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zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
Great attributes for any Christian, those who are following Christ. OH! BTW!!!!! Let us not forget this attribute: GOD IS LOVE.
cfultz
does an adult of the age of accountability who has heard of Jesus need to recognize, and acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as the Saviour?

can an adult of the age of accountability acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as being a real historical figure, and reject Him completely yet be saved?
 

tribesman

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2011
4,622
282
83
Is God allowed to act on a soul which has not yet reached the age of accountability or does He have to wait until that soul has enough reason to be able to make the "right decision"?

Luke 1:44

For, lo, as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in mine ears, the babe leaped in my womb for joy.


Two worlds apart.
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
19,212
2,547
113
An adult of accountablilty needs to yes, But i never believe in something as doctrine. Many have their own beliefs and some are so far from the truth and feel so strongly about it they without realizing it are very far from god. The only way to know if our beliefs are true is to know god on a deep and personal level. No doctrine or customs can do that which god himself does in our hearts
 
C

cfultz3

Guest
cfultz
does an adult of the age of accountability who has heard of Jesus need to recognize, and acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as the Saviour? ABSOLUTELY

can an adult of the age of accountability acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as being a real historical figure, and reject Him completely yet be saved? NOPE. But, from my understanding, correct me if I am wrong, that old Covenant is everlasting. The Law is still there for the Jew. I also understand that those of the OT received their righteousness (not speaking about justification) from that Law.

And from there, my line of reasoning goes to faith being the means of salvation, both those in the OT and NT. They who were of the OT surely received their justification (deliverance from death) because they had faith in a coming Deliverer.

Now, will those Jews who were born after those who were in Hades be held to the same standard of having faith in Christ alone as we Christian do? I do not know. But, I do know God is not quite finished with them.
..................
 
T

Therapon

Guest
. A true Christian isn't someone with the right doctrine, but someone with a humble and contrite heart towards our heavenly Father. Just the fact that you said this proves you are in the right to me.
I used to be deeply hurt by the attacks on my spirit by those who claim to be brethren. But lately, the Lord has given me peace with it. I now just shake my head in unbelief at the untrue criticisms and pray for them, because it must really hurt their walk with the Lord.
 
T

Therapon

Guest
Great attributes for any Christian, those who are following Christ. OH! BTW!!!!! Let us not forget this attribute: GOD IS LOVE.
He is indeed, and I don't forget it. <smile>
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
An adult of accountablilty needs to yes, But i never believe in something as doctrine. Many have their own beliefs and some are so far from the truth and feel so strongly about it they without realizing it are very far from god. The only way to know if our beliefs are true is to know god on a deep and personal level. No doctrine or customs can do that which god himself does in our hearts
i asked specifically about the Person of Jesus Christ of the Bible.
that Name.
that Man. That Saviour.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
I used to be deeply hurt by the attacks on my spirit by those who claim to be brethren. But lately, the Lord has given me peace with it. I now just shake my head in unbelief at the untrue criticisms and pray for them, because it must really hurt their walk with the Lord.
i don't consider you a brother so don't be hurt over anything i say.
 
T

Therapon

Guest
An adult of accountablilty needs to yes, But i never believe in something as doctrine. Many have their own beliefs and some are so far from the truth and feel so strongly about it they without realizing it are very far from god. The only way to know if our beliefs are true is to know god on a deep and personal level. No doctrine or customs can do that which god himself does in our hearts
You are wise beyond your years, brother. <smile>
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
19,212
2,547
113
Zone if you wish to know if Jesus is lord and savior read about him. I live by faith and my deep love for Jesus, the fact you said you do not consider Therapon a brother is your decision and that is allowed but also makes me question your motives.
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
19,212
2,547
113
LOL Loveme1 and Therapon, i am flattered but in truth this is not my own knowledge. I cannot claim to be wise or knowledgable because i only know and believe what i do because i had the advantage to spend all day everyday with god. No job, no school. I gave up video games and movies daily to just enjoy spending time with him. So many other did not have that advantage and god himself taught me these things. These are his words and teachings, his knowledge and wisdom not my own
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
8,137
216
63
LOL Loveme1 and Therapon, i am flattered but in truth this is not my own knowledge. I cannot claim to be wise or knowledgable because i only know and believe what i do because i had the advantage to spend all day everyday with god. No job, no school. I gave up video games and movies daily to just enjoy spending time with him. So many other did not have that advantage and god himself taught me these things. These are his words and teachings, his knowledge and wisdom not my own
So then you have plenty of time to:

John 5

And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape. 38And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.39Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. 40And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. 41I receive not honour from men. 42But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you. 43I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. 44How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only? 45Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there isone that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. 46For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.47But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?
Peace and Love Blain.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
it's more helpful if you can use the quote feature .
i'll do it like this, this time tho:)


Originally Posted by zone
cfultz
does an adult of the age of accountability who has heard of Jesus need to recognize, and acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as the Saviour?

