I think it's a sin issue and a false theology issue. When people try to cover up their sins, the best method is to twist Scripture to conform to their liking so they can cover it up. This in turn results in others believing it, spreading the sin even further. Thus, a little leaven leavens the whole lump.
USURPING AUTHORITY
- Thread starter Stephen63
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I just did a search on my own threads for this and cannot find it. But when I searched the postings in those threads, I found the subject of banning in this one:
How many heretics have you converted?
I also found this in it:
I'm glad you accused me. It made me look back and find this. Without you, this may not have happened. Thank you.
Because that thread was opened, others were able to bless her and change her mind. Just one is worth at all. Maybe something like that could happen on this one as well.
How many heretics have you converted?
I also found this in it:
I'm glad you accused me. It made me look back and find this. Without you, this may not have happened. Thank you.
Because that thread was opened, others were able to bless her and change her mind. Just one is worth at all. Maybe something like that could happen on this one as well.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
[SUP]21 [/SUP]For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.
I believe all men will be saved and yet have been banned for by you and others who CLAIM to know truth. I and others like me are cast away for lies about our loving Father.
I had posted earlier that the ONLY difference between an adversary and an advocate when using scripture is the heart when applied to them. Most here have darkened hearts as I post DAILY about the things we as "christians" should be concerned about, but instead we discuss hair color and should females be pastors for the last 2000 plus years.
They will not all be saved, even though the Father desires them to.
1 Timothy 2:3-4 [SUP]3 [/SUP]For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; [SUP]4 [/SUP]Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
2 Peter 3:9 [SUP]9 [/SUP]The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
1 Timothy 2:3-4 [SUP]3 [/SUP]For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; [SUP]4 [/SUP]Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
2 Peter 3:9 [SUP]9 [/SUP]The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
1
I think what we're forgetting is that Paul intended what he wrote to the Galatians, to totally cancel out what he wrote to Timothy and the Corinthians. You know, kinda like how if you eat a Big Mac, but drink a Diet Coke, the Diet Coke cancels out the Big Mac.
Like to the Galatians he wrote...
Galatians 3
[SUP]28 [/SUP]There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave[SUP][g][/SUP] nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. [SUP]29 [/SUP]And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise.
I mean isn't it clear that Paul is wiping out gender roles and even gender distinctions?
We're not even male and female in Christ!
Right?
Right?
This verse totally cancels out the gender distinct roles he writes about to Timothy and the Corinthians...
1 Tim 2
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Let a woman learn quietly with all submissiveness. [SUP]12 [/SUP]I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet. [SUP]13 [/SUP]For Adam was formed first, then Eve;
1 Cor 14
[SUP]33 [/SUP]For God is not a God of confusion but of peace.
As in all the churches of the saints, [SUP]34 [/SUP]the women should keep silent in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be in submission, as the Law also says. [SUP]35 [/SUP]If there is anything they desire to learn, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is shameful for a woman to speak in church.
I mean most people I know think that 1 Timothy 2 and 1 Cor 14 are the Big Mac and Galatians 3 up there is the Diet Coke. It cancels out all the gender roles and distinctions.
Of course there are some completely crazy people, get this, you'll laugh, these crazy people say Paul was inspired by the Holy Spirit, and that he actually wrote in favor of unity in Christ while also upholding gender roles and distinctions. Not because the roles and distinctions make someone better than the other, but because God made things to function that way. <---But ONLY crazy people believe that.
I hope my absurdity in this post drives some people toward what the Bible really says.
There are gender roles and distinctions.
Roles do not make one gender better than the other.
We are all one in Christ.
Like to the Galatians he wrote...
Galatians 3
[SUP]28 [/SUP]There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave[SUP][g][/SUP] nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. [SUP]29 [/SUP]And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise.
I mean isn't it clear that Paul is wiping out gender roles and even gender distinctions?
We're not even male and female in Christ!
Right?
Right?
This verse totally cancels out the gender distinct roles he writes about to Timothy and the Corinthians...
1 Tim 2
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Let a woman learn quietly with all submissiveness. [SUP]12 [/SUP]I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet. [SUP]13 [/SUP]For Adam was formed first, then Eve;
1 Cor 14
[SUP]33 [/SUP]For God is not a God of confusion but of peace.
As in all the churches of the saints, [SUP]34 [/SUP]the women should keep silent in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be in submission, as the Law also says. [SUP]35 [/SUP]If there is anything they desire to learn, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is shameful for a woman to speak in church.
I mean most people I know think that 1 Timothy 2 and 1 Cor 14 are the Big Mac and Galatians 3 up there is the Diet Coke. It cancels out all the gender roles and distinctions.
Of course there are some completely crazy people, get this, you'll laugh, these crazy people say Paul was inspired by the Holy Spirit, and that he actually wrote in favor of unity in Christ while also upholding gender roles and distinctions. Not because the roles and distinctions make someone better than the other, but because God made things to function that way. <---But ONLY crazy people believe that.
I hope my absurdity in this post drives some people toward what the Bible really says.
There are gender roles and distinctions.
Roles do not make one gender better than the other.
We are all one in Christ.
God gave man an ability......to choose.
Joshua 24:15 [SUP]15 [/SUP]And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.
Before either covenant was brought into being, man had this choice in the garden. Let's not steer off course in this thread, okay?
Joshua 24:15 [SUP]15 [/SUP]And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.
Before either covenant was brought into being, man had this choice in the garden. Let's not steer off course in this thread, okay?
G
does a woman pastor or e man pastor really have the radio for you that is the question how can a 30 be swallowed up it was never there give me the first place?
