So... God picks you out of the garbage heap of humanity?
Says you are His?
Then, if you do something to displease Him?
He tosses you back to where you same from?
Loss of salvation???
- Thread starter gratefuloneson
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Says you are His?
Then, if you do something to displease Him?
He tosses you back to where you same from?
Guess you either didn't read or understand the verses of Eph 2. You certainly don't understand Eph 2:8. Salvation itself
was brought about BY Christ's faithfulness to the Father's plan of salvation, as demonstrated
in/by Christ's offering and sacrifice, and by that, those whom God had aforetime chosen unto salvation, become saved.
To them, faith is given as a gift from salvation - but salvation is all by God, nothing by man - Christ is the Savior,
man is not. You do understand that Christ is the Savior, don't you? It's stated throughout the whole Bible. What do you think that means?
For some reason, you have a problem understanding/accepting the 'and that not of yourself it is the gift of God" part of Eph 2:8. Seems pretty simple and straightforward to me, unless, that is, you're just adverse to what the Bible says because you'd rather salvation be by man's works instead of by God's.
If we are faithless, He remains faithful, for He cannot deny Himself. 2 Tim 2:13
because we are parts of His body. Eph 5:30
How did you get faith?
So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Romans 10:17
When you were given the Gospel you were hearing (comprehending) the Word of God.
That was faith.
We are to add faith to our faith.
Faith is not simply some feeling.
Faith is thinking with the Word of God as the Spirit makes it one with your soul!
...........
The verse is not talking about losing one's faith, that's the point you keep missing.
The verse tells us how one is saved full stop. That will never change. Believe it, don't believe it. God will still save by grace through faith, given as a gift.
There's not a verse in the Bible that corroborates God's word is eternally true?
What?? How do you come at that? Will all the world believe?
You are completely misunderstanding what I say.
You must have missed the warnings the Lord gives in the New Testament about those that lose their salvation.
Are you one of those that believes Christians can live in sin and still be saved?
But He can will deny us if we deny Him:
2 Timothy 2:12
If we deny Him, He also will deny us
Let's do be a cherry picker now, the entire Word of God is true not just the parts that fit your preconceived ideas.
2 Timothy 2:12 demonstrates that Gal 6:7,8 is true in that if we sow to the flesh (walk in sin) we become corrupt.
Those claiming this is not true are mocking God according to Gal 6:7,8
Yes, sir!
He will deny us, as per 1 Cor 3:11-15 tells us. Some will be denied, and suffer a loss of reward.
But, it also says, they cannot lose their salvation! Reward? Yes! Lost!
Ever read it? 1 Cor 3:11-15...
For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus
Christ. If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood,
hay or straw, their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it
to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s
work.
If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. If it is burned up,
the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping
through the flames.
I am so glad I can see what it says. Blessed, actually.......
Nope. Some that have been born again will end up going to hell because they denied the Lord,
1 Cor 3:11-15 is speaking of our works and is not speaking of denying the Lord, turning away from him to go back to living in sin.
Those claiming one can go live in sin and still be saved are speaking in behalf of the devil.
Some folks have been programmed by false teachers to reject the whole counsel of God.
These people are not qualified to talk about the things of the Lord because they are peddling deception and are the tares Jesus warned about.
All believers should produce works. (Ephesians 2:10)
For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works,
which God prepared in advance for us to do.
Our works (be they good, or dead) are based upon what truth we have learned and have become transformed by.
Now, if you want to take the stupid approach?
Be my guest.
You plainly do not know what it means to be born again. Tell me how eternal life can die? That is what it would take. In which case, it can't be eternal. Do you not know that wheat is wheat and tares are tares? Anyone who is subject to the second death was not born again in the first place.
"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! By His great mercy He has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, and into an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, reserved in heaven for you, who through faith are shielded by God’s power for the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.…"
"For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God."
Either someone is born again or he is not. Either he has eternal life or he does not. If he is born again, he meets Jesus at the Bema seat of judgement, which is where prizes are given out. Some will go away empty handed. Others will receive great rewards.
Those who are not born again face the judgement of the Great White Throne. That is where they are consigned to the second death.
You condemn those who disagree with you. Yet you are the one who diminishes the wonderful salvation of God through Jesus and denies His power to keep those who are His. I don't say that you are a "tare". I don't know you well enough to judge. However, be careful. We will be judged as we judge others.
"By their fruit will you know them". (Matthew 7:20). I note how the self righteous love to focus on works, but say nothing about fruit. Unbelievers can do "good" works. Unbelievers do not bear fruit.
You still assume that there is only one salvation. That is not true. To be born again is instantaneous, eternal and cannot be undone. It means a new spirit which is of God. The salvation of the soul is progressive and conditional. Some make tremendous progress because they consecrate themselves soon after being born again. Others make little progress because they value self too much and Lord Jesus too little. It does not help that there is so little sound teaching on this subject. Obviously no one has been able to convince you of your wrong understanding.
Faith is a gift but only if you hold on to your own faith? That makes zero sense.
What are you talking about? How does someone having no faith alter how God saves by grace through faith?
To anyone who does not believe, the gift of salvation is not applicable.
I think you are looking through the telescope from the wrong end because you still seem to fail to understand what I am saying.
Eph.2:8 has nothing to do with "will you or won't you believe", it has everything to do with the way the Lord God has chosen to save people.
That isn't true. No one who has been born again will deny the Lord.
The passage is speaking about people like Paul and Apollos who are building the "house" of God.
Agreed. Romans 6:1
Unfortunately, this is also true.
Yes, this is insightful. The tares are false teachers.
Nicely stated re: our Lord.
The language in those verses tells us more about our relationship with Him.
No double negative 'ou mē' in John5:24 - you're thinking of other Scripture.
I'll move to other Scripture when done with the ones under discussion. Everything you're bringing up so far can likely be understood in the same light, which is quite simple.
If looking at what His Word actually says is grasping at straws, I'm fine with such grasping - would rather be doing nothing but - actually don't do much else - nothing much else holds any interest anymore and hasn't for quite some time (Phil2:13).
believed or are believing or both? I recall some posts ago dealing with choosing to believe and choosing to continue to believe.
1Cor4:2-3.
Your ability to evaluate competence is in full view. When we really get into Scripture you're reverting into the mode of this post - simple ad hominem and other fallacious reasoning. YOu should be able to do better by now.
Your right pastor made a mistake which seems to be a fairly common one in that era. After I looked for the quote you pasted that showed that error, I looked at the work of another who's work I was reading during the years I was studying under your pastor and he was making the same mistake. Good men who worked hard with what they had apparently.
As I recall, you said you were not reliant on him or anyone (?) any more but had been doing your own work for quite some time. Let go and do some work on the perfect tense. Search on the internet or ask AI who does the searches for you. Ask me and I'll point you to some things if I can find it online. If you can't find good instruction, PM me and I'll send you a book.
Chiding me does nothing to me nor does it prove you know Scripture.