Bring Back the Wise Men

Yea, sounds like tradition and Christmas cards has got that all wrong too. They always show a full term pregnant Mary walking or riding a donkey. If they'd ever been around a woman who was full term they'd know that just wouldn't work.

Unless my ex wife pulled one over on me. I'd always have to pull the car up to the door everywhere we went to pick her up and still sometimes thought I'd have to try and carry her to the car. She surely wouldn't have made it walking 98 miles or riding a donkey. lol

Not putting down on pregnant ladies, but seems for sure like they would have used a cart for the trip.

The eight days is within the 40 days, when Jesus was born after 8 days he was circumcised the day before that the 7th ended the bathing in water of Mary then the 33days. Bethany to the temple.

Indeed and surely Joseph being a carpenter probably built the cart.

Matt 2v1: "Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem..."

The Greek phrase for "wise men from the east" is "mágoi apó anatoloón," and the Greek word for "wise men" is "mágoi," the same Greek word that Luke uses in Acts 8v9,11 for Simon the sorcerer and in Acts 13v6,8 of Elymas Barjesus the sorcerer. So it would seem that the "wise men" who came to worship the Lord Jesus at His birth were occults from the East.

Do you really believe God the Father would allow His Son to receive gifts from occultists?
No, these could have been wise men (rulers) from Persia who had read Daniels writings, believed their foretelling of the coming Messiah, and God led them in their faith (spawned by God's Word) via His Shekinah glory (the 'star").

Sounds like the echoes of Sheba to me.

1 kings 10
1Now when the queen of Sheba heard about the fame of Solomon concerning the name of the LORD, she came to test him with difficult questions. 2She arrived in Jerusalem with a very large caravan, with camels bearing spices, gold in great abundance, and precious stones.

Psalm 72
10May the kings of Tarshish and distant shores bring tribute; may the kings of Sheba and Seba offer gifts.
11May all kings bow down to him and all nations serve him.

Try doing a bit of study of the Scriptures and don't just go on your man made "wisdom", because that's what the Scriptures teach!

Scipture teaches they were kings for filling the OT prophets.

Isiah 60
1Arise, shine, for your light has come,
and the glory of the LORD rises upon you.
2For behold, darkness covers the earth,
and thick darkness is over the peoples;
but the LORD will rise upon you,
and His glory will appear over you.
3Nations will come to your light,
and kings to the brightness of your dawn.

It’s possible some have assumed three wise men or they could have been just been from three places.

Isiah 60
6Caravans of camels will cover your land,
young camels of Midian and Ephah,
and all from Sheba will come,
bearing gold and frankincense
and proclaiming the praises of the LORD.

It should be clear from Matthew 2 that (a) the wise men were directed to go to Bethlehem and (b) that Mary, Joseph, and Jesus were living in a house when they arrived. Christ was no longer a babe in a manger, but a young child in a house. The star of Bethlehem brought them to the exact place.

When they had heard the king, they departed; and, lo, the star, which they saw in the east, went before them, till it came and stood over where the young child was. (Mt 2:9)

I wouldn't call spitting out 1st semester Greek and then making definite conclusions as well as accuse a brother in the Lord for leaning on 'man made wisdom' exactly 'study'. At least I brought out the subject in question using a couple of passages in full context and not rely only on one Greek Word. lol

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oh yeah, it's devinately 'twisted' = our JOB', if led, find out the twisting'ness!! -even if most don't even care!!!

(Mat 2:1) Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,
(Mat 2:2) Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.
(Mat 2:3) When Herod had heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him.
(Mat 2:4) And when he had gathered all the chief priests and scribes of the people together, he demanded of them where Christ should be born. (notice the future tense)
(Mat 2:5) And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet,
(Mat 2:6) And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel.
(Mat 2:7) Then Herod, when he had privily called the wise men, enquired of them diligently what time the star appeared.
(Mat 2:8) And he sent them to Bethlehem, and said, Go and search diligently for the young child; and when ye have found him, bring me word again, that I may come and worship him also.
(Mat 2:9) When they had heard the king, they departed; and, lo, the star, which they saw in the east, went before them, till it came and stood over where the young child was.
(Mat 2:10) When they saw the star, they rejoiced with exceeding great joy.
(Mat 2:11) And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense, and myrrh.

Love you Brother!!! hugs.

That’s is quite interesting, so where was the house, in Bethlehem or Nazareth when they returned after all that was required.

