Bipolar Disorder – Is it Demons????

River_W · Aug 29, 2012

Don’t mean to butt in, but I’ve been praying about this for awhile…

Moment of Faith, you are asking if bipolar disorder = demon. You say it does, correct?

Firstly, your opinion is skewed because you say that you do not know any bipolar Christian, or Christians that were bipolar before accepting Christ, correct? If so, then you don’t see a very diverse population of bipolar patients.

Secondly, for clarification—are you saying that demonic possession looks like bipolar, or that bipolar looks like possession?

Thirdly: Bipolar disorder—there’s no cure, but you can control the symptoms in a variety of different ways. For some, the symptoms eventually fade. But for many others, without proper treatment daily, they will have a lifetime of mania and depression.

So, I ask you, Moment of Faith, do you think that a person would remain possessed by this demon of bipolar disorder even if they are crying out, “Jesus help me!” from the depths of their soul?

Lastly, there are too many “what abouts.”

What about the affect medication has on many people with bipolar? If it’s not brain chemistry, why are the symptoms suppressed? Are the meds doing something to the demon?

What about the mental disorders that contain key symptoms of bipolar, but are not clinically bipolar? Some of these disorders could include Dissociative Personality Disorder (DID) and Schizoaffective Disorder. If a demon is the cause, could either of the people described below possessed/oppressed?

DID example—a patient can have a personality exhibiting manic like behavior and another personality that remains severely depressed, which, among others, they cycle through.
Schizoaffective Disorder: it’s practically one type of schizophrenia and another mood disorder, such a bipolar, combined!

I’m not saying that demons cannot make someone fall into illnesses such as bipolar disorder by means of possession or oppression, but I cannot see how they are always the cause.

In Christ,
River

pitts288 · Aug 30, 2012

moment_of_faith said:

Since we can't walk away from sin...I would like to come live with you...and remember that you cant blame me for my sin because no body can walk away from sin. I am free to steal your stuff, lie to you, kill the person closest to, sleep with your significant other, I AM FREE TO BRAKE ALL THESE COMMANDMENTS...BECAUSE IT'S IMPOSSIBLE NOT TO LIE, STEAL, KILL, AND COMMIT ADULTERY. I CAN'T HELP IT IT'S IN MY NATURE.

I DON'T THINK YOUR EXCUSE IS GOING TO HOLD UP JUDGEMENT DAY.

YOU TEACH PEOPLE THAT WE HAVE TO DO THESE THINGS, THAT WE CAN'T STOP SINING BECAUSE IT'S IN ARE NATURE....YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED....YOU LEAD PEOPLE AWAY FROM THE LIFE THAT WE ARE TO LIVE FOR ARE GOD.

REPENT...TURN FROM SIN AND PREACH RIGHTEOUSNESS!!!

Katy-follower · Aug 30, 2012

pitts288 said:

Wow. You're teaching a salvation by works.

If we were completely sinless we would be perfect like Jesus. None of us are.

Those of us born again have had the wage of our sin paid for, we've been cleansed, forgiven. We don't have a license to sin, rather we love God and want to live a life pleasing to Him because we are His children by the blood of Jesus. A fruit of salvation is sustained obedience to God's word which is not possible unless a person is saved.

We can never stop sinning completely as we are human and are not immune to attacks and temptations from the devil, but we need to put on the full Armour of God. We will occasionally fail and sin, because we are not perfect, but we feel guilty when we sin.

1 John 1:8-10: "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us"

By the way - there is no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus. A child of God (those born again) will not face the Great White throne judgment because we've been forgiven. That throne is reserved for all who died not being born again, who are doomed to hell. Children of God will receive rewards, not condemnation.

Cobus · Aug 30, 2012

A Christian is nothing else but a Christian. A Christian needs NOTHING. Not chmicals, not demons not salvation not ANYTHING. Not even healing! I believe God when He said... James 1...
My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
Jas 1:3 Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience.
Jas 1:4 But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

Here is a question, how would JEsus deal with a bipolar person? Would Jesus walk around with a box full of chemicals? Why does the modern christian do things different than Jesus? Maybe they are not Christians. that is why they pray and recieve NOTHING Wanting happy drugs... It is a load of ($&462$) I know bipolar and all these "modern" diagnostics and findings are all a load of %^$&# just people justifying there sin.

