Orthodox Jew answers a few questions

Of course Isaiah is a part of the prophets .Indeed he is one of the major prophets. But all the minor prophets are just one book in the Tanakh, and called "The Twelve". Thus there are only 24 books in the Hebrew Bible (equivalent to the 39 in the OT).

Oh! So suddenly you recognize it? Or no? נביאים אחרונים

I would say no since you acted ignorant of the source.

hmmm.... I suppose a discussion between orthodox Jews and Christians on the meaning of the scroll of Isaiah is a big one; and I don't want to detract from smaller, easier questions that people have right now- but I do try to understand how other's view of the scriptures differ from mine. I will get back to you if I find a concise way to ask the question.

Well don't let that do it for you. Plenty of people react with emotion, condescension, insults but that doesn't make what they say true or untrue. I'm sure you are aware of this it's just said as an encouragement.

Personally, I would like to state unequivocally with integrity that a thing is true or untrue and I cannot do that (in my own personal position) if I let those types of things influence the main argument. That is especially true of things I do not like or do not want to accept as the truth. The way that this true/untrue thing is presented should have no bearing on the actual truth/untruth of the matter due to the imperfections in mankind.

I'll admit that it does tend to sway me somewhat and cause me to be negatively disposed toward what "may" be true but that's on ME so I actively work against that intellectually and in my heart.

Leastways when looking for the truth I don't automatically discount it due to what I term "reasonable excuses" because these excuses must be countered with "justifiable excuses" before the Lord of hosts. However, (in my experience) he is quite understanding with our own personal equation despite very few (or perhaps none) of these "true" excuses existing.

Well since you just wish to attack me I can add you to my ignore list. C-ya!

What is your view of Psalm 22?

I have little patience for incredibly broad questions with no context. If you have a point please make it, if you don't and you're just asking about random verses at least be upfront about it.

Sorry to bother you. I won't ask anymore questions.

Sounds like you are about to join PennEd, Magenta and Me on her ignore list.

Alright then you had no point and you weren't going anywhere?

Dude, I'm not going to sit here and answer a bunch of broad questions so you can "feel me out". If you're not going to show me some respect and state your intentions I'm not going to answer you.

It isn't emotion, they are just rude and belligerent, they are only interested in sniping at me. They act aggrieved when I immediately put them in their place and refuse to play their games. You see this a lot with evangelical types in the US...

They think that once they state their religious beliefs the other person is supposed to unquestioningly accept it, collapse to their knees with tears gushing and convert to their brand of Christianity. When that doesn't happen or they get the slightest pushback (i.e. questioning or request for proof) they flip their lid and become abusive. How weak some of you must be that your beliefs can't even withstand the slightest examination. Either that or many of you have lived inside your evangelical bubble for so long you don't even know how to interact with a non-Christian without being as obnoxious and easily offended as possible.

A perfect example right here is me asking why I should accept their understanding of Isaiah 53 and not my own. No argument made just insults and passive aggressive comments. Fine then, you obviously can't make your case.

Can everyone stop misinterpreting the title of this thread, she says "a few" questions. That means a small number. Basically the questions that she wanted you to have which she answered in the first post.

A few became many but there is no harm done. Hopefully the various posts have given clarity to many.

Aviva, for someone who tells others "you lack self-awareness" you have become a meme at this point.

I wouldn't say I have clarity, but I am much clearer on what "orthodox Jew from Ireland who lives in Canada but is not "ultra orthodox" means.

See! I would have thought that the Torah would be a really important book to keep for orthodox Jews, but "no temple, no sacrifices" that is easy and cheap.

I thought without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness! My bad. I almost want to ask about Hebrews 9:22 but hey if it is in the NT orthodox Jews can claim it is no different than the menu at Denny's! Did not know that Denny's was kosher.

Wow! I never heard it put that way. I have heard many tell me why they don't believe, but apparently orthodox Jews all believe the same thing, the same kind of answer you would expect from a cult member.

So, no, they don't believe in Hell? Weird, I though the day of Atonement was a very big day for them, apparently no one fails in God's judgement in the OT. The rebellion of Korah? The armies of Egypt? Who knew.

As for Lucifer, they "don't really" believe in Him? Wow! Do they believe that man was tempted and fell in the garden of Eden? This is really some bizarre information for me since the OT talks about Lucifer's fall in great detail.

So why are you MISREPRESENTING me? I never said any of that as you have posted. So you are in fact muddying the waters.

I am not misrepresenting you, I corrected the error in the post, read it again. Simple clerical error.

I have read through a lot of the comments. She is getting hit pretty hard by some.

Maybe it's just different cultures?

Years ago, as a babe in Christ, we did a bible study for a year and the group was diverse. Mature believers,babes, 2 Jews, a few seekers(unbelievers), and a few believers who were Jewish prior. It was interesting to say the least.

And that was a question that the leader asked us.......What is your view of Psalm 22? I answered," I don't know." and the rest answered just fine. Different answers sure. But no one was offended by the question.

When you start a thread saying you are going to answer questions, being asked questions is not "being hit hard". The bottom line, I simply asked her legitimate questions from the law and prophets, PennEd did the same, as for Magenta what she said to Aviva is no different than what she has said to me or others. And like you said, nothing wrong with your question.

Most people tell me that if you have 10 Jewish people in a room you will have 100 different opinions on the Bible. So I find her post #1 glaring in the way she pretends all "orthodox Jews" think the same.

I'm not offended by the question, I just don't like broad questions where I don't know the intent.

Psalms is a book primarily of Jewish hymns and prayers. I don't take single passages of the Tanakh and "interpret" them. I believe Tanakh interprets Tanakh and context matters. This is also why I don't know how to answer your questions. It's kind of like asking a detective how he interprets a blood stain without looking at the rest of the crime scene.

Asking the way you do also feels like your trying to assess me, something I also highly dislike.