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P
If I were Walid Shoebat I would not be approaching bible prophecy through the traditional historicist context would I. Last I knew he drank the 7-year tribulation kool-aid. Whoever it was he couldn't answer, would be for the same reasons that you will watch unfold here with grateful.
Why don't you try the question on me? Who's Troy Mo.? What's that an abbreviation for?
Why don't you try the question on me? Who's Troy Mo.? What's that an abbreviation for?
P
You got any idea about what question he referenced Shoebat got stumped on when he referenced "the questions you couldnt answer in Troy Mo. 2010 in front of the church"?
(Not that any Christian should be expected to have an immediate answer any question, in regard to eschatology, on the fly. Except perhaps a careless Christian that has duped himself into believing he has all the answers.)
(Not that any Christian should be expected to have an immediate answer any question, in regard to eschatology, on the fly. Except perhaps a careless Christian that has duped himself into believing he has all the answers.)
Last edited by a moderator:
So Isaiah said the jews would get their land back a second time.
Im looking for the prophecy that says they will return for the third time.
I think that page might have fell out my bible. It is getting pretty rugged.
Im looking for the prophecy that says they will return for the third time.
I think that page might have fell out my bible. It is getting pretty rugged.
W
Troy Mo. is a town not far from St Loius that is right. Calvary chapel is there with another 501c3 false teacher like you named wes denum . I think you are walid and you would justify the deception because you think islam has a jihad on you. Did you find out why Ephraim and Dan are not in Rev 7 that was just one of the questions you still cant answer. Amazing now you fell that you might be from that tribe of Ephraim please explain how that is even possible. If I sleep in a garage does that make me a car you are to funny and liars will not be in heaven Ex 20; 16 and if this is not walid I am sorry.
So many battles, so little context.
Lets have a look at some of the battles so you get an idea of what is happening.
The battle of Badr. Where 950 full armour soldier fought against 320 lightly armed muslims.
The battle of Uhud where the Quraish bitter about the loss at Badr sent an army of 3000 to Madinah to fight against the 700 strong muslim force.
The battle of the trench was the battle where the Quraish recruited people from all over Saudi Arabia. They had a force of 20,000 to the muslims 3,000. A storm destroyed the Quraish camp and ended the battle before it gained any momentum.
You can imagine the size of the armies the Romans and Persians the Muslims had to contend with.
I will end with this quote from Islam at the Crossroads
"History makes it clear, however, that the legend of fanatical Muslims sweeping through the world and forcing Islam at the point of the sword upon conquered races is one of the most fantastically absurd myths that historians have ever accepted." (Islam at the Crossroads, London, 1923, p. 8.).
Lets have a look at some of the battles so you get an idea of what is happening.
The battle of Badr. Where 950 full armour soldier fought against 320 lightly armed muslims.
The battle of Uhud where the Quraish bitter about the loss at Badr sent an army of 3000 to Madinah to fight against the 700 strong muslim force.
The battle of the trench was the battle where the Quraish recruited people from all over Saudi Arabia. They had a force of 20,000 to the muslims 3,000. A storm destroyed the Quraish camp and ended the battle before it gained any momentum.
You can imagine the size of the armies the Romans and Persians the Muslims had to contend with.
I will end with this quote from Islam at the Crossroads
"History makes it clear, however, that the legend of fanatical Muslims sweeping through the world and forcing Islam at the point of the sword upon conquered races is one of the most fantastically absurd myths that historians have ever accepted." (Islam at the Crossroads, London, 1923, p. 8.).
P
That's the problem with trading historical facts for imagination. They had a massive well trained cavalry.
".... according to one unidentified Arab, 'That army went through all places like a desolating storm.' sacking and capturing the city of Bordeaux, and then defeating the army of Duke Odo of Aquitaine at the Battle of the River Garonne — where the western chroniclers state, 'God alone knows the number of the slain'—[3] and Odo fled to Charles Martel, seeking help."
