Old Covenant New Covenant.

[gotime]

Many have stumbled over this Issue. This is important to understand because salvation is very much connected to your conclusion on this.

what is the Old Covenant?

Some may remember that there was a "book of the covenant"

Exo 24:7 And he took the book of the covenant, and read in the audience of the people: and they said, All that the LORD hath said will we do, and be obedient.

This book was made up of:
1. The 10 Commandments
2. Judgments for breaking the commandments and for keeping them.
3. ceremonial laws of feasts etc.

We find a fuller understanding of this "book of the law" in Deuteronomy, which means second law or law repeated.

You may remember that Paul spoke of this law in Galatians.

Gal 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

This is taken from the book of the law.

Deu 27:26 Cursed be he that confirmeth not all the words of this law to do them. And all the people shall say, Amen.

Let us note a few things, this covenant of the "book of the law" contains a few things and Paul is saying that unless you do all of those things, meaning obey the 10 commandments and keep all the ceremonial law. which are only empty works then you bring condemnation on yourself.

but we find else where that God narrows down the covenant even further.

Exo 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

notice here that the words of the covenant are the 10 commandments.

So we have the 10 commandments which are the Covenant and we have the book of the law which also contains the covenant only with judgments etc on top.

Paul makes it clear in Galatians that keeping the whole book of the law is in error and is akin to salvation by works. Why?

Gal 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
Gal 3:14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.


Here Paul makes it clear that Jesus has become the curse for us. why?

so that the blessing of who? Abraham might come on the Gentiles. How? through Jesus Christ.

Praise God even us Gentiles have the same blessing that Abraham had.

It is important to know that the "book of the law" contains both blessings and curses. Blessings for obedience and curses for disobedience. obedience to what?

As seen the 10 commandments are the covenant. Notice that Jesus in Galatians removes only the curses but not the blessings. what happens with the blessings?

We just read it, they are given to the Gentiles. The very same blessings given to Abraham. So Jesus takes away the bad but maintains that which is good. So we already know by this that the blessings remain from the book of the law according to Paul. Abraham had those same blessings and was given the covenant why?

Gen 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

Here is why Abraham received the blessings, because he kept Gods law.

Some may say, "we are under the new covenant so the 10 commandments are gone for they were in the book of the law"

We have already seen that Paul does not thing everything from the book of the law is done away with. clearly the blessings remain. we have also seen that the 10 commandments are separate from the book of the law even though they are included in it.

before we look at the new covenant let us first notice something.

10 commandments

Exo 31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.

1. Written by God himself

Deu 10:1 At that time the LORD said unto me, Hew thee two tables of stone like unto the first, and come up unto me into the mount, and make thee an ark of wood.
Deu 10:2 And I will write on the tables the words that were in the first tables which thou brakest, and thou shalt put them in the ark.
Deu 10:3 And I made an ark of shittim wood, and hewed two tables of stone like unto the first, and went up into the mount, having the two tables in mine hand.
Deu 10:4 And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the ten commandments, which the LORD spake unto you in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them unto me.
Deu 10:5 And I turned myself and came down from the mount, and put the tables in the ark which I had made; and there they be, as the LORD commanded me.

2. put in the ark of the covenant, hence the reason it is called the ark of the covenant.

Book of the Law

Deu 31:24 And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished,

1. Moses wrote the book of the law


Deu 31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

2. they were on the side of the ark not in the ark itself.

clearly there is a distinction between the two.

So what is the New covenant?

Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:


Notice that the new covenant was made in our hearts and it was the law both in our hearts and our minds.

So a law must still remain. what law?

2Co 3:3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

notice that Paul makes it clear that it is the Holy Spirit who writes and he writes where, on the "tables of the Heart. clearly here he is making a parallel with the 10 commandments. It is no longer on tables of stone but now on tables of the heart.

The New covenant is a renewing of the old but better.

1. not the blood of animals but the blood of Jesus.

2. Not a earthly high priest but Jesus our high priest.

3. not an outward law but an inward law.

In the old days God dwelt above the mercy seat where the law was kept.

Now Jesus dwells in our hearts where the law is now written by the Holy Spirit.

There is so much more that can be said. so many connections to be made.

This is why Paul could say:

Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

It is by the spirit that Jesus fulfills the law "IN" us.

Blessings all.

 

[RedTent]

Understanding what God wants us to know about the covenants IS important. What some people are saying about it amounts to denying God the Father, and that is blasphemy. Understanding is important to our very life. Let me point out why and how I think some well meaning people are going wrong.

Gal 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

This is taken from the book of the law.

