POLITICS - AMERICA, WHERE ARE WE HEADED AS A NATION?

[Jacobd]

Yesterday's debate Oct 3, 2012, between the two candidates President Obama and Mitt Romney was a lively one. Yet like most of the country agreed, President Obama seemed a bit off, there was a seeming disconnect, he looked tired, not as energetic as Romney looked. It is common consensus now that Romney took home the accolades for a job well done!

There were a lot of numbers thrown around in the debate - of unemployment, health insurance and taxes. What are the actual facts? Yahoo posted an article on what they are. What do these facts mean to America as a nation? Educate yourself as you go to the polls this November. Where are we headed as a nation?

Also, keep this nation - America in your prayers as we go to the polls to choose a leader.

FACT CHECK: Presidential debate missteps - Yahoo! News

Jeff Green, Yahoo News Columnist, mirrors my views on the overall impression people got of the debate. So did many of the chatters on CC as we discussed the debate just minutes after it was over. To get a better picture of the issues, read up and educate yourself. Also, keep discussions objective, not taking sides with any particular candidate but focus on what issues this nation faces and who then will be the best candidate suited for the job? It's like any job - these two candidates are seeking our approval to get elected / hired to a post that they promise they will use to serve this nation.

After the debate debacle for Obama, we

So this debate is not a time for name-calling (between candidates) or Personal bashing. This debate now more than ever is a debate that must focus on the most serious issues this nation - America is facing in order to get ahead and stay number 1 globally, unchallenged by any other nation.

We have done so much as a nation, even in giving charitably to other hurting nations. And I pray that America will remain that nation that other countries look up to. Let us take a decision to pray for this nation everyday as we rise up from our beds and ask God that He will bless America. God Bless!

 

[Nautilus]

The desire of some people to stay number one is crap to me. Does it inflate your ego? Because Im more concerned that everyone is taken care of first, has equal access to affordable healthcare and access to employment. Removing religion from government. As well as equal civil rights regardless of sex, race, or orientation. Our ranking in the world comes in far after all of those other topics.

 

[1Christianwarrior316]

Let us take a decision to pray for this nation everyday as we rise up from our beds and ask God that He will bless America. God Bless!

2Ch 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Looking at the condition of this nation we are no longer turning to God but instead are rejecting God and His Word, turning to worldly ways.

If we're turning from God then how can we expect the Lord to heal our land?

I believe that the persecution of the true saints in this nation is on the horizon.

In Christ, 1Christianwarrior316

 

[hmla63]

As far as I can tell all of these are issues but I only chose healthcare because unless you have your health you really can't do anything about the other options.

 

[AgapeSpiritEyes]

Cursed is the man who trust in man who makes his arm flesh trusting in drugs and man's knowledge of health is a curse whether you are a believer or not heaven on earth is never viable or attainable by man's arm of effort, utopia at ones imaginations best is still a curse comparatively to the Kingdom of Heaven, so the converse blessed is the person whose makes their arm spiritual, the silent unconscious cry of even a lost soul searching for utopia on earth is COME LORD JESUS

 

[Nautilus]

Non eo fthose options are really top of my list... :/

 

[TheGrungeDiva]

I am disappointed that education is on the bottom right now. So far, only 3 of 15 have voted for it.

Come on, people, education should be the #1 issue. Because every other issue you can think of can be solved through education.

Jobs? Well, the higher your education level, the better job you can get. Easy.
Health care? A well-educated populace can provide superior health care; through research we can find cures to diseases, discover better treatments, and help people live healthier lives.
Inflation? See jobs. As long as wages keep pace with inflation, it's not a bad thing. And if wages do not keep pace with inflation, only through understanding the economic issues at work can the problem be remedied. Education.
High gas prices? Let's find alternative energy sources through research and development.

Seriously, I challenge anyone to present a problem facing the world today that cannot be solved through education.

War in Afghanistan? If we -- both Americans and Afghans -- learn about each other, through exchange programs and common educational goals, we will come to agreement through diplomacy rather than war, a better option financially, ethically, and spiritually.

Abortion? The more women who understand the risks, the fewer will chose that tragic option. Only through education can women (AND MEN!!!!) learn how to prevent unwanted pregnancies.

Seriously, anyone. Just one issue you think can't be solved by education, and I will prove it can.

The fact that this nation is in such a sorry state is because its educational system is crumbling, and has not been working well for decades. This has nothing to do with latch-key kids or women's lib or atheists or taking the Bible out of School. It has everything to do with teaching kids how to think, not how to take a test.

Animals are trained. Humans are educated. But in most schools (both public and private) for the last 20-30 years, students have simply been trained to pass certain benchmarks, not educated. THAT is what is wrong with America.

::steps off soap box for a while::

 

[meecha]

I am disappointed that education is on the bottom right now. So far, only 3 of 15 have voted for it.

Come on, people, education should be the #1 issue. Because every other issue you can think of can be solved through education.

Jobs? Well, the higher your education level, the better job you can get. Easy.
Health care? A well-educated populace can provide superior health care; through research we can find cures to diseases, discover better treatments, and help people live healthier lives.
Inflation? See jobs. As long as wages keep pace with inflation, it's not a bad thing. And if wages do not keep pace with inflation, only through understanding the economic issues at work can the problem be remedied. Education.
High gas prices? Let's find alternative energy sources through research and development.

