The Parable of the Ten Virgins does not refer to the church

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Wise and foolish is defined in the parable as having prepared for this event or not having prepared. Why would the Bride invite unbelievers to be her bridesmaids? Why would unbelievers have lamps that are lit, even if they are going out. Oil does not represent faith, it represents the Spirit. Some of these believers are "Spirit filled" and some barely have enough oil to keep it lit for a very short period of time.

Once again, all of this is traditional teaching going back a hundred years. Darby, Watchman Nee, and many others taught this. You are simply regurgitating and parroting what many others have taught.

What they didn't teach is:

1. Why bridesmaids?
2. What is the Midnight Cry?

I think it is a valid point to say they go to the two witnesses to buy the oil, but the two witnesses begin their ministry when the first lamp of Hanukkah is lit, and 1,260 days later they are martyred on 2nd Passover. What directly ties to this parable is that the first day of Hanukkah is also the first day that you can no longer offer the first fruit of oil to God. Hence the door is shut on that day.

C'mon GWH; learn something today.

Today I have learned that you hate/omit Matt. 25:10-13.
 
Would there really be time after the cry of the archangel to talk to others who were being raptured and for them to tell you to go and buy oil for yourself? I thought that this cry and the rapture takes place in the twinkling of an eye, that seems far to short a time to even worry about your lamp going out. Also being locked out of the wedding indicates they will not be raptured, doesn't mean they can't be martyred for their testimony of the Lord Jesus, and we do see two different groups that are welcomed into heaven, the ones that come out of the tribulation is so great it can't be numbered. They are standing on the glassy sea mingled with fire. Also your interpretation does not explain why there are ten virgins, my interpretation does describe these ten virgins with lamps lit escorting the Bride into the wedding.
@GWH This parable is not intended to be read allegorically. In other words, we are not required to figure out what the virgins or the oil represent. The story, taken as a whole, conveys the message.
 
Today I have learned that you hate/omit Matt. 25:10-13.
Matthew 25:8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.

If your whole life you simply take what someone else teaches and regurgitate it then it explains why the lamps go out when the Lord returns. Incapable of recognizing the Midnight cry, incapable of functioning as a bridesmaid to light the way. Because that oil that lit that lamp for so long has run out and the lamp has gone out.

This is actually very similar to how AI responded. It was like the robot on Lost in Space saying "that does not compute". It is trained to regurgitate what others teach about the Bible and so it kept saying that the ten virgins represented the church and the Bride. So I pointed out that according to the context these ten virgins are the bridesmaids, it is able to read about Galilean weddings and agreed. I asked it where in the New Testament is the church ever referred to as a bridesmaid. The closest verse it could find was Paul saying he wanted to present the church to the Lord as a chaste virgin. I pointed out that those verses describe the church as the bride, not the bridesmaid. It had to admit it could not find a single verse in the New Testament saying the church is a bridesmaid, much less ten bridesmaids.

Now I get why some Christians have a tough time understanding that "no one knows the day or hour" is an idiom for the Feast of Trumpets. But the name in Hebrew means "Day of the awakening blasts". How can they not see that this is referring to the Midnight cry for everyone to wake up because the Lord is coming, and therefore the Midnight cry takes place on Feast of Trumpets?

I get that Christians are careful about astrology. That is fine. But God put the sun, moon and stars in the heavens for signs and seasons, and that specifically refers to the appointed days of His feast days. In revelation 12 the "great sign in the heavens" of a woman crowned with 12 stars, clothed with the sun and the moon at her feet in labor to give birth is a very specific sign in the heavens of Virgo, "the virgin" and 2017 was the first time this sign has been seen in the heavens since the New Testament times. Since it occurred on the Feast of Trumpets this "great sign" is "an awakening blast", "a midnight cry".

100 years ago there was no reason to talk about 2017. But according to the New Testament we are supposed to feed saints "at the appropriate time". Now is the appropriate time to talk about 2017. Repeating messages from a hundred years ago is not the same thing as the word of God being a light unto your path. If you can't give the saints the food at the appropriate time it is the same thing as your lamp going out. Memorizing someone else's sermon is not the same thing as being able to go to the Lord and get a fresh word today from the Lord.
 
@GWH This parable is not intended to be read allegorically. In other words, we are not required to figure out what the virgins or the oil represent. The story, taken as a whole, conveys the message.
By that logic the lamp is not supposed to give light.

The word of God is supposed to be a lamp unto my feet. That is why the Ten virgins have lamps, to light the way to the wedding feast.
 
@GWH This parable is not intended to be read allegorically. In other words, we are not required to figure out what the virgins or the oil represent. The story, taken as a whole, conveys the message.

The NIV calls it a parable, followed by the Parable of the Bags of Gold and the Parable of the Sheep and Goats.
The clue is "The kingdom of heaven will be like", which indicates metaphorical/allegorical language follows this simile
(cf. Matt. 13:24, 31, 33, 44, 47, etc.).

