It is time

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
A

Anonimous

Guest
#21
#21
rachelsedge said:
Alright ThomasLady, I'll bite. :)



For us to completely, fully, 100% understand God is not Biblical. Maybe when we get to heaven we'll understand, but even then I still wonder if there will be some mystery about Him. Deuteronomy 29:29 says, "The secret things belong to the LORD our God, but the things revealed belong to us and to our children, that we may follow the words of this law." There are secret things that only God knows.

I'm not saying we shouldn't strive to know more about Him. I ask questions all the time; I want more understanding. I recently went to a Bible study where we went over the different names of God (and I don't mean "Comforter" and "Healer", I mean "Elohim" and "El Shaddai") and it was incredible how much there is to God, and I know we didn't even get close to covering everything.



I can't tell you how God exists. How could I know? He always has existed. If something/someone made Him, then that would be the "real God", and it's an endless cycle from there.

As for the book, I agree with hattiebod that the Bible is the best source for the topics at hand.

Quote from the webpage you sent us to:



What do you mean by the next great step that must be accomplished?
Click to expand...
Why does anyone try to figure God out? If He could be figured out then He wouldn't be God. Don't worry about it. Just let Him be God already. He has been God for eternity. I think He knows what He is doing by now.
 
T

ThomasLady

Guest
#22
#22
Anonimous, many times in the history of Physics, scientist's thought, OK we are done, we now understand how the universe operates. Then there was special relativity, quantum physics, and I am certain there is more to come, because the logical truth seeking part of some individuals cannot be repressed. As far as I know, the bible encourages the pursuit of truth more than it discourages it, so recommending that people stop trying to figure out how God exists seems to go against the bibles teachings.
 
A

Anonimous

Guest
#23
#23
ThomasLady said:
Anonimous, many times in the history of Physics, scientist's thought, OK we are done, we now understand how the universe operates. Then there was special relativity, quantum physics, and I am certain there is more to come, because the logical truth seeking part of some individuals cannot be repressed. As far as I know, the bible encourages the pursuit of truth more than it discourages it, so recommending that people stop trying to figure out how God exists seems to go against the bibles teachings.
Click to expand...
I do agree that we should continue to seek to know Him better. I think we only have so ability to understand Him from this side of life. We are not meant to know everything or understand everything about Him. Moses asked God to reveal Himself. God said he would let Moses see just His back as He passed otherwise moses would not be able to grasp Him without dying.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
rachelsedge

rachelsedge

Senior Member
#24
Oct 15, 2012
3,659
81
48
34
#24
Anonimous said:
Why does anyone try to figure God out? If He could be figured out then He wouldn't be God. Don't worry about it. Just let Him be God already. He has been God for eternity. I think He knows what He is doing by now.
Click to expand...
I wasn't trying to imply that I was trying to figure God out. I already stated that was impossible. What I meant is that we should want to get to know who He is more, more about His character and aspects of Him. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I'm not trying to peg Him down, though, or anything of that sort.
 
T

ThomasLady

Guest
#25
#25
Why not Rachelsedge? I really do not want to aggravate you but let me ask anyway. Are you saying you are not trying to peg him down to avoid the risk of failing in an endeavor, or because it would take too much effort and you are busy? I could recommend a few things to read, but I double-dog-dare you to make the time and put in the effort to read St. Augustine's Confessions. You will see how valuable thinking about how God exists can be to belief, faith and conversion.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#26
#26
Step back, mate. What she's saying is that you can't put God in a box or fully understand him. Yes, God absolutely gave us brains to critically think about him and the world in which we live but reason can only take you so far in your quest. The rest is revelation from God about who he is based on the Bible and what the Holy Spirit teaches. Still, the human mind will never fully comprehend God and his ways. We are after all, the created, not the Creator.
 
S

Shouryu

Guest
#27
#27
Chuck Missler, in his dissection of the Book of Romans, really sums it up in one clean little statement:

"A God small enough for us to fully comprehend is not is not a God large enough to meet our need."
 
rachelsedge

rachelsedge

Senior Member
#28
Oct 15, 2012
3,659
81
48
34
#28
ThomasLady said:
Why not Rachelsedge? I really do not want to aggravate you but let me ask anyway. Are you saying you are not trying to peg him down to avoid the risk of failing in an endeavor, or because it would take too much effort and you are busy?
Click to expand...
Um, neither? Ha. It's because it can't be done. Picture this: A dog is pegged out in the backyard. What does that mean? It means he's tied to a rope, to a peg in the ground, and there's only so far he can go before the rope jerks him back.

By pegging down God, I would basically be saying "God, this is how far you can go, this is exactly who You are, and nothing more. No further." Who am I to say that? God is way beyond our thinking. He is way beyond our comprehension.

It's not a failed endeavor. It's an awesome thing, to know a God who cannot be put in a box, into a safe little description.

It's not too much effort and I'm not too busy. I strive to know God more. To know about Him and to know Him (two different things, by the way). But I'm not going to say I know all about Him, or even pretend to think that I can fully comprehend Him.

Hope that helped. :)
 
T

ThomasLady

Guest
#29
#29
Let me clarify myself a little. I think we can understand God much better than we typically do if raised strictly on the bible, believing in an incomprehensible God. I agree that we are like a dog pegged in the back yard, but I think the chain is alot longer than you all assume. Your strong belief that your current understanding is as good as it gets is in stark contrast to the thoughts and efforts of many of the founders of Christianity, who had to do a better job explaining one God and His son, if they were going to help this religion spread as Jesus directed.
 