Internet History Sourcebooks Project
Battle of Tours - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Since none of them had jobs, and thus Islam was little more than a massive, cutthroat, murderous theft ring, the army expanded rapidly with fellow reprobates, the farther it went. A problem was, like any theft ring, the larger it got the farther the stolen spoils had to be stretched.
What other army is trained to believe that if you are inadvertently killed while engaged in the act of imperialistic agression against peaceful peoples, that you will receive a reward of multiple virgins to defile, in the chicken and wine serving bordello of Muhammad's overactive imagination?
This is the same reason that young Muslim men travel to foreign countries to get engaged in foreign wars today - besides that anyone who doesn't - or at a minimum wishes in his heart of hearts that he was engaged in fighting non-Muslims - "dies with one of the qualities of a hypocrite".
You can't drop a taqiyyah bomb and expect it to end there. You are as responsible and accountable before God for every word you put in this forum - as am I.
So we either have a Muslim in the forum engaging in taqiyyah, or someone in abject ignorance to history, that prefers being propagandized by a purveyor of taqiyyah rather than seeking out truth. We can hopefully clear some of the air early on. Since for a Muslim to confess that Jesus is the Son of God constitutes the ONLY UNFORGIVABLE SIN, as opposed to child rape or cold-blooded mass murder which are forgivable:
1. Do you confess before the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, and do you pray in Jesus name?
2. Do you confess that Jesus Christ was crucified, died, and was resurrected from the dead?
Now let's look at an Amazon note on the propaganda that you were brainwashed by:
"First published in 1934, this book "Islam at the Crossroads" was written as plea to the Muslims of that generation to avaoid a blind imitation of Western scoail forms and values, and to try to preserve instead their Islamic heritage which once upon a time had been responsible for the glorious many-sided historical phenomenon comprised in the "Muslim Civilization". But, as it happened, much of what the author had aimed at was subsequently misunderstood by the readers and leaders who failed to grasp the full implications of his call to cultural creativeness and to return to the true ideology of the Qur'an and Sunnah. This revised edition, it is hoped, would clarify something of the tragic confusion nowadays prevailing in the Muslim world. This is dedicated to the Muslim youth of today, just as the original 1934 edition was dedicated to the Muslim youth of those days."
Islamic heritage - guffaw! A "heritage" that didn't exist before Muhammad invented it in the 7th century.
A far better way to "the Muslim youth of today" would have been to point out to them that all of the Islamic so-called "tradition" that regards any notion of pre-4th century AD Mecca - that masquerades as 6,000 years of history - is nothing more than 7th to 10th century pure created fiction penned without reference to any actual history that preceded the 5th century AD - pure unadulterated poppycock. That was, at least this generation, could comfortably leave the false prophet Muhammad's antichrist cult, lay down their suicide vests, and come to Christ.
THE HISTORY OF MECCA
"Muslim civilization"??? That's an oxymoron! Today's violent Islamic reprobates are no different than those of the rest of its violent 1400 year history. I'll quote Winston Churchill:
“How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live…The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men. Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities…but the influence of the religion paralyzes the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa…and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it had vainly struggled, the civilization of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilization of ancient Rome.” - by Sir Winston Churchill - The River War, Vol. II, pp. 248-50, London; Longman, Green & Co., 1899
Prophet words as Europe secularized, and today we watch Europe falling to Islamic hordes, without a shot being fired.
Falling Away or Apostasy
"So many battles, so little context" eigh? Please explain to us what the imperialistic forces of the First Islamic Jihad were doing in Tours France and Vienna Austria. This was of course after they conquered, subjugated and enslaved all of Arabia and the Middle East.
Like the beheading of the innocent Banu Qurayza Jewish farm boys, their dads and grandpas - who never struck a blow - after which raping their little sisters, moms, and grandmothers while selling the discards off into slavery for camels and swords, and stealing the fruit of their labor of generations:
Bukhari:V5B59N448 "They then surrendered to the Prophet's judgment but he directed them to Sa'd to give the verdict. Sad said, 'I give my judgment that their men should be killed, their women and children should be taken as captives, and their properties distributed.'"