Seriously, I challenge anyone to present a problem facing the world today that cannot be solved through education.

War in Afghanistan? If we -- both Americans and Afghans -- learn about each other, through exchange programs and common educational goals, we will come to agreement through diplomacy rather than war, a better option financially, ethically, and spiritually.

Abortion? The more women who understand the risks, the fewer will chose that tragic option. Only through education can women (AND MEN!!!!) learn how to prevent unwanted pregnancies.

Seriously, anyone. Just one issue you think can't be solved by education, and I will prove it can.

The fact that this nation is in such a sorry state is because its educational system is crumbling, and has not been working well for decades. This has nothing to do with latch-key kids or women's lib or atheists or taking the Bible out of School. It has everything to do with teaching kids how to think, not how to take a test.

Animals are trained. Humans are educated. But in most schools (both public and private) for the last 20-30 years, students have simply been trained to pass certain benchmarks, not educated. THAT is what is wrong with America.

::steps off soap box for a while::

end tax funded education.........bring back little house on the prairie......read Mcguffey's 7th reader and ask yourself if todays kids could cope with it?

 

[meecha]

Inflation......soon to become hyper inflation....how the rich and powerful rob the rest of us

 

[Nautilus]

I was publicly educated...I was also reading at a high school level in 2nd grade. Maybe we should arrange classes by IQ instead of age and get better results by not holding back the smart ones and boring them in class to teach the dumb ones something.

 

[TheGrungeDiva]

end tax funded education

How will that help? That is exactly what got us into this mess. Bush and his cronies tried to destroy public education with their "no child left behind" act, which de-funds schools for teaching students rather than training them like monkeys. That is exactly the problem: the so-called "tax-funded" education is being mis-regulated. It is not education, it is glorified day care, and those who are trying to undermine teachers' attempts to make a real difference in children's lives need to be stopped.

bring back little house on the prairie

I'm not sure what you mean by this. I'm guessing you hearken back to a day when schools were set up as a single house with all the children in one room, a single "school marm" at the front giving out the days lessons to all the children of the village.

If this is not what you mean, then please explain.

If this is what you mean, then there are two problems with it:

1) Such single-room school houses were only used in rural America, and even then it was rare. That "little house on the prairie" life is make-believe. The US was never really like that: every Pa a hard-working man, every Ma housewife, and 2.3 kids behaved perfectly in their quaint little world where everyone was white and the biggest town dilemma was whether Miss Sue-Ann was going to make her dress or buy one at the market. It's a fantasy. Fiction. It makes for excellent reading, and mediocre television, but it's not historically accurate.

2) Even where such single-room school houses WERE used, guess what? They were tax-supported. The teacher's salary was paid by collecting a tax from everyone in the village, not just those who had children in the school, but anyone who thought educating children would be a good idea. That means the bachelor who ran the factory in town would pay the tax, because he wanted to make sure there was a pool of educated workers to hire. That means Ol' Widow Smith, whose grandchildren are even all growed up, still pays the tax because she benefited from that school when her children went there, and when their children went there, and she sure doesn't want all those hooligans running rampant on the street, after all, might as well keep them in a school.

read Mcguffey's 7th reader and ask yourself if todays kids could cope with it?

Let me ask you this:
If we end all tax-supported schools, how many kids do you think could cope with it: more than today or fewer?

And if you honestly think cutting all tax-supported schools is going to improve education for all children, not just the rich snobs who don't really need public education anyway, then pray tell me how that works? You've got a magic-farting unicorn again?

 

[TheGrungeDiva]

I was publicly educated...I was also reading at a high school level in 2nd grade. Maybe we should arrange classes by IQ instead of age and get better results by not holding back the smart ones and boring them in class to teach the dumb ones something.

Interesting idea. When I am elected queen of the universe, I will appoint you to be my Education Tsar.

 

[meecha]

How will that help? That is exactly what got us into this mess. Bush and his cronies tried to destroy public education with their "no child left behind" act, which de-funds schools for teaching students rather than training them like monkeys. That is exactly the problem: the so-called "tax-funded" education is being mis-regulated. It is not education, it is glorified day care, and those who are trying to undermine teachers' attempts to make a real difference in children's lives need to be stopped.

no child left behind was definitely a disaster and public education is indeed glorified day care

I'm not sure what you mean by this. I'm guessing you hearken back to a day when schools were set up as a single house with all the children in one room, a single "school marm" at the front giving out the days lessons to all the children of the village.

sure...you have a problem with that?

If this is what you mean, then there are two problems with it:

1) Such single-room school houses were only used in rural America, and even then it was rare. That "little house on the prairie" life is make-believe. The US was never really like that: every Pa a hard-working man, every Ma housewife, and 2.3 kids behaved perfectly in their quaint little world where everyone was white and the biggest town dilemma was whether Miss Sue-Ann was going to make her dress or buy one at the market. It's a fantasy. Fiction. It makes for excellent reading, and mediocre television, but it's not historically accurate.

so you are saying that the autobiographical work of Laura Ingills Wilder is fantasy? ok ....never come across that view before ..wiki has a big article ....guess I better check it out??

