Temporary judgment vs eternal judgment

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wattie

Senior Member
Feb 24, 2009
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New Zealand
There are two kinds of discipline/judgment people face.

One is temporal.. where a believer will reap consequences for their sin.

Then eternal judgment for whether are person is justified by Jesus or not.

These get mixed together by many, with people confusing God's discipline for a believer with eternal judgment. So a failing believer is said to lose eternal life, because they see discipline verses in the Bible.

When context is read properly, you can see believers don't suffer the consequence of hell (eternal judgment in hell)..but do face discipline (temporal judgment on earth).
 
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There are two kinds of discipline/judgment people face.

One is temporal.. where a believer will reap consequences for their sin.

Then eternal judgment for whether are person is justified by Jesus or not.

These get mixed together by many, with people confusing God's discipline for a believer with eternal judgment. So a failing believer is said to lose eternal life, because they see discipline verses in the Bible.

When context is read properly, you can see believers don't suffer the consequence of hell (eternal judgment in hell)..but do face discipline (temporal judgment on earth).


If they repent.


🕊
 
There are two kinds of discipline/judgment people face.

One is temporal.. where a believer will reap consequences for their sin.

Then eternal judgment for whether are person is justified by Jesus or not.

These get mixed together by many, with people confusing God's discipline for a believer with eternal judgment. So a failing believer is said to lose eternal life, because they see discipline verses in the Bible.

When context is read properly, you can see believers don't suffer the consequence of hell (eternal judgment in hell)..but do face discipline (temporal judgment on earth).
There are millions of people that confess Jesus but do not believe they can abstain from sin.

If they say they cannot abstain from sin they are holding on to sin.

In that situation they will not be punished for their sins on earth but have eternal life because they will not let go of the flesh.

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

If a person holds on to sin the blood of Christ cannot wash it away.

Some people do not believe a person can fall away once they are saved.

But the Bible says it can happen and warns against it.

2Pe 2:20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
2Pe 2:21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
2Pe 2:22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

These people were saved because they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

And knew the way of righteousness.

They had an understanding to turn away from sins but they went back to the ways of the world.

Which it would have been better if they had not known the way of righteousness than to turn from it.

But this is correctable.

2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

When we repent of our sins and confess Christ we are to turn away from sins and allow the Spirit to lead us to abstain from sins.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

2Ti 3:4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
2Ti 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Some people do not come to the truth and love sin more than God.

These people did not come to the understanding to abstain from sin led by the Spirit.

They would not let go of the flesh.

That is why Jesus said He never knew them.

And they were ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

They were not saved and then went back to sin but they were not saved at all.

Because they did not have the understanding about repentance from the start.

Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

These people were saved for they were enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, and have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come.

But they fell away.

This falling away is not accepting Jesus but going back to sin because it says they cannot renew themselves again which they cannot be saved again.

Which means they lost salvation by believing an alternate reality whether atheist, another religion, or stopped believing Jesus is Lord and Savior.

If they do that they cannot come back to salvation for God will not permit it.

This is not correctable.

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
1Ti 4:2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron.

2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

The time will come that people will not want to hear the truth of the Bible but want to hear it according to the new age.

An example is this the new age movement that interprets the Bible and religions according to the occult and evolution, and people are going to evolve to be spiritual, and greater, and Jesus became an ascended master among others, and there is no personal God, but they honor the God of forces the power of the Cosmos, and the New Age Christ is the next world teacher.

Which some shall depart from the faith and follow a different reality of the Bible that there is no personal God and Jesus is not Lord and Savior.

These people cannot come back to salvation.

But if a person that is in the new age that has not acknowledged the truth but comes to the truth they can be saved.

But if they go back to the new age they cannot be saved again.

Rom 11:20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

Heb 3:12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
Heb 3:13 But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.

Heb 10:38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
Heb 10:39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

And other places that warn the saints they can lose salvation if they do not do what is right.

1Co 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

Gal 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

1Jn 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

1Co 13:5 thinketh no evil;
1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth.