And we ARE left to figure out what the virgins and oil represent, because in the passage Jesus does not explain it, as he did for the Parable of the Sower/Seed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Roger316
Matthew 25:8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.

If your whole life you simply take what someone else teaches and regurgitate it then it explains why the lamps go out when the Lord returns. Incapable of recognizing the Midnight cry, incapable of functioning as a bridesmaid to light the way. Because that oil that lit that lamp for so long has run out and the lamp has gone out.

This is actually very similar to how AI responded. It was like the robot on Lost in Space saying "that does not compute". It is trained to regurgitate what others teach about the Bible and so it kept saying that the ten virgins represented the church and the Bride. So I pointed out that according to the context these ten virgins are the bridesmaids, it is able to read about Galilean weddings and agreed. I asked it where in the New Testament is the church ever referred to as a bridesmaid. The closest verse it could find was Paul saying he wanted to present the church to the Lord as a chaste virgin. I pointed out that those verses describe the church as the bride, not the bridesmaid. It had to admit it could not find a single verse in the New Testament saying the church is a bridesmaid, much less ten bridesmaids.

Now I get why some Christians have a tough time understanding that "no one knows the day or hour" is an idiom for the Feast of Trumpets. But the name in Hebrew means "Day of the awakening blasts". How can they not see that this is referring to the Midnight cry for everyone to wake up because the Lord is coming, and therefore the Midnight cry takes place on Feast of Trumpets?

I get that Christians are careful about astrology. That is fine. But God put the sun, moon and stars in the heavens for signs and seasons, and that specifically refers to the appointed days of His feast days. In revelation 12 the "great sign in the heavens" of a woman crowned with 12 stars, clothed with the sun and the moon at her feet in labor to give birth is a very specific sign in the heavens of Virgo, "the virgin" and 2017 was the first time this sign has been seen in the heavens since the New Testament times. Since it occurred on the Feast of Trumpets this "great sign" is "an awakening blast", "a midnight cry".

100 years ago there was no reason to talk about 2017. But according to the New Testament we are supposed to feed saints "at the appropriate time". Now is the appropriate time to talk about 2017. Repeating messages from a hundred years ago is not the same thing as the word of God being a light unto your path. If you can't give the saints the food at the appropriate time it is the same thing as your lamp going out. Memorizing someone else's sermon is not the same thing as being able to go to the Lord and get a fresh word today from the Lord.

The astute will realize that your reply did not deny my noting that you hate/omit Matt. 25:10-13, presumably because it obviously refutes your pet opinion regarding the meaning of the Virgin Parable.
You would do better by asking AI how those verses support not equating the wise virgins with the good soil, wheat and sheep and the foolish virgins with the bad soil, tares and goats.
 
The astute will realize that your reply did not deny my noting that you hate/omit Matt. 25:10-13, presumably because it obviously refutes your pet opinion regarding the meaning of the Virgin Parable.
You would do better by asking AI how those verses support not equating the wise virgins with the good soil, wheat and sheep and the foolish virgins with the bad soil, tares and goats.
Well the wise will see that it did. That focusing on verses 10-13 is simply regurgitating what other Bible teachers and sermons teach, while the crux of that message on being wise is being able to prepare by buying the oil for yourself and not simply parroting what others teach.
 
  • Wow
Reactions: GWH
By that logic the lamp is not supposed to give light.

The word of God is supposed to be a lamp unto my feet. That is why the Ten virgins have lamps, to light the way to the wedding feast.
Lamps give light because that's what lamps do.

Some of Jesus’ parables are completely understandable as straightforward stories and were never meant to be decoded as allegories. The parable of the ten virgins is one of the clearest: its meaning emerges from the story itself without assigning symbolic value to every detail. Jesus is going away for a long time, and His disciples must be prepared for an extended delay. Some will remain ready; some will not. The point lands even if we never identify what the oil stands for or try to map each element to a hidden spiritual counterpart. The story teaches vigilance, patience, and readiness, and we grasp the message simply by following the narrative rather than dissecting it into symbols.
 
Lamps give light because that's what lamps do.

Some of Jesus’ parables are completely understandable as straightforward stories and were never meant to be decoded as allegories. The parable of the ten virgins is one of the clearest: its meaning emerges from the story itself without assigning symbolic value to every detail. Jesus is going away for a long time, and His disciples must be prepared for an extended delay. Some will remain ready; some will not. The point lands even if we never identify what the oil stands for or try to map each element to a hidden spiritual counterpart. The story teaches vigilance, patience, and readiness, and we grasp the message simply by following the narrative rather than dissecting it into symbols.
And who are you to limit the word of God?
 
The NIV calls it a parable, followed by the Parable of the Bags of Gold and the Parable of the Sheep and Goats.
The clue is "The kingdom of heaven will be like", which indicates metaphorical/allegorical language follows this simile
(cf. Matt. 13:24, 31, 33, 44, 47, etc.).

