Calvinism is Gospel !
- Thread starter brightfame52
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
- Status
Naaman is a good example.
He was told to dip 7 times in the Jordan River.
He almost choose to walk away. This choice was huge. Would he be healed, or not, would he discover the real God of salvation or not.
He made the choice eventually to do it.
He was healed
He believed in the God of Israel.
Did God force Naaman?
2 Kings 5...
God opens doors and offers mercy and grace but the Devil opens doors appealing to the selfish flesh. The devil doesn't want us to choose God's way so he offers many false ways.
Mat 7:13-14
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Jer 29:13 And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart.
As the source and foundation of salvation, the Gospel proclaims divine election. This truth is on the very face of the entire Old Testament Bible: God chose Israel unto salvation, rejecting the other nations. The mediator of the old covenant tells Israel, "the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth. The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people: But because the LORD loved you ..." (Deuteronomy 7:6-8).
In perfect harmony with this obvious truth of the old covenant, the mediator of the new covenant traces every aspect of His salvation back to divine election. His life-giving death stems from election: "that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him" (John 17:2). His priestly pity and intercessory prayer are regulated by election: "I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine" (John 17:9). His saving revelation of the truth to men depends upon election: "I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world ..." (John 17:6). The coming of men to Him in true faith is effected by election: "All that the Father giveth me shall come to me ..." (John 6:37). His preservation of men in faith and His resurrection of these men in glory are due to election: "... that of all which he bath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day" (John 6:39).
Election has a prominent place in the Gospel preached by the apostles. It is the cause of the salvation of every one who is saved, and the source of every blessing of salvation: "... the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ ... hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings ... according as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world" (Ephesians 1:3-4). Upon eternal predestination was forged the golden (and unbreakable) chain of salvation: "Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified" (Romans 8:30). The entire river of the mercy of God in Jesus flows out of His will of election; and the sovereign graciousness of this will is illustrated by this, that God hardens some men according to His eternal decree of reprobation: "Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth" (Romans 9:18).
A Defense of Calvinism as the Gospel
In perfect harmony with this obvious truth of the old covenant, the mediator of the new covenant traces every aspect of His salvation back to divine election. His life-giving death stems from election: "that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him" (John 17:2). His priestly pity and intercessory prayer are regulated by election: "I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine" (John 17:9). His saving revelation of the truth to men depends upon election: "I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world ..." (John 17:6). The coming of men to Him in true faith is effected by election: "All that the Father giveth me shall come to me ..." (John 6:37). His preservation of men in faith and His resurrection of these men in glory are due to election: "... that of all which he bath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day" (John 6:39).
Election has a prominent place in the Gospel preached by the apostles. It is the cause of the salvation of every one who is saved, and the source of every blessing of salvation: "... the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ ... hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings ... according as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world" (Ephesians 1:3-4). Upon eternal predestination was forged the golden (and unbreakable) chain of salvation: "Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified" (Romans 8:30). The entire river of the mercy of God in Jesus flows out of His will of election; and the sovereign graciousness of this will is illustrated by this, that God hardens some men according to His eternal decree of reprobation: "Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth" (Romans 9:18).
A Defense of Calvinism as the Gospel
He was predestinated to obey and be healed, the story shows Divine Election and Predestination to obedience. The story of Naaman and the widow were predetermined events that Jesus would use in His Public Ministry to teach sovereign election in the synagogue Lk 4, which story infuriated the jews
Christ gives us the Holy Spirit to come beside us to recall His Word. For example, when we say, "Jesus is Lord," Holy Spirit says, "Yes. Amen." or Holy Spirit says, "Jesus is Lord," and we say, "Yes. Amen." That is how the author and finisher works through our faith.
In discussing Total Depravity or Inability: Free will and Free agency must be distinguished. It is a serious error of Arminians to ignore the distinction -
The Distinction Between Free Will and Free Agency
INABILITY: FALLEN HUMAN BEINGS ARE BOTH FREE AND ENSLAVED
by J.I. Packer
The heart is deceitful above all things and beyond cure. Who can understand it? - JEREMIAH 17:9
Clear thought about the fallen human condition requires a distinction between what for the past two centuries has been called free agency and what since the start of Christianity has been called free will. Augustine, Luther, Calvin, and others spoke of free will in two senses, the first trivial, the second important; but this was confusing, and it is better always to use free agency for their first sense.
Free agency is a mark of human beings as such. All humans are free agents in the sense that they make their own decisions as to what they will do, choosing as they please in the light of their sense of right and wrong and the inclinations they feel. Thus they are moral agents, answerable to God and each other for their voluntary choices. So was Adam, both before and after he sinned; so are we now, and so are the glorified saints who are confirmed in grace in such a sense that they no longer have it in them to sin. Inability to sin will be one of the delights and glories of heaven, but it will not terminate anyone’s humanness; glorified saints will still make choices in accordance with their nature, and those choices will not be any the less the product of human free agency just because they will always be good and right.
