Some thoughts on the Sabbath...

[Gideon300]

here is one response,

Sure, good one. Lord Jesus told the rich young ruler that obeying the law is not enough. Also, the New Covenant of grace was not yet in force. "thus, Christ did not know where of He speaks?"

Why can you not comprehend the truth about the New Covenant? God does not save us so that we can obey the Law that brings death. There is a new covenant with a new law - the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus. You go by that law and you'll be fine. Stay under the old law, and you will have to live with the consequences of disobedience. Keep this in mind: only one person has ever obeyed God perfectly. And it's not you.

Do you know what grace is? I guess not, because you prefer to live according to the law.

the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus -- what does that mean?? here is one some other person gave me: "The law is the shadow of the reality"
confusion

The law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus means that Jesus does the living in place of the life that we inherit from fallen Adam. Every believer has that choice, to live according to his own wisdom, desires, preconceived notions and attitudes, or according to the leading and empowering of the Holy Spirit.

"For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful man, as an offering for sin. He thus condemned sin in the flesh, so that the righteous standard of the law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit." Romans 8: 3 & 4

Those who are led by the Spirit of God are the sons of God. Romans 8:14

My advice to you is get born again now. Then you will have the indwelling Holy Spirit who will lead you, guide you, teach you and empower you. Obeying the written commandments will not give you eternal life. If you die without Christ, you will die in your sins.

 

[DavidLamb]

Sir, with no disrespect

on this site, when I show by the words of Jesus Christ or an Apostle, we are to obey, that the Torah has NOT been abolished, I am told,
I do not know what I am talking about, that I do not understand "Grace".

These folks fully believe Grace eliminates the need to obey.
No Sabbath
No Commandments
No Torah

"Just believe", I guess all they think is needed, is to believe Christ exist?

Not really. I think of the words of the apostle to the Philippian jailer:

(Act 16:31) And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved.”

Yes, believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. "Lord" implies authority, rule. Paul himself was an example of this. When the Lord Jesus Christ met with him on the road to Damascus, Paul asked the Lord (yes, he actually called Him "Lord"), "Lord, what do you want me to do?" He was ready to obey the One Who was now His Saviour. We obey, not in order to be saved, but because we are saved. That's why Paul in Ephesians 2 makes so much of the fact that the Ephesian believers had not been saved by their works/obedience, but by God's grace. Now they were saved, they were to do the good works that God had prepared for them.

There may well be people who imagine that it was enough to believe in the existence of Jesus but I assure you I am not one of them. He is my Lord and I seek to obey Him.

 

[Roger316]

I said the 7th day is Saturday..

How is this error?

Today, the Seventh day is a Saturday for the Jewish people. The Seventh day is a Sunday for most of the Gentile world. Back when the Fourth Commandment was given, the Jewish people gave numbers to the calendar days.

 

[GWH]

Not really. I think of the words of the apostle to the Philippian jailer:

(Act 16:31) And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved.”

Yes, believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. "Lord" implies authority, rule. Paul himself was an example of this. When the Lord Jesus Christ met with him on the road to Damascus, Paul asked the Lord (yes, he actually called Him "Lord"), "Lord, what do you want me to do?" He was ready to obey the One Who was now His Saviour. We obey, not in order to be saved, but because we are saved. That's why Paul in Ephesians 2 makes so much of the fact that the Ephesian believers had not been saved by their works/obedience, but by God's grace. Now they were saved, they were to do the good works that God had prepared for them.

There may well be people who imagine that it was enough to believe in the existence of Jesus but I assure you I am not one of them. He is my Lord and I seek to obey Him.

Amen, and "through faith" indicates the God's condition for forgiveness (IF/MFW)
and "that not of yourselves" indicates that saving faith is not meritorious.

 

[Roger316]

I live under God's calander. Not man's.

Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.
Acts 5:29

Why would you do that? Paul the apostle discouraged this behavior.

 

[memberofthebride]

The law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus means that Jesus does the living in place of the life that we inherit from fallen Adam. Every believer has that choice, to live according to his own wisdom, desires, preconceived notions and attitudes, or according to the leading and empowering of the Holy Spirit.

"For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful man, as an offering for sin. He thus condemned sin in the flesh, so that the righteous standard of the law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit." Romans 8: 3 & 4

Those who are led by the Spirit of God are the sons of God. Romans 8:14

My advice to you is get born again now. Then you will have the indwelling Holy Spirit who will lead you, guide you, teach you and empower you. Obeying the written commandments will not give you eternal life. If you die without Christ, you will die in your sins.

