Okay...I will bite.
How does Cameron143 know that his personal assurance is not a false assurance?
Assurance of Salvation
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How does Cameron143 know that his personal assurance is not a false assurance?
Read 1 John. It has 5 tests for whether one is saved or not. Hint: walking in the light is the first. Also, read Romans 8:16. God the Spirit confirms it personally.
I commend 2 books to you:
Experiencing God by Henry Blackaby
Joy Unspeakable by Martyn Lloyd-Jones
If they don't bless you I will reimburse the cost to you.
Assurance is in the words of Christ Jesus, not in oneself.
It is those who look to themselves who do not have true assurance.
Here is the verse:
Phil. 2:12
Therefore, my beloved, just as you have always been obedient when I am present, you must be so all the more now when I am absent, as you work out your salvation in fear and trembling.
What in the verbiage of this verse expresses that the person Paul is speaking to has his/her salvation guaranteed?
A simple reading of this verse would imply that the salvation mentioned has not been worked out.
First of all this IS A LETTER so there are no Chapters and Verses. That means this Verse 12 v continues in the same thought as the next Verse 13 that tells us that God is doing a work in us.
God only works to make people like Himself if they're saved.
So essentially as the Spirit of God instructs us and we learn to listen and obey as long as we're trying to do God's Will we're working out our salvation by learning what role God wants to use us towards the Body of Christ, how to become more like Christ, to hear God when He wants us to do something.
Whenever I feel impressed to give money to someone I can assure that is not my idea. But I will get this overwhelming feeling to give to someone and feel like when I give I am to say that God loves you.
But the kicker is I will even ask how much to give and a number just immediately comes to my mind.
So what actually took place was GOD wanted to bless someone and tell them that He loves them.
But it took me working out my salvation to hear God, understand what He wanted to do, and do it just as I felt Him tell me to do it.
Now had I ignored or refused I would be like the man with 1 talent and buried it not investing it back into the Kingdom of God.
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God. Ephesians 2:8
Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. Romans 10:9
“Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.” John 5:24
For “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” Romans 10:13
Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. Romans 10:9
“Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.” John 5:24
For “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” Romans 10:13
It does for me.
What it also tells me is that you know little, if anything, about true spirituality. Don't you want to experience the witness of the Spirit confirming to you that you are indeed a child of God?
There is much more to a relationship with God than you know. It's worth it to explore further.
What makes you any different from the multitude of others who falsely claim to be in a "relationship" with God?
Wait let me guess...because you say so.
Mormons are some of the most assured of their salvation as they come. Does that make it so?
I showed you from the word of God that assurance can be had and how. You may not believe that I have the witness of the Spirit, but you can't deny that it's possible to know without denying scripture.
Since my assurance is personal to me, I cannot prove that the Spirit witnessed with my spirit. I can, however, show you the difference between my claim of assurance with that of those in Matthew 7. Notice what they trusted in. First...Lord, Lord. They trusted first in their profession of faith. Second, they trusted in their works...did we not? I make no such assumptions; rather, I revealed to you what scripture teaches.
One thing is for sure: you have no assurance. So what are you actually trusting? It can't be the blood of Jesus Christ. If you did, you would know that it is sufficient. So what are you trusting in?
The sad part is that you squandered an opportunity to know God intimately. The resources I suggested are excellent.
A healthy Christian walk holds both assurance and reverence together. Scripture clearly teaches that believers can know they are saved — not because of what we’ve done, but because of what Christ has finished.
“These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life.” (1 John 5:13)
“He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation.” (John 5:24)
This is the confidence of the first group — resting in the finished work of Christ. We’re not saved by doing enough, but by trusting in the One who did it all (Ephesians 2:8–9).
Yet Scripture also calls us to live with a reverent fear — not fear of losing salvation, but fear of taking grace lightly.
“Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.” (Philippians 2:12)
“Pass the time of your sojourning here in fear.” (1 Peter 1:17)
That’s the heart of the second group — humility before a holy God, desiring to live worthy of His grace (Titus 2:11–12).So the truth isn’t either/or — it’s both.
A true believer can rest in full assurance of salvation through Christ, while still walking in reverence, gratitude, and obedience.
