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Applying God's Word to Politics
- Thread starter GWH
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T
TruthDefender
Guest
I had never viewed leaven in connection with being slowly boiled, but I do now, so thanks for that Scripture!
(1Cor. 5:6, Gal. 5:9)
i vote primarily based off one policy and that is to end the killing of babies. Seems only one side supports ending it. And you do realize Trump only has three more years and he is out right? We have a constitution that says so.
T
TruthDefender
Guest
T
TruthDefender
Guest
Yes, and if politically apathetic people allow Marxists and Islamists to steal the blessings of political freedom and prosperity God gave them--a pox on their heads!
Like Esau who was apathetic about his blessing and so lost it (Heb. 12:16-17).
"For the choice he made, a price he paid, until he is set free."
Yes, but spiritually we are trying to preserve our birthright: the political rights/talents God has entrusted to us for stewardship on behalf of the world. I just watched a report on Fox News about an Iranian pastor in Tennessee who said the fastest growing church in the world is the underground Christian church in Iran.
Yes, IMO we need to kick Turkey out of NATO and replace it with Kurdistan.
I guess y'all are noticing that the new thread "A time for war" is on the topic of applying GW to politics.
What we need to be aware of is that the physical war with Iran is part of the spiritual war against the anti-Christ/Satan,
who has beachheads in NYC, CA and other atheist Democrat Party strongholds in the USA. Pray for victory!
What we need to be aware of is that the physical war with Iran is part of the spiritual war against the anti-Christ/Satan,
who has beachheads in NYC, CA and other atheist Democrat Party strongholds in the USA. Pray for victory!
War and Capital Punishment
We are saved by faith (EPH 2:8-9), but God’s grace is not cheap, so genuine saving faith is followed by good works (EPH 2:10, cf. JM 2:17). By cooperating with God’s Word = Holy Spirit (PHP 2:13) and rejecting evil desires (2TM 2:22), we can be a “good soldier of Christ Jesus” (2TM 2:3), spiritually trained and “equipped for every good work” (2TM 3:17). Speaking of being a soldier and good works leads us to address the following question: Is military soldiering a good work? Can we be both a good soldier of Christ and a military soldier?
The Bible does not condemn any occupation other than prostitution, and notice that Paul here (and Jesus in MT 8:5-13) spoke of soldiering without condemning it, and such silence speaks volumes! This silence leaves us with the freedom and consequent responsibility to evaluate vocations including soldiering. The most relevant scriptural references are RM 13:1-5 and 1PT 2:13-14. Pacifists cite Jesus’ command to turn the other cheek (in MT 5:39) and Paul’s instruction to overcome evil with good rather than seek revenge (in RM 12:17-21) as implying that policing and soldiering are wrong, but these passages refer to personal relationships rather than to governmental enforcement of criminal laws.
In the Romans passage, verses 3&4 are the key ones: “Rulers hold no terror [imprisonment or execution—a very contemporary term!] for those who do right, but for those who do wrong… the one in authority… is God’s servant to do you good [this eliminates rulers such as Hitler, Stalin and Saddam Hussein]. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword [means to kill] for nothing. He is God’s servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer [murderer, terrorist].” (By the way, “God’s servant” is what the word “Muslim” means.)
Similarly, 1PT 2:14 says that governors “are sent by [God] to punish those who do wrong and to commend those who do right.” This truth applies not only to police forces in cities and states but also to soldiers in national governments, implying that (more godly, though imperfect) nations should punish evil tyrants and terrorists.
Thus, soldiers who serve God’s will to fight in righteous or justified wars to defeat murderers are agents of His wrath (Muslims). Let us note that wrath does not mean a hateful fit of rage, but rather the loving action of righteous anger, such as that displayed by Jesus when he cleared the temple of money-changers (in MT 21:12-13). God’s wrath metes out the just or appropriate consequence for those who choose to behave evilly and hatefully. Thus, any killing or other violent actions we do should be motivated by love: love for God, for divine justice and for the victims of demonic injustice.
