False teaching by separating Scripture from Scripture

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He was speaking to his disciples, that is why context is paramount!
Yes, but it applies to all of His followers/believers from every age. Not only those who were present with Him at the time. The context must not be forced to conform to anyone's presumptions, the bible interprits the bible. We don't get to narrate it.
 
Yes, but it applies to all of His followers/believers from every age. Not only those who were present with Him at the time. The context must not be forced to conform to anyone's presumptions, the bible interprits the bible. We don't get to narrate it.

The application is to those who heard it first and what it meant to them, and then we understand it from that perspective, that is the correct interpretative lens.
 
ATG SAID: 'Remain' alone? So, you are preaching a hybrid of faith alone salvation? Salvation begins with having faith alone without works, but does not continue alone without works? Salvation is not only by faith alone, but also justified by faith with works? Hybrid faith alone? That's a new one.

You're the one preaching it. You don't reject the explanation.

We have been made alive together with Christ and by grace through faith, not works FIRST (Ephesians 2:5-9)
Why are you addressing works salvation before faith? That's not a gospel being preached here.

Perhaps for those Christians that only preach faith alone salvation without any works, naturally believe the only alternative gospel is works alone justification without any faith. They are the only two contending gospels, that they understand, both of which are false.

The Scriptures only preach the gospel of faith salvation with works through Jesus Christ, and works justification with faith of Jesus Christ.

Gal 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.


Col 2:6
As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving.

With Jesus Christ, neither faith nor works comes first before the other, but are both from the beginning of His salvation and justification:

Acts{3:19}
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:


Jesus Christ the righteous does not come without His faith, nor without His works, but always comes with both, even as He Himself is always pleasing God, so do them that receive Him:

Jhn 8:29
And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.

1Th 4:1
Furthermore then we beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by the Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more.

For any man to have faith alone without works pleasing to God, he must have his own faith alone, not that given with Jesus Christ Himself.

Eph{2:8}
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Rev 22:13
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.


Both the faith and the works of Jesus Christ are throughout His salvation and justification on earth, from beginning to end. With Jesus, there is never any faith first without His works, nor works first without His faith.

Eph{2:8}
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.


Neither the faith nor the works of Jesus Christ are our own, that any man can boast of. The faith and works of Jesus Christ are only His own, that pleases and glorifies God:

Phl 2:13
For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.


If God is not working in us to do His good pleasure, then we have not the faith of His Son, but rather our own faith and works to boast of: Such as our own works of righteousness, work of the law, and works of iniquity and idolatry.

Rom 9:31
But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they

Rom 2:23
Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God. For the name of God is blasphemed among the nations through you, as it is written.

Psa 49:6
They that trust in their wealth, and boast themselves in the multitude of their riches;

Psa 94:4
How long shall they utter and speak hard things? and all the workers of iniquity boast themselves?

Psa 97:7
Confounded be all they that serve graven images, that boast themselves of idols: worship him, all ye gods.
 
With Jesus Christ, neither faith nor works comes first before the other, but are both from the beginning of His salvation and justification:
Faith and salvation come FIRST (Ephesians 2:8,9) then good works FOLLOW. (Ephesians 2:10) You seem to conflate faith with works.
Both the faith and the works of Jesus Christ are throughout His salvation and justification on earth, from beginning to end. With Jesus, there is never any faith first without His works, nor works first without His faith.
Wrong. We are saved by faith at its origin and not later, based on works. See Romans 4:2-6. The false gospel that salvation is by faith AND works remains your achilles heel. 🚩
 
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Man is justified (accounted as righteous) by faith, not works (Romans 4:2-6) then justified (shown to be righteous) by works. (James 2:21, 24) That proper balance confuses folks who teach that we are justified/saved by works.
The confusion is trying to balance a hybrid gospel of justification by faith alone, and not works, and then justification by faith and works.

The Scriptures' gospel of Jesus Christ is always justification by faith and works from the beginning, and never by faith nor works alone.

James{2:22}
Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.


Rom 9:31
But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law.
There is no first and 'then' with Jesus Christ, but only first and last the same from beginning to end:

Rev 22:13
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.




Not right out of the starting gate it isn't.
Certainly not by your faith alone without any works at all.

Which we conclude cannot be the faith of Jesus Christ who is always doing good, and never does nothing with God:

Jhn 8:29
And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.

How many works has one accomplished a split second after they have been saved through faith?
You mean your faith alone conversion time to faith with works...