What Paul is talking about here is the “works of the law”. If you were living in that time, or studied the history of what was going on at that time you would be aware that the Jews were saying that if you wanted to join them you must go through a ceremonial rite that included circumcision and other rituals to prove your sincerity. It was very like some of our churches ask for a certain ceremony when we join. God had Paul explain to us that it wasn’t the ceremony but the heart that the joining consisted of.

The law is from God, the “works of the law” is suggestions for living out the spiritual law, and it is the spiritual law that is important. To put in Paul’s mouth the thought, even, that we are not to listen to God is wrong. Paul often told us to not only hear but do. Paul would never, ever, contradict God and himself.

notice that Paul makes it clear that it is the Holy Spirit who writes and he writes where, on the "tables of the Heart. clearly here he is making a parallel with the 10 commandments. It is no longer on tables of stone but now on tables of the heart.

The New covenant is a renewing of the old but better.

To this I say amen. Some say the new covenant wiped out the old, we are not to listen to God because of it! Gotime makes it clear that the old is with us, to be listened to, and we each have the Holy Spirit within us for an added blessing.

 

[Laodicea]

Gotime you have made good points about the covenant. He has taken the curses but, not the blessings that is good

 

[xino]

@gotime

thank you so much for this.
makes more sense man!

so basically these are the laws:

1. The 10 Commandments
2. Judgments for breaking the commandments and for keeping them.
3. ceremonial laws of feasts etc.

Jesus fulfilled 2 and 3 right? Because the 2 was too much, very similar to Islam Quran as if you go to another religion, you will be killed.
Just like how the Old Testament had hash teachings just like the Quran. Such as if your family stops you from worshipping God, you have to kill them. Or the controversial Rape marriage:/

So with Jesus omitting number 2 and 3 laws.


So do we have to still keep the 10 Commandments?
people are saying we don't.

Hebrews 4 Paul was talking about as we heard the Gospel, we enter God's rest. In the middle of Heb 4 he said God made Sabbath day (Saturday) TODAY. Towards the end of Hebrews 4, Paul stressed that we should try to enter that rest so that we are not disobedient.

So the question, if we are following 10 commandments, are we to keep Sabbath Day or not?
if yes, How do we keep Sabbath Day?


also when Jesus was on the cross, he said "it is done". meaning everything including the Law has been fulfilled.
Mary had to prepare all the preparation, oil and food because the Sabbath was coming next day.
So logic= if Jesus fulfilled the Law when he died on the Cross, why did Mary honour and obeyed the Sabbath by resting on that day?


because today is Saturday, i will be going to sleep and when I wake up later during the day of Saturday. I will be resting and not doing work!

 

[gotime]

Understanding what God wants us to know about the covenants IS important. What some people are saying about it amounts to denying God the Father, and that is blasphemy. Understanding is important to our very life. Let me point out why and how I think some well meaning people are going wrong.


What Paul is talking about here is the “works of the law”. If you were living in that time, or studied the history of what was going on at that time you would be aware that the Jews were saying that if you wanted to join them you must go through a ceremonial rite that included circumcision and other rituals to prove your sincerity. It was very like some of our churches ask for a certain ceremony when we join. God had Paul explain to us that it wasn’t the ceremony but the heart that the joining consisted of.

The law is from God, the “works of the law” is suggestions for living out the spiritual law, and it is the spiritual law that is important. To put in Paul’s mouth the thought, even, that we are not to listen to God is wrong. Paul often told us to not only hear but do. Paul would never, ever, contradict God and himself.


To this I say amen. Some say the new covenant wiped out the old, we are not to listen to God because of it! Gotime makes it clear that the old is with us, to be listened to, and we each have the Holy Spirit within us for an added blessing.

I am not sure but you may have misunderstood me here. I agree with what you said about the "works of the law" however I did not go into detail so as to keep the post shorter. so I focused on the fact that Paul is speaking of the book of the law and not just the law on its own. What you are saying is also very clear in the context of the rest of Galatians.

You are right that Paul never went against the word of God. that is why we must examine the context of what he said. I think you will find that we are on the same page.

Blessings

 

[ed12]

@gotime

thank you so much for this.
makes more sense man!

so basically these are the laws:

1. The 10 Commandments
2. Judgments for breaking the commandments and for keeping them.
3. ceremonial laws of feasts etc.

Jesus fulfilled 2 and 3 right? Because the 2 was too much, very similar to Islam Quran as if you go to another religion, you will be killed.
Just like how the Old Testament had hash teachings just like the Quran. Such as if your family stops you from worshipping God, you have to kill them. Or the controversial Rape marriage:/

So with Jesus omitting number 2 and 3 laws.


So do we have to still keep the 10 Commandments?
people are saying we don't.

