If you must be saved before you can believe the gospel, then something other than the gospel saves you — according to Calvinists.
brightfame52 said:
One must be saved before they can believe the Gospel of their Salvation !
Calvinism is Gospel !
- Thread starter brightfame52
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
- Status
brightfame52 said:
One must be saved before they can believe the Gospel of their Salvation !
The Cult of Calvin cannot answer a question without running down the giver of the question. Just ask the hard, obvious questions and watch them go nuts.
That's not what was stated at all. Adam was not tainted with a sin nature.
My first statement was actually incorrect. Adam's will was not free. It was still subject to his nature. And this is what you don't understand. Being able to make choices is not the same thing as having free will. All beings are subject to their nature; including God. God cannot sin. Why? Because sin is contrary to God's nature. Likewise, there are limitations to all humans because of their nature. And those limitations increased as a result of sin.
Here we have an example of the tulip projection technique.
Here we have an example of the truth of God being foolishness to tulipists.
Its like trapped or cornered animals they go into attack mode
Only they get cornered by scripture Well, that is an interesting question.
Yes would mean Adam could not be blamed justly for eating.
No would mean Adam was morally perfect.
However, God said Adam as created was good, not perfect.
Apparently moral perfection could only be achieved via the process we call salvation history culminating with Christ and sanctification via cooperation with the HS.
Thus, Adam's sin was inevitable, which may be why Genesis does not describe a period of moral goodness between Adam's creation and his sin.
Wrong. Ability to make choices is the very definition of free will.
I've never said anyone isn't accountable before God. But we are all accountable before God because Adam sinned since we are all in Adam. That's because he was our representative. As said representative, his consequences became ours.
Free will is the ability to make every choice; not some.
If you prefer the term limited free will I'm good with that. But something free is unencumbered. So if something hinders the will, it cannot be free. That pesky thing that hinders the will is the nature of the entity...the way it was created. Dogs don't fly. Why? They weren't made that way. It's not in their nature.
What is true on a physical level is also true on the spiritual level. Man's nature governs his spirit as well.
I certain that is what endeared me to our Lord, that, although my natural mind thought it was foolish to think God loved the world so much as that He sent His son to die for the sins of the world, I was willing to be a fool for Him and believe what I'd heard. And it was about that moment that He let me know just how much His love is immeasurable and overflowing into every desert baked crack and fissure in my heart.
I had come to that point where I didn't care if the rest of the world regarded me as an idiot for believing that God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son so that it might be saved. And since, even now, not even the suggestion that I'm an idiot draws a blink from me because I, personally, know I can't measure God's love but now clearly see how much any other idiot trying to pin it down to an exact measure is a fool for even suggesting the possibility. God's love is unlimited.
He loves the world so much that He is willing even to suffer them the desires of their own wicked and self-centered hearts.
AND, unlike the rest of world, He didn't make a fool out of me for believing in Him. in fact, He lifted me up with Him and said to me, "You are My beloved. You are Mine."
- Status