Revolution in Iran

[Beekeeper]

Go run to those authorities that you trust so much at the UN and file a complaint. Tell them that you are horrified and appalled that Ezekiel 37 is now being fulfilled and will inevitably lead to Ezekiel 38 thru 48.

And that your are sick with worry that Hosea 6:1-2 will lead to the Second Coming.

And that you are mortified that Zechariah chapters 12, 13 and 14 prove that per Acts 1:6, 1:11 and 3:21, Luke 13:35, Luke 21:24, Rom 11:25 the kingdom and land will be restored to the Sons of Jacob the Nation Israel by the express will and command of the Lord Jesus Himself.

And that much to your chagrin, the Greater Joseph actually loves His brothers, and will save them as is proven below.

Gen 45:1 - Then Joseph could not restrain himself before all those who stood by him, and he cried out, “Make everyone go out from me!” So no one stood with him while Joseph made himself known to his brothers.

Gen 50:20 - “But as for you, you meant evil against me; but God meant it for good, in order to bring it about as it is this day, to save many people alive.

And that you are filled with dread that the Greater Nazarene, the Greater Samson actually loves his wife and will destroy them that choose to destroy her, as is proven below.

Jdg 15:2 - Her father said, “I really thought that you thoroughly hated her; therefore I gave her to your companion. Is not her younger sister better than she? Please, take her instead.”

Jdg 15:3 - And Samson said to them, “This time I shall be blameless regarding the Philistines if I harm them!”

Jdg 15:8 - So he attacked them hip and thigh with a great slaughter; then he went down and dwelt in the cleft of the rock of Etam.

********************************

You see, I have chosen to be mentally and emotionally grounded in objective proven Biblical facts. Rather than fitfully tossing around emotionally charged political footballs weeping all the while of supposed injustices.

If you choose to spend your days obstinate and willfully antagonistic to prophetic reality and Gods plan of salvation, I expect dark days ahead for you and your like-minded crew.

You give yourself a bit of credit there.
I was not actually praising your theology, just criticizing the spirit that seems to motivate you.

If the UN guy has a copy of the book of Ezekiel on his desk that could prove embarrassing.
What if he was to noticed all the instructions concerning land borders in chapter 48, including a portion for the Levites?
What if he saw all the measurements given for the building of the second temple before it was built?
I would look pretty silly having looked straight over a direct fulfillment of the prophesy wouldn't I?

Anyway I am sure that you did not flood me with so many interpretations all at once because you have any interest in my answers.
People don't do that.
So I ask what are we really trying to achieve?
Are we just trying to sound like the clever guy and get some of those nice emojis?

I can see how all this stuff you are in to helps a political cause, but how does it help you or I?
I can remember being filled with tears, love and uncontrollable happiness at the realization of Jesus' beauty.
The truth is that I feel that less now, but I miss it.
Does your theology give you anything that makes you uncontrollably happy like that?
Anyway that probably sounds like sissy stuff to a tough guy like you.

My Dad is 93 now and has severe cancer.
He wants to refuse medication and let it take its course.
He likes what he calls "the teachings of Jesus", but does not believe that Jesus is the door.
He saw the months leading to the Nakba before he left former Palestine in 1948 and he struggles to accept that the God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob is good.
Throughout his life he has repeatedly heard people attribute the atrocities that he witnessed to that God.
What message of hope would you have for an old man like that?
Would you explain to him how it is all worth it?

I struggle to see how what you are trying to teach has the character of God in it.
It seems that you put many obstacles in front of many people, and offer no hope.

 

[cv5]

That map sure paints a scary picture.
I look at it and imagine that little population of Israelis taking bits of it over the years stage by stage, just like their "buffer zones" in Gaza, West Bank, Lebanon, and Golan Heights.
I think of all the victim stories and "justifications" you would have to keep repeating to us until you are an old lady.
I think of all the millions of collateral "Amalek" that you will have to teach us to blame.
I wonder how that little population will manage to control that huge land that they have no use for.
Will they all learn to fly Apache helicopters by the time they are 5?
You can not blame me for thinking that you have a very radicalized religion.

