The "Secret Rapture" is a False Doctrine.

[Psalm1]

If the Church is removed before the arrival of the Antichrist, and we understand that no serious Wrath is taking place before the arrival of the Antichrist, then Pre-Wrath is a possibility.
Because some scholars believe the Marriage Supper could last the entire Millennium so there's no set rules when it must begin.

Jesus first miracle was with a few close disciples and his mother.

The marriage feast with wine from water, was his first miracle.
Jesus prophesied at the lsst supper, that he would drink of the cup with his bride in heaven.
Mat 25 has the bride taken to the marrige chamber, at the gathering of her, from her location, DIRECTLY to the marriage. ( the pretrib rapture)
The pretrib rapture is to heaven, in a pretrib setting, to the marriage and consumation. As the bible declares.

 

[Psalm1]

Let's use the example Yeshua spoke about in Matthew 24 about Coming in the Clouds and gathering the Elect once Tribulation had ended.

Now let's put that into perspective with the concept of pre-Wrath which believes the Church is removed before the reign of the Antichrist which typically is dealing with the Jews at that time.

Pre-Wrath would be after the Tribulation for the Church because it's removed before having to face the Antichrist and the real Wrath mentioned for the time period after the 3 1/2 year mark is when we see the real destruction taking place + the MOB and the bottomless pit opened up.

But clearly your beheaded reference of Scripture would obviously fall somewhere in the outline I am presenting.

But more than anything it's not pre-trib but removed before the Church would face the Antichrist.

Nope.
And impossible.
Every rapture verse, has a pretrib setting.
EVERY ONE OF THEM.

Now, you are claiming mat 24 has the church raptured after the trib.
Which is apparently mid 7 yr trib. ( mid trib). The trib is 7 yrs according to Daniel.
You still believe mat 24 is a postrib rapture?
JESUS DOES NOT gather anyone. ANGELS GATHER AFTER THE TRIB, (in your only postrib verse).
The setting is also OPPOSITE the actual rapture setting.
Why do you guys muddy that up?

The setting is given at EVERY rapture verse, and you guys cast it down.

Read Rev 14, (the gathering of the Jews).
That gathering is "MID TRIB", MID 7 YR TRIB.
It is not, and can not be the church rapture of 1 thes 4.

Postrib, prewrath, postwrath are all tied to the 7 yr trib referenced in daniel.

Part of the problem with interpretation, is making a exaggerated separation of the panoramic picture.

From that precarious position, mat 24 get misinterpreted over and over.
...and as a main "go to".
They actually think Jesus comes twice in power and great glory, inspite of the BIBLE'S DEPICTION.

Then turn around and claim acts 1 "like manner" is also Jesus coming in power and great glory.

That is appalling.

 

[ATG]

if. you look at Rev, the martyrs are not allowed in the general population.
They are kept under the altar, UNTILL THEIR NUMBER IS FULFILLED.

True. The dead in Christ number will be fulfilled, when the Lord returns to earth to avenge their blood. The number of all the saints, dead and alive on earth, will be fulfilled in the air.

Mar 13:20
And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.

1 Th 4:15
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

That's when the fulness of all nations entering into the saved Israel of God, both the dead and alive, will be fulfilled at the Deliverer of Sion's return to earth.

Rom 11:25
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the nations be come in.

Rom 11:26
And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

The fulness of the dead in Christ in heaven, is no doubt the majority of all God's saints, but is not all of God's saints. All of God's saints at the hour of the Lord's return will be united altogether with Him in the air.

But it gets worse for your assumptions because we are taken bodily to heaven.

False.

Jde 1:14
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

After meeting in the air, the Lord and His saints cometh to the earth, not departeth to heaven. They must still reign on the earth with the Lord for thousand years.

I really don't understand why some Christians prefer the resurrected saints ruling over the earth from heaven, rather than with the Lord on earth, even as Scripture says:

Rev 5:8
And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

This is seen in mat 25 where The gathered bride is taken into the marriage chamber.

True. The Mt Sion in the air: the fulness of all the resurrected body of Christ from righteous Abel and OT saints, to the last remaining NT saint alive on earth.