Since it's your own faith alone doing nothing, and not God's faith always doing good, then that call to do good, is all up to you by your own faith and will alone.

That's not God's calling to do good later, because His calling to do good is always now, never later:

2 Cor 6:2
(For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)... Harden not your heart, as in the provocation, and as in the day of temptation in the wilderness: When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my work.


Another natural question must also be asked with any faith alone conversion time to faith with good works: Can later become too much later? So that a person is not justified by their faith alone without works? And what of any unrepented evil works during the meantime? Is that person still justified by their faith alone apart from their continued evil works?

In any case, Jesus Christ never comes to any man without His faith, nor without His works, because He is always doing good and pleasing God from the beginning to end, not at first without works, and then later with works:

Rev 22:13
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.



How many works has one accomplished a split second after they have been saved through faith?
And so, how many works is Jesus Christ the righteous not doing with His faith and Himself recieved by them that repent?

Acts 3:19
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

3 John{1:11}
Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that is doing good is of God: but he that is doing evil hath not seen God.


If sins are blotted out right away, and so is conversion by faith with Jesus Christ, then so is doing good by His faith, even as He is always doing good:

1 John{3:7}
Little children, let no man deceive you: he that is doing righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
 
Faith produces works and not the other way around.
False. Faith with works is always works with faith, from beginning to end, faith and works always work together to please God and do good:

Jas 2:22:
Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?


Phl 2:13
For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

It only takes doing nothing, to not have God's faith working in us to do good.

Luk 19:24
And he said unto them that stood by, Take from him the pound, and give it to him that hath ten pounds. For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him.
So, you teach salvation by faith AND WORKS? How many works does it take?
How many works does it take to have faith and works.

It takes the first works of faith, to have faith with works.

Rev 2:4
Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love. Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.


It only takes one evil work, not to have faith and works with Jesus Christ.






The alone part that is attached to saving faith is faith that trusts in Jesus Christ "alone" for salvation.
Not when preached as faith alone without works. That is the lie that Jesus Christ comes with His faith alone, and not with His works.

Rev 22:12
And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

The reward of Jesus Christ is always with his works, not with any faith alone.

We see time and again, that of the two contending false gospels: Faith without works, and works without faith, there is more Scriptural cause to preach justification by works first, without any faith, than any faith first without works.

The Pharisees and Judaizers are such strong contenders with Jesus Christ's gospel, because they had to be taken seriously by their works. But those preaching faith alone and doing nothing to be justified with God? They only rate a couple of verses in James 2. Paul spent much more time and effort on showing how doing good works, and works of the law, without faith toward God, does not justify any man...

The gospel of Jesus Christ is simple and sure, when not muddied by works alone, or faith alone justification: If we repent of our evil works, and believe Jesus Christ for deliverance from sins and trespasses, we are promised Jesus Christ with us to now only do good:

Mat 1:23
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

Mat 1:21
And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Acts{3:19}
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

3 John{1:11}
Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that is doing good is of God: but he that is doing evil hath not seen God.
 
False. Faith with works is always works with faith, from beginning to end, faith and works always work together to please God and do good:

Jas 2:22:
Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?


Phl 2:13
For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

It only takes doing nothing, to not have God's faith working in us to do good.

Luk 19:24
And he said unto them that stood by, Take from him the pound, and give it to him that hath ten pounds. For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him.

How many works does it take to have faith and works.

It takes the first works of faith, to have faith with works.

Rev 2:4
Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love. Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.


It only takes one evil work, not to have faith and works with Jesus Christ.

Not when preached as faith alone without works. That is the lie that Jesus Christ comes with His faith alone, and not with His works.

Rev 22:12
And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

The reward of Jesus Christ is always with his works, not with any faith alone.

We see time and again, that of the two contending false gospels: Faith without works, and works without faith, there is more Scriptural cause to preach justification by works first, without any faith, than any faith first without works.

The Pharisees and Judaizers are such strong contenders with Jesus Christ's gospel, because they had to be taken seriously by their works. But those preaching faith alone and doing nothing to be justified with God? They only rate a couple of verses in James 2. Paul spent much more time and effort on showing how doing good works, and works of the law, without faith toward God, does not justify any man...