Hebrews 4 Paul was talking about as we heard the Gospel, we enter God's rest. In the middle of Heb 4 he said God made Sabbath day (Saturday) TODAY. Towards the end of Hebrews 4, Paul stressed that we should try to enter that rest so that we are not disobedient.

So the question, if we are following 10 commandments, are we to keep Sabbath Day or not?
if yes, How do we keep Sabbath Day?


also when Jesus was on the cross, he said "it is done". meaning everything including the Law has been fulfilled.
Mary had to prepare all the preparation, oil and food because the Sabbath was coming next day.
So logic= if Jesus fulfilled the Law when he died on the Cross, why did Mary honour and obeyed the Sabbath by resting on that day?


because today is Saturday, i will be going to sleep and when I wake up later during the day of Saturday. I will be resting and not doing work!

Hi xino,
Could it be that at that stage, Jesus preparation, the Spirit had not been poured out on mankind, to follow.
As to the disciples attending synagogues, especially on Saturdays, I ask, "where else would you go to find those who believed in the One True Creator God.

To enter into the Sabbath, now not a day but a lifestyle, one needs to enter into Jesus rest, ie trust in Him, totally. Then He 'keeps' us and "blesses" us completely.
love in Jesus
ed

 

[gotime]

@gotime

thank you so much for this.
makes more sense man!

so basically these are the laws:

1. The 10 Commandments
2. Judgments for breaking the commandments and for keeping them.
3. ceremonial laws of feasts etc.

Jesus fulfilled 2 and 3 right? Because the 2 was too much, very similar to Islam Quran as if you go to another religion, you will be killed.
Just like how the Old Testament had hash teachings just like the Quran. Such as if your family stops you from worshipping God, you have to kill them. Or the controversial Rape marriage:/

So with Jesus omitting number 2 and 3 laws.


So do we have to still keep the 10 Commandments?
people are saying we don't.
There is no place in the word of God where the 10 commandments are done away with. Paul says the blessings still remain also. the blessings come from keeping the law. however this can not be done in our human strength. we need the Holy Spirit to write them on our hearts and to empower us to keep them.

Hebrews 4 Paul was talking about as we heard the Gospel, we enter God's rest. In the middle of Heb 4 he said God made Sabbath day (Saturday) TODAY. Towards the end of Hebrews 4, Paul stressed that we should try to enter that rest so that we are not disobedient.

So the question, if we are following 10 commandments, are we to keep Sabbath Day or not?
if yes, How do we keep Sabbath Day?

As said the 10 commandments are written on our hearts, they are a part of the new covenant. so Yes if we love Jesus we will keep them. The last time checked the Sabbath was one of the commandments. so Yes I myself keep it and it is my delight. as You have seen the author of Hebrews understood the 7th day Sabbath to be deeply connected with salvation. by accepting the day you accept the one who gave it. Jesus is lord of the Sabbath.


also when Jesus was on the cross, he said "it is done". meaning everything including the Law has been fulfilled.

Jesus was very clear that the earth would pass away before the law or even the smallest letter of the law would go away.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Jesus was referring to the payment for our sins. He had made an atonement for us. He is the lamb that was slain. This is also a reference to the prophecy in Daniel where the year of His death was predicted, also the month day and hour as predicted in the Passover feast. Read Isiah 53 and you will see what was done. Phil 2 also.


Mary had to prepare all the preparation, oil and food because the Sabbath was coming next day.
So logic= if Jesus fulfilled the Law when he died on the Cross, why did Mary honour and obeyed the Sabbath by resting on that day?

This question you asked showed the error of the preposition that the law is done away with. It was not done away with but rather moved from stone to our hearts. Mary understood the sacredness of the Sabbath as She had been taught by Jesus.


because today is Saturday, i will be going to sleep and when I wake up later during the day of Saturday. I will be resting and not doing work!

Hope this helps. blessings

 

[xino]

Hi xino,
Could it be that at that stage, Jesus preparation, the Spirit had not been poured out on mankind, to follow.
As to the disciples attending synagogues, especially on Saturdays, I ask, "where else would you go to find those who believed in the One True Creator God.

To enter into the Sabbath, now not a day but a lifestyle, one needs to enter into Jesus rest, ie trust in Him, totally. Then He 'keeps' us and "blesses" us completely.
love in Jesus
ed

hmm interesting, I will deeply look into this because I asked another brother at my work and he said similar thing that we have to be holy.

Hope this helps. blessings

ok so Sabbath is everyday right?
why do we go to church on sundays then?

i believe it is time for me to find a church that operates on saturday instead.

makes no sense to me that we go church on sunday thus confusing many sunday is sabbath.

