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I defined the relationships carefully.
Jesus is a distinct person, but he is not one God by himself. There are not three separate Gods. YHVH is one.
Is this too complex for you? Must you reduce everything to human existence where there is only one person per being?
I think that's one issue with anti-Trinitarians. They are incapable of reasoning outside of their human existence, where one person = one being.
God is a multi-personal being.
This was the problem in the anti-Trinitarian cult I belonged to. They thought that the infinite, worship-worthy God could fit into their man-sized box. They cannot conceive of a multi-personal being.
However, as I indicated, this multi-personal being is love by nature, because he is community by nature. The Father loves the Son, the Son loves the Father, and they both love the Holy Spirit. This is no mere solitary being, and this is no starry-eyed couple; it is a loving community within the same eternal being.
Jesus is a distinct person, but he is not one God by himself. There are not three separate Gods. YHVH is one.
Is this too complex for you? Must you reduce everything to human existence where there is only one person per being?
I think that's one issue with anti-Trinitarians. They are incapable of reasoning outside of their human existence, where one person = one being.
God is a multi-personal being.
This was the problem in the anti-Trinitarian cult I belonged to. They thought that the infinite, worship-worthy God could fit into their man-sized box. They cannot conceive of a multi-personal being.
However, as I indicated, this multi-personal being is love by nature, because he is community by nature. The Father loves the Son, the Son loves the Father, and they both love the Holy Spirit. This is no mere solitary being, and this is no starry-eyed couple; it is a loving community within the same eternal being.
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Ask yourself this..do you think you have the right, as a mere creation of God, to pull him down to your level and claim that he cannot be a multi-personal being?
The Trinity is not that complex, once one acknowledges that multi-personal beings are possible. Your view does not have Scriptural support, either. You cannot reconcile all the statements about God that Scripture provides.
And, you state that God CANNOT be Triune. Where do you derive this understanding? Logically, what prohibits God from being one, in terms of essence, and three, in terms of person?
Answer: there is no such prohibition.
I have suggested books to others which carefully outline the Trinity doctrine above. It is not complex. It is complex to conceive of a multi-personal being, but the Scriptural support is not complex.
It is essential to a mature understanding of Christianity to understand the Trinity, though, for reasons I have outlined above. Man is to image God, and one way he images God is in his community interactions within the Church and the community. The Trinity is a model for the image of God, in one sense, and this demonstrates that Christians are to live in community with one another and to image the Trinity in this manner. So, understanding the Trinity is important to practical Christianity, and those that don't understand it don't really understand Christianity very well. In some cases, I don't even think they are believers, particularly the anti-Trinitarians who defiantly reject it.
If anyone wants to seriously study the doctrine, and is troubled by the claims of anti-Trinitarians here, let me know and I'd be glad to talk about it with you.
The Trinity is not that complex, once one acknowledges that multi-personal beings are possible. Your view does not have Scriptural support, either. You cannot reconcile all the statements about God that Scripture provides.
And, you state that God CANNOT be Triune. Where do you derive this understanding? Logically, what prohibits God from being one, in terms of essence, and three, in terms of person?
Answer: there is no such prohibition.
I have suggested books to others which carefully outline the Trinity doctrine above. It is not complex. It is complex to conceive of a multi-personal being, but the Scriptural support is not complex.
It is essential to a mature understanding of Christianity to understand the Trinity, though, for reasons I have outlined above. Man is to image God, and one way he images God is in his community interactions within the Church and the community. The Trinity is a model for the image of God, in one sense, and this demonstrates that Christians are to live in community with one another and to image the Trinity in this manner. So, understanding the Trinity is important to practical Christianity, and those that don't understand it don't really understand Christianity very well. In some cases, I don't even think they are believers, particularly the anti-Trinitarians who defiantly reject it.
If anyone wants to seriously study the doctrine, and is troubled by the claims of anti-Trinitarians here, let me know and I'd be glad to talk about it with you.
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God is Spirit. That's the one correct remark in your statement.
I am not sure if you are inferring that spirit and person are mutually exclusive. I have heard that claim before, as well.
God is Spirit.
God is one Being.
God is three Persons, Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
These three are co-eternal (having existed forever) and co-essential (sharing the same Essence)
All four statements are true. And this is what the Trinity teaches.
Angels are spirit, too, and they are personal. However, they are not co-essential, co-eternal and they are individual beings, unlike God.
I am not sure if you are inferring that spirit and person are mutually exclusive. I have heard that claim before, as well.
God is Spirit.
God is one Being.
God is three Persons, Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
These three are co-eternal (having existed forever) and co-essential (sharing the same Essence)
All four statements are true. And this is what the Trinity teaches.
Angels are spirit, too, and they are personal. However, they are not co-essential, co-eternal and they are individual beings, unlike God.
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This part remains unexplained. I think it is a misunderstanding. To me it is an impossibility and it means non existence. Something like a square-circle which doesn't and can not exist.
God being a spirit means you can not count Him.
God being one has nothing to do with numeric quantification but rather "He alone (in all His attributes)"
So God is not 3 units in one being, how can He be?
God being a spirit means you can not count Him.