The gospel of Jesus Christ is simple and sure, when not muddied by works alone, or faith alone justification: If we repent of our evil works, and believe Jesus Christ for deliverance from sins and trespasses, we are promised Jesus Christ with us to now only do good:

Mat 1:23
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

Mat 1:21
And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Acts{3:19}
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

3 John{1:11}
Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that is doing good is of God: but he that is doing evil hath not seen God.
Mass confusion. I was recently in a discussion with someone on a different Christian forum who also conflates faith with works and he made this erroneous statement to me below in blue.

When we obey by faith it means our obedience is our faith. Obedience is the very essence of faith.

Faith and obedience are one and the same action. Obedience is part of the definition of faith.

That statement in blue is absolutely false. Prior to my conversion several years ago while still attending the Roman Catholic church, I made that same error of conflating faith with works.
 
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ATG said:
Why not just preach the Scriptures of salvation through faith, and justification by faith in Jesus Christ?

I do (Ephesians 2:8; Romans 5:1) and works follow.
Not when you also preach justification by faith alone apart from works.

You add alone with faith in Scripture where it doesn't belong, and so you add teaching in Scripture where it doesn't belong.

Deu 4:2
Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.


The only place in Scripture with faith and alone, is James 2 teaching it is dead without works.

No other Scriptures add alone with faith, not for imputed righteousness, salvation, sanctification, nor justification

Justification is not by alone added to faith, but only by works added to faith.

2 pet 1:4
And beside faith, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity...
Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.


Because we are saved the moment that we place our faith in Jesus Christ "alone" for salvation. (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9)
Believing we're saved by any Christ without obeying God, is not believing on Jesus Christ with obedience to God.


What is modifying Scripture and turning God's words upside down is saying that we are made alive together with Christ BY WORKS
Made alive together with Jesus Christ by faith with works.

The problem with the false gospel of faith alone justification without works, is that they only acknowledge the opposing false gospel of works before faith.

Neither of them acknowledge the Scriptures' gospel of faith and works, that are from the beginning of being made alive and righteous in Christ Jesus.
(Ephesians 2:5) and saved by grace through faith AND WORKS (Ephesians 2:8,9)
Exactly.

The faith given by Jesus christ, and the works of God's righteousness, not any works of man's righteousness that he can boast of.

Eph 2:8
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works that any man should boast.

So, according to you, faith is dead UNTIL it produces works and then it becomes alive?
?? Not to me. Scripture says dead faith is that faith alone, that doesn't have works.

Jas 2:17
Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.


Faith alone can't ever become alive, because only faith having works is alive.

As with dead works, dead faith alone must be repented of, in order to receive the living faith of our Lord Jesus Christ.




How does something that is dead produce anything?
It doesn't. It's dead.

Jas 2:26
For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Neither can something that is alive, not produce anything. Dead faith can never be with works, and living faith can never be without works.

Faith alone without works, is not that faith, that is with works, nor becomes that living faith, that is not alone.

Faith with works does not follow faith alone. Faith alone must be repented of as dead works, in order to receive Jesus' living faith with justified works: For the just shall live by his faith.

The unjust shall die by his faith alone. Even as the transgressors that repent not of their dead works.


So, according to that same logic, a fruit tree is dead UNTIL it produces fruit and then it becomes a living tree.
A dead tree without fruit, that does not become a living tree with fruit, does not mean that a tree is dead, until it becomes alive.

Dead trees only fall to the ground. Living trees only produce fruit.

Jhn 15:5
I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Mat 13:29
Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Tares do not become wheat.

Except they repent of their dead faith and works alone without Christ.


Faith must be alive in Christ FIRST
Faith is alive in Jesus Christ always. And so, Jesus Christ doesn't give anyone dead faith alone, because He has no dead faith alone to give.






Faith must be alive in Christ FIRST and then it produces good works.
Faith in Jesus Christ is always alive, and the believer having Jesus Christ is always doing good with Him:

Jhn 8:29
And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.

Luk 1:37
For with God nothing shall be impossible.


It's not possible to have the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ without any works, because Jesus Christ is never doing nothing.

Jesus Christ does not first come to anyone with His faith, but without His works. When Jesus Christ comes, He always comes with His faith and works pleasing to God.

Jesus Christ is never without His faith, nor without His works. Only man's own dead faith alone can be without any works.




A fruit tree must be alive FIRST and then it produces fruit. You have the cart before the horse.
Exactly. No dead tree is alive to produce any fruit. You have a dead horse before an empty cart.
 
Did not the verses on repentance, baptism and continued faithfulness not apply to the jailer?