Originally Posted by zone
can an adult of the age of accountability acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as being a real historical figure, and reject Him completely yet be saved?

But, from my understanding, correct me if I am wrong, that old Covenant is everlasting.
this is Christianity 101, cfultz.
did you know this once and forget?
or have you adopted a new doctrine?

notice how easily we are enticed away by false teachers.


Hebrews 8:13 c68AD
In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

STRONGS NT 3822: παλαιόω

παλαιόω, παλαιῷ: perfect πεπαλαίωκα; passive, present participle παλαιουμενος; future παλαιωθήσομαι; (παλαιός);

a. to make ancient or old, the Sept. for בִּלָּה; passive to become old, to be worn out, the Sept. for בָּלָה, עָתַק: of things worn out by time and use, as βαλάντιον, Luke 12:33; ἱμάτιον, Hebrews 1:11 (cf. Psalm 101:27 (); Deuteronomy 29:5; Joshua 9:19 (); Nehemiah 9:21; Isaiah 50:9; Isaiah 51:6; Sir. 14:17). passive τό παλαιούμενον, that which is becoming old, Hebrews 8:13 (Plato, symp., p. 208 b.; Tim., p. 59 c.).

b. to declare a thing to be old and so about to be abrogated: Hebrews 8:13 (see γηράσκω, at the end).



Galatians 4
Sons and Heirs

1I mean that the heir, as long as he is a child, is no different from a slave,a though he is the owner of everything, 2but he is under guardians and managers until the date set by his father. 3In the same way we also, when we were children, were enslaved to the elementary principlesb of the world. 4But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law, 5to redeem those who were under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons. 6And because you are sons, God has sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, crying, “Abba! Father!” 7So you are no longer a slave, but a son, and if a son, then an heir through God.

Example of Hagar and Sarah
21Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not listen to the law? 22For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by a slave woman and one by a free woman. 23But the son of the slave was born according to the flesh, while the son of the free woman was born through promise. 24Now this may be interpreted allegorically: these women are two covenants. One is from Mount Sinai, bearing children for slavery; she is Hagar. 25Now Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia;e she corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother. 27For it is written,

“Rejoice, O barren one who does not bear;
break forth and cry aloud, you who are not in labor!
For the children of the desolate one will be more
than those of the one who has a husband.”

28Now you,f brothers, like Isaac, are children of promise. 29But just as at that time he who was born according to the flesh persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, so also it is now. 30But what does the Scripture say? “Cast out the slave woman and her son, for the son of the slave woman shall not inherit with the son of the free woman.” 31So, brothers, we are not children of the slave but of the free woman.

But, from my understanding, correct me if I am wrong, that old Covenant is everlasting.
so are you wrong? ^


The Law is still there for the Jew. I also understand that those of the OT received their righteousness (not speaking about justification) from that Law.
false. jews have no standing before God when rejecting Christ.
no one does.
didn't you already agree to that?

And from there, my line of reasoning goes to faith being the means of salvation, both those in the OT and NT. They who were of the OT surely received their justification (deliverance from death) because they had faith in a coming Deliverer.
alright.

Now, will those Jews who were born after those who were in Hades be held to the same standard of having faith in Christ alone as we Christian do? I do not know. But, I do know God is not quite finished with them.
Originally Posted by zone
cfultz
does an adult of the age of accountability who has heard of Jesus need to recognize, and acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as the Saviour?

Originally Posted by zone
can an adult of the age of accountability acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as being a real historical figure, and reject Him completely yet be saved?

i don't think you know what you believe.

what happened cfultz?
 
