Loss of salvation???
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How did it contradict what we can, and do know?
Scripture mentions "outer darkness."
Why did you ask for Scripture then?
And this is my prayer: that your love may abound more and more in knowledge and depth of insight,
so that you may be able to discern what is best and may be pure and blameless for the day of Christ."
Philippians 1:9-10
.
Reading your thread so far, one would think most protestants think believers cannot walk away from salvation, yet current estimates per a Google AI search say 60-65% of believers think a believer can lose salvation.
Loss of reward IS judgment.
Since when is it not?
One of the rewards for the Christian will be to reign with Christ over the new earth.
What will happen to those denied this reward while there will be those enjoying that reward?
Seeing what they missed is part of their punishment.
For they chose to reject truth while truth was being given...
If we deny Him (selfishness) He will deny us (rewards and blessing in eternity that could have been ours).
If we endure,
We shall also reign with Him.
If we deny Him,
He also will deny us.
If we are faithless,
He remains faithful;
He cannot deny Himself. (we can not lose our salvation)
2 Timothy 2:12-13
Jonah was fleeing God's presence because he didn't want to do what God assigned him to do. While fleeing " Jonah1:9 So he said to them, "I am a Hebrew; and I fear the LORD, the God of heaven, who made the sea and the dry land."
Doesn't sound like apostasy.
I know a pastor-teacher who assumed leadership of a long-established ministry he had not desired to take over. He said something to the effect that he had to be kicked through the goal posts before he assumed the role.
One of God's servants got a big-fish-cruise to his destination - another got a kick to it.
That's one interpretation of a continually recycled argument that never gets resolved.
No, it can't be lost. Mat 10:33 is speaking of the unsaved, not the saved.
Those saved by Christ will not/cannot deny Him. They have had His righteousness imputed to them by salvation and are judged not by their righteousness but by Christ's righteousness.
Notice in Jhn 17:2, those given to Christ by the Father are given ETERNAL LIFE. Eternal life is eternal not temporary, transient, or subject to change.
Notice in 1 Pe 1:5, that God made Himself guarantor that those who have been given the inheritance (eternal life) are kept in it unto the end.
[Jhn 17:1-3 KJV]
1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:
2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
[1Pe 1:3-5 KJV]
3 Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
You said hell is in the center of the earth.
I was wondering if there's scripture for this.
I also asked you where heaven is - (since you might know that too)
So what's the reply?
Genez
Take a look at the following.
If you're correct in your exegesis....
either verse 12 is wrong
or verse 13 is wrong.
2 Timothy 2:11-13
11 It is a trustworthy statement: For if we died with Him, we will also live with Him;
12 If we endure, we will also reign with Him; If we deny Him, He also will deny us;
13 If we are faithless, He remains faithful, for He cannot * deny Himself.
Verse 12......If we deny Him,,,He will also deny us.
Verse 13....if we are faithless, He remains faithful for He cannot deny Himself.
So in verse 12 we're told we can be denied in front of God.
In verse 13 YOUR exegesis says God remains faithful even if we are not faithful because God cannot deny Himself.
So which is it?
Oh for goodness sakes Lamar!
The sow was always dirty!
It didn't RETURN to anything.....(or the word RETURN is not properly understood by some).
we must be reading a different bible from those that believe
"they were never saved to begin with".
You think @Standard will every reply?
So far, no one ever has.
It's the unanswerable question.
It's too simple.
If he does reply,,,he'll take a pargraph or two,,,at least.
IOW,,,he won't reply even if he does reply.
Where's the verse that teaches the above?
You say that NO SIN either by numbers or severity is greater than forgiveness once given.
The New Testament writers do not agree with you.
Here's what John, an Apostle taught:
1 John 1:6
6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth;
1 John 3:10
10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.
Here's what Paul taught:
Ephesians 4:1
1 Therefore I, the prisoner of the Lord, implore you to walk in a manner worthy of the calling with which you have been called
1 Corinthians 6:9-10
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.
The spirit cannot live with the flesh.
Romans 8:5-8
5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,
8 and those who are in the flesh cannot * please God.
Thought your "there we go" was you agreeing with my post. Sorry if I misunderstood. Please disregard.
Just so as I am clear this time, you are saying that sin is greater than Christ, but that man is greater than sin, making man greater than Christ? Is that correct?
By these verses:
[Heb 1:3 KJV]
3 Who being the brightness of [his] glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
[Tit 3:5-7 KJV]
5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
It's good you've come out more clearly. You do know this is pretty standard fare OSAS interpretation, correct?
Nope, they do not disagree; they confirm.
Those verses were given as edification to the saved, because only the saved, as saved, will be able to truly satisfy them.
An attempt to satisfy those by the unsaved will not bring salvation to them, as only Christ, as Savior, is able to save.