Excuses Excuses Excuses.. I am just human, I am only a sinner, I was born gay, Iam a destirbed individual but does not want to be.... Hey man.... Jesus said... COME TO ME AND I WILL GIVE YOU REST... So GO! Go to Jesus HE WILL GIVE YOU REST!

This is what I hate about todays Christians, they are so weak, Paul said in His weakness God was strong, but I dod not witness any strong God in the weak Chriatians today, all I witness is pethetic excuses! People wake up and GO TO JESUS!

pitts288 · Aug 30, 2012

Katy-follower said:

YOU TEACH FALSE DOCTRINE!!! I DID NOT SAY WE CAN BE COMPLETELY SINLESS...I SIMPLE SAY WE CAN CHOSE TO STOP SINING. THIS IS WHAT IT MEANS TO REPENT. YOU WOULD UNDERSTAND MORE IF YOU UNDERSTOOD THE RESURRECTION. BUT REMEMBER THE KEY TO UNDERSTANDING HIS RESURRECTION IS IN HIS LIFE AND DEATH. HE LIVED, HE DIED, THEN HE WAS RESURRECTED...WHAT DO THESE THREE THINGS MEAN. ALL THREE THINGS SHOW YOU ONE THING...WHAT IS IT?

spirit · Aug 30, 2012

My brother is bipolar and has nothing to do with whether the person has more faith in God or not , or possession of demons. It is a mental illness and was lucky to stop medication after many years. He is married to a Catholic but is not a Catholic himself. When he is manic its becacuse the illness takes over him, not Demons, so whoever told you that does know the facts of Mental Health

moment_of_faith · Aug 30, 2012

UGLY -- when were you diagnosed? Before accepting Jesus or after ??

That was the demon spending all her money living life large and when it was all gone the demon would leave her with her depression and soon as she was caught up again the demon would come back and do the same to keep her in BONDAGE

River -- You're always welcome. Also if you will read back over the entire post you will see I answered or at least I tried to answer most of those. Now it is several on this post that are not Christian and you can verify that by their profile page. Matter of fact I believe we only have two that say they are Christian and bipolar - Ugly being one and sorry to say I forget the other ladies name.

Now can I bipolar person come to the lord and be saved?? I say YES --- but the few BIPOLAR PEOPLE I know that say they have accepted Jesus as their lord and savior don't believe the bible or at least not all of it or it's literal version. They don't believe in the flood, Jonah, creationism, revelation, healing the sick, casting out demons,

Then they get mad when you ask them how they believe in Jesus but nothing he says. They say stuff like " I don't have to believe in that to be saved " -- Now I say you don't need to know that to be saved, but once you are saved and then read the book you have to stand on the lords account because he said thy word is TRUE.

let me open another can of worms. Evolution -- Did Jesus have to evolve to come out the grave? He said we would be changed in a twinkling of an eye. Does that sound like evolution??

The devil is the deceiver and I believe "Bipolar" is the name he gave us for his torment. Satan is trying to torment all of us and then to throw us off DEMONIC OPPRESSION / POSSESSION he got godless doctors to say it’s a mental disorder, but it’s really satan and the fallen angels tormenting you and at the moment believe it to mostly if not entirely be on unbelievers.

See when things get bad in my life I eventually fall down on my knees and say Lord I'm sorry / I repent / I can't do it on my own / I need you / Please Help Me.

Not the bipolar people I have met. They say the lord gave me a brain and I'm going to use it. I don't have time to wait on the lord. I have to take action now. I would be living on the street if I took your advice and I believe someone has already said that on this thread.

They put no FAITH in JESUS because in their heart they don’t believe him. That’s why they say the name Jesus without scaring the demon because that name means nothing to the person using it. A Christian uses the lord Jesus Christ name with GREAT ATHURIOTY
Now I could be wrong and that’s why this thread was created so anyone and everyone can chime in.