I think if the scriptures were read as one, the orde of events might look like this. IMO

10€ The Birth of Jesus
Luke 2: 1~17_20_18~19

The Birth of Jesus Luke 2:1~17_20_18~19

Lk2:1 In those days Caesar Augustus issued a decree that a census should be taken of the entire Roman world.
Lk2:2 (This was the first census that took place while Quirinius was governor of Syria.)
Lk2:3 And everyone went to his own town to register.
Lk2:4 So Joseph also went up from the town of Nazareth in Galilee to Judea, to Bethlehem the town of David, because he belonged to the house and line of David.
Lk2:5 He went there to register with Mary, who was pledged to be married to him and was expecting a child.
Lk2:6 While they were there, the time came for the baby to be born,
Lk2:7 and she gave birth to her firstborn, a son. She wrapped him in cloths and placed him in a manger, because there was no room for them in the inn.

The Shepherds and the Angels Luke 2:8~21

Lk2:8 And there were shepherds living out in the fields nearby, keeping watch over their flocks at night.
Lk2:9 An angel of the Lord appeared to them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them, and they were terrified.
Lk2:10 But the angel said to them, "Do not be afraid. I bring you good news of great joy that will be for all the people.
Lk2:13 Suddenly a great company of the heavenly host appeared with the angel, praising God and saying,
Lk2:12 This will be a sign to you: You will find a baby wrapped in cloths and lying in a manger."
Lk2:11 Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is Christ the Lord.
Lk2:14 "Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace to men on whom his favor rests."
Lk2:15 When the angels had left them and gone into heaven, the shepherds said to one another, "Let's go to Bethlehem and see this thing that has happened, which the Lord has told us about."
Lk2:16 So they hurried off and found Mary and Joseph, and the baby, who was lying in the manger.
Lk2:17 When they had seen him, they spread the word concerning what had been told them about this child,
Lk2:20 The shepherds returned, glorifying and praising God for all the things they had heard and seen, which were just as they had been told.
Lk2:18 and all who heard it were amazed at what the shepherds said to them.
Lk2:19 But Mary treasured up all these things and pondered them in her heart.

11€ Jesus presented in the temple
Luke 2: 21~39

Jesus Presented in the Temple Luke 2:21~39

Lk2:21 On the eighth day, when it was time to circumcise him, he was named Jesus, the name the angel had given him before he had been conceived.
Lk2:22 When the time of their purification according to the Law of Moses had been completed, Joseph and Mary took him to Jerusalem to present him to the Lord
Lk2:23 (as it is written in the Law of the Lord, "Every firstborn male is to be consecrated to the Lord"
Lk2:24 and to offer a sacrifice in keeping with what is said in the Law of the Lord: "a pair of doves or two young pigeons."
Lk2:25 Now there was a man in Jerusalem called Simeon, who was righteous and devout. He was waiting for the consolation of Israel, and the Holy Spirit was upon him.
Lk2:26 It had been revealed to him by the Holy Spirit that he would not die before he had seen the Lord's Christ.
Lk2:27 Moved by the Spirit, he went into the temple courts. When the parents brought in the child Jesus to do for him what the custom of the Law required,
Lk2:28 Simeon took him in his arms and praised God, saying:
Lk2:29 "Sovereign Lord, as you have promised, you now dismiss your servant in peace.
Lk2:30 For my eyes have seen your salvation,
Lk2:31 which you have prepared in the sight of all people,
Lk2:32 a light for revelation to the Gentiles and for glory to your people Israel."
Lk2:33 The child's father and mother marveled at what was said about him.
Lk2:34 Then Simeon blessed them and said to Mary, his mother: "This child is destined to cause the falling and rising of many in Israel, and to be a sign that will be spoken against,
Lk2:35 so that the thoughts of many hearts will be revealed. And a sword will pierce your own soul too."
Lk2:36 There was also a prophetess, Anna, the daughter of Phanuel, of the tribe of Asher. She was very old; she had lived with her husband seven years after her marriage,
Lk2:37 and then was a widow until she was eighty-four. She never left the temple but worshiped night and day, fasting and praying.

Lk2:38 Coming up to them at that very moment, she gave thanks to God and spoke about the child to all who were looking forward to the redemption of Jerusalem.
Lk2:39 When Joseph and Mary had done everything required by the Law of the Lord, they returned to Galilee to their own town of Nazareth.

12€ Before the Escape To Egypt
Matthew 2:23

Mt2:23 and he went and lived in a town called Nazareth. So was fulfilled what was said through the prophets: "He will be called a Nazarene."