Also in Rev 14, that Jewish gathering goes bodily to heaven.

Separating Jew and Gentile, or even male and female, in the body of Christ on earth, and among the dead in Christ in heaven, is Judaizing heresy.

Tit 3:10
A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject; Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.

 

[legion]

We have a false doctrine that John Nelson Darby invented and spread during 1830-1833 which had not been held in Christianity, but slowly this idea got picked up and crept into Christianity and which has infected the world today. Many Churches began picking up the false Doctrine of the "Secret Rapture", which gives the people the idea that if you are a real Christian you will be caught up in the secret rapture to be with Christ. This "Secret Rapture" doctrine did not exist before John Darby invented it in 1830 and somehow came into a idea from him, no one had ever heard of a secret rapture doctrine. The only thing that even came close was a short essay that a student Morgan Edwards wrote as a college paper for Bristol Baptist College in Bristol England in 1744 where the student confused the second coming with the first resurrection of Revelation 20 and described a "pre-tribulation" rapture. To arrive at this the Scripture has to be twisted and taken out of context. Here are some of the texts that have been quoted as referring to the rapture:-

1. The Church will meet Christ in the air - 1 Thessalonians 4:17
2. The Church will be taken to heaven - 1 Thessalonians 4:17
3. Christ will come for His saints - 2 Thessalonians 2:1
4. The rapture is a mystery - 1 Corinthians 15:51
5. The righteous will be removed - 1 Thessalonians 4:17

Lets take a look at the key verses starting with ! Thessalonians 4:13

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18
13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

This is nothing but the resurrection at the Second Coming which Jesus Christ Himself taught, we see it in the question Martha asked about her brother Lazarus who had died.

John 11:24
Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

We see the answer Jesus gave that even if people died they would be raised up.

John 11:25
Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

And we see more from Christ..

Luke 14:14
And thou shalt be blessed; for they cannot recompense thee: for thou shalt be recompensed at the resurrection of the just.
John 5:29
And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

One of the saints for eternal life, and then another will happen of the wicked to perdition, and we see it in Acts.

Acts 24:15
And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.

When Christ comes again the saints will be raised from the grave as is says, "and the dead in Christ shall rise first:" and then those saints still alive join them, as we see, "we which are alive and remain will be caught up with those that have been raised from the grave to be ever with the Lord Jesus Christ". This quote can fit nowhere else but the Second Coming of Jesus. And we are given this which clearly does away with the false "Secret Rapture" idea.

Revelation 1:7
Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Darby didn't invent the rapture... he did run with the concept and made it popular, but it is not his creation. For all the evidence against there being a rapture there is just as much evidence that there is one. This is one of those things that come down to faith, you either have faith it is real or not. Moreover, it isn't a fundamental teaching related to salvation. It is a secondary or tertiary subject.

If there was actual proof that it was or was not real this question would have ceased to come up. but for 2000 years this has no resolution. This is no different than the lack of evidence for once saved always saved or its inverse that you can throw away your salvation (note I didn't say "lose").

 

[ATG]

3. The Wicked are Slain at the Second Coming and await the Second Resurrection of Damnation.

True. Not only by the plagues on earth, and the destruction of the armies around Armageddon, but also the wicked goats left alive to be judged by the Lord at the beginning of His reign.

These people will be destroyed and their bodies will be strewn over the earth. And the slain of the Lord shall be at that day from one end of the earth, even unto the other end of the earth; they shall not be lamented, neither gathered, nor buried; they shall be dung upon the ground. Jeremiah 25:33

Jer 25:31
A noise shall come even to the ends of the earth; for the LORD hath a controversy with the nations, he will plead with all flesh; he will give them that are wicked to the sword, saith the LORD.

The wicked are all slain. The sheep that did good for the sick and wounded, will enter into His millennial kingdom. His thousand year reign will only begin with the meek sheep:

Isa 37:11
But the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.

They cannot be gathered, lamented or buried because no living being will remain on earth.

Mat 24:22
And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Not all flesh on earth will be destroyed, when the Lord comes to smite the nations in judgment and wrath:

Rev 19:15
And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

He will rule them that remain alive, and are welcomed into His millenium on earth. They will repopulate the earth, even as Noah's family after the flood.