Medicine – I had posted once already but don’t feel like looking up again but basically for several reasons the medicine helps

1. Maybe the medicine calms the fallen angels also. They know they are going to the lake of fire and time is getting shorter.
2. Maybe the meds keep the person so NUMB to the WORLD the demon can’t have fun with them. Can’t make them shop till they have no money or whatever.
3. Maybe the meds keep them in chains and just where the devil wants them

And I could go on, but it’s a base for you to think about.

Pitt --- Really ?? Really ?? What I’m saying is you may not steal my stuff, lie to me, kill the person closest to, sleep with your significant other, but it doesn’t mean you want just because you are a Christian.

You may not take thousands of dollars but you may take a penny here and there, You may not sleep with my wife but may think about it all day “ Coveting “ you may not kill me but stick a knife in my back and twist out of jealousy.

We are always sinning even if it’s just in our hearts.

moment_of_faith · Aug 30, 2012

spirit -- maybe whomever told you / him that doesn't know their bible

Cobus · Aug 30, 2012

You do realize that Christians will be tempted by Satan, right? He will go after us harder than a nonbeliever because we do not belong to him. True or false? Can he if God stops him?

Fortunately Jesus also knows this that is why he says this.. For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted. Now just imagine Jesus standing right there with you when Satan comes with the temptation and Jesus gives you the advice and way OUT of the temtation..... What a waste of time Satan committed.... Nothing to do with our "nature"

Look GOD KNOWS THIS!!!!! 2 Peter 2:9... The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:
Imagine the Lord deliver you from temptations... It will be hard to sin then would it not!

And Hebrews 2:18... For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

And God advises us to pray that we DO NOT enter into temptation... Did Jesus not say we should pray... LEAD US NOT INTO TEMPTATION BUT DELIVER US FROM EVIL... Think!!!!! If God does this, do you really think we can still be tempted? I SAY NO!!!
As we see GOd KNWS to deliver the GODLY from evil!!! God knows this already! The cheek we have to say we will always be tempted... or suggest that.. I used to say the same!!!

psychomom · Aug 30, 2012

This thread is coming dangerously close to saying that anyone who ever has a headache is outside the will of God / a heretic / demon possessed or opressed/ or unsaved. A simple look at the book of Job should be enough for us to see that, although the enemy might be used as a tool of the Lord God, he cannot touch the faithful believer without the Lord's permission. (or even instigation, as it was with Job!) I think one person, at least, actially said God is unwilling for any child of His to be sick ever. Does this include the common cold? Do we run to figure out what our sin was when we have hay fever?
(I use hyperbole to make a point, and I realize it is hyperbole)
Also, the idea that all medications are bad based in some meaning related to pharmacy, or meds in general, is unwarranted, IMO. People used what they had to treat illness when the NT was written, as witnessed by Paul telling Timothy to take a bit of wine for his stomach disorder, whatever that may have been. (note: he didn't tell his son in the faith to repent! or rebuke a demon! this should also be a clue for us) And Paul himself had his thorn, and we really don't know what that was, either. We only know for sure that he asked the Lord to take it, and we know how the Lord responded.

Just about everything that we have said here (I completely include myself) is opinion. Our opinions. I do not know this to be true, but I wonder if the OP in some way has been either injured (in body or feelings) by someone with bi-polar or has felt compassion for them, but with, to coin a phrase, a zeal not in accordance with knowledge? I do NOT mean to offend the OP, but rather am searching for a reason he would choose this specific mental health issue over all others, and that's what I could come up with.
But...what I could come up with hardly matters!! What I think, what I say, these are the heart of God mixed with my own sinful nature, and almost everything I say is a mixture of the two. (all too often more me than Him

) I think most of us can admit to this.

As believers we are scripturally called to judge one another as regards to sin. We are given guidelines for this: remove the beam, go alone, then take 1 or 2 others with you. We are not to judge those outside the household of faith--that is strictly God's job. In a real love for others, be they saved or not, and a desire to help them, perhaps we need to be sure we have the Spirit of agape with us about it, and not, as I am too often guilty of, just our selves?