If I understand you correctly, a follower of Jesus Christ does not actually follow, they are led by the Holy Spirit along an unknown path, no rules, no instructions?

That Christ did not give us clear instructions as to HOW to follow Him correctly,
Rules to guide us as we walk on that narrow difficult path? No instruction as how to avoid sin, how to live in righteousness, godliness?

Sir, If I did not have that ONE Spirit of my Father in me – there is no way I would be here saying things that are the direct opposite of what the majority on this site accepts as truth.

After preaching and warning to tens of thousands, there were only 120 at Pentecost, that despised “Jew” day, the 120 assembled to observe as Commanded. Christ’s few! I will remain as one of THE FEW, gladly.

Why, if Christ removed/abolished the Torah, changed everything, were they there on that day?

Why, after Christ had taught for 3 ½ years, was it reported in the N T that they rested on the Sabbath after Christ’s death 56 And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment. Are we to believe Christ forgot to mention the Sabbath was no more, He fulfilled it, done, gone?

I will obey my Master and obey the same exact law He obeyed to perfection.

Sorry, I will never be “born again”, I will wait for the First Resurrection when I will be “born from above” in to Spirit, born into the Family of God. Actually, I am not at all sorry.

 

[God-fearing]

Sir, with no disrespect

on this site, when I show by the words of Jesus Christ or an Apostle, we are to obey, that the Torah has NOT been abolished, I am told,
I do not know what I am talking about, that I do not understand "Grace".

These folks fully believe Grace eliminates the need to obey.
No Sabbath
No Commandments
No Torah

"Just believe", I guess all they think is needed, is to believe Christ exist?

Friend
I totally understand where your coming from, and yes many take advantage of God's grace and twist it into a sort of get out of jail free card.
Rest assured that the word of the Lord is not mocked nor returns void.
The grace that I know of and some others here is unmerited favor, a undeserved opportunity to be forgiven and saved from the second death. To have forgiveness and fellowship once again with the one who created us.
Jesus said.....that not one jot nor tittle shall pass untill all is fulfilled so yes the Torah the commandments the sabbaths are all in effect, but now they are all under a different light, that light is Christ Jesus. The light of the world.
Surely you cannot deny what is before your eyes, the nation of Israel today and our Jewish brothers and sisters around the world
Practicing and living out what was given to them by moses but yet deny their messiah. Somethings wrong here.
Christ has come to fulfill all that was required .....but not for himself but for us.
For while we were yet sinners Christ died for us......taking the wrath of God for us.....a debt we could never repay in worship or observance .

 

[Roger316]

Gal 3:28-29 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

All one

But you are saying there is different rules for literal Jews and different rules for literal gentiles..

There are no religious rules for Gentiles.

Rom 2:28-29
28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: 29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

All one in Christ
One standard for all
It is all about the heart.

People may have changed the sabbath to Sunday but it is not because God said so.

People didn't change the Jewish sabbath to Sunday. The Jewish Sabbath (Shabbat) is the seventh day of the week, which corresponds to Saturday. Catholic doctrine is explicit: The Sabbath remains Saturday, but Christians gather on Sunday because of the resurrection of Jesus.

The Catechism states that Sunday is the day of Christian worship because Christ rose on the first day of the week — not because the Sabbath changed.

God did not say to keep Sunday as the Sabbath.

It is a man made tradition and a sign of the rcc's authority.

What is wrong with man-made tradition? I am not Catholic, but I see nothing wrong with tradition. The RCC as an institution has a lot to answer for. But there is nothing wrong with Sunday worship.

"It is well to remind the Presbyterians, Baptists, Methodists, and all other Christians, that the Bible does not support them anywhere in their observance of Sunday.

Neither does the Bible command against observing Sunday. However, Paul warned believers against forming a religion. He strongly discouraged it. We are free in Christ and don't need religious rites or observances to please God. We should question whether we understand the Gospel correctly if we start observing days.

You can follow the bible or the rcc
I choose the bible.

Those who follow the Bible worship God every day. We are free in Christ to honor God through our behavior, guided by the Holy Spirit. The Christ follower obeys the fruits of the Spirit: Love, Joy, Peace, Patience, and etc. Galatians 5:22-23 He or she would do well to rest every weekend. But the Christ follower is not obligated to rest every seventh day. He is free of all that.