And we ARE left to figure out what the virgins and oil represent, because in the passage Jesus does not explain it, as he did for the Parable of the Sower/Seed.
While the story is intended to work as an analogy using metaphor, it is not intended as an allegory,

Some of Jesus’ parables are completely understandable as straightforward stories and were never meant to be decoded as allegories. The parable of the ten virgins is one of the clearest: its meaning emerges from the story itself without assigning symbolic value to every detail. Jesus is going away for a long time, and His disciples must be prepared for an extended delay. Some will remain ready; some will not. The point lands even if we never identify what the oil stands for or try to map each element to a hidden spiritual counterpart. The story teaches vigilance, patience, and readiness, and we grasp the message simply by following the narrative rather than dissecting it into symbols.

Allegories usually place animals or objects in unusual or impossible situations—like a fox eating grapes or trees voting for a king—to signal that the story is meant to be decoded symbolically. But the parable of the ten virgins contains nothing like that. The characters behave exactly as real people would in a real wedding procession: they wait, they grow tired, they fall asleep, and some bring enough oil while others do not. Nothing in the story is fantastical or out of place, which tells us it is not an allegory but a straightforward lesson. Jesus is teaching that His return may be delayed and His disciples must be prepared for that delay. The meaning emerges naturally from the narrative without needing to assign symbolic value to the oil or any other element.
 
Lamps give light because that's what lamps do.

Some of Jesus’ parables are completely understandable as straightforward stories and were never meant to be decoded as allegories. The parable of the ten virgins is one of the clearest: its meaning emerges from the story itself without assigning symbolic value to every detail. Jesus is going away for a long time, and His disciples must be prepared for an extended delay. Some will remain ready; some will not. The point lands even if we never identify what the oil stands for or try to map each element to a hidden spiritual counterpart. The story teaches vigilance, patience, and readiness, and we grasp the message simply by following the narrative rather than dissecting it into symbols.

IOW, you agree that the point of the parable is the need for perseverance per Matt. 7:21-23?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Roger316
Nowhere in the New Testament is the church referred to as "bridesmaids" for the wedding of the Lord. So then, who are these ten bridesmaids in Matthew 25?
10 virgins.
It is the Church without a doubt.
 
While the story is intended to work as an analogy using metaphor, it is not intended as an allegory,

Some of Jesus’ parables are completely understandable as straightforward stories and were never meant to be decoded as allegories. The parable of the ten virgins is one of the clearest: its meaning emerges from the story itself without assigning symbolic value to every detail. Jesus is going away for a long time, and His disciples must be prepared for an extended delay. Some will remain ready; some will not. The point lands even if we never identify what the oil stands for or try to map each element to a hidden spiritual counterpart. The story teaches vigilance, patience, and readiness, and we grasp the message simply by following the narrative rather than dissecting it into symbols.

Allegories usually place animals or objects in unusual or impossible situations—like a fox eating grapes or trees voting for a king—to signal that the story is meant to be decoded symbolically. But the parable of the ten virgins contains nothing like that. The characters behave exactly as real people would in a real wedding procession: they wait, they grow tired, they fall asleep, and some bring enough oil while others do not. Nothing in the story is fantastical or out of place, which tells us it is not an allegory but a straightforward lesson. Jesus is teaching that His return may be delayed and His disciples must be prepared for that delay. The meaning emerges naturally from the narrative without needing to assign symbolic value to the oil or any other element.
Well not really.
Every parable has components.
The allegory has both naturally understood components and spiritually discerned components.

You discerned the virgins are the church.
Which is correct.
 
10 virgins.
It is the Church without a doubt.
Well the one thing that is certainly without doubt is that this is your private interpretation, not based on any other New Testament verse at all.
 
Half of Christ's church shut out of heaven?
They get in later. Martyred for refusing the mark.

The chuch contains the bride.
The bride is part of the church.
Paul addresses this in his depiction of the different classes of believers.
 
  • Wow
Reactions: GWH
Well the one thing that is certainly without doubt is that this is your private interpretation, not based on any other New Testament verse at all.
Tell me who they are in your superior interpretation.
 
Well not really.
Every parable has components.
The allegory has both naturally understood components and spiritually discerned components.

You discerned the virgins are the church.
Which is correct.
Talk about fudge factor, with that you could make any parable say anything you want and there is no way to falsify any interpretation.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DavidLamb
Well the one thing that is certainly without doubt is that this is your private interpretation, not based on any other New Testament verse at all.
Not based on verses ?
Look it up in the Greek.
You use "bridesmaids".
It is more correctly translated "virgins".
Seems your private interpretation is easily challenged.
 
Talk about fudge factor, with that you could make any parable say anything you want and there is no way to falsify any interpretation.
Why the hostile attitude?
Of course most every verse can be fudged.
You think you are deity, and nobody has the right to challenge you?