 

[ed12]

hmm interesting, I will deeply look into this because I asked another brother at my work and he said similar thing that we have to be holy.


ok so Sabbath is everyday right?
why do we go to church on sundays then?

i believe it is time for me to find a church that operates on saturday instead.

makes no sense to me that we go church on sunday thus confusing many sunday is sabbath.

Hi xino,
I believe that Jesus was not crucified nor raised as we are schooled because Jesus says He will be in the earth three days and three nights. Well Friday to Sunday can never be 3 days and 3 nights.
Personally, and please understand this is my belief and it is not for anyone to follow if you believe something else, I want to just follow scripture now. No Christmas, no Easter. To me this is a broadening of the Word, a departure from the narrow way. Again if you have reached the stage in your faith where you live in God's Sabbath, then every day is a Sabbath. This is being led by the Spirit. One should be serious regarding these issues though as the Spirits knows us perfectly and knows how to push out buttons and He will test us deeply in our weaknesses, not where we are strong, in His time, not in our time. Before starting on this path, take stock and if you are not yet ready, prepare. I think this may be impossible for a married person. Yoked to one who has a different level of faith makes for difficult times.
oops raving on. Regarding going to a church that operates on a Saturday is following a law. This is against Jesus Christ and leads you to breaking a rule that Jesus does not want you to break.
I do not say you should follow me but I just go to the closest church, irrespective of denomination. The Spirit has me obey. Jesus moves me around, my life is blessed.
love in Jesus
ed

 

[wattie]

Thing about Old and New Covenants

These are about ways of service to God and not the means by which people receve everlasting life from God.

David believed in a redeemer

So did Job

The prophets foretold the redeemer

Jesus was around before He was in the human flesh form

Adam and Eve- how did they get their covering for their nakedness? Slaying an innocent animal to get animal skin right?

So an innocent animal slain to cover the sins of Adam and Eve. Picture of Jesus right there.


Eternal salvation same way OT and NT

Different means of serving God though.

 

[WolfInOxHide]

The new covenant is the spiritual extension, explanation, and manifestation of the physical old covenant.
But the framework has not been changed. It has been fulfilled, spiritually and physically, in Y'Shua.

It means a law against sin in the flesh was not sufficient.
It means a law against sin in the heart is now required, the flesh will then follow.
It comes with a lesser physical impact, and a greater spiritual impact.
Like it or not, it's scriptural.

The laws themselves have not changed. They are now to be embraced spiritually first, the we will understand how they manifest physically.

"And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest."

The law will be in the mind and heart, and we won't be teaching it into people.
But they will still need for what's hidden in their heart to be revealed to them.
That is, "why" the law is what it is.
Enter: "The Revelation of Y'Shua"
It has taken us 2000 years, but we are about to finally see it.

"And in the last days it shall be, God declares, that I will pour out my Spirit on all flesh"

 

[xino]

Hi xino,
I believe that Jesus was not crucified nor raised as we are schooled because Jesus says He will be in the earth three days and three nights. Well Friday to Sunday can never be 3 days and 3 nights.
Personally, and please understand this is my belief and it is not for anyone to follow if you believe something else, I want to just follow scripture now. No Christmas, no Easter. To me this is a broadening of the Word, a departure from the narrow way. Again if you have reached the stage in your faith where you live in God's Sabbath, then every day is a Sabbath. This is being led by the Spirit. One should be serious regarding these issues though as the Spirits knows us perfectly and knows how to push out buttons and He will test us deeply in our weaknesses, not where we are strong, in His time, not in our time. Before starting on this path, take stock and if you are not yet ready, prepare. I think this may be impossible for a married person. Yoked to one who has a different level of faith makes for difficult times.
oops raving on. Regarding going to a church that operates on a Saturday is following a law. This is against Jesus Christ and leads you to breaking a rule that Jesus does not want you to break.
I do not say you should follow me but I just go to the closest church, irrespective of denomination. The Spirit has me obey. Jesus moves me around, my life is blessed.
love in Jesus
ed

your first sentence does not make sense to me.
But I will the Jonah reference he made was talking about destroying the temple and him raising it up in 3 days.
Nights and Day?
Night starts from the evening and ends 12am. The next day starts from 12am.
So Jesus saying NIght and Day is still accurate. We call night because it is darkness. Jesus was in immersed in complete darkness inside the tomb. Therefore I believe that is what he was talking about.