13€ The Magi Visit Jesus
Matthew 2: 1~12

The Visit of the Magi ~ Matthew 2:1~12

Mt2:1 After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi from the east came to Jerusalem
Mt2:2 and asked, "Where is the one who has been born king of the Jews? We saw his star in the east and have come to worship him."
Mt2:3 When King Herod heard this he was disturbed, and all Jerusalem with him.
Mt2:4 When he had called together all the people's chief priests and teachers of the law, he asked them where the Christ was to be born.
Mt2:5 "In Bethlehem in Judea," they replied, "for this is what the prophet has written:
Mt2:6 "`But you, Bethlehem, in the land of Judah, are by no means least among the rulers of Judah; for out of you will come a ruler who will be the shepherd of my people Israel.'
Mt2:7 Then Herod called the Magi secretly and found out from them the exact time the star had appeared.
Mt2:8 He sent them to Bethlehem and said, "Go and make a careful search for the child. As soon as you find him, report to me, so that I too may go and worship him."
Mt2:9 After they had heard the king, they went on their way, and the star they had seen in the east went ahead of them until it stopped over the place where the child was.
Mt2;10 When they saw the star, they were overjoyed.
Mt2:11 On coming to the house, they saw the child with his mother Mary, and they bowed down and worshiped him. Then they opened their treasures and presented him with gifts of gold and of incense and of myrrh.
Mt2:12 And having been warned in a dream not to go back to Herod, they returned to their country by another route.

14€ Joseph takes Jesus and Mary to Egypt
Matthew 2: 13~18

The Escape to Egypt ~ Matthew 2:13~14_16~18

Mt2:13 When they had gone, an angel of the Lord appeared to Joseph in a dream. "Get up," he said, "take the child and his mother and escape to Egypt. Stay there until I tell you, for Herod is going to search for the child to kill him."
Mt2:14 So he got up, took the child and his mother during the night and left for Egypt,

Mt2:16 When Herod realized that he had been outwitted by the Magi, he was furious, and he gave orders to kill all the boys in Bethlehem and its vicinity who were two years old and under, in accordance with the time he had learned from the Magi.
Mt2:17 Then what was said through the prophet Jeremiah was fulfilled:
Mt2:18 "A voice is heard in Ramah, weeping and great mourning, Rachel weeping for her children and refusing to be comforted, because they are no more."

15€ The return to Nazareth
Matthew 2:19_15_20~22

The Return to Nazareth ~ Matthew 2:19_15_20~22

Mt2:19 After Herod died, an angel of the Lord appeared in a dream to Joseph in Egypt
Mt2:15 where he stayed until the death of Herod. And so was fulfilled what the Lord had said through the prophet: "Out of Egypt I called my son.”
Mt2:20 and said, "Get up, take the child and his mother and go to the land of Israel, for those who were trying to take the child's life are dead."
Mt2:21 So he got up, took the child and his mother and went to the land of Israel.
Mt2:22 But when he heard that Archelaus was reigning in Judea in place of his father Herod, he was afraid to go there. Having been warned in a dream, he withdrew to the district of Galilee,


16€ Jesus at the temple when Twelve years old
Luke 2: 40~52

The Boy Jesus at the Temple Luke 2:40~52

Lk2:40 And the child grew and became strong; he was filled with wisdom, and the grace of God was upon him.
Lk2:41 Every year his parents went to Jerusalem for the Feast of the Passover.
Lk2:42 When he was twelve years old, they went up to the Feast, according to the custom.
Lk2:43 After the Feast was over, while his parents were returning home, the boy Jesus stayed behind in Jerusalem, but they were unaware of it.
Lk2:44 Thinking he was in their company, they traveled on for a day. Then they began looking for him among their relatives and friends.
Lk2:45 When they did not find him, they went back to Jerusalem to look for him.
Lk2:46 After three days they found him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions.
Lk2:47 Everyone who heard him was amazed at his understanding and his answers.
Lk2:48 When his parents saw him, they were astonished. His mother said to him, "Son, why have you treated us like this? Your father and I have been anxiously searching for you."
Lk2:49 "Why were you searching for me?" he asked. "Didn't you know I had to be in my Father's house?"
Lk2:50 But they did not understand what he was saying to them.
Lk2:51 Then he went down to Nazareth with them and was obedient to them. But his mother treasured all these things in her heart.
Lk2:52 And Jesus grew in wisdom and stature, and in favor with God and men.

Robertson, in his Word Pictures cites Justin Martyr...

Mt. 2:9
Went before them (proegen autous). Imperfect tense, kept on in front of them, not as a guide to the town since they now knew that, but to the place where the child was, the inn according to Lu 2:7. Justin Martyr says that it was in a cave. The stall where the cattle and donkeys stayed may have been beneath the inn in the side of the hill.

I guess a cave could be called a house, many call a cardboard box home.

Though I wonder how the cave part came about, what was the conclusion that lead to it being a cave interesting

They may have rented a house in Bethlehem after a short stay in the inn, then left for Egypt. Later on they returned to Nazareth and settled there.