"I look at it and imagine that little population of Israelis taking bits of it over the years stage by stage, just like their "buffer zones" in Gaza, West Bank, Lebanon, and Golan Heights."

You have to be kidding right? Those boundaries will ONLY be assigned post Second Coming during the millennium.

 

[cv5]

You know what Paul wrote...

....for I made the decision to know nothing [that is, to forego philosophical or theological discussions regarding inconsequential things and opinions while] among you except Jesus Christ, and Him crucified [and the meaning of His redemptive, substitutionary death and His resurrection].

AMP 1 Cor 2:2

You say that the time of Jacobs trouble aka great tribulation that triggers the confession/repentance/redemption of the Nation Israel and the Second Coming and millennial age prophesied so often that the topic takes up perhaps 30% (if not more) of the Bible are "inconsequential things"?

Oh but I beg to differ. In fact this is the core theme in all of the Bible.
And what is that again, this core theme?

Seeking and saving that which was lost.
Redeeming the fallen and dispossessed back to fellowship with their Creator.
Redeeming the planet earth back to its original sinless state.

 

[HeIsHere]

You say that the time of Jacobs trouble aka great tribulation that triggers the confession/repentance/redemption of the Nation Israel and the Second Coming and millennial age prophesied so often that the topic takes up perhaps 30% (if not more) of the Bible are "inconsequential things"?

Oh but I beg to differ. In fact this is the core theme in all of the Bible.
And what is that again, this core theme?

Seeking and saving that which was lost.
Redeeming the fallen and dispossessed back to fellowship with their Creator.
Redeeming the planet earth back to its original sinless state.

Will God force every Jew to believe sometime in the future is that what you believe?

 

[Churchgoer]

The Real God loves His wife of old Israel and will surely redeem her. In fact this is both pivotal and essential to fulfill all "end time" prophecy.

Oh and BTW, there are many MANY Biblically illiterate and/or willfully antagonistic persons on this thread that gleefully declare that YHVH hates Israel and has rejected her forever. Or even more bizarrely, say that the book of Hosea refers to the Church!

In his systematic framework of *Israelology*, prominent Messianic theologian Dr. Arnold Fruchtenbaum outlines a concept known as **"The Wife of Jehovah."** He uses the literal historical relationship between the prophet Hosea and his unfaithful wife, Gomer, as the primary type (or prophetic model) for God's relationship with the nation of Israel.

Fruchtenbaum summarizes this redemption through distinct legal and relational stages, focusing heavily on cycles of **rejection (divorce/separation)** and **ultimate loving redemption (remarriage)**.

## 1. The Type of Rejection (The Great Adultery & Separation)
Fruchtenbaum notes that just as Gomer broke her marriage covenant through literal prostitution, Israel committed spiritual adultery by pursuing false gods. This resulted in a formal period of rejection and separation.

### Specific Passages of Rejection:
* **The Prostitution of the Land:** **Hosea 1:2** sets the stage for the rejection. God commands Hosea to *“Go, take unto thee a wife of whoredoms and children of whoredoms; for the land hath committed great whoredom, departing from the Lord.”* Gomer’s unfaithfulness mirrors Israel's unfaithfulness.

* **The Symbolic Rejection of the Children:** In **Hosea 1:6 and 1:9**, Gomer’s children are given names that reveal God’s withdrawal of covenantal care from the northern kingdom:
* *Lo-Ruhamah* (**1:6**): Meaning "No Mercy" or "Unpitied."
* *Lo-Ammi* (**1:9**): Meaning "Not My People." God explicitly states, *“for ye are not my people, and I will not be your God.”*

* **The Legal Divorce and Stripping of Provisions:** In **Hosea 2:2-5**, the language of a formal divorce is invoked: *“Plead with your mother, plead: for she is not my wife, neither am I her husband.”* God threatens to strip her of her blessings (vines, fig trees, wool, and flax) because she credited her pagan lovers for her prosperity.

