide... maybe just stand up for the king of kings lord of lords the one that came in the flesh died for the worlds sin was buried rose the 3rd day is seated at the right hand of the Father the only way to the Father.

We need to get over it there is only one vine and many branches. We are one family. So unless something touches salvation. There are so many *.ism.. I don't like them..

This has nothing to do with this.. I have to I was typing this when this song played that I have never heard "Show me where you were" By Lanely Rene.. I know know that you were with me..

Hes always there always when you need Him.. fighting something (spiritual) I said I really need you.. and He said "you can do all things through Christ who strengthens you". So many times we ask for help yet we forget He already gave it.

Speak words of life to each other. I mean who do you think your really speaking to? Christ is in them just like He is in you. Just a thought

 

[Magenta]

Why divide... maybe just stand up for the king of kings lord of lords the one that came in the flesh died for the worlds sin was buried rose the 3rd day is seated at the right hand of the Father the only way to the Father.

We need to get over it there is only one vine and many branches. We are one family. So unless something touches salvation. There are so many *.ism.. I don't like them..

This has nothing to do with this.. I have to I was typing this when this song played that I have never heard "Show me where you were" By Lanely Rene.. I know know that you were with me..

Hes always there always when you need Him.. fighting something (spiritual) I said I really need you.. and He said "you can do all things through Christ who strengthens you". So many times we ask for help yet we forget He already gave it.

Speak words of life to each other. I mean who do you think your really speaking to? Christ is in them just like He is in you. Just a thought

People do not like Calvinism because it teaches that God does not offer salvation to everyone, but
then He will eternally punish those who do not choose it, even when it was never offered to them.
It does seem a fatal flaw in the ism...

 

[GWH]

Child of God, dear one, brother, saint, elder, or any other greeting they used in their epistles.

Which would include follower of Christ = Christian. (See Gideon's post #48.)