I beheld the earth, and indeed it was without form and void; and the heavens, they had no light. I beheld the mountains, and indeed they trembled, and all the hills moved back and forth. I beheld, and indeed there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens had fled. I beheld, and indeed the fruitful land was a wilderness, and all its cities were broken down at the presence of the Lord, by His fierce anger. For thus says the Lord: 'The whole land shall be desolate; yet I will not make a full end.' For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black, because I have spoken. I have purposed and will not relent, nor will I turn back from it. Jeremiah 4:23-28 NKJV

Yet will I not make a full end...

This can also apply spiritually to the end of faith toward God on earth at the crucifixion of Jesus Christ: There was no believer in the Messiah at the cross nor on earth, with the death of God's Son.

None of them believed He was the Son of God, nor His words that He would resurrect from the dead. They all falsely believed He was smitten by God as a blasphemer and evil doer.

Isa 53:34
He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

'I will utterly consume everything from the face of the land,' says the Lord; 'I will consume man and beast; I will consume the birds of the heavens, the fish of the sea, and the stumbling blocks along with the wicked. I will cut off man from the face of the land,' says the Lord. Zephaniah 1:1-3 NKJV

This can only be after the Lord's Millennium at the end of the world by fire from God, when both this heaven and earth pass away.

Rev 19:17
And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God; That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.

The fowls of the air will eat of the flesh of the wicked dead. And so, not all life on earth is destroyed.

And, of course, the Lord must still reign over them of the smitten nations, that must remain alive to be ruled.

Anti-millennialism on earth at the Lord's return, is false.

 

[ATG]

https://ref.ly/Zeph 1.1-3;nkjv?t=biblia

So the events are pretty clear that the doctrine of the secret rapture which proposes that the people of God will be secretly taken to heaven

No secret rapture, ascension into the air, and coming down to earth, and reigning.

Once again, I don't really understand why some Christians, who otherwise take the Lord at His words, insist on a thousand year reign over earth from heaven, and not on earth as Scripture plainly says:

Rev 5:9
And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

If all the saints and the Lord are in heaven during His millennium, so that they cannot be seen on the earth, then it would certainly be a secret Millennium. Which in fact is what some already falsely preach today.

 

[ATG]

while the unconverted remain on the earth to receive what is false and is tantamount to a second chance.

There is no second chances for those that have faith toward God, and then turn from Him by works. They are not granted a renewed repentance by seeing the Lord return in the air. They are the bad tares separated from the good wheat, who will be appointed wrath with the hypocrites of the earth.

However, the everlasting gospel will still be preached by an angel after the first resurrection of the saints, and during the hour of the Lord's judgment. The promise of blessing is made to the unbelievers that did not name Christ, if any repent and keep the faith of Jesus unto death:

Rev 14:6
And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Rev 14:12
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.

They will be more dead in Christ, that don't have part in the first resurrection, but who will resurrect unto life among the rest of the dead, after the Lord's Millennium:

Rev 20:5
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.

Rev{20:12}
And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works….And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
Only the saints at the Lord's coming have part in the blessed first resurrection of His people, but prophecy still holds that there will be another resurrection of both the good and the evil dead:

Dan 12:2
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
Jhn 5:28
Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Jhn 6:39
And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jesus promises to not lose any that repent for His sake, even them that see Him and believe unto righteousness, not only as Thomas after His resurrections, and Saul on the Damascus road, but also them at His coming again.

Even in Lord's righteous judgment and wrath, it is to lead the few to repentance:

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
Even during the Lord's wrath on earth, many are called to repentance, but few chosen that do repent. Afterall, nothing makes the unbelievers at the Lord's return less repentworthy, than any evil doer before His return.

1Ti 1:12
And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry; Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.

If Saul of Tarsus could repent after persecuting the sheep of God before the Lord's return, then so can any repent that persecute after the Lord's return. Indeed, both Thomas and Saul only repented when seeing the Lord of glory himself. All on earth will also see the Lord of glory in the air:

Rev 1:7
Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
There will be them wailing over their sins against the Lord and His people, and repent. Not all will blaspheme and continue to make war with Him and His people.