G

GreenNnice

Guest
[video]http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=1M_0U-9DV70&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D1M_0U-9DV70[/video]
i don't consider you a brother so don't be hurt over anything i say.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
Is God allowed to act on a soul which has not yet reached the age of accountability or does He have to wait until that soul has enough reason to be able to make the "right decision"?





Two worlds apart.
i was merely trying to foresee ANY possible cop-outs tm.
bear with me
 
C

cfultz3

Guest
it's more helpful if you can use the quote feature .
i'll do it like this, this time tho:)


Originally Posted by zone
cfultz
does an adult of the age of accountability who has heard of Jesus need to recognize, and acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as the Saviour?



Originally Posted by zone
can an adult of the age of accountability acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as being a real historical figure, and reject Him completely yet be saved?





this is Christianity 101, cfultz.
did you know this once and forget?
or have you adopted a new doctrine?

notice how easily we are enticed away by false teachers.


Hebrews 8:13 c68AD
In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

STRONGS NT 3822: παλαιόω

παλαιόω, παλαιῷ: perfect πεπαλαίωκα; passive, present participle παλαιουμενος; future παλαιωθήσομαι; (παλαιός);

a. to make ancient or old, the Sept. for בִּלָּה; passive to become old, to be worn out, the Sept. for בָּלָה, עָתַק: of things worn out by time and use, as βαλάντιον, Luke 12:33; ἱμάτιον, Hebrews 1:11 (cf. Psalm 101:27 (); Deuteronomy 29:5; Joshua 9:19 (); Nehemiah 9:21; Isaiah 50:9; Isaiah 51:6; Sir. 14:17). passive τό παλαιούμενον, that which is becoming old, Hebrews 8:13 (Plato, symp., p. 208 b.; Tim., p. 59 c.).

b. to declare a thing to be old and so about to be abrogated: Hebrews 8:13 (see γηράσκω, at the end).



Galatians 4
Sons and Heirs

1I mean that the heir, as long as he is a child, is no different from a slave,a though he is the owner of everything, 2but he is under guardians and managers until the date set by his father. 3In the same way we also, when we were children, were enslaved to the elementary principlesb of the world. 4But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law, 5to redeem those who were under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons. 6And because you are sons, God has sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, crying, “Abba! Father!” 7So you are no longer a slave, but a son, and if a son, then an heir through God.

Example of Hagar and Sarah
21Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not listen to the law? 22For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by a slave woman and one by a free woman. 23But the son of the slave was born according to the flesh, while the son of the free woman was born through promise. 24Now this may be interpreted allegorically: these women are two covenants. One is from Mount Sinai, bearing children for slavery; she is Hagar. 25Now Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia;e she corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother. 27For it is written,

“Rejoice, O barren one who does not bear;
break forth and cry aloud, you who are not in labor!
For the children of the desolate one will be more
than those of the one who has a husband.”

28Now you,f brothers, like Isaac, are children of promise. 29But just as at that time he who was born according to the flesh persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, so also it is now. 30But what does the Scripture say? “Cast out the slave woman and her son, for the son of the slave woman shall not inherit with the son of the free woman.” 31So, brothers, we are not children of the slave but of the free woman.



so are you wrong? ^




false. jews have no standing before God when rejecting Christ.
no one does.
didn't you already agree to that?



alright.



Originally Posted by zone
cfultz
does an adult of the age of accountability who has heard of Jesus need to recognize, and acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as the Saviour?



Originally Posted by zone
can an adult of the age of accountability acknowledge Jesus Christ of Nazareth as being a real historical figure, and reject Him completely yet be saved?



i don't think you know what you believe.

what happened cfultz?
May God bless you, Zone.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
Zone if you wish to know if Jesus is lord and savior read about him. I live by faith and my deep love for Jesus, the fact you said you do not consider Therapon a brother is your decision and that is allowed but also makes me question your motives.

i'm not asking about Jesus for myself.
if you're not following this ongoing dispute, then please either do, or don't.
ellis is a false teacher, and extremely dangerous.

you can like; follow; call a brother or let him butter you up if you want to.
that's your choice.
my motives are clear.

he's a false teacher.
i'm saying so.

nothing more, nothing less.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
May God bless you, Zone.
alright.
you don't even understand the basics of the Christian faith apparently.

that's okay.
it takes time i guess.
i wouldn't be trying to learn from Therapon.
but its your choice.