Again, Jesus made it clear who has authority over Him. His Father , only him
Again, Jesus made it clear who has authority over Him. His Father , only him
Remember, "Blessed are those who are persecuted, for they...."
I know, i know, persed by fellow believers, really raws my hide, too
________
Ok, I was typing on a small phone screen earlier and typing those little numbers annoys me almost as much as ohzone does on a daily basis, well, without the persecution, anyway. OH< WAIT! That's stevestephen getting 'that.'
And, not just from ohzone, hang, brother, on the wings of Him who made you, who carries you, carries you, carries you afar to a beautiful place of understanding after having waited on Him to first come and pick you up
Okee, so, yes, what was being said is: How can a woman pastor have authority over me? How can she ever even teach authority over me?
The next woman that teaches she's in authority over me I am going to drop kick to China
Now, listen, humor aside, what about a woman pastor speaking of God's Word to you, now, shhhh, quiet, I want you to hear this ! Listen up
Who is revealing the Word's truths to you? That woman pastor (or, man pastor, for that matter), or, He who reveals ALL truth to you. Ohzone about said it, and, stopped sHort....
The "H" starting word, c'mon, you can say it, get in the zone, autozone. Oh, wait, that's not it, how about get into John 16:13 and you will see the 'H' come to life, you will see the Spirit of truth come ALIVE in your life, and, speak softly, yet, more cutting than any other thing/way/person ever could. Sharper !!!
Green, you are so sharp, sometimes, cutting, even. Mean with your authority !
Am I? I have no authority over YOU just like you have NO authority over me. My God, and, my Lord, NOT my pastor has authority over me. My pastor has zip, nada, zilch authority over me. None !!! Never has and guess what! Never will.
God ! God ! God !
who is the same yesterday, as today, as forevermore, He ALONE has COMPLETE and UTTER sovereign authority over my life. The Lord leads. Follow Him . "...you follow Me." John 21:22
Sorry, too of all that garble of that quote one more time, I probably made ohzone's brain spin into the twilight zone. Hey, that just might be just the best place for it !
Ohzone, you know i love you, persecution and all, "they (you) know not what they (you) do, I forgive you, of course, for that." Boy, though, man oh man, is there a lot of forgiving I am always doing for you of others on here, ohzone. Isn't there a limit, God !!
"No, green, forgive them, 70x7, and, if you don't forgive them, I won't forgive you."
Oooh, Ok, got it, God
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what this?
ya...you did.
but if you can't just speak your mind clearly Stephen, i have to wonder why?
i've been through the thread several times.
you say you believe women are to be teachers, even pastors and leaders.
then you say not here....and that's based on ATTITUDE, and behavior.
what i was suggesting is men ought not to be pastors or leaders if their behavior is of the Charismatic variety.
neither should women.
maybe we're just not seeing eye to eye.
you think that's the problem?
i prefer straight-forward.
you know...seeing if what we say and do IN CHURCH lines up with scripture, or if it's something else entirely.
we can worry about the world wide web later maybe?
ya...you did.
but if you can't just speak your mind clearly Stephen, i have to wonder why?
i've been through the thread several times.
you say you believe women are to be teachers, even pastors and leaders.
then you say not here....and that's based on ATTITUDE, and behavior.
what i was suggesting is men ought not to be pastors or leaders if their behavior is of the Charismatic variety.
neither should women.
maybe we're just not seeing eye to eye.
you think that's the problem?
i prefer straight-forward.
you know...seeing if what we say and do IN CHURCH lines up with scripture, or if it's something else entirely.
we can worry about the world wide web later maybe?
G
huh, oh, nooooo, ohzone, you see eye to eye fine with Stevestephen, just, if you could, it might hurt a little, but could I remove the plank from your Lutheran eye. And, I'm looking, but i just don't see that same 'plank' in steveStephen's pentecostal eye.
I AM looking !!
Still looking.
*Green goes and gets microscope, thinking, maybe, steveStephen, could have a small 'pick' sized timber in there.
Still looking !
Nope, don't see nothing, ohzone, sorry, I just don't see it.
I AM looking !!
Still looking.
*Green goes and gets microscope, thinking, maybe, steveStephen, could have a small 'pick' sized timber in there.
Still looking !
Nope, don't see nothing, ohzone, sorry, I just don't see it.
huh, oh, nooooo, ohzone, you see eye to eye fine with Stevestephen, just, if you could, it might hurt a little, but could I remove the plank from your Lutheran eye. And, I'm looking, but i just don't see that same 'plank' in steveStephen's eye.
I AM looking !! Nope, don't see it.
I AM looking !! Nope, don't see it.
thanks.
Isaiah 28:15-19
15*Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves:
16*Therefore thus saith the Lord God, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste.
17*Judgment also will I lay to the line, and righteousness to the plummet: and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies, and the waters shall overflow the hiding place.
18*And your covenant with death shall be disannulled, and your agreement with hell shall not stand; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it.
19*From the time that it goeth forth it shall take you: for morning by morning shall it pass over, by day and by night: and it shall be a vexation only to understand the report.
15*Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves:
16*Therefore thus saith the Lord God, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste.
17*Judgment also will I lay to the line, and righteousness to the plummet: and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies, and the waters shall overflow the hiding place.
18*And your covenant with death shall be disannulled, and your agreement with hell shall not stand; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it.
19*From the time that it goeth forth it shall take you: for morning by morning shall it pass over, by day and by night: and it shall be a vexation only to understand the report.