Rev 16:9
And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory. And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.

The second chance doctrine is a doctrine of false hope which does not encourage people to change their lives and make right with God, but to continue in sin and iniquity. But God tells us to repent and His mercy and grace will allow pardon.

This only applies to those given up by God, who knew God, and then forsook Him for their own worship:

Rom 1:21
Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

The gospel of Jesus Christ is very clear in doctrine and practice: No one naturally is too evil by works to repent, and be saved from their evil doing, including them that slew the Lord on a cross:

Act 2:22
Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

Acts 2:37
Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?...Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

 

[ATG]

Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts; and let him return unto the Lord, and He will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for He will abundantly pardon. Isaiah 55:7

But if a wicked man turns from all his sins which he has committed, keeps all My statues, and does what is lawful and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die. None of the transgressions which he has committed shall be remembered against him; because of the righteousness which he has done, he shall live. 'Do I have any pleasure at all that the wicked should die?' says the Lord, 'and not that he should turn from his ways and live?' Ezekiel 18:21-23 NKJV

Again there is an "if" in these verses. Salvation is conditional to obedience. We will be held accountable for our deeds.

Amen brother. Justification by faith alone without repentance from all evil works, is a strong delusion that is akin to reprobation. Until someone first repents of believing that lie, they will not fear to repent of their own unrighteous deeds.

1 Cor 6:9
Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind…Gal 5:19 and such like of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

In fact, many of them strongly oppose repentance from all transgressions, so that we only doing righteousness in the Lord. They call the holy saints keeping His commandments blameless, self-righteous boasters and blasphemers against their own self-justification by faith-alone:

2Pe 3:3
Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father, with his angels, and then he shall reward every man according to his works. Matthew 16:27

1 Peter {1:15}
But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy. And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man’s work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:

 

[lrs68]

That passage,you are referencing, has Jesus coming in power and great glory.
Mat 24
30;And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Rev 19 passage also describes the second coming on white horses in power and great glory.

Mat 24 "power and great glory " passage is the second coming with the saints, gathered by angels, not Jesus, in heaven, who are now called the wife.( in heaven).

Postribs claim the church never goes to heaven at the rapture, but do a made up uturn, in the sky.
That DIRECTLY contradicts the virgin parable, Rev 19, and the last supper dialogue.

No one has ever proclaimed Revelation is in complete order of events but rather the things to come.

 

[lrs68]

Jesus first miracle was with a few close disciples and his mother.

The marriage feast with wine from water, was his first miracle.
Jesus prophesied at the lsst supper, that he would drink of the cup with his bride in heaven.
Mat 25 has the bride taken to the marrige chamber, at the gathering of her, from her location, DIRECTLY to the marriage. ( the pretrib rapture)
The pretrib rapture is to heaven, in a pretrib setting, to the marriage and consumation. As the bible declares.

You clearly have no idea what a marriage supper in Jewish tradition involved and who all was able to participate.

 

[lrs68]

Nope.
And impossible.
Every rapture verse, has a pretrib setting.
EVERY ONE OF THEM.

Now, you are claiming mat 24 has the church raptured after the trib.
Which is apparently mid 7 yr trib. ( mid trib). The trib is 7 yrs according to Daniel.
You still believe mat 24 is a postrib rapture?
JESUS DOES NOT gather anyone. ANGELS GATHER AFTER THE TRIB, (in your only postrib verse).
The setting is also OPPOSITE the actual rapture setting.
Why do you guys muddy that up?

The setting is given at EVERY rapture verse, and you guys cast it down.

Read Rev 14, (the gathering of the Jews).
That gathering is "MID TRIB", MID 7 YR TRIB.
It is not, and can not be the church rapture of 1 thes 4.

Postrib, prewrath, postwrath are all tied to the 7 yr trib referenced in daniel.

Part of the problem with interpretation, is making a exaggerated separation of the panoramic picture.

From that precarious position, mat 24 get misinterpreted over and over.
...and as a main "go to".
They actually think Jesus comes twice in power and great glory, inspite of the BIBLE'S DEPICTION.