Yes I know that Christmas is just man made.
But here is an interesting point, it doesn't matter if we follow Christmas or not because it is a public holiday and no one would be working on that day (except emergency people)

But how can everyday be God's sabbath when you are not resting? Sabbath means to rest right? but we are working are we not? which nullifies the purpose.
also didn't Jesus say we shouldn't work for food that spoils but set our eyes on things above?


that is stupid to me. How can going to church on Saturday be following the law. What law? did the bible say we should go church on Saturday? And you say it's against Jesus. How so?
which is worst, going to church on Saturday which is the sabbath (Jesus and Paul preached during sabbath) or Going to church on sunday (which means nothing)?

 

[mule]

I gave a like to Gotimes argument, not because I am in agreement with its conclusion but because I thought it was a well formed arguments that made strong points for the 10 commandments.
I stand with my statements that in the new covenant there are two and only two laws handed down to us by Jesus -- Love God and love others

John 15: 10
If ye keep My commandments, ye shall abide in My love; even as I have kept My Fathers commandments and abide in His love.

John 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, That ye also love one another.
John 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.
John 15 17 These things I command you, that ye love one another.

Romans 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another HATH FULFILLED THE LAW
Romans 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the FULFILLING OF THE LAW
Galatians 5:14 For ALL the LAW IS FULFILLED in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love they neighbour as thyself.
James 2:8 If ye FULFILL the ROYAL LAW according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as they self, ye do well;

Doesn't say if you keep the 10 commandments you have kept the law or that if you keep the sabbath you have kept the law --and as I have tried to emphasize over and over

James 2: 10 FOR WHOSOEVER SHALL KEEP THE WHOLE LAW, AND YET OFFEND IN ONE POINT, HE IS GUILTY OF ALL.

 

[RedTent]

Ed12 says: Regarding going to a church that operates on a Saturday is following a law. This is against Jesus Christ and leads you to breaking a rule that Jesus does not want you to break.

Please think very carefully about this, it is very important to your life with God that you know who God is. Jesus Christ is one with the Father and the Holy Spirit. What the Father says the Son says. Christ, scripture tells us in Mark, even, was there at creation. God is eternal, God knew of Christ’s work on the cross at creation. The OT sacrificial system was a shadow of Jesus, and nothing can be a shadow of something that isn’t real. So when we follow Jesus, we are also following the Father and the Holy Spirit. The law is instructions from the Father. We don’t need to sacrifice animal blood, for now we use the blood of Christ, the real blood not a shadow of that blood. We don’t have to do the physical things to follow the spiritual teachings of the Father like circumcision. But other than that, everything the Father is, every instruction the Father gave, applies to the Son for the Son is one with the Father.

 

[gotime]

I gave a like to Gotimes argument, not because I am in agreement with its conclusion but because I thought it was a well formed arguments that made strong points for the 10 commandments.
I stand with my statements that in the new covenant there are two and only two laws handed down to us by Jesus -- Love God and love others

John 15: 10
If ye keep My commandments, ye shall abide in My love; even as I have kept My Fathers commandments and abide in His love.

John 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, That ye also love one another.
John 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.
John 15 17 These things I command you, that ye love one another.

Romans 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another HATH FULFILLED THE LAW
Romans 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the FULFILLING OF THE LAW
Galatians 5:14 For ALL the LAW IS FULFILLED in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love they neighbour as thyself.
James 2:8 If ye FULFILL the ROYAL LAW according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as they self, ye do well;

Doesn't say if you keep the 10 commandments you have kept the law or that if you keep the sabbath you have kept the law --and as I have tried to emphasize over and over

James 2: 10 FOR WHOSOEVER SHALL KEEP THE WHOLE LAW, AND YET OFFEND IN ONE POINT, HE IS GUILTY OF ALL.

Hi Mule, permit me to address your post here if you will.

As shown in 2 Cor 3:3 Paul believed that the 10 commandments were written on our hearts.

So you bring up a good point, that there are only two laws. Yet if we look at our bibles we find something interesting about these two laws.

1. They are Old Testament laws.

While Jesus says new here we must understand it in light of the fact that it is not the first time God has said it or given it. The word translated new here means fresh, in other words I could tell you something that others know but it can be new and fresh for you if you did not know it. But how can I be sure it is not brand new?


Deu 6:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

Lev 19:18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

Notice that we are commanded to love God and our neighbor a long time ago.

Deu 11:1 Therefore thou shalt love the LORD thy God, and keep his charge, and his statutes, and his judgments, and his commandments, alway.

This is always connected with Gods 10 commandments in the old Testament. Thus when Jesus quotes these texts he is reminding the reader of the 10 commandments that are based and can only be kept in love.

This is why Paul and James brought the law back to love. Love does not destroy or take away the law. rather it fulfills it.

I put God first because I love Him. I keep the Sabbath, I don't take his name in vain and I don't worship Idols because I love Him and desire to please Him.