* **The Period of Separation:** **Hosea 3:3-4** models the long period of isolation where Gomer must stay secluded without a husband, typifying how *“the children of Israel shall abide many days without a king, and without a prince, and without a sacrifice.”*

## 2. The Type of Loving Redemption (The New Betrothal)
Fruchtenbaum emphasizes that Israel's divorce and separation are not final. Under the unconditional aspects of the patriarchal covenants, God initiates a loving redemption that culminates in a future remarriage during the Messianic Kingdom.

### Specific Passages of Loving Redemption:
* **The Purchase from Slavery:** **Hosea 3:1-2** serves as the literal type of redemption. Even though Gomer is enslaved and deeply degraded, God commands Hosea: *“Go yet, love a woman beloved of her friend, yet an adulteress, according to the love of the Lord toward the children of Israel.”* Hosea physically buys her back out of the slave market for fifteen pieces of silver and a quantity of barley. Fruchtenbaum points out that this demonstrates God's grace—buying back a wife who brings nothing to the table but her shame.

* **The Wilderness Wooing:** **Hosea 2:14-15** shows God changing His tone from judgment to tender restoration: *“Therefore, behold, I will allure her, and bring her into the wilderness, and speak comfortably unto her.”*

* **The Reversal of Rejection Names:** In **Hosea 2:23**, God systematically undoes the names of rejection: *“And I will sow her unto me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy [Ruhamah]; and I will say to them which were not my people [Ammi], Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my my God.”*

* **The Eternal Betrothal:** **Hosea 2:19-20** provides the ultimate summary of this loving redemption:
> *“And I will betroth thee unto me forever; yea, I will betroth thee unto me in righteousness, and in judgment, and in lovingkindness, and in mercies. I will even betroth thee unto me in faithfulness: and thou shalt know the Lord.”*
>
### The Theological Summary
Fruchtenbaum concludes that the book of Hosea demonstrates that Israel's national history tracks perfectly with Gomer's narrative. Though Israel is currently in the "Stage of Separation" (Hosea 3:4), national repentance at the end of the age will lead to her final restoration, where she will permanently become the faithful, clean, and beautifully redeemed **Wife of Jehov
ah** (**Hosea 3:5**).

Sorry I don't buy this analogy at all.

30 years walk with Lord, I am not a baby believer anymore. Will not be swayed by every jehowa witness, or Mormon or 2 way of salvation or any teaching that is taking people away from the real Gospel, or to worship a political system for salvation, or to follow one single human s idea....

There is no other way. Repent today and come to Jesus, the only way today.

Scripture never teaching us to commit all the sins of the world in order to build a political system, which will prepare Jesus 2nd coming, completely false!!!!

Jesus says if you love me, follow my commandments.

 

[HeIsHere]

Colossians 1:25-27
I was made a minister of this church according to the commission from God granted to me for your benefit, so that I might fully carry out the preaching of the word of God, that is, the mystery which had been hidden from the past ages and generations, but now has been revealed to His saints, to whom God willed to make known what the wealth of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles is, the mystery that is Christ in you, the hope of glory.

† Now manifested proves it was already revealed, not future, but present in their time (Colossians 1:26)
† Fulfil the word of God connects directly to the finishing of the mystery, showing completion, not continuation (Revelation 10:7)
† Christ in you shows the result of the mystery, not something coming later, but a present reality (Galatians 2:20)

 

[cv5]

Sorry I don't buy this analogy at all.

30 years walk with Lord, I am not a baby believer anymore. Will not be swayed by every jehowa witness, or Mormon or 2 way of salvation or any teaching that is taking people away from the real Gospel, or to worship a political system for salvation, or to follow one single human s idea....