Then turn around and claim acts 1 "like manner" is also Jesus coming in power and great glory.

That is appalling.

Show me specific Verses that reveal pre-trib tenure.

 

[Psalm1]

Show me specific Verses that reveal pre-trib tenure.

Mat 24 ( Jesus
says his return will be in a pretrib setting)
Acts 1( Jesus prophesied to return in pretrib setting)
Mat 25 (rapture of church with pretrib setting)
Rev 3 " I will keep you from the hour of temptation"

Last supper doalogue is the church in heaven at the rapture

Jesus other escape verse, ( I will look it up for you If you like)

That is 6 off the top of my head

 

[lrs68]

Mat 24 ( Jesus
says his return will be in a pretrib setting)
Acts 1( Jesus prophesied to return in pretrib setting)
Mat 25 (rapture of church with pretrib setting)
Rev 3 " I will keep you from the hour of temptation"

Last supper doalogue is the church in heaven at the rapture

Jesus other escape verse, ( I will look it up for you If you like)

That is 6 off the top of my head

Matthew 24 tells us AFTER the Tribulation ends.

The marriage supper shows us AFTER there's a new earth and the New Jerusalem comes down as a BRIDE according to John in Revelation.

 

[Psalm1]

No one has ever proclaimed Revelation is in complete order of events but rather the things to come.

Things to come , mostly in order.
A timeline is plain.
several flash backs here and there

 

[ATG]

ATG said:
Jesus cannot avenge the blood of the saints, before coming to earth to avenge the blood of the saints.

No response given to common sense Scripture.

QUOTE
"Scripture does not call these voices of people. The angels in heaven are rejoicing for the marriage supper of the Lamb to come, because they are the rejoicing friends of the Bridegroom, not the bride."

Nope.
The virgin parable says the bride goes back to heaven with the groom.
The wedding in heaven.

False.

Mat 25:1
Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom....And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.

Mat 25:10
And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.

Mat 25:11
Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us. But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not. Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.

The marriage is with meeting the Lord in the air at His coming again to earth.

No Scripture of the Lord going back to heaven, but only of shutting the marriage door to them not prepared.

At the last supper Jesus prophesied he Would drink of the vine with us in heaven.

Already corrected this lie once by Scripture: He will drink it again in the kingdom of God coming with Him:

Luk 22:18
For I say unto you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine, until the kingdom of God shall come.

The marriage drink of the vine is when the Husband comes to earth again with His kingdom. All prophecy of His coming and kingdom, not of going back to heaven.

In Rev 19 the bride has become the wife.

Rev 19:7
Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready. And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.

And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.

The midnight call to the marriage supper of the Lamb, is cried to them that have made themselves ready to meet Him coming in the air, and with open door they shall be arrayed in fine linen and white righteousness of resurrected saints.

Rev 19:11
And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

After entering the open door to meet the Husband in His kingdom come, the Lord comes with ten thousands of His saints out of the air, to destroy the beast and rebel army on earth. And rule them of the smitten nations, that remain alive.

Jde 1:14
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

Rev 19:15
And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

Rev 19:19
And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

Rev 19:21
And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

The marriage song is newly sung by the resurrected kings and priests of the Lord, who shall rule with Him on the earth.

Rev 5:9
And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

That is 3 omissions by you.

That is one refused response by you, 2 lies added to Scripture, and 1 half lie changing Scripture.

 

[ATG]

QUOTE
"As I quoted Scriptures already: It's the angels following the Lord out of heaven to earth, who shall gather the resurrected saints from the 4 winds of the earth, to meet Him where He is in the air. When He keeps His promise to come again and receive them unto Himself."


Rev 19
1 And after these things I heard a great voice of much people in heaven, saying, Alleluia; Salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God:
(PEOPLE IN HEAVEN)

Correct again. The dead in Christ in Rev 6, that prayed the Lord avenge their blood on earth. No response by you.

7;Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.
Bride is now the wife in heaven (marriage is complete in heaven)

The marriage midnight cry and call to His marriage at His coming. His prepared bride enters His opened kingdom door in the air, for the Lamb's supper with drink of the new wine.