I doubt Peter taught the jailer OSAS, FART or the "sinners prayer".
OSAS is a FARCE I know. The sinners prayer is FART?

The Greek word for blasphemy is from the sound of passing gas: Bdelugmo
 
Not when you also preach justification by faith alone apart from works.
Romans 3:24 - being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, 26 to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus. 27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? Of works? No, but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith apart from the deeds of the law. *Hence, faith alone.

Romans 4:5 - But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works: *Hence, faith alone.
Romans 5:1 - Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2 through whom also we have access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God. *Hence, faith alone.
You add alone with faith in Scripture where it doesn't belong, and so you add teaching in Scripture where it doesn't belong.
The Bible makes it clear in many passages of scripture that man is saved through belief/faith - "apart from additions or modifications." (John 1:12; 3:15,16,18,36; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 13:38-39; 15:7-9; 16:31; 26:18; Romans 1:16; 3:24-28; 4:5-6; 5:1-2; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; Galatians 2:16; 3:6-14, 26; Ephesians 2:8,9; Philippians 3:9; 2 Timothy 3:15; Hebrews 10:39; 1 John 5:13 etc..).

Now we don't need to "add" the word "alone" next to "belief/faith" in each of those passages of scripture in order to figure out that the words, "belief/faith" stand alone in connection with receiving eternal life/salvation. Hence, FAITH ALONE. Do these many passages of scripture say belief/faith "plus something else?" Plus, works? NO. So, then it's faith (rightly understood) in Jesus Christ alone. ✝️

*This is not to be confused with a bare profession of faith/dead faith that remains alone/barren of works. (James 2:14, 24)

CONTINUED..
 
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Deu 4:2
Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.
This is addressed to Israel. Deuteronomy 4:1 - “Now, O Israel, listen to the statutes and the judgments which I teach you to observe, that you may live, and go in and possess the land which the Lord God of your fathers is giving you. The Pharisees and teachers of the law were often rebuked by Jesus for adding man-made traditions to God's word.
The only place in Scripture with faith and alone, is James 2 teaching it is dead without works.
James is talking about an empty profession of faith/dead faith that remains "alone" - barren of works. (James 2:14-20) Not to be confused with faith that trusts in Jesus Christ "alone" for salvation and not in works. (Romans 3:24-26; 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) *Learn the difference.
No other Scriptures add alone with faith, not for imputed righteousness, salvation, sanctification, nor justification

Justification is not by alone added to faith, but only by works added to faith.
Again, I previously showed you many passages of scripture which make it crystal clear that man is saved through belief/faith - "apart from additions or modifications." (John 1:12; 3:15,16,18,36; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 13:38-39; 15:7-9; 16:31; 26:18; Romans 1:16; 3:24-28; 4:5-6; 5:1-2; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; Galatians 2:16; 3:6-14, 26; Ephesians 2:8,9; Philippians 3:9; 2 Timothy 3:15; Hebrews 10:39; 1 John 5:13 etc..). 👀

*Now we don't need to "add" the word "alone" next to "belief/faith" in each of those passages of scripture in order to figure out that the words, "belief/faith" stand alone in connection with receiving eternal life/salvation. Hence, FAITH ALONE. Do these many passages of scripture say belief/faith "plus something else?" Plus, works? NO. So, then it's faith (rightly understood) in Jesus Christ alone.
2 pet 1:4
And beside faith, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity...
Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
This is after we have been saved through faith in Jesus Christ alone. By cultivating the qualities listed in 2 Peter 1:5-7, Christians can be sure that God has called them and elected them. These fruits will confirm it. Make sure you have been called and elected - bébaios (an adjective, derived from bainō, "to walk where it is solid") – properly, solid (sure) enough to walk on; hence, firm, unshakable; (figuratively) absolutely dependable, giving guaranteed support (security, surety).

To practice these qualities gives evidence of salvation, though they are not the basis (or cause) of salvation. They are the effect. Cause of being in Christ (FAITH) effect of being in Christ (FRUIT).

For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ (verse 8). For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins (verse 9). What is the object of the forgetting? Is this forgetting temporary because this believer had fallen into error or does this lack of fruit exist because this person’s "cleansing" was merely an external reformation that did not come from a truly changed heart?