“Let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear.” (Hebrews 12:28)
Confidence without reverence breeds arrogance.Reverence without confidence breeds doubt.
But confidence in Christ and reverence before God—that’s biblical assurance.
Grace and peace in Him.
I can personally attest to the fact that the Mormons are by far the most assured group of people on the issue of their personal salvation and relationship with God.
I have worked with a number of them and I doubt that anyone here can match their sincerity and enthusiasm on this subject.
Ask any of their 20 year old bachelor "elders" and they will both prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that their relationship with God is both secure and that your relationship is "incomplete".
I think this whole true assurance vs. false assurance is lame. None of us can truly say that we know our ultimate fate. Only God knows this, we should be content knowing that Christians are assured and focus on working out our faith in fear and trembling.
This is enough for me to sleep at night.
I've had numerous conversations with RLDS and LDS folks who sound pretty confident about making it to one of the three glories in heaven: celestial, terrestrial, telestial. I even heard one LDS fellow say he is pretty confident he will make it to heaven, but he also said that he doesn't think he will make it any higher than the terrestrial glory. Pretty confident is still not absolutely certain. From what I know about Mormon beliefs, they do not believe in absolute, assurance of the highest form of salvation which is known as "exaltation," (which is the highest glory in heaven) and requires obedience/works in addition to grace which is not something a person can be completely certain of.
Now of course, 3 glories in heaven is a false doctrine. Joseph Smith altered 1 Corinthians 15:40.
KJV - There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
Joseph Smith's inspired version - Also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial, and bodies telestial; but the glory of the celestial, one; and the terrestrial, another; and the telestial, another.
Joseph Smith coined the word "telestial" and "added" it to 1 Corinthians 15:40 in order to come up with 3 glories in heaven.
Now celestial simply means "heavenly" and terrestrial simply means "earthly." There are heavenly bodies and earthly bodies, but the glory of the heavenly is of one kind, and the glory of the earthly is of another. (ESV)
I found that it's really tough to convince Mormons that they are lost and in need of salvation from Hell. If I understand them, they think everyone except the most reprehensible villains are going to one of the three Joseph smith glories. The other category of people going to wander about in their idea of outer darkness are those Mormons who leave the faith. This pressure keeps a lot from getting saved. Most, if I understand correctly, who leave Mormonism just become atheists/ agnostics instead of getting saved.
The other hurdle is that they don't consider their good works as Ephesians 2:9 works.
Their idea of discipleship is not defined in their thinking as works of righteousness.
Getting past these two problems leaves another. The Jesus of the Bible is not their Jesus the brother of Satan, one of the multitude of gods.
See post #34.
Romans 8:16 - The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God.
1 John 5:13 - These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.
Do you believe these verses above? If your faith rests solely in Jesus Christ for salvation, then you can have absolute assurance of salvation. To not have absolute assurance of salvation based on Jesus Christ and His finished work of redemption would be equivalent to saying that what Jesus Christ accomplished to save you was IN-sufficient. God forbid! If you are trusting in your works/imperfect obedience to save you "in addition" to trusting in Jesus Christ (at best for the most part) to save you then you could not have absolute assurance of salvation because you could never know for sure if you measured up and got a passing grade, based on the merits of your performance.
A Bible scholar with a background in Hebrew and Greek language studies pointed out an idiosyncrasy of Hebrews 1:2's wording that more precisely translates as 'Hath in these last days spoken unto us in Son..." as the idea with Son as a language. And, in learning to understand that 'language,' and so I can more perfectly understand the language of 1John5:20 and Rom 8:14-16.
Thank you for mentioning Blackaby's Experiencing God.
Years ago we used it for a man's study, picked it up a few years ago and read it again, realized He has done just about every one of the encounters mentioned in each page.
blessings!
Regardless of what you think about the validity of the Mormon faith, this is about their assurance in it.
Whatever Joseph Smith added to 1st Corinthians is moot, they believe it. Their assurance is extreme, well beyond most other groups and on par with Muslims.
They are both assured of the soundness in their ultimate outcome as well as yours if you do not convert.
Their mentality is no different than many posting here.