 

[Roger316]

But for Gentiles, the seventh day of the week is Sunday. That is a fact of our reality.

roger,
Who gave gentiles, the authority to change a day Jesus Christ, GOD, Made Holy on the last day of creation week?
and the Sabbath is not the only thing the gentiles have changed.

Not one of the apostles would recognized what is falsely called the christian church today. sunday, easter, xmas -- pagan
I fully realize none of that makes any difference to you, you are free to do what you please when you please --- until The KING of Kings returns.

have a nice day

I wholeheartedly agree with you. The Apostles would not recognize the so-called "Christian" church today. But the way back is not to adopt Jewish practices.

 

[memberofthebride]

Friend
I totally understand where your coming from, and yes many take advantage of God's grace and twist it into a sort of get out of jail free card.
Rest assured that the word of the Lord is not mocked nor returns void.
The grace that I know of and some others here is unmerited favor, a undeserved opportunity to be forgiven and saved from the second death. To have forgiveness and fellowship once again with the one who created us.
Jesus said.....that not one jot nor tittle shall pass untill all is fulfilled so yes the Torah the commandments the sabbaths are all in effect, but now they are all under a different light, that light is Christ Jesus. The light of the world.
Surely you cannot deny what is before your eyes, the nation of Israel today and our Jewish brothers and sisters around the world
Practicing and living out what was given to them by moses but yet deny their messiah. Somethings wrong here.
Christ has come to fulfill all that was required .....but not for himself but for us.
For while we were yet sinners Christ died for us......taking the wrath of God for us.....a debt we could never repay in worship or observance .

"If" what I have read is true, the tiny nation of Israel is very sinful, which would be why the Jews are again destroyed and taken into captivity. IF? but prophecy is true, so I would believe they are, once again, going into captivity.

 

[memberofthebride]

I wholeheartedly agree with you. The Apostles would not recognize the so-called "Christian" church today. But the way back is not to adopt Jewish practices.

I follow the teachings of Jesus Christ, not the Hebrews, not pharisaic practices, Christ warned , "They say and do NOT!
neither pagan practices, sunday, easter, xmas. If Christ did not do it and did not teach it, I do not do it.

 

[memberofthebride]

There are no religious rules for Gentiles.

People didn't change the Jewish sabbath to Sunday. The Jewish Sabbath (Shabbat) is the seventh day of the week, which corresponds to Saturday. Catholic doctrine is explicit: The Sabbath remains Saturday, but Christians gather on Sunday because of the resurrection of Jesus.

The Catechism states that Sunday is the day of Christian worship because Christ rose on the first day of the week — not because the Sabbath changed.

What is wrong with man-made tradition? I am not Catholic, but I see nothing wrong with tradition. The RCC as an institution has a lot to answer for. But there is nothing wrong with Sunday worship.

Neither does the Bible command against observing Sunday. However, Paul warned believers against forming a religion. He strongly discouraged it. We are free in Christ and don't need religious rites or observances to please God. We should question whether we understand the Gospel correctly if we start observing days.

Those who follow the Bible worship God every day. We are free in Christ to honor God through our behavior, guided by the Holy Spirit. The Christ follower obeys the fruits of the Spirit: Love, Joy, Peace, Patience, and etc. Galatians 5:22-23 He or she would do well to rest every weekend. But the Christ follower is not obligated to rest every seventh day. He is free of all that.

Who was it that rested on the 7th day ending creation week?
Who was it the MADE the 7th day HOLY time?
Who is LORD of the Sabbath?
Only the One who made it -- can change it --- I can find nothing in that regard -- period.
and under no circumstances can gentiles.

 

[Roger316]

So what you are stating is God is a law unto Him self, The 10 Commandments He does not need to keep, what ever He does is right,

Yes. He wouldn't be God otherwise. God, in his role as creator, establishes morality for his creation.

the commandments and Torah statutes that Christ kept to be declared sinless, were just a human thing.

The Torah contained "Commandments", "statutes," and "ordinances." The commandments are based on Moral principles that are universal and objectively true for all human beings. Resting every seven days in the Torah is a statute (ḥōq), not a universal moral commandment or a civil ordinance.

God is exempt.
this beginning to sound like the greek gods.
Better hope He does not change His mind about you.

I understand your objection. It is essentially true. The Greek gods did not teach morality, reveal moral law, or demand moral behavior in anything like the way the God of Israel does. Greek religion was about ritual, sacrifice, and honoring the gods, not about becoming virtuous.

