should women submit totaly to their husbands

RoboOp · May 21, 2009

Look at it this way. If the wife has sexual desire, and the man doesn't at that moment, should he say no to his wife, and refuse to fulfill her? That would be selfish, wouldn't it? Likewise........................ (you can complete the rest).

So, it's not only when both want to, it's when either wants to. (1 Cor 7:3-5) And yah just because the woman doesn't have those desires as often as the husband, doesn't mean that she should be selfish and refuse to fulfill her husband's desire just because she doesn't have the desire. (Or vice-versa, of course.)

sabrina29 · May 21, 2009

seems like the bible was made for men and not women. what's the difference between the bible teaching and the quran teaching when it comes to women? don't they both tell the women to be quiet and submit?

mcap · May 21, 2009

While reading 1 Corinthians I read that Paul was telling the church that a womans body does not belong totally to her and the same for a man.He also said If somebody planned on marrying to marry a believer.I know the Bible says for a woman to submit totally to her husband but doesn't it say the same for the man?I
When I married my wife she was a Christian and I was not.She has a very strong will and she eventually changed my views.Before this happened we argued constantly and were on the verge of divorce.Since my change we have become much more civil and our marriage is solid.
I guess what I'm trying to say is If a believer marries a believer submission should not be an issue.Hope I didn't confuse anyone.

RoboOp · May 21, 2009

No, it does not say for a man to totally submit to his wife. It says the other way around. Go read your Bible. Ephesians 5. Wives submit (totally), husbands love (totally). And loving your wife does not necessarily mean submitting to her in everything -- that's not leadership.

In the bedroom however it's totally mutual

Submit to each other's sexual desires. (1 Cor 7).

Braveheart47 · May 21, 2009

That story was from a woman, it was her testimony concerning her relationship and she gave it as a testimony of God's grace, patience, obedience and fruit. It was not a recommendation or given with that intent. The woman was never raped by her husband and to throw that thought and imagination into it, is not very wise and I am sure she would lovingly tell you different

One thing I have learned in working with abused woman and children is that a lot of the time they do not realize the kind of damage is done to them. They would tell you themselves they are not damaged, but in thoughts and behavior would tell you different. I have never met a woman who had sex with her husband when she didn't want not be damaged. And those who are healthy will tell you, it did indeed harm them.

And to Robocop...like I said...you take one verse and try to make and arguement, and that is not only bad hermanutics,(interpretation), it is just illogical and can be used by humans to abuse others, and by Satan himself to dupe others. As my pastor once said... a man opened the bible and pointed his finger and the scripture said "Judas hung himself", then he did it again and he pointed his finger at a verse saying "go and do likewise". Let us all be careful to use prayer, contemplation, and full use of the bible, when interpreting it. Remember, Satan used scripture to tempt Jesus.

Braveheart47 · May 21, 2009

RoboOp said:

Wow, This stuff really concerns me. If a husband wants to have sex with his wife, she has the right to say no. That is our basic human right. If he wants to change her mind, he can help her do that, but if she still doesn't, then she doesn't have to. Same with the wife, if she is in the mood and he isn't, she can help with that but if he still doesn't want to, he doesn't have to. This is basic human respect for one another. I do nt' believe these verses you pull out of context support having sex with someone when you don't want to. These are principles, not literal. Understand the difference.

RoboOp · May 21, 2009

Braveheart, I haven't quoted any scriptures out of context. 1 Cor 7 does tell each spouse to not refuse the other (in the bed). I don't know what other kind of "interpretation" you can make of it, and if you do you make some other "interpretation" of that, well, that my friend, is very "bad hermeneutics". If I refused my wife, that would be selfish. And vice-versa. I'm speaking in general -- and I'm simply speaking what the scripture says.

Braveheart47 · May 21, 2009

The fruit of the spirit is love joy peace PATIENCE, AND SELF CONTROL!!!!!!

It would be selfish of you to ask your wife to have sex with you when she didnt' want to..love your niehgbor as yourself....love does not demand.

Braveheart47 · May 21, 2009

I Corinthians 13:4-8

Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant, does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered, does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth; bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

You have to take all the verses the bible gives us to determine what is right. So just taking the one verse you want to say can't be interpreted any other way, there are many verses you must balance it with all over the scripture.