We all have our doctrinal differences, and we all believe we have it "right". This is part of the reason I read the threads in this section--to challenge my own beliefs, and to look at God's Word given to us in the scriptures to see if A) I am correct, and B) to correct my false beliefs about God. My own false beliefs are my biggest cause of idol worship, for if I worship God not as He truly IS, I worship an idol of my own making. (as least, this is what I have come to believe thus far)
As Christians, we have several different "job descriptions", like glorifying God in our words and deeds, serving all, ministering the gospel to the lost, ministering to one another. Another of our "jobs" as believers is to complete the sufferings of Christ. Therefore, we will have trials, and loss, and illness.
It's not necessarily a sign we are outside the will of God (although it's always a good idea to check with him!).
Sometimes, like with the blind man I referenced in my first post, illness is simply to glorify God.

And I do think that if we are ill, we should ask the Lord to heal us, but not to hold Him hostage to it. If we have asked in faith, we may rest in the promises and know that as soon as His purpose is fulfilled, He will heal us. The idea that everyone who doesn't die of old age is somehow sinning is sad to me. We all die of something, and thank God! Who would want to be here in these bodies forever, right?

I do realize the oroginal post was strictly about bipolar, and I hope the OP will forgive me for this tangent.
If any of you read all this babbling, I thank you.

Again...for what it's worth.
ellie

traveler101 · Aug 30, 2012

Mental illness is just part of the ripple affect of the fall. I have known plenty of people who are believers and who have also been diagnosed with bipolar, schizophrenia, multiple personalities, etc. This is a chemical malfunction in the brain. The same as some people have more estrogen or testosterone in their body. It is a body chemistry thing. Not a demon possesion thing. I have had depression since I was in my teens and have loved the Lord the whole time. It wasn't until I was in college that I finally was diagnosed with it and put on medication. I realize that I will forever be on meds but I also know that God has done and connected me with people in some amazing ways thru this experience. Yes, people can feel like someone else is trying to control their thoughts. We know the brain is powerful and we know that Satan uses our weaknesses to his benefit. There are lots of people out there that have had demon possession but have not had a diagnosis of demon possession. That is a spiritual thing, not a physical ailment. Mental health is a physical ailment though you don't see it like a limp or a stutter. Can both co-mingle? Sure. But to say that in every case, that is what is going on, is FALSE and extremely niave. The fall has had a huge ripple affect on people. We want to categorize and put labels on people to fit them in nice little boxes but we all have the ability to do evil things and to fall under satan's lies.

psychomom · Aug 30, 2012

moment_of_faith said:

As are many other things, like autism and autistic tendencies. Why not choose these issues? Why specifically bi-polar?

psychomom · Aug 30, 2012

moment_of_faith said:

I do not know why that is, my friend.

But I think perhaps you may be confusing what the Lord said about people in the last days and these ones you know who report to you that they feel this way.
I've dealt with many patients on psychotropic meds who do not feel like that (numb). There are such a wide variety of psychotropic meds that one cannot make a rule for side effects which includes them all.

I was blessed to work for a doc who prescribed both medication (when it was warranted) and the name of and directions of a healing center where people could speak to a Christian counselor and be prayed for if they wanted to.

I don't mean to completely discount your theory, since I suffered from depression when I was younger, and it was fear related. When I learned to t-r-u-s-t God, it went away and hasn't returned. But I thank Him for medication that potentially kept me from doing something serious in the meantime! (hurting myself, and thereby hurting my family)
I don't claim to have all the answers. I only mean to say we must have a care when speaking of these things.

Lord bless you, and those whom you love,
ellie

moment_of_faith · Aug 30, 2012

psychomom -- You keep going back to the believer -- I'm saying most I know that has been diagnosed w/ bipolar are not Christians or they were diagnosed before accepting Jesus as lord and savior or they don't really accept the bible leaving room to believe they may not accept Jesus.

Now Christian face all kinds of trials and tribulations. Satan try’s to deceive/ rattle us/ beat us down, but sooner or later a Christian fights back with the authority of Jesus. The Holy Spirit in us tells us to fight.