Biblical morality is rooted in the conviction that God Himself reveals what is good, not through myth or ritual but through commandments, statutes, and ordinances that express His character. Unlike the gods of Greece—who neither taught virtue nor demanded it—the God of Israel grounds morality in His own holiness and binds His people to it through covenant. Biblical morality is therefore personal (because it comes from a personal God), objective (because it reflects His unchanging nature), and relational (because obedience is an expression of covenant loyalty). It unites the inner life and outward action: loving God, loving neighbor, pursuing justice, protecting the vulnerable, and embodying righteousness in daily life. In Scripture, morality is never a human invention or philosophical ideal; it is God’s revealed will, shaping a people who reflect His character in the world.

The Genuine Gentile Believer is not antinomian. He or she is holy and lives a holy life according to the Spirit. Ideally, the Genuine follower of Christ has no religion, follows no religious praxis, is not bound by any religious statute or ordinance. The apparent need for structured religious practice is a longing we should resist. To follow apostolic teaching, the followers of Christ will meet in someone's house, hear about each other's needs, hear the scriptures taught, and pray for each other. They will obey their Lord who taught them to worship God in Spirit and in Truth.

 

[Roger316]

Who was it that rested on the 7th day ending creation week?
Who was it the MADE the 7th day HOLY time?
Who is LORD of the Sabbath?
Only the One who made it -- can change it --- I can find nothing in that regard -- period.
and under no circumstances can gentiles.

Is this an argument for why Gentiles need religious rules?

 

[Roger316]

If I understand you correctly, a follower of Jesus Christ does not actually follow, they are led by the Holy Spirit along an unknown path, no rules, no instructions?

That Christ did not give us clear instructions as to HOW to follow Him correctly,
Rules to guide us as we walk on that narrow difficult path? No instruction as how to avoid sin, how to live in righteousness, godliness?

Sir, If I did not have that ONE Spirit of my Father in me – there is no way I would be here saying things that are the direct opposite of what the majority on this site accepts as truth.

After preaching and warning to tens of thousands, there were only 120 at Pentecost, that despised “Jew” day, the 120 assembled to observe as Commanded. Christ’s few! I will remain as one of THE FEW, gladly.

Why, if Christ removed/abolished the Torah, changed everything, were they there on that day?

Why, after Christ had taught for 3 ½ years, was it reported in the N T that they rested on the Sabbath after Christ’s death 56 And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment. Are we to believe Christ forgot to mention the Sabbath was no more, He fulfilled it, done, gone?

I will obey my Master and obey the same exact law He obeyed to perfection.

Sorry, I will never be “born again”, I will wait for the First Resurrection when I will be “born from above” in to Spirit, born into the Family of God. Actually, I am not at all sorry.

I agree, Christ didn't abolish the Torah. But neither did He require the non-covenental people to keep the statutes and ordinances.

 

[memberofthebride]

Yes. He wouldn't be God otherwise. God, in his role as creator, establishes morality for his creation.

The Torah contained "Commandments", "statutes," and "ordinances." The commandments are based on Moral principles that are universal and objectively true for all human beings. Resting every seven days in the Torah is a statute (ḥōq), not a universal moral commandment or a civil ordinance.

I understand your objection. It is essentially true. The Greek gods did not teach morality, reveal moral law, or demand moral behavior in anything like the way the God of Israel does. Greek religion was about ritual, sacrifice, and honoring the gods, not about becoming virtuous.

Biblical morality is rooted in the conviction that God Himself reveals what is good, not through myth or ritual but through commandments, statutes, and ordinances that express His character. Unlike the gods of Greece—who neither taught virtue nor demanded it—the God of Israel grounds morality in His own holiness and binds His people to it through covenant. Biblical morality is therefore personal (because it comes from a personal God), objective (because it reflects His unchanging nature), and relational (because obedience is an expression of covenant loyalty). It unites the inner life and outward action: loving God, loving neighbor, pursuing justice, protecting the vulnerable, and embodying righteousness in daily life. In Scripture, morality is never a human invention or philosophical ideal; it is God’s revealed will, shaping a people who reflect His character in the world.

The Genuine Gentile Believer is not antinomian. He or she is holy and lives a holy life according to the Spirit. Ideally, the Genuine follower of Christ has no religion, follows no religious praxis, is not bound by any religious statute or ordinance. The apparent need for structured religious practice is a longing we should resist. To follow apostolic teaching, the followers of Christ will meet in someone's house, hear about each other's needs, hear the scriptures taught, and pray for each other. They will obey their Lord who taught them to worship God in Spirit and in Truth.

""Biblical morality is rooted in the conviction that God Himself reveals what is good, not through myth or ritual but through commandments, statutes, and ordinances that express His character.""