RoboOp · May 21, 2009

Braveheart47 said:

Braveheart, I don't think it would be selfish of my wife to ask me to have sex when I don't want to, when she has a strong desire. I think it would be selfish of me to refuse her (in general). And vice-versa. But anyway......

Since you feel so strongly about this, and insist that I and many others here wrongly interpret 1 Cor 7 ("bad hermeneutics", etc.), can you please interpret it for us, line by line please. Here it is:

1Now for the matters you wrote about: It is good for a man not to marry. 2But since there is so much immorality, each man should have his own wife, and each woman her own husband. 3The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband. 4The wife's body does not belong to her alone but also to her husband. In the same way, the husband's body does not belong to him alone but also to his wife. 5Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.

Braveheart47 · May 21, 2009

You keep missing my point. No doctrine can be based on one verse without taking into account, the whole bible and its teaching. So this verse, you so much want to promote must be tempered with the whole word of God.

Theses verses are principles in which we need to keep in mind as we live as husband and wife. they are not to be used in its context you want to use it, it is not literally every time a man wants sex and every time a woman wants sex. it is a principle in general that we should care for one anothers needs in this way. But it was never ever supposede to be used as a weapon to sling at someone for not meeting your needs. Like I said, love is not demanding, and when people use verses like this to promote their own agenda, it is no biblical or done in the spirit of the holy spirit. Every verse Satan quoted to Jesus was straight from the bible, so should we do what Satan asked Jesus to do because they were Biblical versess? NO, he used them for his own agenda....and these few scriptures do not encompass the whole will of God...the whole bible has to be considered in basing doctrine.

does that answer your question?

Braveheart47 · May 21, 2009

Robo, do you have a wife? you keep refering him to your wife...so was just checking.

RoboOp · May 22, 2009

Braveheart47 said:

This is your original statement that I responded to, and yes I think 1 Cor 7 is extremely relevant -- it's the most directly relevant passage.

Yes, I'm married, but whether I am or not, I'm speaking in general (using examples, when I say "if I refuse my wife", etc.).

But let me give you a real example. There's a sister who posted in one of the forums here that her husband only wants to have sex with her about once a month. This is a big problem for her. Yes, I apply 1 Cor 7 to that situation, and a vice-versa situation. And yes, I say that her husband is the selfish one, not her.

Braveheart47 · May 22, 2009

Robocop, if you think outside the box, which is very healthy and helpful. Reasons why people are not having sex with their spouses are vast. And until you can deal with the cause it is most likely that the issue will not change. You can't just quote scripture at people and expect that that alone is going to solve the problem. There could be communication problems, medical problems, emotional problems. and those are the things that need to be addressed, not necessarily that she isn't getting enough sex. You talk to any therapist and they will tell you sex issues are usually not about sex, but something else.

And if you want to get so literal about your interpretation, lets check out Matthew 5:29-30.
"If your right eye makes you stumble, tear it out and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. If your right hand makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into hell.

boston · May 23, 2009

I think Woman should submit herself totally to their husband and its husband duty to fulfill her desire.

ashieldoffaith · May 23, 2009

Do you mind if I add something here? This only comes from first hand experience. A friend noticed me having difficulty with submitting to my husbands will and saw how it was tearing me apart to not follow what my heart said I should do. He said I should study the difference between submission and oppression telling me that if both my husband and I were following the will of God, that there would not be a question but rather an answer. And though the study ended up dealing with all authoritative people, the answer is still the same. Sorry if its a little long.

Submission vs. Oppression

A friend once asked me to do a Bible study on the difference between submission and oppression. I wasn’t totally sure where this was headed, but decided to do the study.

Oppression is an unjust or cruel exercise of authority or power, something that oppresses especially in being an unjust or excessive exercise of power. It also says that to feel oppressed is to have a sense of being weighed down in body or mind.

Submission is the act of submitting to the authority or control of another - to yield to governance or authority.

There are many different forms of oppression, as well as submission in our lives today, but the one thing they have in common is they both deal with how we interact with the authority figures around us.

