That is the theory proposed by more recent lawyer theologians, but not among the theories of the church in at least the first five centuries. Penal substitutionary atonement (PSA) is not something the Bible teaches. It is something you have been programmed to see in scripture by advocates of the system. The proof of this is that you cannot see the logic of a different understanding of the very same scriptures you use to defend PSA. Are you able to see the reasonable logic in my exposition of those verses from Is 53 ?
Man imputed Jesus with sin on the cross, not God.
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Jesus Christ was a son of Adam, so He like all mankind inherited mortality, which was the consequence of Adam's sin. He would have died eventually because he was human. The reason we know our sins are forgiven is because Jesus prayed to the Father from the cross to forgive those who were murdering Him. That's how I know Jesus wants to forgive the penitent.... if He even wanted to forgive the, as yet, impenitent.
No, Christ was not in Adam. That's the point of the virgin birth. And the reason we know our sins are forgiven is because they have been atoned for.
Are the wages of sin physical death or spiritual death? If it is physical death, then one must explain why Adm lived so long after eating the fruit. but if it is spiritual death, then a long physical life might well be possible.
In Genesis 2:17...you shall surely die...translates to...dying you shall die. In other words, death needn't be instantaneous. It would include both physical and spiritual death.
Isn't the spiritual death immediate and the physical could be immediate and longer, given Adam lived 900+ years?
I know, i'm sorry, It just looked like a good time to sneak that in there
Wow. If Christ wasn't a descendant of Adam, He wasn't human? Mary was a descendant of Adam, and provided half of Jesus' chromosomes.
Where does scripture say that the purpose of the virgin birth was so that Christ would not be in Adam? Perhaps the purpose of the virgin birth was so that we could have a mediator who would be both Divine and human, and fulfil the prophecy,
Isa 9:6
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
While the terms don’t exist, Scripture repeatedly describes a condition of being “dead” in relation to God:
“dead in trespasses and sins” — Ephesians 2:1
“dead in your sins… God made you alive” — Colossians 2:13
“the wages of sin is death” — Romans 6:23
These passages describe a real condition of death, but Scripture never labels it “spiritual death.” That phrase is a later theological shorthand, not biblical vocabulary. Was not my intention to mislead in my use of it.
Actually, you were responding to a poster who recognizes that all the evidence we have from science indicates that either scripture is false or that it was referring to spiritual death as paleontological records indicate that physical death for the genus homo has always existed. But then I maintain that when scripture and science differ, that the one who sees a difference is misunderstanding at least one of the fields, and I also recognize that scripture tells us that God is also revealed in nature, thus science.
But for those who deny that scripture supports the use of and knowledge gainable from science need not worry about contradictions between THEIR understanding of scripture and any source that might indicate that they are wrong.
I didn't say Jesus wasn't a descendant of Adam. I said He wasn't in Adam. Read Romans 5:12. Unless you believe Jesus sinned, He was not under the condemnation that Adam brought upon the human race.
Christ is called the second Adam. Do you know what that means?
I would agree that Genesis 2:17 is referring to physical death, but that doesn't limit its meaning to only that. Other verses speak to a separation from God as death, and others speak to a lack of spiritual connection.
The Bible gives revelation progressively. God didn't include everything in Genesis. Hence, we are instructed to get the full counsel of God and study to show ourselves approved.
The exact Hebrew literal would mean "You shall begin to die". Adam was no longer an immortal being. He became mortal, corruptible (his body began to die) after eating the forbidden fruit.
When Jesus comes that condition is reversed for His people. Our mortal bodies become immortal, corruption becomes incorruptible.
So, because (you claim) God laid my sins on Jesus, I am not subject to the consequences of my behaviour. If I steal or murder, I cannot be arrested and charged and sentenced?
Are you playing dumb or just don't understand the difference between the temporal and the eternal?
Where does scripture say, without ambiguity, that our sins are laid to Jesus Christ's charge?
Sorry. My bad. I did not register the word eternal in reading your first sentence.