Yes, now we agree on something;

we are to put on HIS HOLY DIVINE NATURE as expressed and revealed by His commandments, statutes and Judgements.

If our Father does not reveal what we are to be like ---how we are to live -- the rules that produce perfect results --- we are doomed.
not one of us could ever, in 6000 years, ever figure it out.

Only by the POWER of His Spirit working in us, is that possible.
The N C and the sacrifice of Jesus Christ is what made the Holy Spirit available to us, with out that power -- we are dead for eternity.

 

[memberofthebride]

""Biblical morality is rooted in the conviction that God Himself reveals what is good, not through myth or ritual but through commandments, statutes, and ordinances that express His character.""

Yes, now we agree on something;

we are to put on HIS HOLY DIVINE NATURE as expressed and revealed by His commandments, statutes and Judgements.

If our Father does not reveal what we are to be like ---how we are to live -- the rules that produce perfect results --- we are doomed.
not one of us could ever, in 6000 years, ever figure it out.

Only by the POWER of His Spirit working in us, is that possible.
The N C and the sacrifice of Jesus Christ is what made the Holy Spirit available to us, with out that power -- we are dead for eternity.

All peoples, all nations must put on the Divine nature of God,, without which there can be no unity, no peace --only what we have now.
To say the gentiles are exempt -- is saying they are always to be a source of problems -- not so in the Kingdom of God

 

[Rob7]

"Through the two great errors, the immortality of the soul and Sunday sacredness, Satan will bring the people under his deceptions. While the former lays the foundation of spiritualism, the latter creates a bond of sympathy with Rome. The Protestants of the United States will be foremost in stretching their hands across the gulf to grasp the hand of spiritualism; they will reach over the abyss to clasp hands with the Roman power; and under the influence of this threefold union, this country will follow in the steps of Rome in trampling on the rights of conscience." Ellen White, Great Controversy p. 588.1

Satan, Rome, & "Apostate Protestants of the United States" = Dragon, Beast, & False Prophet = Revelation 16:13-16

And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.

For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth to the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watches, and keeps his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.

And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
Click to expand...

Just as the Covid 19 "Plan"-demic was used as a testing ground to initiate and subvert our freedom of conscious. Government mandating "The Jab" , superseding our Constitutional, God Given, Freedom of Conscious. So shall the these Last Day Events, be ...

This unholy union of State and Religion, which Trump and Apostate Protestantism are NOW initiating & promoting, will soon lead to the mandating of the Mark of the Beast, .... Rome's "Mark of Authority," ... as she says ... The changing of God's Sabbath, to man's sabbath, Sunday.

Armageddon and the Final Events of Bible Prophecy

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ~~ Blessed Sabbath Folks ! ~~ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
​

 

[memberofthebride]

Satan, Rome, & "Apostate Protestants of the United States" = Dragon, Beast, & False Prophet = Revelation 16:13-16



Just as the Covid 19 "Plan"-demic was used as a testing ground to initiate and subvert our freedom of conscious. Government mandating "The Jab" , superseding our Constitutional, God Given, Freedom of Conscious. So shall the these Last Day Events, be ...

This unholy union of State and Religion, which Trump and Apostate Protestantism are NOW initiating & promoting, will soon lead to the mandating of the Mark of the Beast, .... Rome's "Mark of Authority," ... as she says ... The changing of God's Sabbath, to man's sabbath, Sunday.

Armageddon and the Final Events of Bible Prophecy

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ~~ Blessed Sabbath Folks ! ~~ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
​

Sorry Rob, I do not follow men much less women. who was deceived in the garden?

the United States of America is not the Beast!
The USA will be defeated in World War Three, by the Beast Power in Europe led by a German and joined by the pope.
the 4th Seal is World War three in which 2 billion will die from war, famine, disease and animals. (this is before the tribulation)
Three is God's number revealing completion and finality. The THIRD world war with Germany, rearming as we write.

7 And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see.

8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth,
to kill with sword,
and with hunger,
and with death (pestilence),,
and with the beasts of the earth.

 

[God-fearing]

I follow the teachings of Jesus Christ, not the Hebrews, not pharisaic practices, Christ warned , "They say and do NOT!
neither pagan practices, sunday, easter, xmas. If Christ did not do it and did not teach it, I do not do it.

Yes brother but he was talking about the pharisees not israel as a whole.. please note Jesus condemned the pharisees of the time.
A pharisees is a type of person not necessarily a temple jew.