The genuineness of their profession is demonstrated as believers express these virtues. These fruits confirm their divine source. 10 Therefore, brothers, be all the more diligent to make your calling and election sure, for if you practice these qualities you will never fall. *Proverbs 24:16, we read - For a righteous man may fall seven times and rise again, But the wicked shall fall by calamity.
Believing we're saved by any Christ without obeying God, is not believing on Jesus Christ with obedience to God.
Obedience (good works) "follows" having been saved by grace through faith, not works. (Ephesians 2:8-10)
Made alive together with Jesus Christ by faith with works.
You are "adding" to Ephesians 2:5 - even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved). You "added" with works. Good works "follow" salvation by grace through faith. You put the cart before the horse.
The problem with the false gospel of faith alone justification without works, is that they only acknowledge the opposing false gospel of works before faith.
It's a works-based false gospel that is the problem. Acts 15:7 - And when there had been much dispute, Peter rose up and said to them: “Men and brethren, you know that a good while ago God chose among us, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe. 8 So God, who knows the heart, acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us, 9 and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. *What happened to works?

Romans 1:16 - For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God unto salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek. *What happened to works?

1 Corinthians 15:1 - Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you—unless you believed in vain. 3 For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures.. *What happened to works?

Paul has some sobering words for those who promote a works-based false gospel in 1 Corinthians 1:18-21; 2 Corinthians 4:3,4.

CONTINUED..
 
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Neither of them acknowledge the Scriptures' gospel of faith and works, that are from the beginning of being made alive and righteous in Christ Jesus.
Ephesians 2:5 - ..made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), through faith, not works. (Ephesians 2:8,9)
Exactly.

The faith given by Jesus Christ, and the works of God's righteousness, not any works of man's righteousness that he can boast of.
That is just a fanciful way of teaching salvation by faith and works, which culminates in a works-based false gospel.

Romans 4:6 - God imputes righteousness apart from works. *Also see Romans 3:24-28; Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9.
Philippians 3:9 - and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness, which is from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith. Your saved by "these" works and just not "those" works argument is bogus!
Eph 2:8
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works that any man should boast.
What part of NOT OF YOURSELFES; IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD; NOT OF WORKS do you have trouble understanding?
?? Not to me. Scripture says dead faith is that faith alone, that doesn't have works.

Jas 2:17
Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.


Faith alone can't ever become alive, because only faith having works is alive.
Faith is made alive in Christ, not in works. By our works we SHOW that our faith is alive. CONTEXT. In James 2:14, we read of one who says/claims he has faith but has no works (to evidence his claim). That is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith. *So James does not teach that we are saved "by" works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine. Simple!

James is not using the word "justified" in James 2:24 to mean "accounted as righteous" but is shown to be righteous. James is discussing the evidence of faith (says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18) and not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God. (Romans 4:2-3)
As with dead works, dead faith alone must be repented of, in order to receive the living faith of our Lord Jesus Christ.

It doesn't. It's dead
Jas 2:26
For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Neither can something that is alive, not produce anything. Dead faith can never be with works, and living faith can never be without works.

Faith alone without works, is not that faith, that is with works, nor becomes that living faith, that is not alone.

Faith with works does not follow faith alone. Faith alone must be repented of as dead works, in order to receive Jesus' living faith with justified works: For the just shall live by his faith.
In James 2:26, the comparison of the human spirit and faith converge around their modes of operation. The spirit (Greek pneuma) may also be translated "breath." As a breathless body exhibits no indication of life, so fruitless faith exhibits no indication of life. The source of the life in faith is not works; rather, life in faith is the source of works. (Ephesians 2:8-10)
The unjust shall die by his faith alone. Even as the transgressors that repent not of their dead works.
The just shall live by faith. Galatians 2:20 - I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me. If you are NOT trusting in Jesus Christ alone for salvation, then all you have is a spurious faith, conjuring up dead works from an unregenerate heart.
A dead tree without fruit, that does not become a living tree with fruit, does not mean that a tree is dead, until it becomes alive.
Life flows through the root of the tree and produces fruit. Just as faith is the root of salvation and works are the fruit, yet in your errant theology both faith and works are the root of salvation.
Dead trees only fall to the ground. Living trees only produce fruit.
Amen!
Jhn 15:5
I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Mat 13:29
Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Tares do not become wheat.

Except they repent of their dead faith and works alone without Christ.
Good sobering reminder for pseudo-Christians.
Faith is alive in Jesus Christ always. And so, Jesus Christ doesn't give anyone dead faith alone, because He has no dead faith alone to give.