Charity, love in action, is greater than faith.

And faith works by love.

So if there is no love then faith is void.

Which charity does not think an evil thought.

And does not rejoice in iniquity but rejoices in the truth to hate sin allowing the Spirit to lead them to abstain from sin.

People who hold on to sin that is not love then there is no salvation.

A person that is saved can lose salvation if they do not abide in the truth they once accepted.

Having an understanding of repentance for that is the way to be saved.

Some Churches say they cannot abstain from sin so the people do not get saved not having the understanding of repentance.

Which they have a form of godliness but do not allow the Spirit to lead them and love sin more than God.
 
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There are two kinds of discipline/judgment people face.

One is temporal.. where a believer will reap consequences for their sin.

Then eternal judgment for whether are person is justified by Jesus or not.

These get mixed together by many, with people confusing God's discipline for a believer with eternal judgment. So a failing believer is said to lose eternal life, because they see discipline verses in the Bible.

When context is read properly, you can see believers don't suffer the consequence of hell (eternal judgment in hell)..but do face discipline (temporal judgment on earth).

God is just (2Thes. 1:6a, cf. Rom. 3:25-26 & 9:14, Deut. 32:4, Psa. 36:6, Luke 11:42, Rev. 15:3). All explanations of reality and interpretations of Scripture should conform to this certitude: “The Lord is righteous in all his ways, and holy in all his works.”
(Psa. 145:17) The Judge is just. It would be better not to attempt an explanation of God’s Word than to state one that impugns
God’s justice and love for all people (Joel 2:13, John 3:16).

Even the wrath of God (Rom. 1:18) is an expression of His love. Hebrews 12:4-11 offers the clue for harmonizing these two themes. This passage indicates that divine wrath is intended as discipline: to teach people to repent of their hatefulness or faithlessness (Pro. 3:12, Isa. 33:14-15 Rev. 3:19) before they die, after which divine wrath will be experienced justly without the opportunity for repentance.

The purpose of earthly punishment is to promote repentance, but the reason for retribution in hell is to attain justice. It is difficult to imagine, but somehow even someone as evil as Hitler will receive perfect justice, perhaps experiencing the agony of the millions of deaths he caused in accordance with the principal of “eye for eye” (MT 5:38), after which their souls are destroyed forever (per John 17:12, Rom. 9:22, Gal. 6:8, Phil. 3:19, 2Thes. 1:9, 2Pet. 3:7 & Rev. 20:13-14).

Evil people grieve God and punish/torture themselves by experiencing delayed karma, just as those who experience appropriate justice during this earthly existence also punish themselves or reap what they have sown and send themselves to jail. This view makes souls responsible for breaking the rules rather than blaming evil on the judges (or Judge) who enforce the rules.
 
Which ..for eternal salvation..is to change the heart, mind at the point of believing on Jesus for the first time.


I'm going to go with what God shows me in the Bible. Salvation is a lifelong involvement with God who wants me to love Him with all my heart, mind, spirit and body, not just give mental assent for the first time, but continuously yielding to Him. It's not a mere one-time, set it and forget it deal.

I like living in an active relationship with God. As I learn and obey Him through His Holy Spirit, He shows me if I'm doing something wrong. I repent of it and He helps me to stop committing that sin. So repentance is ongoing and not just one time at the beginning.


🕊
 
I'm going to go with what God shows me in the Bible. Salvation is a lifelong involvement with God who wants me to love Him with all my heart, mind, spirit and body, not just give mental assent for the first time, but continuously yielding to Him. It's not a mere one-time, set it and forget it deal.

I like living in an active relationship with God. As I learn and obey Him through His Holy Spirit, He shows me if I'm doing something wrong. I repent of it and He helps me to stop committing that sin. So repentance is ongoing and not just one time at the beginning.


🕊

Are you describing daily service or eternal salvation?

That is the key to understanding the types of judgment
 
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There are millions of people that confess Jesus but do not believe they can abstain from sin.