8;And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.
(The wife in heaven arrayed in white robes.)

When she enters the open door to the Husband in the air, that is shut to them not prepared for His coming.

14;And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
Saints in heaven ...AGAIN CLOTHED IN WHITE ROBES.

Nothing about people, only armies.

Rev 15:6
And the seven angels came out of the temple, having the seven plagues, clothed in pure and white linen, and having their breasts girded with golden girdles.

Angels of God are clothed in white linen, with golden girdles as the Lord Himself.

Mat 16:27
For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

Only angels are prophesied coming with Him from the Father in heaven. Then shall every man on earth be judged by Him, and rewarded for good at His marriage supper, or wrath on earth for evil.

Mat 24:31
And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Then shall His angels gather His prepared bride from the 4 winds to meet their Husband, where He is in the air.

I can not fathom why you would change Revelation.

I've already asked why some people insist on the Lord and His saints reigning over earth from heaven, rather than where they will be on earth with rods of iron.

It's already taken 3 nonresponses to common sense Scripture, 2 lies added to Scripture, 1 half lie changing Scripture, and 2 assumptions inserted into Scripture.

Oh yes I do know why.
It , if it is true, and it is, destroys your deal completely.
That is desperation, changing Revelation.

I'm still wondering what your personal deal is for having the Lord go back from earth, to have His marriage supper in heaven, and then reign over the earth from there, rather than where He will be seated in Jerusalem.

Joe 3:16
The LORD also shall roar out of Zion, and utter his voice from Jerusalem; and the heavens and the earth shall shake: but the LORD will be the hope of his people, and the strength of the children of Israel.

Btw...those gathered in Matt 24 " after the trib" ,is JESUS SENDING ANGELS to GATHER PEOPLE .
IT PLAINLY SAYS ANGELS GATHER.
( also DECLARED in mark)

And now you agree Scripture plainly says the angels are sent by the Lord at His coming, to gather His elect people from the 4 winds to meet Him in the air.

And yet you still insist on saying they are armies of His elect people coming with Him out of heaven. So, why is it you refuse to allow the Lord His kingdom marriage supper in the air, and reign with His saints on earth?

What is the benefit to you?

In earth's history, I know of no place where someone sends another party to gather someone, but it gets translated that the one sending goes himself.

Earth's history? I'm repeating Bible prophecy of how the Lord does so. And with His kingdom's marriage door open in the air, then it makes perfect sense to send His angels to gather His elect people to meet Him there.

Are you now saying He won't send His angels to gather His elect people to Him in the air?

In any case, if you're going by earth history of man, then that explains why you add, change, and insert into Scripture your own thinking.

The bible rules!!!!!

Mat 15:8
This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.

 

[ATG]

QUOTE
"Scripture does not call these voices of people. The angels in heaven are rejoicing for the marriage supper of the Lamb to come, because they are the rejoicing friends of the Bridegroom, not the bride."

SMH IN DISBELIEF.
Rev 19
1 I heard a great voice of much PEOPLE IN HEAVEN, saying, Alleluia; Salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God:....

Already corrected twice .

 

[ATG]

The resurrected first fruits were gathered at the Second Coming of Yeshua.

Gal 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

2Ti 2:18
Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.

Mat 24:30
And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

 

[ATG]

Question---Is the Lord dealing with sin in the Tribulation??

The Lord is always judging sin, where ever and when ever there is sinning, whether by angels in heaven, or men on earth.

Even on the new earth, sin will be dealt with at His New Jerusalem gates:

Rev 21:25
And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there. And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.

And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

 

[ATG]

Jesus is the firstfruits of the first resurrection.

The first resurrection of a man from the dead.

Rev 20:4
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Rev 20:5
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Not the first resurrection of His church from the dead.

3 nonresponses to common sense Scripture, 2 lies added to Scripture, 1 half lie changing Scripture, 2 assumptions inserted into Scripture, and now 1 half truth diminishing Scripture.

The church is not in any way firstfruits concerning the resurrection.

Jas 1:18
Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

Rom 8:23
And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

Rev 14:4
These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

3rd lie taking away from Scripture.