We wage war on three levels. Within our own hearts we seek to let God’s love and wisdom overcome temptations to be selfish and foolish (RM 7:23, 2CR 10:3-5, 1PT 2:11). On an interpersonal level, we must bear with one another in love, endeavoring to keep the unity and peace of the Holy Spirit (EPH 4:2-3) rather than be deceived by lies and attempts of the ungodly spirit to divide and conquer us (1CR 3:3, 2CR 12:20, GL 5:20). And on a corporate level, we must cooperate and enforce just laws, so that murderers are not allowed to destroy more righteous, though imperfect, people (EX 21:12, 21:23).
Because the Bible contains detailed instructions regarding the punishment of crimes such as murder, it is logical to assume that it would contain a commandment and specific teachings against war if pacifism were correct, but it does not. The OT principle of “life for life” (EX 21:24) indicates that murder is the capital crime for which execution is just, although the NT teaching about forgiveness for minor crimes (TOJ #29 & #36) implies that a society may grant even violent criminals a chance to hear the gospel, repent and be rehabilitated. Some say that capital punishment risks unjust executions, but this concern needs to be balanced with ensuring that a penal system does not encourage unjust murders. (See the essay on Criminal Justice.)
The justification of capital punishment can be applied on an international scale. Godly or civilized nations must cooperate and enforce just laws so that demonic souls like Hitler and Stalin are not allowed to conquer or destroy more righteous, though imperfect, governments. (See TOJ #30.) We have a responsibility as ministers of God and disciples of Christ to share the gospel with people in all nations (MT 28:19) and thereby help them to acquire their God-given rights to life (JN 10:10), liberty (JN 8:32&36) and the pursuit of happiness (JN 15:11). To the extent we are able, we should prevent murder and stop murderous dictators from killing and enslaving people (JM 4:17). As the world’s super-power, may God grant our leaders the courage to use this power with wisdom to show divine love (RM 5:8) for the poor and enslaved by defeating ungodly regimes (TOJ #45&129, RM 14:19).
As we contemplate the deaths of our soldiers and the sorrow of their families during times of military war, may it remind us of the great sacrifices that have been made by those who have gone before us in order to preserve the blessings of freedom for our country and humanity. And may their sacrifice remind us of the sacrifice of Christ (PHP 2:8), whose death one day will free us from the sinful nature that does evil and necessitates war against extremely evildoers, so that there will be “no more death or mourning or crying or pain” (RV 21:4). This recreation of the world is the meaning of Easter, and indeed the reason for the creation of the present universe in the beginning of time. May it begin in our hearts and be evidenced by our lives, to the glory of God.
One way to show divine love is by forgiving people who do wrong (MT 5:39). Another way is by teaching people not to do wrong (HB 12:5-6&11). And a third way is by imposing just consequences for doing wrong. For those who hurt people, confinement may be necessary, and for murderers execution is deserved (RM 13:4), although a society may decide that circumstances warrant extended confinement instead or even efforts to reform them.
The problem is deciding which type of love to apply to various situations, because we should have learned from the attempts by European nations to appease Hitler in the 1930s that war may become necessary, so resisting evil sooner may be less tragic and destructive of life than waiting until it becomes more widespread. By the grace of God the United States was able to acquire the atom bomb before Germany and Japan, but it may not have been necessary to lose so many lives in the invasion of Normandy and in the bombing of Japan if Europe had stopped Hitler before he became powerful and allied with Japan.
The lesson of Hitler’s Holocaust against the Jews and Christians is that evil is real, and that we all have the potential to be as horrible as Hitler, although we may battle the tendency toward hatred and selfishness in our own souls (RM 7:22-23). The death of relatively innocent people who are killed by terrorists continues to remind us of our mortality and our need for God’s goodness and resurrection power as well as of the vital responsibility that comes with our human moral capacity and free will. Paul wrote that we should “make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification” (RM 14:19, cf. EPH 4:29). Leading to peace includes both spiritual war to prevent Satan from conquering souls and physical war to prevent anti-Christ from conquering the world.