If they say they cannot abstain from sin they are holding on to sin.

In that situation they will not be punished for their sins on earth but have eternal life because they will not let go of the flesh.

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

If a person holds on to sin the blood of Christ cannot wash it away.

Some people do not believe a person can fall away once they are saved.

But the Bible says it can happen and warns against it.

2Pe 2:20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
2Pe 2:21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
2Pe 2:22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

These people were saved because they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

And knew the way of righteousness.

They had an understanding to turn away from sins but they went back to the ways of the world.

Which it would have been better if they had not known the way of righteousness than to turn from it.

But this is correctable.

2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

When we repent of our sins and confess Christ we are to turn away from sins and allow the Spirit to lead us to abstain from sins.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

2Ti 3:4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
2Ti 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Some people do not come to the truth and love sin more than God.

These people did not come to the understanding to abstain from sin led by the Spirit.

They would not let go of the flesh.

That is why Jesus said He never knew them.

And they were ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

They were not saved and then went back to sin but they were not saved at all.

Because they did not have the understanding about repentance from the start.

Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

These people were saved for they were enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, and have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come.

But they fell away.

This falling away is not accepting Jesus but going back to sin because it says they cannot renew themselves again which they cannot be saved again.

Which means they lost salvation by believing an alternate reality whether atheist, another religion, or stopped believing Jesus is Lord and Savior.

If they do that they cannot come back to salvation for God will not permit it.

This is not correctable.

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
1Ti 4:2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron.

2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

The time will come that people will not want to hear the truth of the Bible but want to hear it according to the new age.

An example is this the new age movement that interprets the Bible and religions according to the occult and evolution, and people are going to evolve to be spiritual, and greater, and Jesus became an ascended master among others, and there is no personal God, but they honor the God of forces the power of the Cosmos, and the New Age Christ is the next world teacher.

Which some shall depart from the faith and follow a different reality of the Bible that there is no personal God and Jesus is not Lord and Savior.

These people cannot come back to salvation.

But if a person that is in the new age that has not acknowledged the truth but comes to the truth they can be saved.

But if they go back to the new age they cannot be saved again.

Rom 11:20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

Heb 3:12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
Heb 3:13 But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.

Heb 10:38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
Heb 10:39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

And other places that warn the saints they can lose salvation if they do not do what is right.

1Co 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

Gal 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

1Jn 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

1Co 13:5 thinketh no evil;
1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth.

Charity, love in action, is greater than faith.

And faith works by love.

So if there is no love then faith is void.

Which charity does not think an evil thought.

And does not rejoice in iniquity but rejoices in the truth to hate sin allowing the Spirit to lead them to abstain from sin.

People who hold on to sin that is not love then there is no salvation.

A person that is saved can lose salvation if they do not abide in the truth they once accepted.

Having an understanding of repentance for that is the way to be saved.

Some Churches say they cannot abstain from sin so the people do not get saved not having the understanding of repentance.

Which they have a form of godliness but do not allow the Spirit to lead them and love sin more than God.
To start with on Hebrews 10.. the kind of sacrifice that is described is animal sacrifices mainly.

So 'no sacrifice for sins' being no more.. is no more animal sacrifice that the Hebrews were going back to do doing to try and appease God.

Not 'no more Jesus's payment for sins for the believer '
 
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There are two kinds of discipline/judgment people face.

One is temporal.. where a believer will reap consequences for their sin.

Then eternal judgment for whether are person is justified by Jesus or not.

These get mixed together by many, with people confusing God's discipline for a believer with eternal judgment. So a failing believer is said to lose eternal life, because they see discipline verses in the Bible.

When context is read properly, you can see believers don't suffer the consequence of hell (eternal judgment in hell)..but do face discipline (temporal judgment on earth).
Discipline is the real Love of God. It is to disciple, to show each person there mistake(s) To work through them and see new in trust to Father and siren Son for them
But I just did it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "I" don't want to, yet I continue to do what I do not want to do. I need Help Father

King James Version
Romans 7:13-18​

13Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.