A

AgapeSpiritEyes

Guest
#30
#30
God is who made us in His image and likeness this is supreme among all His created creatures, By the Simplicity of His quintessence we are made, to know His mind this is His design with the invitation that His delight is for us to tell Him how we precieve Him and in this is the expansion of God's mind and will to reveal more of Himself to us for we: recycle, reflect, respond to His image that we are made in, this is a concept that may be the reason we are made and that in the regeneration (eternal ages) higher than all beings for His fellowship and delight in us, our free will choosing Him in Love, making the infinite deterant of Sin and rebellion of Him and His kingdom, sons and daughters forever abiding to: reflect, respond, feel, experience, know and reveal: His image, His soul, His mind ,His will, His affections, HIs emotions, His desires of which we are made closest to.
 
T

ThomasLady

Guest
#31
#31
AgapeSpiritEyes,
I like your post. Took a few reads but I think I understand your views. I have difficulty conceiving of a God with affections, emotions, and desires. All this puts him in the land of space-time and I think (as of course others do in philosophical/theological writings) that space and time, where we have emotions at certain times, desire things so that they may be satisfied at a later time; spacetime is a human, earthly creation that has no bearing on God and his purpose. Clearly God impacts life in Earth, but cannot control everything in Earth, but there is no attribute of God, including his will and purpose, that changes over time. Thus a number of philosophers label God as Truth, since ultimate Truth does not change with time.
 
A

AgapeSpiritEyes

Guest
#32
#32
ThomasLady said:
AgapeSpiritEyes,
I like your post. Took a few reads but I think I understand your views. I have difficulty conceiving of a God with affections, emotions, and desires. All this puts him in the land of space-time and I think (as of course others do in philosophical/theological writings) that space and time, where we have emotions at certain times, desire things so that they may be satisfied at a later time; spacetime is a human, earthly creation that has no bearing on God and his purpose. Clearly God impacts life in Earth, but cannot control everything in Earth, but there is no attribute of God, including his will and purpose, that changes over time. Thus a number of philosophers label God as Truth, since ultimate Truth does not change with time.
Click to expand...
I disagree concerning His attributes not making limits or time your conclusion is not absolute time is a law of which lesser of absolute is participating within it's confines, but His will is to find how a microcosmo of Himself would perceive His absoulute essence. I disagree truth is made as a son or image and in it the image changes through creativity, God is not aware of His finitness only His omni essence but we are and that is what expands Himself to grow in our experiences of Him, although i would repeat for comparitive illustration that many believe that energy can not be destroyed only changed(creative orgaization of randomness so it is with God He can not be destroyed but is infinty creative throught our reflecting Him in our being back to Himself, emotions desires feelings are omni within Himself they are all present onmipresent within Himself time is just the degrees of lesser than His omni.
 
A

AgapeSpiritEyes

Guest
#33
#33
ThomasLady said:
AgapeSpiritEyes,
I like your post. Took a few reads but I think I understand your views. I have difficulty conceiving of a God with affections, emotions, and desires. All this puts him in the land of space-time and I think (as of course others do in philosophical/theological writings) that space and time, where we have emotions at certain times, desire things so that they may be satisfied at a later time; spacetime is a human, earthly creation that has no bearing on God and his purpose. Clearly God impacts life in Earth, but cannot control everything in Earth, but there is no attribute of God, including his will and purpose, that changes over time. Thus a number of philosophers label God as Truth, since ultimate Truth does not change with time.
Click to expand...
I can understand your difficulty in accepting God with anthrophoro attr. but you have them do you not? and if so then the energy of your soul is a micro image of Him and in so He identifies with your energy your soul sensateessence thus time is present in experience even surrounded in the infinite. If i chose to think in digressive or progressive inferrences or deduction i think only linearly so why are you thinking this way it continues to eliminate the paradox of time and eternity blended or within each other. It confines you to eliminate one or to be uncertian of one and thus reject it or the other. Why does it not require us to think omni of all things and states and energy and persona? Just entreaty to thought.
 
T

ThomasLady

Guest
#34
#34
Agape (like the name, used in some of my favorite writings from Dr. King),
Lots to comment on but let me just say two things. First, when you and I refer to "I", I think we are referring to different entities. I usually am not referring to the conscious I that establishes and enforces our existence in space time. I am referring to ALL of us, including the part that interacts with God as He truly is. And I say God out of convenience. I do not think God is a singular object/being as we conceive ourselves to be.
Secondly, the big conundrum with regard to time is, how does something without time (God, the infinity of infinities) create something so definitive that exists with time (Earth conceived by the human conscious mind). Perhaps God does exist in some form of time? Seems alot like the mathematical field of dimensional transformation. Or as Calvin would say, transmogrification (don't know if I spelled that right).
 
A

AgapeSpiritEyes

Guest
#35
#35
I understand your belief from your logic conclusions as they for now are the realities of you (as you can only define) as also i have but, without my choosing i have to include experience of which are the predominate opriori of my inclusions of knowledge. Although you will not be able to participate in my beliefs they are from my experiences you can read of one in my profile. My desire and wish above all things is your experience of Agape. GBYIAF
 
T

ThomasLady

Guest
#36
#36
Is everything the world needs to accomplish God's Reason, to bring Heaven on Earth, in the Bible? Or do we need to search and study outside the Bible?
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#37
#37
The world doesn't accomplish God's Reason. God comes down to our level in human form, sacrifices JC and rises to new life. Then he ascends into Heaven (still in his human/God form). We can search and study outside the Bible, absolutely, but we need to always come back to the Bible (understanding it to be perfect and God's Word) and line up what we learn from outside sources/study with what we know is true of God and his Word. In the end, his Word trumps all.
 
T

ThomasLady

Guest
#38
#38
The world (space, time, organisms, knowledge, etc.) is in part guided by God, so the world is accomplishing part of His Reason. Humans, through free will born in the Garden of Eden, apparently have the ability to go against His will, according to the bible.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.