The authorities in our life today are God, the governments for our countries, states, provinces, villages, cities and towns, as well as the authority in our work place, in our home and in our church.

God is our ultimate governing authority. He has given us the Bible to guide us in what He desires us to do and not do. We should submit to the authority of God first and above all, always trying our best to do His will.

Jesus is our prime example of submission. Jesus, in the Garden of Gethsemane, asked God to take the cup from him. Jesus had to take on the sins of the world in order that we can be saved. What an awesomely heavy burden that must be considering how much sin there is. But Jesus submitted to the will of His Father, He became a sin sacrifice for us, so that we may have life.

We also should submit to the will of our Father, and though it may be a difficult task, you need to get your brain out of the way and follow what your heart says - follow what God tells you, even if it means to die so that others might live.

To submit to our government authorities is to follow their laws. If the law says we should not steal, then we should be obedient to that law and not steal. Just as if the law says to drive a speed limit of 45 in a certain area, we should understand it is not only for our safety, but the safety of others and submit to it.

Every person is to be in subjection to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God. Romans 13:1

To be in subjection means to be subordinate, to submit to one's control, to obey or be subject to.

By submitting to the governing authorities, we are also submitting to God’s will. When Paul spoke these words, Christians may not have desired to follow the rule of their non-Christian rulers. However, Paul also explains that if the rulers misuse their authority so that it might cause one to be outside the will of God, then it is better for a person to obey God and not man.

This is also true for the work place, home and especially church. If a person is put into a position that would cause them to be outside the will of God, then it would be better for that person to obey God before man.

The authority at home is husband and wife. Husband is the head, just as Christ is the head of the church.

Wives, be subject to your own husbands, as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body. But as the church is subject to Christ, so also the wives ought to be to their husbands in everything. Husbands, love your wives just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her. Ephesians 5:22-25

It is important to note that it is a relationship, being shown here. It is not a one sided street, but takes both the husband and wife to work together to make it work. Just as our relationship with Christ takes not just the Lord to make it work, but it also takes us to make it a true relationship. A husband should give himself up for his wife, just as a wife should submit to her husband. When this happens it becomes a relationship.

Paul also teaches that when we are married that we tend to care more about the things of the world and how to please our husband or our wife rather than giving true devotion to the Lord (1 Corinthians 7) and that it is better that we be as though we are not married.

The elders of the church have an extremely important job and as the authority in the church, they are held accountable for the teachings and happenings within the church. They are responsible for making sure the people of the church are guided according to the truth of God’s word.

In all these areas the governing rule should be to love those who are under their authority. However, there are some who bring oppression to the people. The word oppression in Hebrew is Tok (toke) and it means injury, oppression, oppressor, fraud, deceit, deceitful.

The most well known oppression by a governmental ruler is the Egyptians. The Egyptians brought oppression to the Israelites (Exodus). The Egyptians demeaned the Israelites and put them into slavery. God delivered His people from the hand of the Egyptians and took them to a better place.

This is also a place to see a good example of following God over man.

Then the king of Egypt spoke to the Hebrew midwives, one of whom was named Shiphrah and the other was named Puah; and he said, “When you are helping the Hebrew women to give birth and see them upon the birthstool, if it is a son, then you shall put him to death; but if it is a daughter, then she shall live.” But the midwives feared God, and did not do as the king of Egypt had commanded them, but let the boys live. So the king of Egypt called for the midwives and said to them, “Why have you done this thing, and let the boys live?” The midwives said to Pharaoh, “Because the Hebrew women are not as the Egyptian women; for they are vigorous and give birth before the midwife can get to them.” So God was good to the midwives, and the people multiplied, and became very mighty. Because the midwives feared God, He established households for them. Exodus 1:15:-21

The midwives understood that killing the boys was against God’s law and chose to follow God before man and God protected them and blessed them for their obedience.

He will rescue their life from oppression and violence, And their blood will be precious in his sight; Psalms 72:14

We too should submit to God over man. If someone tells you to do something you know is wrong, then follow your heart and do what is right. Have trust in God to protect you and know that He will one day say “Job well done!”