The above, happens to people, when one focuses on to not do it anymore, this focus brings on more sin, once anyone tries not to sin, being under Law, aware not to, consciously. Yet to see this one seems to need t go through it first. I did

14For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

First birth of man and woman, No flesh other than Son's could ever please God Father. Romans 8:1-3

15For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.

Are you experiencing the above verse? God wants to reveal to you it is God that does it through you, and no one sees this until one, anyone lets go of the self Phil 3:1-20

16If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.

So is the Law itself good, perfect and correct? Yet when you try to do it, you find you can't, not perfectly as is done by Son fr you?

17Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

Be clothed new in. purple from Father through risen Son. for you too. That be the first born you, not the new you God is creating in you, by you being willing for God to do it. Will you? Col 1:21-23

18For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

As said by Jesus in the garden of Gethsemane to the disciples that fell asleep
The flesh is willing yet weak. So no flesh but Son's flesh could or can do perfection through anyone, Yet not u til the resurrected Son can that be now done. To live new in no longer in flesh and blood, first birth. It is now

  1. John 4:23
    But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

  2. John 4:24
    God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

This is a transformation from first birth of man and woman to Father and Son that is risen for you to be new in the same love and mercy of Son given you first. John 13:34. The entire Bible is a gigantic love letter from Father and Son to all people to choose to believe or not, consciously so at the end of grace, there will be no excuse for anyone, each has chosen
 
Some people believe if you don't have perfect doctrine you will be eternally damned.
Some people believe you cannot have any unrepented sin when you die or you will be eternally damned.
Some people believe if you haven't performed the right type and amount of works (which cannot be defined) before you die you will be eternally damned.
Some people believe you must be baptized in water and/or the Holy Spirit or you will be eternally damed.
Some people believe if you don't attend the "correct" church you will be eternally damned.
Some people believe if you believe in the wrong timing for the "Rapture" you will be eternally damned.

I could go on, but in every case above "some people" would be wrong.
 
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Discipline is the real Love of God. It is to disciple, to show each person there mistake(s) To work through them and see new in trust to Father and siren Son for them
But I just did it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "I" don't want to, yet I continue to do what I do not want to do. I need Help Father

King James Version​

Romans 7:13-18​

13Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.

The above, happens to people, when one focuses on to not do it anymore, this focus brings on more sin, once anyone tries not to sin, being under Law, aware not to, consciously. Yet to see this one seems to need t go through it first. I did

14For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

First birth of man and woman, No flesh other than Son's could ever please God Father. Romans 8:1-3

15For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.

Are you experiencing the above verse? God wants to reveal to you it is God that does it through you, and no one sees this until one, anyone lets go of the self Phil 3:1-20

16If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.

So is the Law itself good, perfect and correct? Yet when you try to do it, you find you can't, not perfectly as is done by Son fr you?

17Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

Be clothed new in. purple from Father through risen Son. for you too. That be the first born you, not the new you God is creating in you, by you being willing for God to do it. Will you? Col 1:21-23

18For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

As said by Jesus in the garden of Gethsemane to the disciples that fell asleep
The flesh is willing yet weak. So no flesh but Son's flesh could or can do perfection through anyone, Yet not u til the resurrected Son can that be now done. To live new in no longer in flesh and blood, first birth. It is now

  1. John 4:23
    But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

  2. John 4:24
    God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

This is a transformation from first birth of man and woman to Father and Son that is risen for you to be new in the same love and mercy of Son given you first. John 13:34. The entire Bible is a gigantic love letter from Father and Son to all people to choose to believe or not, consciously so at the end of grace, there will be no excuse for anyone, each has chosen

Yea the addict telling God they will never fall into it again.

It's not leaning on Jesus's grace and truth.

They are binding themselves to an unachievable standard of law.
 