My eyes are going bad, can't hear good, feet hurt, poison ivy from head to toe, but at this moment mentally ok. I would rather lose all of my physical features and keep my mind.

Also I said anyone can ask Jesus into their heart and be saved. I'm not condemning anyone to HELL.

Traveler -- Do you know if these people where diagnosed before or after coming to the lord?
I see you say you love the lord. Who is that lord? Do you accept him as your lord and savior, Have you asked him to come into your heart? Do you repent to him? Do you believe he is GOD in the flesh?

Also look what you are saying here. Jesus tells us the opposite. He says we are not fighting flesh and blood “Physical " we are fighting Spirits

Ephesians 6
12 For we[c] are not fighting against flesh-and-blood enemies, but against evil rulers and authorities of the unseen world, against mighty powers in this dark world, and against evil spirits in the heavenly places.

moment_of_faith · Aug 30, 2012

Autism is a developmental disorder that appears in the first 3 years of life, and affects the brain's normal development of social and communication skills.

Sounds more Physical -- not mental to me

Also you 2nd what I said. You turned to GOD. Bipolar people don't and I'm asking why? By what I have notice they don't believe.

cenallen · Aug 30, 2012

moment_of_faith said:

have you even bothered to search the internet or ask church counsellors about the innumerable ministries for christians suffering from 'bi-polar' mood swings?
seems your theory floats like a rock. leave it for people qualified to help those suffering.

moment_of_faith it may you who needs to seek counselling.
you are exhibiting sings of obsession

God bless.

Mediate · Aug 30, 2012

pitts288 said:

He does Have a point. In that, we are always going to sin. We will never come to a day (and this goes for ALL people, not just 'christians'), where we will not sin at all.

An impure thought is a sin. You've heard 'I tell you ,he who hates his brother has commited murder in his heart.'

This is why, there is no 'I am saved, they are not'.

It is 'I am as bad as the unbeliever. I have no right'.

'Let He who is without sin cast the first stone'.

That's also why this thread is un-christian.

carey · Aug 30, 2012

You know it really does offend me when you claim bipolar people do not accept Christ many people haven't accepted Christ, it's their choice, it has absolutely nothing to do with any mental illness they might have, have you ever stopped to consider their backgrounds, that they may have been hurt, or are hurting? Maybe they have run into judgemental christians that have put a stumbling block before them. Maybe instead of being so judgmental you could offer some kindness to them, show them the love of Christ, instead of judgements.

Shyness · Aug 30, 2012

Mental conditions has nothing to do with demons. I looked it up and many other conditions on Wikipedia and it never even mentioned demonic possession. Wikipedia states that Bipolar Disorder is caused by

From Wikipedia

Genetic

Genetic studies have suggested many chromosomal regions and candidate genes appearing to relate to bipolar disorder's development, but the results are not consistent and often not replicated.[26]
Although the first genetic linkage finding for mania was in 1969,[27] the linkage studies have been inconsistent.[28] Meta-analyses of linkage studies detected either no significant genome-wide findings or, using a different methodology, only two genome-wide significant peaks, on chromosome 6q and on 8q21.[citation needed] Neither have genome-wide association studies brought a consistent focus — each has identified new loci.[28]
Findings point strongly to heterogeneity, with different genes being implicated in different families.[29] A review seeking to identify the more consistent findings suggested several genes related to serotonin (SLC6A4 and TPH2), dopamine (DRD4 and SLC6A3), glutamate (DAOA and DTNBP1), and cell growth and/or maintenance pathways (NRG1, DISC1 and BDNF), although noting a high risk of false positives in the published literature. It was also suggested that individual genes are likely to have only a small effect and to be involved in some aspect related to the disorder (and a broad range of "normal" human behavior) rather than the disorder per se.[30]
Advanced paternal age has been linked to a somewhat increased chance of bipolar disorder in offspring, consistent with a hypothesis of increased new genetic mutations.[31]
Physiological

The full causes of bipolar disorder have yet to be discovered, but there is strong evidence that one root lies in problems with brain structure