All of the boys that exhibited pubic hair were beheaded.
Tabari VIII:35/Ishaq:464 "The Jews were made to come down, and Allah's Messenger imprisoned them. Then the Prophet went out into the marketplace of Medina (it is still its marketplace today), and he had trenches dug in it. He sent for the Jewish men and had them beheaded in those trenches. They were brought out to him in batches. They numbered 800 to 900 boys and men."
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri: We got female captives in the war booty and we used to do coitus interruptus with them. So we asked Allah's Apostle about it and he said, "Do you really do that?" repeating the question thrice, "There is no soul that is destined to exist but will come into existence, till the Day of Resurrection." (Book #62, Hadith #137)
It is obviously false doctrine (all of which is inspired by Satan) that would cause a person to jump to the defense of a cult - that is commanded to conquer all kingdoms, and subjugate all people, to DISbelieving the crucifixion of Christ, DENYING the Son of God, and REJECTING His shed blood as articles of faith in Muhammad - with falsehood.
Why are you defending a violent imperialistic antichrist cult that is commanded to conquer and subjugate YOU to disbelieving, denying and rejecting the same, while also subjugating you to prostrating yourself toward the Quraish pagan's black stone idol in Mecca five times a day, while praying in the "vain repetitions of the heathen" in the names of the Arabian pagan deity "Allah" and his "messenger" Muhammad?
Look at the evil that unsound doctrine duped these poor self-proclaimed Christians into getting involved with, during this great apostasy:
http://www.brotherpete.com/religious_pluralism.htm
".... according to one unidentified Arab, 'That army went through all places like a desolating storm.' sacking and capturing the city of Bordeaux, and then defeating the army of Duke Odo of Aquitaine at the Battle of the River Garonne — where the western chroniclers state, 'God alone knows the number of the slain'—[3] and Odo fled to Charles Martel, seeking help."
Internet History Sourcebooks Project
Battle of Tours - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Since none of them had jobs, and thus Islam was little more than a massive, cutthroat, murderous theft ring, the army expanded rapidly with fellow reprobates, the farther it went. A problem was, like any theft ring, the larger it got the farther the stolen spoils had to be stretched.
What other army is trained to believe that if you are inadvertently killed while engaged in the act of imperialistic agression against peaceful peoples, that you will receive a reward of multiple virgins to defile, in the chicken and wine serving bordello of Muhammad's overactive imagination?
This is the same reason that young Muslim men travel to foreign countries to get engaged in foreign wars today - besides that anyone who doesn't - or at a minimum wishes in his heart of hearts that he was engaged in fighting non-Muslims - "dies with one of the qualities of a hypocrite".
You can't drop a taqiyyah bomb and expect it to end there. You are as responsible and accountable before God for every word you put in this forum - as am I.
So we either have a Muslim in the forum engaging in taqiyyah, or someone in abject ignorance to history, that prefers being propagandized by a purveyor of taqiyyah rather than seeking out truth. We can hopefully clear some of the air early on. Since for a Muslim to confess that Jesus is the Son of God constitutes the ONLY UNFORGIVABLE SIN, as opposed to child rape or cold-blooded mass murder which are forgivable:
1. Do you confess before the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, and do you pray in Jesus name?
2. Do you confess that Jesus Christ was crucified, died, and was resurrected from the dead?
Now let's look at an Amazon note on the propaganda that you were brainwashed by:
"First published in 1934, this book "Islam at the Crossroads" was written as plea to the Muslims of that generation to avaoid a blind imitation of Western scoail forms and values, and to try to preserve instead their Islamic heritage which once upon a time had been responsible for the glorious many-sided historical phenomenon comprised in the "Muslim Civilization". But, as it happened, much of what the author had aimed at was subsequently misunderstood by the readers and leaders who failed to grasp the full implications of his call to cultural creativeness and to return to the true ideology of the Qur'an and Sunnah. This revised edition, it is hoped, would clarify something of the tragic confusion nowadays prevailing in the Muslim world. This is dedicated to the Muslim youth of today, just as the original 1934 edition was dedicated to the Muslim youth of those days."