Some people believe if you don't have perfect doctrine you will be eternally damned.
Some people believe you cannot have any unrepented sin when you die or you will be eternally damned.
Some people believe if you haven't performed the right type and amount of works (which cannot be defined) before you die you will be eternally damned.
Some people believe you must be baptized in water and/or the Holy Spirit or you will be eternally damed.
Some people believe if you don't attend the "correct" church you will be eternally damned.
Some people believe if you believe in the wrong timing for the "Rapture" you will be eternally damned.

I could go on, but in every case above "some people" would be wrong.

Yea.. mixing up performance with eternal salvation.
 
There are two kinds of discipline/judgment people face.

One is temporal.. where a believer will reap consequences for their sin.

Then eternal judgment for whether are person is justified by Jesus or not.

These get mixed together by many, with people confusing God's discipline for a believer with eternal judgment. So a failing believer is said to lose eternal life, because they see discipline verses in the Bible.

When context is read properly, you can see believers don't suffer the consequence of hell (eternal judgment in hell)..but do face discipline (temporal judgment on earth).
Can you show some scripture to support this ?

Yea.. mixing up performance with eternal salvation.

Like this what’s this one about ? Eternal life v wrath ?


“But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed.

God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.



But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2


Is this about the day of judgement everyone’s warned repeatedly about ?
 
Yea the addict telling God they will never fall into it again.

It's not leaning on Jesus's grace and truth.

They are binding themselves to an unachievable standard of law.
“ It's not leaning on Jesus's grace and truth.”

“Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:31-32‬ ‭KJV‬‬
 
Can you show some scripture to support this ?



Like this what’s this one about ? Eternal life v wrath ?


“But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed.

God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.



But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2


Is this about the day of judgement everyone’s warned repeatedly about ?
So all of those passages need the setting of who is talking to whom, what is the occasion, what is the reason for speaking/writing. Then you get the distinction between eternal salvation and daily service
 
So all of those passages need the setting of who is talking to whom, what is the occasion, what is the reason for speaking/writing. Then you get the distinction between eternal salvation and daily service
“all of those passages need the setting of who is talking to whom, what is the occasion, what is the reason for speaking/writing.”

…..Right well the apostle Paul wrote this , to the Church because it’s true doctrine . He was warning them for judging one another for sin while also being sinners and explaining this to them

“But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed.

God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. There will be trouble and distress for every human being ( that’s who he’s talking about ) who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; but glory, honor and peace for everyone ( again this is who he’s talking about ) who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. For God does not show favoritism.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:5-11‬ ‭

To be clear , This doesn’t only apply to those who actually received the letter at rome at that time 😂 it’s doctrine from the eternal gospel preached by Jesus Christ the judge of all humanity
that God has been telling mankind since the beginning it’s the same consistently to the end and encompasses all of humanity especially believers in Jesus like those Paul wrote to at the Roman church who wlrwady were believers and yet he’s writing this to them as a warning against judging each other because what Paul is teaching is the doctrine Jesus taught

Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall be given into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:36-38‬ ‭KJV‬‬

This is what Paul’s teaching them in Roman’s 2 because everyone has to be judged we can be forgiving and merciful in how we judge others or we can be harsh sticklers and hold everything against everyone demanding restitution demanding “ an eye for en eye “ and either judgement we express to others when we’re offended is going to be the judgement we receive come that day

a paup wasn’t teaching then they had to be perfect according to Moses law he was teaching them to abide in the doctrine of Christ because they will also appear before him to be judged by thier deeds whether good or evil

“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.”
‭‭2 Corinthians5:9-10

when we do that one day we can be judged according to Christs word and the gospel “ be merciful and you will receive mercy forgive and you will be forgiven don’t condemn and you won’t be condemned don’t judge others and you won’t be judged the same measure you use will be returned to you “

that’s what Paul’s addressing in Roman’s 2 by judging others and condemning people fornthier sins when they also are sinners they are storing up wrath and judgement against themselves and need to repent

“Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things. ….And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God? Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance? But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:1, 3-5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Paul’s simply doing what he always did as well as Peter and the rest of them preaching the truth of the gospel Jesus preached before them and the prophets Foretold of before him ….

“Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.”
‭‭Ecclesiastes‬ ‭12:13-14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

his judgements are now manifest in the gospel for all to hear and believe
 
Yea the addict telling God they will never fall into it again.

It's not leaning on Jesus's grace and truth.

They are binding themselves to an unachievable standard of law.
that be what Peter did, who denied Christ three times as predicted would, who by God got forgiven and remained that way, and then began the learning new process. He did that in fear, not understanding truth, about the resurrected Son for him and all people.
Still was learning and then some afterwards. As we all make mistakes, it is not us in belief that make the mistakes, it is not fathoming it is finished for us to walk new in the risen Son in love and mercy to all as well, thank you. Romans 7

We all are in process, putting past behind us as fast as it happened to learn from by God who does not stop loving anyone. Phil 3:1-20. Then one begins learning new humbly, through adversities as if getting peeled like peeling an onion, which makes people cry and when get to the center, we get a sweet smelling savor, the risen Son and Father guiding us in the same love and mercy given us by Son's one time willing death for everyone to choose to believe it or not between Father and them or not
Love God's charitable Love overcame evil by Son's done work on that cross. So see it, believe t and walk it out to all in lo ve and mercy to all. Thanks
 
Yea the addict telling God they will never fall into it again.

It's not leaning on Jesus's grace and truth.

They are binding themselves to an unachievable standard of law.
Yet God does not give up as flesh people do. And God calls and continues. I know this truth. God has mercy for us each to learn from error(s) and see truth and then willingly let go in humility over things not well for our souls
Humbly so, no more room for pride or guilt anymore, God took it all through Son's done work for us all John 19:30
 
“all of those passages need the setting of who is talking to whom, what is the occasion, what is the reason for speaking/writing.”

…..Right well the apostle Paul wrote this , to the Church because it’s true doctrine . He was warning them for judging one another for sin while also being sinners and explaining this to them

“But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed.

God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. There will be trouble and distress for every human being ( that’s who he’s talking about ) who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; but glory, honor and peace for everyone ( again this is who he’s talking about ) who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. For God does not show favoritism.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:5-11‬ ‭

To be clear , This doesn’t only apply to those who actually received the letter at rome at that time 😂 it’s doctrine from the eternal gospel preached by Jesus Christ the judge of all humanity
that God has been telling mankind since the beginning it’s the same consistently to the end and encompasses all of humanity especially believers in Jesus like those Paul wrote to at the Roman church who wlrwady were believers and yet he’s writing this to them as a warning against judging each other because what Paul is teaching is the doctrine Jesus taught

Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall be given into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:36-38‬ ‭KJV‬‬

This is what Paul’s teaching them in Roman’s 2 because everyone has to be judged we can be forgiving and merciful in how we judge others or we can be harsh sticklers and hold everything against everyone demanding restitution demanding “ an eye for en eye “ and either judgement we express to others when we’re offended is going to be the judgement we receive come that day

a paup wasn’t teaching then they had to be perfect according to Moses law he was teaching them to abide in the doctrine of Christ because they will also appear before him to be judged by thier deeds whether good or evil

“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men;
but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.”
‭‭2 Corinthians5:9-10

when we do that one day we can be judged according to Christs word and the gospel “ be merciful and you will receive mercy forgive and you will be forgiven don’t condemn and you won’t be condemned don’t judge others and you won’t be judged the same measure you use will be returned to you “

that’s what Paul’s addressing in Roman’s 2 by judging others and condemning people fornthier sins when they also are sinners they are storing up wrath and judgement against themselves and need to repent

“Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things. ….And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God? Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance? But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:1, 3-5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Paul’s simply doing what he always did as well as Peter and the rest of them preaching the truth of the gospel Jesus preached before them and the prophets Foretold of before him ….

“Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.”
‭‭Ecclesiastes‬ ‭12:13-14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

his judgements are now manifest in the gospel for all to hear and believe
Yeah, this is all mainly earthly, temporal judgment for believers. Matthew 18 also shows this kind of discipline