Free will, however, has been defined by Christian teachers from the second century on as the ability to choose all the moral options that a situation offers, and Augustine affirmed against Pelagius and most of the Greek Fathers that original sin has robbed us of free will in this sense. We have no natural ability to discern and choose God’s way because we have no natural inclination Godward; our hearts are in bondage to sin, and only the grace of regeneration can free us from that slavery. This, for substance, was what Paul taught in Romans 6:16-23; only the freed will (Paul says, the freed person) freely and heartily chooses righteousness. A permanent love of righteousness—that is, an inclination of heart to the way of living that pleases God—is one aspect of the freedom that Christ gives (John 8:34-36; Gal. 5:1, 13).
It is worth observing that will is an abstraction. My will is not a part of me which I choose to move or not to move, like my hand or my foot; it is precisely me choosing to act and then going into action. The truth about free agency, and about Christ freeing sin’s slave from sin’s dominion, can be expressed more clearly if the word will is dropped and each person says: I am the morally responsible free agency; I am the slave of sin whom Christ must liberate; I am the fallen being who only have it in me to choose against God till God renews my heart.
The Distinction Between Free Will and Free Agency | Monergism
The Distinction Between Free Will and Free Agency
INABILITY: FALLEN HUMAN BEINGS ARE BOTH FREE AND ENSLAVED
by J.I. Packer
The heart is deceitful above all things and beyond cure. Who can understand it? - JEREMIAH 17:9
Clear thought about the fallen human condition requires a distinction between what for the past two centuries has been called free agency and what since the start of Christianity has been called free will. Augustine, Luther, Calvin, and others spoke of free will in two senses, the first trivial, the second important; but this was confusing, and it is better always to use free agency for their first sense.
Free agency is a mark of human beings as such. All humans are free agents in the sense that they make their own decisions as to what they will do, choosing as they please in the light of their sense of right and wrong and the inclinations they feel. Thus they are moral agents, answerable to God and each other for their voluntary choices. So was Adam, both before and after he sinned; so are we now, and so are the glorified saints who are confirmed in grace in such a sense that they no longer have it in them to sin. Inability to sin will be one of the delights and glories of heaven, but it will not terminate anyone’s humanness; glorified saints will still make choices in accordance with their nature, and those choices will not be any the less the product of human free agency just because they will always be good and right.
Free will, however, has been defined by Christian teachers from the second century on as the ability to choose all the moral options that a situation offers, and Augustine affirmed against Pelagius and most of the Greek Fathers that original sin has robbed us of free will in this sense. We have no natural ability to discern and choose God’s way because we have no natural inclination Godward; our hearts are in bondage to sin, and only the grace of regeneration can free us from that slavery. This, for substance, was what Paul taught in Romans 6:16-23; only the freed will (Paul says, the freed person) freely and heartily chooses righteousness. A permanent love of righteousness—that is, an inclination of heart to the way of living that pleases God—is one aspect of the freedom that Christ gives (John 8:34-36; Gal. 5:1, 13).
It is worth observing that will is an abstraction. My will is not a part of me which I choose to move or not to move, like my hand or my foot; it is precisely me choosing to act and then going into action. The truth about free agency, and about Christ freeing sin’s slave from sin’s dominion, can be expressed more clearly if the word will is dropped and each person says: I am the morally responsible free agency; I am the slave of sin whom Christ must liberate; I am the fallen being who only have it in me to choose against God till God renews my heart.
The Distinction Between Free Will and Free Agency | Monergism
God values our faith in Christ. He counts it as righteousness. You discount what God has placed His value on.
God is sovereign, but man still responsible for our actions. Jesus was predestined to go on the cross, even before the beginning of creation, God's very name is YHVH, behold nail, behold hand. But the people who put Jesus on the cross are still responsible, unless they repent before they die.
Same for today, every one so claim to be a Christian, is still responsible for our actions.
LORD have mercy!
This surely demonstrates why it is never a good idea to build a doctrine based on one line out of context from scripture.
I have come to see that these doctrines require the adherents of high intellectuals like Packer, Martin Lloyd- Jones, Begg and Sproul because it takes A LOT of high but ultimately empty rhetoric and narrative to make it seem Biblical.
That sounds like you are believing the error of neonomianism, faith replaces the Law for righteousness, the "law of faith".
