Did God plan for man to fall to prove something to Satan and his angels?
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But the verse in the bible that uses the word "foreordained" is this one:
“He indeed was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you” (1Pe 1:20 NKJV)
That means far more than God the Father merely knowing in advance that He would send His only begotten Son (the "He" in the verse I quoted) into the world. In that verse, "foreordained" says nothing about our wrong choice, but about the plan of the Father to send His Son.
“He indeed was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you” (1Pe 1:20 NKJV)
That means far more than God the Father merely knowing in advance that He would send His only begotten Son (the "He" in the verse I quoted) into the world. In that verse, "foreordained" says nothing about our wrong choice, but about the plan of the Father to send His Son.
You dont know then, its the word proginōskō {
Barnes writes:
Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world - That is, it was foreordained, or predetermined, that he should be the great stoning Sacrifice for sin. On the meaning of the word "foreordained," (προγινώσκω proginōskō,) see Romans 8:29. The word is rendered which knew, Acts 26:5; foreknew and foreknow, Romans 8:29; Romans 11:2; foreordained, 1 Peter 1:20; and know before, 2 Peter 2:17. It does not elsewhere occur in the New Testament. The sense is, that the plan was formed, and the arrangements made for the atonement, before the world was created.
- to have knowledge before hand
- to foreknow
- of those whom God elected to salvation
- to predestinate
Barnes writes:
Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world - That is, it was foreordained, or predetermined, that he should be the great stoning Sacrifice for sin. On the meaning of the word "foreordained," (προγινώσκω proginōskō,) see Romans 8:29. The word is rendered which knew, Acts 26:5; foreknew and foreknow, Romans 8:29; Romans 11:2; foreordained, 1 Peter 1:20; and know before, 2 Peter 2:17. It does not elsewhere occur in the New Testament. The sense is, that the plan was formed, and the arrangements made for the atonement, before the world was created.
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God to this day has not stopped loving us all, amazing, time to respond ion thanksgiving and praise and see new, not to harm anyone else ever again for any reason to do that as we all have in past.
Belief is not saved, it is on the way to receive the Faith of God that will not deny God, no matter what problems happen to them. Can we be content in troubles or just the good going on? not wanting troubles
Faith of God, that is given to anyone that does not deny God, no matter what happens to them, is the gift of sincerity, contentment in humility, growing up in the done work of Son for everyone, Hebrews 5:12-Chapter 6
A good example to me is the book of Job, and deeper in Jesus who went willingly without a flesh fight back to save us, might be time to be sincerely thankful to God Father for this gift and then respond, and stop creating as if are God
deny flesh nature, and stand in trust to God Father and Son as won (One), for it is done to be new in trust to God, to me at least
Thanks
I have no desire to argue this premise.
You either get it.
Or, you don't
Belief is not saved, it is on the way to receive the Faith of God that will not deny God, no matter what problems happen to them. Can we be content in troubles or just the good going on? not wanting troubles
Faith of God, that is given to anyone that does not deny God, no matter what happens to them, is the gift of sincerity, contentment in humility, growing up in the done work of Son for everyone, Hebrews 5:12-Chapter 6
A good example to me is the book of Job, and deeper in Jesus who went willingly without a flesh fight back to save us, might be time to be sincerely thankful to God Father for this gift and then respond, and stop creating as if are God
deny flesh nature, and stand in trust to God Father and Son as won (One), for it is done to be new in trust to God, to me at least
Thanks
I have no desire to argue this premise.
You either get it.
Or, you don't
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If Adam was the figure of him to come then the fall would have had to have been with Adam and Eve and not their seed after them.
Scripture says that Adam wasn't deceived which means he gave up his life not only for Eve,but for all of humanity.
That's a foreshadowing of Jesus.The fact that Adam died and Jesus rose up also points to what happen to Jesus on the cross.The first Adam died and he rose up on the cross.
The reason God planned this is because unless a seed falls unto the ground and dies it cannot bare much fruit.
Romans 5:14
Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
1 Timothy 2:14
And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
All things both seen and unseen are held together through the Spirit,Water,and the Blood.
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Think of it like God planting a garden because scripture also does.You can find verses relating to people like trees,fruits, and seeds.
John 12:24
Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.
Scripture says that Adam wasn't deceived which means he gave up his life not only for Eve,but for all of humanity.
That's a foreshadowing of Jesus.The fact that Adam died and Jesus rose up also points to what happen to Jesus on the cross.The first Adam died and he rose up on the cross.
The reason God planned this is because unless a seed falls unto the ground and dies it cannot bare much fruit.
Romans 5:14
Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
1 Timothy 2:14
And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
All things both seen and unseen are held together through the Spirit,Water,and the Blood.
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Think of it like God planting a garden because scripture also does.You can find verses relating to people like trees,fruits, and seeds.
John 12:24
Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.
This is his universal decision
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16 KJV
And this always has been his decision regarding mankind
“Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.”
Ecclesiastes 12:13-
his decision doesn’t eliminate ours his decision is what gives us a choice. If Jesus hadn’t came and died and rose no one would have a choice we’d all be condemned . Now we can accept and believe the gospel and be saved and live forever
his decisions are the ones he spoke forth in the gospel …..he’s told us the truth that can save us but sometimes people dont want to hear it when we reject him for a time he will find those who are willing
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16 KJV
And this always has been his decision regarding mankind
“Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.”