We are saved by faith (EPH 2:8-9), but God’s grace is not cheap, so genuine saving faith is followed by good works (EPH 2:10, cf. JM 2:17). By cooperating with God’s Word = Holy Spirit (PHP 2:13) and rejecting evil desires (2TM 2:22), we can be a “good soldier of Christ Jesus” (2TM 2:3), spiritually trained and “equipped for every good work” (2TM 3:17). Speaking of being a soldier and good works leads us to address the following question: Is military soldiering a good work? Can we be both a good soldier of Christ and a military soldier?
The Bible does not condemn any occupation other than prostitution, and notice that Paul here (and Jesus in MT 8:5-13) spoke of soldiering without condemning it, and such silence speaks volumes! This silence leaves us with the freedom and consequent responsibility to evaluate vocations including soldiering. The most relevant scriptural references are RM 13:1-5 and 1PT 2:13-14. Pacifists cite Jesus’ command to turn the other cheek (in MT 5:39) and Paul’s instruction to overcome evil with good rather than seek revenge (in RM 12:17-21) as implying that policing and soldiering are wrong, but these passages refer to personal relationships rather than to governmental enforcement of criminal laws.
In the Romans passage, verses 3&4 are the key ones: “Rulers hold no terror [imprisonment or execution—a very contemporary term!] for those who do right, but for those who do wrong… the one in authority… is God’s servant to do you good [this eliminates rulers such as Hitler, Stalin and Saddam Hussein]. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword [means to kill] for nothing. He is God’s servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer [murderer, terrorist].” (By the way, “God’s servant” is what the word “Muslim” means.)
Similarly, 1PT 2:14 says that governors “are sent by [God] to punish those who do wrong and to commend those who do right.” This truth applies not only to police forces in cities and states but also to soldiers in national governments, implying that (more godly, though imperfect) nations should punish evil tyrants and terrorists.
Thus, soldiers who serve God’s will to fight in righteous or justified wars to defeat murderers are agents of His wrath (Muslims). Let us note that wrath does not mean a hateful fit of rage, but rather the loving action of righteous anger, such as that displayed by Jesus when he cleared the temple of money-changers (in MT 21:12-13). God’s wrath metes out the just or appropriate consequence for those who choose to behave evilly and hatefully. Thus, any killing or other violent actions we do should be motivated by love: love for God, for divine justice and for the victims of demonic injustice.
We wage war on three levels. Within our own hearts we seek to let God’s love and wisdom overcome temptations to be selfish and foolish (RM 7:23, 2CR 10:3-5, 1PT 2:11). On an interpersonal level, we must bear with one another in love, endeavoring to keep the unity and peace of the Holy Spirit (EPH 4:2-3) rather than be deceived by lies and attempts of the ungodly spirit to divide and conquer us (1CR 3:3, 2CR 12:20, GL 5:20). And on a corporate level, we must cooperate and enforce just laws, so that murderers are not allowed to destroy more righteous, though imperfect, people (EX 21:12, 21:23).
Because the Bible contains detailed instructions regarding the punishment of crimes such as murder, it is logical to assume that it would contain a commandment and specific teachings against war if pacifism were correct, but it does not. The OT principle of “life for life” (EX 21:24) indicates that murder is the capital crime for which execution is just, although the NT teaching about forgiveness for minor crimes (TOJ #29 & #36) implies that a society may grant even violent criminals a chance to hear the gospel, repent and be rehabilitated. Some say that capital punishment risks unjust executions, but this concern needs to be balanced with ensuring that a penal system does not encourage unjust murders. (See the essay on Criminal Justice.)