"Therefore being justified by faith,.... Not that faith is at the first of our justification; for that is a sentence which passed in the mind of God from all eternity, and which passed on Christ, and on all the elect considered in him, when he rose from the dead; see Ro 4:25; nor is it the chief, or has it the chief place in justification; it is not the efficient cause of it, it is God that justifies, and not faith; it is not the moving cause of it, that is the free grace of God; it is not the matter of it, that is the righteousness of Christ: we are not justified by faith, either as God's work in us, for, as such, it is a part of sanctification; nor as our work or act, as exercised by us, for then we should be justified by works, by something of our own, and have whereof to glory; but we are justified by faith objectively and relatively, as that relates to the object Christ, and his righteousness; or as it is a means of our knowledge, and perception of our justification by Christ's righteousness, and of our enjoying the comfort of it;..." John Gill on Romans 5:1
"By God’s act you are in Christ Jesus; God has made him our wisdom, and in him we have our righteousness, our holiness, our liberation. Therefore, in the words of scripture, ‘If anyone must boast, let him boast of the Lord.’" (1Cor 1:30-31, REB)
Christ was innocent of sin, and yet for our sake God made him one with human sinfulness, so that in him we might be made one with the righteousness of God. (2Cor 5:21, REB)
Old Testament prophecy:
“Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will raise up for David a righteous Branch, and he shall reign as king and deal wisely, and shall execute justice and righteousness in the land. In his days Judah will be saved, and Israel will dwell securely. And this is the name by which he will be called: ‘The LORD is our righteousness.’ (Jer 23:5-6, RSV)
“Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will fulfil the promise I made to the house of Israel and the house of Judah. In those days and at that time I will cause a righteous Branch to spring forth for David; and he shall execute justice and righteousness in the land. In those days Judah will be saved and Jerusalem will dwell securely. And this is the name by which it will be called: ‘The LORD is our righteousness.’ (Jer 33:14-16, RSV)
Is this verse true:
Daniel 4:35?
Does God do His will in the armies of heaven and among the inhabitants of the earth?
This one:
Matthew 16:18?
Is Jesus building His church or are individuals building the church?
You see the choices men outwardly make without ever seeing the actions of God that undergird those choices.
Is Acts 2:23 true?
Did wicked men crucify Christ? Did they do so after the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God?
Perhaps you need to view things from God's perspective, and not man's.
You are then also rejecting Augustine, Luther, Calvin, etc. But, maybe you are a Roman Catholic and that would be a normal response.
In one of his confrontations with the Pharisees, Jesus replied, ". . . you are UNWILLING to come to Me that you might have life."
Yes we can see from scripture, people are responsible to decisions.
Also God is sovereign.
I thank God for He found me in my darkness, and brought me to His wonderful light.
A new heart, a new spirit
!!!!
Well stated. Calvinists need to add words to scripture, like “all men means all elect men”, or “repent is commanded to those who are already born again and who are now able to repent”, to make it conform to their mistaken theology. Then they need teachers to spin forth deep sounding explanations on why simple scriptures mean something other than what they clearly say.
Your bride places her faith in you when she declares "I do,' and she takes and stands 'in your name.'
You don't have to recognize His righteousness as mine. It only matters as long as God does, it doesn't matter what you want to call it.
Same thing,, the Faith He gives comes by way of regeneration by the Spirit, the Spirit reveals Christ as the object of our Faith Jn 16:
13 ;Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
Now this is directed to the disciples, but it includes the Church, His Body. The Spirit will shew the redeemed church Christ and His finished work, and faith them to believe in Him The Spirit Glorifies Christ by giving sinners Faith in Him to believe in Him
See Phi 1:29
Okay I have no problem with that.
Right and it was for a specific people, them already written in the Lambs book of Life Rev 13:8
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Not Roman Catholic .... but I do hold to the Biblical, Orthodox soteriology.
There is a great move for Baptist Churches to return to the Traditional Baptist Statement on Soteriology before they were infiltrated by those who sought to spread the erroneous doctrine of TULIP.
I have learned that another has left a "Reformed" church... Dr. Seth Stiles and we will see a continued exodus due the correct biblical exegesis being put out daily by people like Dr. Leighton Flowers, David Allen and many others.
Early Reformers did NOT preach regeneration preceding faith btw... this doctrine was formulated after DORT.
Calvinists fall into a pattern of reading the Bible not to discover what it means, but to affirm what they already believe it means.
It all gets filtered first through their doctrine in order to gain 'understanding' of it.
What seems to affirm TULIP is readily accepted without any regard or even curiosity for context.
What does not readily affirm TULIP must be 'massaged' to fit.
What cannot be massaged is explained away or dismissed as 'too mysterious' for human understanding.
This is true even if it clearly presents a God who cannot be trusted since His offer of salvation is only for some.
- Status