Ecclesiastes 12:13-
his decision doesn’t eliminate ours his decision is what gives us a choice. If Jesus hadn’t came and died and rose no one would have a choice we’d all be condemned . Now we can accept and believe the gospel and be saved and live forever
his decisions are the ones he spoke forth in the gospel …..he’s told us the truth that can save us but sometimes people dont want to hear it when we reject him for a time he will find those who are willing
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Gods Will is for Adam to sin ?
“And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.”
Genesis 2:16-17 KJV
is this gods will for man too ?
“And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.”
Genesis 6:5-6
Let me understand this God creates mankind and blesses them , gives them the earth to rule says it’s all very good commands man not to eat the forbidden fruit .
then he blames mankind for corrupting the earth and cursing it , decides to eventually destroy them all except 8 people again blaming them for all this that’s apparently his Will …..
then he ruins everything and blames mankind and says “ I repent for even creating mankind on the earth because they’ve corrupted the earth with thier wickedness ….
You know whose will it actually is that mankind sins and dies ? The one lying about the fruit
“And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: for God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.”
Genesis 3:4-5 KJV
mankind had two options to believe me what God said “ don’t eat that fruit you’ll surely die ! “ and what Satan said “ that fruit won’t hurt you ot will make you as gods “
Gods Will isnt for mankind to sin satans Will is for mankind to sin we are not n between good and evil have to choose Gods decisions are all written down in the Bible the gospel specifically
the decision isn’t “ you don’t need to do anything “ it’s “ preach the gospel to everyone …whoever believes the gospel and is baptized shall be saved … whoever doesn’t believe the gospel shall be damned
each choice leads to a certain result
It’s always been the same choice life and death that’s gods decision those things he teaches us in the Bible we’re meant to hear and learn and accept them and follow where they lead us
“And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.”
Genesis 2:16-17 KJV
is this gods will for man too ?
“And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.”
Genesis 6:5-6
Let me understand this God creates mankind and blesses them , gives them the earth to rule says it’s all very good commands man not to eat the forbidden fruit .
then he blames mankind for corrupting the earth and cursing it , decides to eventually destroy them all except 8 people again blaming them for all this that’s apparently his Will …..
then he ruins everything and blames mankind and says “ I repent for even creating mankind on the earth because they’ve corrupted the earth with thier wickedness ….
You know whose will it actually is that mankind sins and dies ? The one lying about the fruit
“And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: for God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.”
Genesis 3:4-5 KJV
mankind had two options to believe me what God said “ don’t eat that fruit you’ll surely die ! “ and what Satan said “ that fruit won’t hurt you ot will make you as gods “
Gods Will isnt for mankind to sin satans Will is for mankind to sin we are not n between good and evil have to choose Gods decisions are all written down in the Bible the gospel specifically
the decision isn’t “ you don’t need to do anything “ it’s “ preach the gospel to everyone …whoever believes the gospel and is baptized shall be saved … whoever doesn’t believe the gospel shall be damned
each choice leads to a certain result
It’s always been the same choice life and death that’s gods decision those things he teaches us in the Bible we’re meant to hear and learn and accept them and follow where they lead us
It was God's purpose, that God would use his omniscience in knowing Adam would sin.
God did not create Adam to sin.
God created Adam knowing he could sin, and caused Adam to exist for a time that suited God's plan.
God did not create Adam to sin. God created Adam able to sin.
Jesus was the second Adam and he did not sin.
If Adam had the sense to cry out to the Lord when the serpent was tempting Eve?
God would have helped Adam not to sin.
Jesus was always crying out to the Father when tempted.
I need to clarify this for the heretical notion that God created man to sin.
God created man with free will.
As a result of free will?
Able to sin.
grace and peace .................
God did not create Adam to sin.
God created Adam knowing he could sin, and caused Adam to exist for a time that suited God's plan.
God did not create Adam to sin. God created Adam able to sin.
Jesus was the second Adam and he did not sin.
If Adam had the sense to cry out to the Lord when the serpent was tempting Eve?
God would have helped Adam not to sin.
Jesus was always crying out to the Father when tempted.
I need to clarify this for the heretical notion that God created man to sin.
God created man with free will.
As a result of free will?
Able to sin.
grace and peace .................
I don't recall that being what Apostle Paul said in 1st Corinthians 2.
It isn't in keeping with what Jesus told his Disciples either. That part where and why he always taught his Gospel in parables.
If we're created separated from God due to our sinful human nature, how can we bridge that nature all by ourselves and choose Jesus?
It isn't in keeping with what Jesus told his Disciples either. That part where and why he always taught his Gospel in parables.
If we're created separated from God due to our sinful human nature, how can we bridge that nature all by ourselves and choose Jesus?
Please learn the right way to quote somebody, so that person can use the link to go back to the post you are quoting from,
and not have to search through the messsages to see what one you were citing from.
We all had to learn how at one point.
See the little arrow neaxt to your name? Click on please.
Thanks...
and not have to search through the messsages to see what one you were citing from.
We all had to learn how at one point.
See the little arrow neaxt to your name? Click on please.
Thanks...
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