The justification of capital punishment can be applied on an international scale. Godly or civilized nations must cooperate and enforce just laws so that demonic souls like Hitler and Stalin are not allowed to conquer or destroy more righteous, though imperfect, governments. (See TOJ #30.) We have a responsibility as ministers of God and disciples of Christ to share the gospel with people in all nations (MT 28:19) and thereby help them to acquire their God-given rights to life (JN 10:10), liberty (JN 8:32&36) and the pursuit of happiness (JN 15:11). To the extent we are able, we should prevent murder and stop murderous dictators from killing and enslaving people (JM 4:17). As the world’s super-power, may God grant our leaders the courage to use this power with wisdom to show divine love (RM 5:8) for the poor and enslaved by defeating ungodly regimes (TOJ #45&129, RM 14:19).
As we contemplate the deaths of our soldiers and the sorrow of their families during times of military war, may it remind us of the great sacrifices that have been made by those who have gone before us in order to preserve the blessings of freedom for our country and humanity. And may their sacrifice remind us of the sacrifice of Christ (PHP 2:8), whose death one day will free us from the sinful nature that does evil and necessitates war against extremely evildoers, so that there will be “no more death or mourning or crying or pain” (RV 21:4). This recreation of the world is the meaning of Easter, and indeed the reason for the creation of the present universe in the beginning of time. May it begin in our hearts and be evidenced by our lives, to the glory of God.
One way to show divine love is by forgiving people who do wrong (MT 5:39). Another way is by teaching people not to do wrong (HB 12:5-6&11). And a third way is by imposing just consequences for doing wrong. For those who hurt people, confinement may be necessary, and for murderers execution is deserved (RM 13:4), although a society may decide that circumstances warrant extended confinement instead or even efforts to reform them.
The problem is deciding which type of love to apply to various situations, because we should have learned from the attempts by European nations to appease Hitler in the 1930s that war may become necessary, so resisting evil sooner may be less tragic and destructive of life than waiting until it becomes more widespread. By the grace of God the United States was able to acquire the atom bomb before Germany and Japan, but it may not have been necessary to lose so many lives in the invasion of Normandy and in the bombing of Japan if Europe had stopped Hitler before he became powerful and allied with Japan.
The lesson of Hitler’s Holocaust against the Jews and Christians is that evil is real, and that we all have the potential to be as horrible as Hitler, although we may battle the tendency toward hatred and selfishness in our own souls (RM 7:22-23). The death of relatively innocent people who are killed by terrorists continues to remind us of our mortality and our need for God’s goodness and resurrection power as well as of the vital responsibility that comes with our human moral capacity and free will. Paul wrote that we should “make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification” (RM 14:19, cf. EPH 4:29). Leading to peace includes both spiritual war to prevent Satan from conquering souls and physical war to prevent anti-Christ from conquering the world.
T
TruthDefender
Guest
“Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God.
Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves.
For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority?
Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same. For he is God’s minister to you for good.
But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God’s minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil.
Therefore you must be subject, not only because of wrath but also for conscience’ sake.”
Romans 13:1-5 NKJV
Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves.
For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority?
Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same. For he is God’s minister to you for good.
But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God’s minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil.
Therefore you must be subject, not only because of wrath but also for conscience’ sake.”
Romans 13:1-5 NKJV
Not sure if your post was meant for me, but of course I completely agree, having said in my post:
"In the Romans 13, verses 3&4 are the key ones: "Rulers hold no terror [imprisonment or execution—a very contemporary term!] for those who do right, but for those who do wrong… the one in authority… is God’s servant to do you good [this eliminates rulers such as Hitler, Stalin and Saddam Hussein]. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword [means to kill] for nothing. He is God’s servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer [murderer, terrorist]."
"Similarly, 1Pet. 2:14 says that governors “are sent by [God] to punish those who do wrong and to commend those who do right.” This truth applies not only to police forces in cities and states but also to soldiers in national governments, implying that (more godly, though imperfect) nations should punish evil tyrants and terrorists."
In the TOP thread it is #66:
TOP #66: Governments or rulers that are not tyrannical toward right-doers are ordained by God to punish wrongdoers and should be obeyed. [Rom. 13:1-5, Tit. 3:1] Those who stop reading the Romans passage at verse two might misinterpret what it means. The reason for obedience should not only be fear of punishment but also because it is morally right.