Abnormalities in the structure and/or function of certain brain circuits could underlie bipolar. Two meta-analyses of structural MRI studies in bipolar disorder report an increase in the volume of the lateral ventricles, globus pallidus and increase in the rates of deep white matter hyperintensities.[32][33][34] Functional MRI findings suggest that abnormal modulation between ventral prefrontal and limbic regions, especially the amygdala, likely contribute to poor emotional regulation and mood symptoms.[35]
The "kindling" theory asserts that people who are genetically predisposed toward bipolar disorder can experience a series of stressful events, each of which lowers the threshold at which mood changes occur. Eventually, a mood episode can start (and become recurrent) by itself. There is evidence of hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis (HPA axis) abnormalities in bipolar disorder due to stress.[36][37][38][39]
Other brain components which have been proposed to play a role are the mitochondria,[40] and a sodium ATPase pump,[41] causing cyclical periods of poor neuron firing (depression) and hypersensitive neuron firing (mania). This may only apply for type one, but type two apparently results from a large confluence of factors.[citation needed] Circadian rhythms and melatonin activity also seem to be altered.[42]
Environmental

Evidence suggests that environmental factors play a significant role in the development and course of bipolar disorder, and that individual psychosocial variables may interact with genetic dispositions.[30] There is fairly consistent evidence from prospective studies that recent life events and interpersonal relationships contribute to the likelihood of onsets and recurrences of bipolar mood episodes, as they do for onsets and recurrences of unipolar depression.[43] There have been repeated findings that between a third and a half of adults diagnosed with bipolar disorder report traumatic/abusive experiences in childhood, which is associated on average with earlier onset, a worse course, and more co-occurring disorders such as PTSD.[44] The total number of reported stressful events in childhood is higher in those with an adult diagnosis of bipolar spectrum disorder compared to those without, particularly events stemming from a harsh environment rather than from the child's own behavior.[45]
Diagnosis

Diagnosis is based on the self-reported experiences of an individual as well as abnormalities in behavior reported by family members, friends or co-workers, followed by secondary signs observed by a psychiatrist, nurse, social worker, clinical psychologist or other clinician in a clinical assessment. There are lists of criteria for someone to be so diagnosed. These depend on both the presence and duration of certain signs and symptoms. Assessment is usually done on an outpatient basis; admission to an inpatient facility is considered if there is a risk to oneself or others. The most widely used criteria for diagnosing bipolar disorder are from the American Psychiatric Association's Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, the current version being DSM-IV-TR, and the World Health Organization's International Statistical Classification of Diseases and Related Health Problems, currently the ICD-10. The latter criteria are typically used in Europe and other regions while the DSM criteria are used in the USA and other regions, as well as prevailing in research studies. The DSM-V, to be published in 2013, will likely include further and more accurate sub-typing.[46]
An initial assessment may include a physical exam by a physician. Although there are no biological tests which confirm bipolar disorder, tests may be carried out to exclude medical illnesses such as hypo- or hyperthyroidism, metabolic disturbance, a systemic infection or chronic disease, and syphilis or HIV infection. An EEG may be used to exclude epilepsy, and a CT scan of the head to exclude brain lesions. Investigations are not generally repeated for relapse unless there is a specific medical indication.
Several rating scales for the screening and evaluation of bipolar disorder exist, such as the Bipolar spectrum diagnostic scale.[47] The use of evaluation scales can not substitute a full clinical interview but they serve to systematize the recollection of symptoms.[47] On the other hand instruments for the screening of bipolar disorder have low sensitivity[disambiguation needed] and limited diagnostic validity.[47]

It severely pains me on how some people assume mental disorders and certain types of disabilities is caused by demonic possession and 100% of the time, they are proven to be wrong by science and medical evidence.

carey · Aug 30, 2012

It seems to me that you just want to argue, you asked if bipolar is demon posession, and many people have told you no, but you still insist that it is, so why continue with this thread? If your convinced that your right and the rest of us are wrong, which by the way seems very arrogant, shallow, closed minded, and un christian, what is the point in continuing the argument?
Just wondering

Bipolar Disorder – Is it Demons????

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