Islamic heritage - guffaw! A "heritage" that didn't exist before Muhammad invented it in the 7th century.
A far better way to "the Muslim youth of today" would have been to point out to them that all of the Islamic so-called "tradition" that regards any notion of pre-4th century AD Mecca - that masquerades as 6,000 years of history - is nothing more than 7th to 10th century pure created fiction penned without reference to any actual history that preceded the 5th century AD - pure unadulterated poppycock. That was, at least this generation, could comfortably leave the false prophet Muhammad's antichrist cult, lay down their suicide vests, and come to Christ.
THE HISTORY OF MECCA
"Muslim civilization"??? That's an oxymoron! Today's violent Islamic reprobates are no different than those of the rest of its violent 1400 year history. I'll quote Winston Churchill:
“How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live…The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men. Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities…but the influence of the religion paralyzes the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa…and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it had vainly struggled, the civilization of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilization of ancient Rome.” - by Sir Winston Churchill - The River War, Vol. II, pp. 248-50, London; Longman, Green & Co., 1899
Prophet words as Europe secularized, and today we watch Europe falling to Islamic hordes, without a shot being fired.
Falling Away or Apostasy
"So many battles, so little context" eigh? Please explain to us what the imperialistic forces of the First Islamic Jihad were doing in Tours France and Vienna Austria. This was of course after they conquered, subjugated and enslaved all of Arabia and the Middle East.
Like the beheading of the innocent Banu Qurayza Jewish farm boys, their dads and grandpas - who never struck a blow - after which raping their little sisters, moms, and grandmothers while selling the discards off into slavery for camels and swords, and stealing the fruit of their labor of generations:
Bukhari:V5B59N448 "They then surrendered to the Prophet's judgment but he directed them to Sa'd to give the verdict. Sad said, 'I give my judgment that their men should be killed, their women and children should be taken as captives, and their properties distributed.'"
All of the boys that exhibited pubic hair were beheaded.
Tabari VIII:35/Ishaq:464 "The Jews were made to come down, and Allah's Messenger imprisoned them. Then the Prophet went out into the marketplace of Medina (it is still its marketplace today), and he had trenches dug in it. He sent for the Jewish men and had them beheaded in those trenches. They were brought out to him in batches. They numbered 800 to 900 boys and men."
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri: We got female captives in the war booty and we used to do coitus interruptus with them. So we asked Allah's Apostle about it and he said, "Do you really do that?" repeating the question thrice, "There is no soul that is destined to exist but will come into existence, till the Day of Resurrection." (Book #62, Hadith #137)
It is obviously false doctrine (all of which is inspired by Satan) that would cause a person to jump to the defense of a cult - that is commanded to conquer all kingdoms, and subjugate all people, to DISbelieving the crucifixion of Christ, DENYING the Son of God, and REJECTING His shed blood as articles of faith in Muhammad - with falsehood.
Why are you defending a violent imperialistic antichrist cult that is commanded to conquer and subjugate YOU to disbelieving, denying and rejecting the same, while also subjugating you to prostrating yourself toward the Quraish pagan's black stone idol in Mecca five times a day, while praying in the "vain repetitions of the heathen" in the names of the Arabian pagan deity "Allah" and his "messenger" Muhammad?
Look at the evil that unsound doctrine duped these poor self-proclaimed Christians into getting involved with, during this great apostasy:
http://www.brotherpete.com/religious_pluralism.htm
“In those days and at that time,
when I restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem,
[SUP]2 [/SUP]I will gather all nations
and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat.[SUP][b][/SUP]
There I will put them on trial
for what they did to my inheritance, my people Israel,
because they scattered my people among the nations
and divided up my land.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]They cast lots for my people
and traded boys for prostitutes;
they sold girls for wine to drink.