I don't murder or steal or covet etc because I love God and I love those who he has died for.

1Jn 4:20 If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?
1Jn 4:21 And this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth God love his brother also.

If we love God we will love our neighbor.

Now you have heard me say that the two great commandments are really the proper motivation to keep the 10 commandments. Now lets see God say that.


Jas 2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:

notice His words and now he will clarify what he means by Royal law.
Jas 2:9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
Jas 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
Jas 2:11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
Jas 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.


So James clearly believed that to love your neighbor was to obey the 10 commandments concerning the way we treat each other. On top of that he counsels us to speak and do as those who will be judged by that very law.

Paul makes this very same point:

Rom 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.


Notice that he quotes the 10 commandments concerning the way we treat each other/last six. and then says that we can comprehend all these in the saying love they neighbor as thyself. this is a quote from Leviticus concerning the law.

then he makes his point, love is the basis of the law and only love can fulfill it.

Permit me to make a point. Paul knew well that some tried to obey through works. but we should only obey in love.

This is why Jesus said: Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.


So in conclusion the bible is clear in the old testament that loving your neighbor and God are the basis of keeping the law of God.

the New and Old testament is in complete congruence on this point. The two great laws are not replacements but rather the correct motivation for keeping the 10 commandments.

A man may keep the commandments but If he has not love he has nothing.

A man may claim he loves and knows God, but if he does not keep the commandments then he does not know Him.

Blessings.

 

[mule]

hi,
the 10 are given -- then telling us to love is post script to them

the 10 are commanded !!

Jesus says HE commands we love and we will abide in Him as He kept Gods commandments and abided in His love.
there is a distinct separations between Jesus command and Gods command -- this is the new covenant it is with God through Jesus. Praise His name for that hey?

if you keep the commandments and offend one you are guilty of them ALL
okay -- have you ever in your heart lusted after a beautiful person -- oh no that is adultery!!
has anyone ever caused you to feel hate? oh no that is murder!!
Jesus explained to us these things

love works no ill -- that is why it fulfills the law -- it is about our heart. our spirit. oh to have the faith of a child

God loves mercy not sacrifice.

 

[gotime]

hi,
the 10 are given -- then telling us to love is post script to them

the 10 are commanded !!

Jesus says HE commands we love and we will abide in Him as He kept Gods commandments and abided in His love.

Joh 15:9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.

First Jesus makes a point, the very same love that his father has towards Jesus, Jesus has towards us. Then Jesus gives a command, "Continue ye in my love."

Now Jesus will clarify what it is to continue in His love.

Joh 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

IF you keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love. Jesus said this in another way earlier:
Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

however he does not stop here he again likens it to the fact that he has kept his Father's commandments and thus Jesus abides in the love of the Father. remember that Jesus has already clarified that this love is the same love. So in order to abide in the love of Jesus which is the same love of the Father we must keep The commands of Jesus. one of the commands is to continue in Jesus' love.

but he says more, Jesus again clarifies his commandment in verse 12 which is an expansion or clarification of his first command in verse 9 (continue ye in my love).

Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

Notice that Jesus commandment is again love and its about loving one another as Jesus loves us.

So from these verses Jesus is telling us that the same way in which the Father loves Jesus, Jesus loves us and his commandment is that we love each other in the same way that the Father loves Jesus and Jesus loves us.

Then He clarifies how great that love is in the next verse:

Joh 15:13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.
Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

Notice that this goes both ways, Jesus says that those who love Him are his friends and We know that God showed His love how?:

1Jn 3:16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.

John here is clarifying what Jesus was saying in john 15. Jesus loved us that he gave his life for us, so we should lay down our lives for our brethren because we love them the same. Read the verse before 16 of 1 john 3 and John uses murder as an example of not abiding in love. again he connects the 10 commandments to this love.

1Jn 3:23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.
1Jn 3:24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

here John summs this up that the commandment is to love one another.

I have already shown that love is the basis and fulfillment of the 10 commandments.

read the rest of chapter 3 of 1 john and it is clear that John understood Jesus to connect the 10 commandments as an expression of love.
there is a distinct separations between Jesus command and Gods command -- this is the new covenant it is with God through Jesus. Praise His name for that hey?

if you keep the commandments and offend one you are guilty of them ALL
okay -- have you ever in your heart lusted after a beautiful person -- oh no that is adultery!!
has anyone ever caused you to feel hate? oh no that is murder!!
Jesus explained to us these things

This is the greatness of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, when you give your life to Jesus and the control of the Holy Spirit, only then are you able to keep the commandments. because lvoe is perfected in you.