There is no other way. Repent today and come to Jesus, the only way today.

Scripture never teaching us to commit all the sins of the world in order to build a political system, which will prepare Jesus 2nd coming, completely false!!!!

Jesus says if you love me, follow. Y commandments.

Of course you don't. You have consistently refused to hear sound exegetically thorough Biblically grounded doctrine, but rather choose to live in your own childish little soundproof bubble while you vainly excoriate the foregoing.

 

[WayneNSO]

Of course you don't. You have consistently refused to hear sound exegetically thorough Biblically grounded doctrine, but rather choose to live in your own childish little soundproof bubble while you vainly excoriate the foregoing.

Says the person who Iggy's people for quoting scripture which refutes what he says lol

 

[Churchgoer]

Says the person who Iggy's people for quoting scripture which refutes what he says lol

Correct, all we can say is choose this day who you want to serve, the real God, or the idols.

All in God's hand!

 

[cv5]

Will God force every Jew to believe sometime in the future is that what you believe?

You have leveled that ridiculous accusation several times.
However, as usual, the Scripture vindicates my view as accurate.
Which of course follows the consistent Biblical mandate: valid repentance has to be a sincere expression of one's own free will.

Hos 6:1
Come, and let us return unto the LORD: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.

Hos 6:2
After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.

Hos 6:3
Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth.

 

[WayneNSO]

You have leveled that ridiculous accusation several times.
However, as usual, the Scripture vindicates my view as accurate.
Which of course follows the consistent Biblical mandate: valid repentance has to be a sincere expression of one's own free will.

Hos 6:1
Come, and let us return unto the LORD: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.

Hos 6:2
After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.

Hos 6:3
Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth.

All fulfilled at Calvary

 

[HeIsHere]

You have leveled that ridiculous accusation several times.
However, as usual, the Scripture vindicates my view as accurate.
Which of course follows the consistent Biblical mandate: valid repentance has to be a sincere expression of one's own free will.

Hos 6:1
Come, and let us return unto the LORD: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.

Hos 6:2
After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.

Hos 6:3
Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth.

So they had free will the first time and did not accept Christ but the second time they will, how convenient for the dispensationalist system. lol

 

[cv5]

I struggle to see how what you are trying to teach has the character of God in it.
It seems that you put many obstacles in front of many people, and offer no hope.

"Oh but I beg to differ. In fact all of that which I post constitutes the core theme in all of the Bible.
And what is that again, this core theme?

Seeking and saving that which was lost.
Redeeming the fallen and dispossessed back to fellowship with their Creator.
Redeeming the planet earth back to its original sinless state."

And that DEFINITELY includes the wife of YHVH, the Nation Israel.
The inevitable fact of which so many here openly defy, spitefully despise and rail against in a "SPIRIT" of wickedness.

 

[cv5]

So they had free will the first time and did not accept Christ but the second time they will, how convenient for the dispensationalist system. lol

No "second chances" if you are a supersessionist. Did I get that right?

Its a tough life being a hard hearted Israel despiser. And the consequences are too awful to contemplate.

 

[cv5]

All fulfilled at Calvary

Standard fake false supersessionist dogma and effortlessly debunked.
You and your crew are being made fools of, and this is both necessary and useful.

 

[HeIsHere]

The fruit of dispensationalism is on display. Take note.

 

[cv5]

The fruit of dispensationalism is on display. Take note.

The fruit of dispensationalism is the love for the people He foreknew the wife of YHVH the nation Israel.
And I can say with complete confidence that the bitter fruit of supersessionism will have its just reward.

 

[dkontner]

The 'world' will destroy ' Mystery Babylon' and then the Lord comes and destroys the the 'world'. God does this kind of thing all through the OT. There was a reason for the events of 1948, the scriptures can not be broken. 70 AD should have been a warning. When the Lord returns, no more wars.