Now what have you against me, Tyre and Sidon and all you regions of Philistia? Are you repaying me for something I have done? If you are paying me back, I will swiftly and speedily return on your own heads what you have done. [SUP]5 [/SUP]For you took my silver and my gold and carried off my finest treasures to your temples.[SUP][c][/SUP] [SUP]6 [/SUP]You sold the people of Judah and Jerusalem to the Greeks, that you might send them far from their homeland. [SUP]7 [/SUP]“See, I am going to rouse them out of the places to which you sold them, and I will return on your own heads what you have done. [SUP]8 [/SUP]I will sell your sons and daughters to the people of Judah, and they will sell them to the Sabeans, a nation far away.” The Lord has spoken.
Bring down your warriors, Lord!
[SUP]12 [/SUP]“Let the nations be roused;
let them advance into the Valley of Jehoshaphat,
for there I will sit
to judge all the nations on every side.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Swing the sickle,
for the harvest is ripe.
Come, trample the grapes,
for the winepress is full
and the vats overflow—
so great is their wickedness!”
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Multitudes, multitudes
in the valley of decision!
For the day of the Lord is near
in the valley of decision.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]The sun and moon will be darkened,
and the stars no longer shine.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]The Lord will roar from Zion
and thunder from Jerusalem;
the earth and the heavens will tremble.
But the Lord will be a refuge for his people,
a stronghold for the people of Israel.
Blessings for God’s People
[SUP]17 [/SUP]“Then you will know that I, the Lord your God,
dwell in Zion, my holy hill.
Jerusalem will be holy;
never again will foreigners invade her.
(taken from Joel3)
Can you tell me when exactly all the nations were brought to the valley of Jehoshaphat, and the sun and the moon were darkened, and the sun no longer shone, only it seems clear from scripture that at this time Israel will/or have been restored to their own land, and no foriegner will again invade the land
Thanks
when I restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem,
[SUP]2 [/SUP]I will gather all nations
and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat.[SUP][b][/SUP]
There I will put them on trial
for what they did to my inheritance, my people Israel,
because they scattered my people among the nations
and divided up my land.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]They cast lots for my people
and traded boys for prostitutes;
they sold girls for wine to drink.
Now what have you against me, Tyre and Sidon and all you regions of Philistia? Are you repaying me for something I have done? If you are paying me back, I will swiftly and speedily return on your own heads what you have done. [SUP]5 [/SUP]For you took my silver and my gold and carried off my finest treasures to your temples.[SUP][c][/SUP] [SUP]6 [/SUP]You sold the people of Judah and Jerusalem to the Greeks, that you might send them far from their homeland. [SUP]7 [/SUP]“See, I am going to rouse them out of the places to which you sold them, and I will return on your own heads what you have done. [SUP]8 [/SUP]I will sell your sons and daughters to the people of Judah, and they will sell them to the Sabeans, a nation far away.” The Lord has spoken.
Bring down your warriors, Lord!
[SUP]12 [/SUP]“Let the nations be roused;
let them advance into the Valley of Jehoshaphat,
for there I will sit
to judge all the nations on every side.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Swing the sickle,
for the harvest is ripe.
Come, trample the grapes,
for the winepress is full
and the vats overflow—
so great is their wickedness!”
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Multitudes, multitudes
in the valley of decision!
For the day of the Lord is near
in the valley of decision.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]The sun and moon will be darkened,
and the stars no longer shine.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]The Lord will roar from Zion
and thunder from Jerusalem;
the earth and the heavens will tremble.
But the Lord will be a refuge for his people,
a stronghold for the people of Israel.
Blessings for God’s People
[SUP]17 [/SUP]“Then you will know that I, the Lord your God,
dwell in Zion, my holy hill.
Jerusalem will be holy;
never again will foreigners invade her.
(taken from Joel3)
Can you tell me when exactly all the nations were brought to the valley of Jehoshaphat, and the sun and the moon were darkened, and the sun no longer shone, only it seems clear from scripture that at this time Israel will/or have been restored to their own land, and no foriegner will again invade the land
Thanks