1Jn 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1Jn 2:5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
1Jn 2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

1Jn 4:11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we ought also to love one another.
1Jn 4:12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.
1Jn 4:13 Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit.

This can be seen only a few verses down from the one you allude to.

Jas 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

Jas 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

why would James tell us to speak and also do the commandments as if we are going to be judged by them if we no longer had to? verse 11 clarifies that the 10 commandments are being spoken of here.

so have I ever hated or stolen etc, Yes but praise God his blood cleanses me from all sin. now I no longer walk in the ways of the flesh but in the ways of the Spirit. It is by his blood and by his power that I no longer partake in hatred or theft. this is the power of the Gospel.


love works no ill -- that is why it fulfills the law -- it is about our heart. our spirit. oh to have the faith of a child

I agree its about our heart, that is Why Paul says that he Spirit writes the 10 commandments that were on stone where?

2Co 3:3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

On our hearts, love the 10 commandments are the expression of true and pure love. love to God and love to man. This is why love is constantly connected to the commandments throughout the writings of Jesus the Old Testament and the writings of the apostles.

God loves mercy not sacrifice.

This is the greatness of the Gospel, Jesus offers freely forgiveness for our sins. and then he offers freely the Gift of the Holy Spirit which changes us so that what was impossible before is now possible. When before it was against our nature to keep the commandments of God, now through His grace freely given we my now obey our of love. praise God. we are no longer slaves to the flesh that we should obey its nature, rather we are slaves to God by choice in Jesus and the power of the Holy Spirit.

 

[ed12]

Please think very carefully about this, it is very important to your life with God that you know who God is. Jesus Christ is one with the Father and the Holy Spirit. What the Father says the Son says. Christ, scripture tells us in Mark, even, was there at creation. God is eternal, God knew of Christ’s work on the cross at creation. The OT sacrificial system was a shadow of Jesus, and nothing can be a shadow of something that isn’t real. So when we follow Jesus, we are also following the Father and the Holy Spirit. The law is instructions from the Father. We don’t need to sacrifice animal blood, for now we use the blood of Christ, the real blood not a shadow of that blood. We don’t have to do the physical things to follow the spiritual teachings of the Father like circumcision. But other than that, everything the Father is, every instruction the Father gave, applies to the Son for the Son is one with the Father.

Hi RedTent,
I am not too sure I understand your point of view. You seem to have written this in response to a portion of a post, that portion being "going to a church on a Saturday being against Jesus". Forgive me if I have not quoted perfectly. These words are taken out of context. I say this because it is not going to a church on a Saturday which is against Jesus but the reason one would go on a Saturday. If you go to a church on a Saturday because you want to follow the unfulfilled law then this is against Jesus. If you go to church on a Saturday because you want to worship God then this is beautiful.
For example Jesus said not to make oaths. The reason Jesus said that is because if we make oaths or promises then we have put ourselves into a position of breaking our word. Jesus says don't do it. We may end up with a guilty conscience. Don't say, hey I am going to do this, say if God is willing etc. If you go to a church on a Saturday because you see that as God's law, you are going for the wrong reason. This means you are able to "break" this law and end up with a guilty conscience. Go on Saturday because you want to worship God. if you miss Saturday go another day, no guilt.
I understand and agree with you that Jesus is the Word and was the God of Israel and that the Law was a shadow of the spiritual law.
Surely we just have a misunderstanding because of my poor expressions.
love in Jesus
ed

 

[ed12]

your first sentence does not make sense to me.
But I will the Jonah reference he made was talking about destroying the temple and him raising it up in 3 days.
Nights and Day?
Night starts from the evening and ends 12am. The next day starts from 12am.
So Jesus saying NIght and Day is still accurate. We call night because it is darkness. Jesus was in immersed in complete darkness inside the tomb. Therefore I believe that is what he was talking about.

Yes I know that Christmas is just man made.
But here is an interesting point, it doesn't matter if we follow Christmas or not because it is a public holiday and no one would be working on that day (except emergency people)

But how can everyday be God's sabbath when you are not resting? Sabbath means to rest right? but we are working are we not? which nullifies the purpose.
also didn't Jesus say we shouldn't work for food that spoils but set our eyes on things above?


that is stupid to me. How can going to church on Saturday be following the law. What law? did the bible say we should go church on Saturday? And you say it's against Jesus. How so?
which is worst, going to church on Saturday which is the sabbath (Jesus and Paul preached during sabbath) or Going to church on sunday (which means nothing)?

Hi xino.
Matthew 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly, so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
John 11:9 Jesus answered. ""Are there not twelve hours in the day?....