Matthew 23
29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,
30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.
31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.
32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.
36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.
37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

 

[cv5]

The 'world' will destroy ' Mystery Babylon' and then the Lord comes and destroys the the 'world'. God does this kind of thing all through the OT. There was a reason for the events of 1948, the scriptures can not be broken. 70 AD should have been a warning. When the Lord returns, no more wars.

Matthew 23
29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,
30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.
31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.
32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.
36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.
37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Oh look, there it is........verse 39!
And it just so happens that this verse once again proves that the "dispensationalist" view:
"in that day", in the latters days, the Nation Israel will undoubtedly RECEIVE their King, Jesus Messiah.

Mat 23:38
Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Mat 23:39
For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, ***till*** ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

In Fruchtenbaum’s system, Matthew 23:39 is one of the decisive New Testament texts establishing that the Second Coming is contingent upon a future, corporate Jewish acknowledgment of Jesus as Israel’s Messiah.


Christ has just pronounced judgment upon “this generation” and Jerusalem, but then says:

“Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.”

Fruchtenbaum takes the word “till” seriously. It does not mean Israel will never see Him again; it establishes the condition under which they will see Him again. The nation that officially rejected Him must someday officially receive Him.


The quotation is from Psalm 118:26, part of the Egyptian Hallel Psalms (Psalms 113–118), traditionally associated with the Passover season. But in Matthew 23 it is no longer merely a festive greeting. In Fruchtenbaum’s reading, Jesus turns it into Israel’s future confession:

“Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.”

That is, Israel’s surviving remnant—and, ultimately, the nation in its representative leadership—will recognize that Jesus is the One sent by YHWH and will petition Him to return. Fruchtenbaum explicitly states that Jesus “will not come back to the earth until the Jews and the Jewish leaders ask Him to come back,” identifying Matthew 23:39 as the basis for that conclusion.

• It is not merely that individual Jews become believers during the Tribulation.
• It is that Israel, in a national and representative sense, turns to Messiah Jesus.
• That confession occurs in the end-time distress commonly called Jacob’s Trouble.
• The national plea for Messiah’s return is answered by the visible Second Coming.

Fruchtenbaum normally connects Matthew 23:39 with passages such as:

• Leviticus 26:40–42 — Israel confesses her iniquity, and God remembers His covenant with Jacob, Isaac, Abraham, and the land.
• Deuteronomy 30:1–10 — after dispersion and tribulation, Israel returns to the LORD and is regathered.
• Hosea 5:15 — “I will go and return to my place, till they acknowledge their offence, and seek my face: in their affliction they will seek me early.”
• Zechariah 12:10 — Jerusalem looks upon the One whom they pierced and mourns.
• Zechariah 13:8–9 — the refined remnant says, “The LORD is my God.”
• Isaiah 53:1–9 — in Fruchtenbaum’s future-remnant reading, Israel finally confesses that the rejected Servant bore our sins.
• Romans 11:25–27 — after the present partial hardening, “all Israel shall be saved,” in connection with the Deliverer coming out of Zion.

Thus Matthew 23:39 is not, for Fruchtenbaum, a vague statement that there will always be some Jewish believers somewhere. It is a prophetic pledge that the rejected King will remain absent from Israel in His visible earthly presence until Israel says the words of Psalm 118 with faith and recognition. Then He comes—not to begin the Church age, but to deliver the repentant remnant, judge His enemies, restore Israel, and inaugurate the Messianic Kingdom.

 

[cv5]

So they had free will the first time and did not accept Christ but the second time they will, how convenient for the dispensationalist system. lol

Futurism has ALL of the right answers. And the crucifixion led to the ASCENSION and the Church Age.
Not the time of Jacobs trouble, nor the Return (IMMEDIATELY AFTER).
The crucifixion DID however fulfill these "UNTIL" statements.

So now the ball is in your court. Explain if you can these crucial UNTIL statements.

Act 1:11
Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

Act 3:21
Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

Luk 13:35
Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

Luk 21:24
And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Rom 11:25
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.