2) Even where such single-room school houses WERE used, guess what? They were tax-supported. The teacher's salary was paid by collecting a tax from everyone in the village, not just those who had children in the school, but anyone who thought educating children would be a good idea. That means the bachelor who ran the factory in town would pay the tax, because he wanted to make sure there was a pool of educated workers to hire. That means Ol' Widow Smith, whose grandchildren are even all growed up, still pays the tax because she benefited from that school when her children went there, and when their children went there, and she sure doesn't want all those hooligans running rampant on the street, after all, might as well keep them in a school.

fair point and I should have said federal tax funded ...but of course you didn't have to send your kids to school...they could work on the farm and get taught at home. Of course the teacher's salary need s to be paid but it stops there....no dept of education....no government inspections...no "national curriculum"

Let me ask you this:
If we end all tax-supported schools, how many kids do you think could cope with it: more than today or fewer?

the ones who will cope will be the ones whose parents care enough to educate them. Christians who know the Bible know that the job of education starts with the parents...actually the father to be precise...the more education is controlled by government the more it becomes propaganda.
Education belongs in the market where good products compete with bad ones. America is leading the way with it's home schooling movement. HOme schoolers are comfortably outperforming public and private schooled kids demonstrating that more money is NOT the answer since homeschoolers fund their own education program more succesfully than government. You have rightly recognised that government " education" is nothing more than extended child care. Follow the signs till you get to the logical conclusion.

And if you honestly think cutting all tax-supported schools is going to improve education for all children, not just the rich snobs who don't really need public education anyway, then pray tell me how that works?

the rich snobs will always do their own thing....it's in our power to do the right thing for our kids and not leave them at the mercy of the state. School is not a branch of social services...if there is no meaningful education happening it is time to look elsewhere.

 

[TheGrungeDiva]

so you are saying that the autobiographical work of Laura Ingills Wilder is fantasy? ok ....never come across that view before ..wiki has a big article ....guess I better check it out??

Ummmm .... you mentioned "Little House on the Prairie." That is fiction, not "autobiography." It's also only one of about 10 books written, all of which were based on the memories of a 90-year-old woman who even admitted, before she died, that they were embellished stories, not intended as historical fact.

And the TV series was so divergent from the books, it was complete fabrication.

Honestly, you're the first person I've met who didn't realize the series was fiction. I'm as astounded as your understanding of them as "autobiographical" as you are at my interpretation.

fair point and I should have said federal tax funded ...but of course you didn't have to send your kids to school...they could work on the farm and get taught at home.

And home-schooling is still an option.

Of course the teacher's salary need s to be paid but it stops there....no dept of education....no government inspections...no "national curriculum"

Hmmm. So, special-needs kids, like kids with mental or physical disabilities, are just SOL? And what about the lunch staff? Are you saying all kids should bring a lunch from home, and if the family is too poor, well, they'll just have to sit there and starve while they watch their friends eat?

I do agree that the "administrative" side of education has become too unwieldy. This is one thing I would (and/or will) change. But you can't completely eliminate the administration. In a doctor's office, if there's only one doctor, you may not need a medical assistant of any kind. But how many people can that one doctor serve, doing all his own paperwork, labwork, billing, etc.? He could keep track of maybe 50 patients? What happens when you're serving a town with more than 50 people? Well, doctors get together, 5 or 6 of them in an office, and they hire several nurses, a few medical assistants, a billing specialist, and maybe two lab people, heck, let's throw in a pharmacist. Now you need the admin. And it makes sense for different people to do different jobs, allowing the nurses to do what they're good at, the doctors to do what they're trained for, and providing a good distribution of labor.

This is how education should be. I am in complete agreement that we do not need administrators telling teachers how to do their job. It should be the other way around.

the ones who will cope will be the ones whose parents care enough to educate them.

....and happen to be wealthy enough that one parent can stay home and educate the kids, and lucky enough not to have a kid with any special needs, and smart enough to do it, meaning their own parents were both wealthy and lucky ... meaning the wealthy will become more educated, and the poor will become less so, and the separation between the classes will become more and more pronounced.

No, Lord Jesus Christ, that is NOT the way!

You have rightly recognised that government " education" is nothing more than extended child care. Follow the signs till you get to the logical conclusion.

And your "logical conclusion" is that if something doesn't work, throw it away? What a wasteful attitude.

What ever happened to good ol'-fashioned American ingenuity? Sure, a cheap plastic watch can be discarded rather than investing money to repair it. But children? Are you really suggesting that our children are so cheap as to be discarded rather than to look to solutions to the problem? Fix the problem, don't throw it away!

School is not a branch of social services...if there is no meaningful education happening it is time to look elsewhere.

It is, has always been, and should continue to be. The reason civilized people support public education is because it is what is best for the greater good. That is practically the DEFINITION of a social program.

As for uncivilized people, I don't care what they do or why. I just know that we must strive to do better.

 

[jimmydiggs]

With the debt we have, we'll be foreclosed on by China and Japan before long.