12 hours in a day, 12 hours in a night
3 days 3 nights. 36+36 = 72 hours.
all of Friday 24 all of Saturday 24 all of Sunday 24 so if Jesus was crucified one hour into Friday, then He was resurrected on Monday.
I don't know the truth but tradition definitely seems incorrect.
This site, which won't correspond with me any longer because I ask too many questions regarding their living by the law, particularly the Sabbath as the 7th day of the week, seems to offer reasoned answers on this issue.
'After Three Days'
Yes Sabbath means rest. Read Hebrews 3 which is very short ie " So we see that they could not enter in (rest) because of unbelief."
Is this talking about unbelief in a day called Saturday?
There comes a time in our spiritual walk, when we hand the reins over to Christ and rest in Him.
love in Jesus
ed

 

[xino]

@ed12
we cannot assume that or we will contradict ourselves instead.

what time was Jesus buried on friday?
Jesus didn't have to spent the whole 24hrs on Friday in burial. He spent the rest of the Friday or remaining hours in burial so it counts.
Day and NIght.
Day as in, even though it is 9am, he is in burial, however it is dark inside the tomb therefore the day and night are happening simultaneous.

Why do we have night? because that is when darkness comes in, darkness is what separate light.
But Jesus was in constant darkness all the time, but the day was still counting.

in fact thank you for bringing out Hebrew 3, it corresponds to Hebrew 4 because 4 also talks about -TODAY-.
Hebrews 3 is referring Today as everyday, so that we can encourage ourselves to strengthen in the Lord and not fall short.


and this is what Hebrews 4 clearly says

A Sabbath-Rest for the People of God

4 Therefore, since the promise of entering his rest still stands, let us be careful that none of you be found to have fallen short of it.

straight and simple!
The PROMISE of the day of rest STILL STANDS meaning we still need to honour 7th day Sabbath.

For we also have had the good news proclaimed to us, just as they did; but the message they heard was of no value to them, because they did not share the faith of those who obeyed.[a]

who is he talking about?
he is talking about disobedient whom also have heard the Gospel just as we did.
But they did not share the faith of those who believed in the Gospel.

Now we who have believed enter that rest, just as God has said,

“So I declared on oath in my anger,
‘They shall never enter my rest.’”

what is this talking about?
people who argued and tested God, not having enough faith will NOT enter the rest day. But because Jesus introduced a new covenant through the Gospel. We can now enter that resting day again.

And yet his works have been finished since the creation of the world. 4 For somewhere he has spoken about the seventh day in these words: “On the seventh day God rested from all his works.”[c] 5 And again in the passage above he says, “They shall never enter my rest.”

this is why Paul makes things hard to understand.
God spoke about the 7 day he blessed. He told the people following him who argued and tested him, in anger God declared they will not enter his rest. Now is God talking about those people alone or just any followers of God in Old Testament?

However the scripture is God's words, God saying they shall never enter my rest nullifies the purpose of him creating and blessing the 7th Day. This is why Jesus came and became the Lord of Sabbath. So God saying they will never enter his sabbath STILL stands. Just like the 7th day stands, God did not cancel the Sabbath, he just declared that people will not enter it.
But we can only enter it THROUGH Jesus because he is Lord of Sabbath.

Therefore since it still remains for some to enter that rest, and since those who formerly had the good news proclaimed to them did not go in because of their disobedience,

exactly just what I said.
Sabbath day still remains! Yet people who had the Gospel still did not go in because of disobedient.

God again set a certain day, calling it “Today.” This he did when a long time later he spoke through David, as in the passage already quoted:

“Today, if you hear his voice,
do not harden your hearts.”[d]

ok reading this now makes sense. Because if we look at Hebrews 3 it talks about being holy, righteous or following God daily. Or whenever we can Today in a week.

For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not have spoken later about another day.

this is the quote Paul was talking about God giving them rest if Joshua had not
The Lord gave them rest on every side, just as he had sworn to their ancestors. Not one of their enemies withstood them; the Lord gave all their enemies into their hands. joshua 21:44
God gave those clans rest...not us! It was talking about the town of Levites.

There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God;

for anyone who enters God’s rest also rests from their works,[e] just as God did from his.

straight forward and simple!
if people use an excuse and say sabbath is anyday or today or everyday. You see that Paul just said if we are to enter the Lord's Sabbath, we should not work! (working as in working for food that spoils)

Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will perish by following their example of disobedience.

exactly...let us make every EFFORT to get into that rest!
meaning Sabbath is for man not man for sabbath.
if Man is for sabbath therefore WE HAVE to rest on Sabbath
but if Sabbath is for man (which it is) we have to TRY to rest on that day!




I will stick to Sabbath rest day...bible clearly says so. I won't be disobedient and use excuse that everyday/today is rest.