Faith in Jesus Christ is always alive, and the believer having Jesus Christ is always doing good with Him:
Faith is alive in Christ. Apart from Him we can do nothing.
Jhn 8:29
And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.

Luk 1:37
For with God nothing shall be impossible.


It's not possible to have the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ without any works, because Jesus Christ is never doing nothing.
Like I said already, genuine faith results in producing works. Faith is the root of salvation and works are the fruit. No fruit produced at all would demonstrate there is no root.
Jesus Christ does not first come to anyone with His faith, but without His works. When Jesus Christ comes, He always comes with His faith and works pleasing to God.

Jesus Christ is never without His faith, nor without His works. Only man's own dead faith alone can be without any works.

Exactly. No dead tree is alive to produce any fruit. You have a dead horse before an empty cart.
You just don't get it, and you sound just as confused as I was prior to my conversion several years ago while still attending the Roman Catholic church. :(
 
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OSAS is a FARCE I know. The sinners prayer is FART?

The Greek word for blasphemy is from the sound of passing gas: Bdelugmo
I have found that ALL false religions and cults that promote salvation by works strongly oppose OSAS, which remains a major 🚩 for me.
 
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Amen! In Acts 16:31, the apostles who told the jailer what they must do to be saved, said - believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved and NOT believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and get baptized and you will be saved.
Since Peter later confirms that water baptism, along with outer circumcision, is not necessary to be saved, it is a work of public commitment and acceptance into the churches of God.

However, repentance from dead works before Christ, is always the necessary part of the gospel of Jesus Christ.

A gospel of only believe and be saved, is of unrepented transgressors justifying themselves by their own faith alone.
 
That's because there is no conversion (remission of sins) before water baptism.
Good response if true. And water baptism can't be so easily dismissed from salvation, like outer circumcision.

However, I'm sure you've read and heard the Scriptures in Acts and elsewhere, but I'll go through them with you anyway.

It's clear that water baptism does not always accompany conversion and receiving Jesus Christ. It does not mean that water baptism is not done at all by the new converts, however, there is practical and doctrinal proof, that water baptism is not necessary to be saved, no more than is outward circumcision.

Cornelius and his household is baptized with the holy Ghost without water baptism. God does not give of Himself to unconverted sinners. Receiving of the spirit is by the hearing of the word with faith:

Gal 3:2
This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

1Pe 3:21
The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

Water baptism is indeed a physical figure of conversion, but is not the conversion by faith toward God.

Natural water does not wash aways sins and trespasses of the soul, no more than natural blood of bulls and goats...

Jhn 15:3
Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.

Eph 5:25
Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.


Only the washing of the clean word of God, is the baptism of Christ to convert the soul. Even as the circumcision of the Spirit cuts off past sins and trespasses.

1Co 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Col 2:10
And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

No one can say that faith and conversion cannot be with water baptism, but repentance and faith does convert the soul without water baptism.

Act 2:36
Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

Acts 3:19

Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

The one thing that faith and conversion cannot be without nor before, is repentance from dead works without Christ:

Mark{1:15}
The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Heb 6:1
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

Eph 2:12
That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.




 
DavidLamb said:
Although I certainly don't believe that water baptism is a prerequisite of being saved, nor do I believe that it is an "optional extra" for people once they have been saved.
Well, you disagree with yourself by saying:
1. WB is not required for salvation.
2. WB is not optional for salvation.

Which do you agree with?
You lose your argument, when you begin to misread people on purpose.

He says water baptism is not necessary to become saved. But once saved, like all things commanded by Jesus Christ, it's not an option that new converts can dismiss out of hand.
 
Since Peter later confirms that water baptism, along with outer circumcision, is not necessary to be saved, it is a work of public commitment and acceptance into the churches of God.

However, repentance from dead works before Christ, is always the necessary part of the gospel of Jesus Christ.

A gospel of only believe and be saved, is of unrepented transgressors justifying themselves by their own faith alone.
Believe what apart from repentance? We must first repent (change our mind) before we can believe the gospel/place our faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and be saved. Two sides to the same coin.

Mark 1:15 - and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe the gospel."
Acts 20:21 - testifying both to Jews and to Greeks of repentance toward God and of faith in our Lord Jesus Christ.

For someone to say, I believe the gospel, but I never repented, is an oxymoron, and also for someone to say, I repented, but I don't believe the gospel is also an oxymoron.
 
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