But you must first recognize God as being the ultimate authority. Have the faith and trust in Him that He will do as He has promised and He will bless your obedience. Know that He has the ability to harden hearts or soften hearts, He can make the blind see and the deaf hear. He can give life and He can take it away. Absolutely nothing is impossible for God.

If you are a person in a position of authority you need to look at your actions, not from your view, but from the view of those who are submitted to your authority.

Now try to look at your actions from Gods prospective. Are you doing things Gods way, or your way. If you see wrong, correct it. God will help you to get back on track and love others as He desires you to. God is patient beyond all measure, He is forgiving and He loves you.

The fact is, that if you put God first – everything else will fall into place.

imoss · May 23, 2009

awesome post ashieldoffaith! Oh... another thing i'd just quickly like to mention, I have friends who marvel over my husbands & my 19 year & solid relationship... I believe in addition to the fact that it IS biblical to submit, like it or not, you get what you give. Also, me submitting to my husband is not in any way hurting me, you are wrong about this braveheart... But again I state that he loves me (as is a requirement for him) so if he can see i'm absolutely exhausted or have a headache he wont bug me. When that happens i take the time to bug him the next day cause I know its something he needs. Have a willing spirit with your husband, wrap your mind around deciding to love your husband when he feels amourous, its not difficult to change your mind. I was hurt as a child so i had many issues in this area when we were first married. My husband patiently loved me. I still, sometimes, if he tries to wake me up in the middle of the night scream no no no, so yes I know what it is to be hurt & deciding to submit to my husband has not hurt me in the least, believe me! I think its given us a VERY solid relationship where he randomly hugs me and tells me he loves me. I also, most certainly, think its out of line to let other issues effect the bedroom. For starters you dont expect your husband to read your mind on issues and then take your bitterness to the bedroom and deny him there because he couldnt adequately read your thoughts or displeasure in a matter. I only say this because its seems to be a direction lots of my friends take and then they wonder why they are on the verge of divorce. People... men dont read minds. You are thinking he's thinking about you when he';s thinking about work or the baseball game or his harley or whatever... I have a very close friend currently on the verge of divorce who states "body mind & spirit' must be in line b4 she will go that direction... ITS BEEN MONTHS!!! her husband accuses her wrongfully of having an affair... Of course he thinks that. I think whoever told her those lies have done her a great deal of harm. Its hard though to discuss this with her so i just tell her men need sex like we need hugs and affection, if you dont want affection dont give the other.

My favorite verse is wife of nobel Charactor, the outrageous requirement for a wife as outlined by a mother. Why has it become shameful for a woman to want to please God her Husband and her family? For all of you stringent non-submitters, I challenge you... submit for one month and see where it takes your relationship. I'm willing to bet your relationship will improve drastically. Now by submit I mean when you are just tired or just want to read a book...(not if you are ill or in a bad time of the month) just decide to remember what you love about him (or loved about him.) Of course i'm speaking to people with fairly normal relationships (no such thing as totally normal... lol) and not those who are abused by their husbands cause for them, i think they should just get out.

carpetmanswife · May 23, 2009

In the sex department, i feel that if there is the mutual love ,and respect , and self scarifice ,as described in the bible that husbands and wives are supposed to have for one another ,when one or the other isnt interested at that moment for whatever reason..the partner loves and respects the other enough to accept it ,. Much more importantly we'd better be absolutely sure our marriage isnt threatened by a lack of sex because if it is ..i feel that something else is wrong in the heart area, my point being what if God forbid by an accident or illness one partner could no longer perform at all, what do you do? leave them for lack of?? marriage is a matter of the heart ,commitment , come what may.Sex is just a benefit.

p.s. be nice or im never coming outta my dryer!

imoss · May 23, 2009

if you stay in the dryer can i have your red shoes?

DoranisGallant · May 23, 2009

question: should women submit totaly to their husbands
totally*
answer 1: as you may or may not know I have a multiple personality so the personality with the ego which isnt really me at all couldnt stand seeing women with any type of power.

answer 2: however i have a totally submissive personality which is more like the real me that says women should have all the power. so if you are in my shoes you have the jerk with the ego or the guy that lets women walk all over him heh =\

should women submit totaly to their husbands

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