God being one has nothing to do with numeric quantification but rather "He alone (in all His attributes)"
So God is not 3 units in one being, how can He be?
I didn't use the word "units"....I used the word "persons". God is three Persons within one Being.
White light is composed of three distinct lights, red, green blue. These are physical comparisons but have some level of applicability.
God is one Being yet three Persons. We know this is true because Scripture teaches it. To deny it is basically to deny Scripture.
YHVH refers to Himself with personal pronouns in Is 40-55 so we know that He is one. Yet YHVH is used in reference to the Father and the Son explicitly in Scripture. This demands unity of YHVH in one sense (essence), and plurality in another sense (personhood).
White light is composed of three distinct lights, red, green blue. These are physical comparisons but have some level of applicability.
God is one Being yet three Persons. We know this is true because Scripture teaches it. To deny it is basically to deny Scripture.
YHVH refers to Himself with personal pronouns in Is 40-55 so we know that He is one. Yet YHVH is used in reference to the Father and the Son explicitly in Scripture. This demands unity of YHVH in one sense (essence), and plurality in another sense (personhood).
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“Philip said to Him, Lord, show us the Father, and it suffices us. Jesus said to him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet have you not known Me, Philip? he that has seen Me has seen the Father; and how say you then, Show us the Father? Believe you not that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? the words that I speak to you I speak not of Myself: but the Father that dwells in Me, He does the works” (Jhn 14:8–10).
“I and My Father are one” (Jhn 10:30).
There is only one God, only one person in this God, and only one Spirit of God, much as it is written down in the Bible that “There is only one Holy Spirit and only one God.” Regardless of whether the Father and the Son of which you speak exist, there is only one God after all, and the substance of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit you believe in is the substance of the Holy Spirit. In other words, God is a Spirit, but He is able to become flesh and live among men, as well as to be above all things. His Spirit is all-inclusive and omnipresent. He can simultaneously be in the flesh and throughout the universe. Since all people say that God is the only one true God, then there is a single God, divisible at will by none! God is only one Spirit, and only one person; and that is the Spirit of God.
“I and My Father are one” (Jhn 10:30).
There is only one God, only one person in this God, and only one Spirit of God, much as it is written down in the Bible that “There is only one Holy Spirit and only one God.” Regardless of whether the Father and the Son of which you speak exist, there is only one God after all, and the substance of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit you believe in is the substance of the Holy Spirit. In other words, God is a Spirit, but He is able to become flesh and live among men, as well as to be above all things. His Spirit is all-inclusive and omnipresent. He can simultaneously be in the flesh and throughout the universe. Since all people say that God is the only one true God, then there is a single God, divisible at will by none! God is only one Spirit, and only one person; and that is the Spirit of God.
Well we first have to acknowledge that Jesus is in fact God. You have been down this path many times before, so you KNOW there are tons of Scripture that support that He is. One WILL be sufficient here, because you can't wiggle out of it.
Matthew 1:23 New King James Version (NKJV)
23 “Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel,” which is translated, “God with us.”
Jesus Is Addressed As Both Human And Divine
We find Jesus being addressed by the human and divine usages of kurios. The polite form of kurios meaning, "Sir," is used. In John's gospel Jesus met a woman at a well in Samaria. She addressed Him as kurios (sir).
John 4:11
The woman said to him, "Sir (kurios), you have no bucket, and the well is deep. Where do you get that living water?
There are other times when kurios speaks of Jesus' full Deity as God the Son.
Philippians 2:10-11
So that at the name of Jesus every knee should bend, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Romans 10:9That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
So if YOU have NOT confessed (acknowledged) Jesus as Lord (God) you are not saved.
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The demons do not deny it they shudder.
If God was a man that could be necessary. No power is said to come through the flesh .jesus said his flesh propfits for nothing.it was a demonstration of a unseen work. We walk by faith
One God exercising two attributes as if he was a man. He remains with out beginning of days abiding as our priest contuillly as the Son of God. Not the Son of man used for the demonstration
For he is not a man, as I am, that I should answer him, and we should come together in judgment. Neither is there any daysman betwixt us, that might lay his hand upon us both Job 9:32-33
No power as to what the eyes see. But rather walk by faith the unseen eternal
Romans 1:3-5 King James Version (KJV) Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead: By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:
No such thing as holiness of the corrupted flesh, the flesh of the Son of man.
As in all thing mixing faith in what is seen or hears(Hebrew4:1-4) indicates a person has heard the gospel that gives us rest.2
The 20/20 prescription, in all things which is needed to "mix faith' ….understand God not seen.
Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.
Walk by faith the eternal. . not but what the eyes see the temporal
If God was a man that could be necessary. No power is said to come through the flesh .jesus said his flesh propfits for nothing.it was a demonstration of a unseen work. We walk by faith
One God exercising two attributes as if he was a man. He remains with out beginning of days abiding as our priest contuillly as the Son of God. Not the Son of man used for the demonstration
For he is not a man, as I am, that I should answer him, and we should come together in judgment. Neither is there any daysman betwixt us, that might lay his hand upon us both Job 9:32-33
No power as to what the eyes see. But rather walk by faith the unseen eternal
Romans 1:3-5 King James Version (KJV) Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead: By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:
No such thing as holiness of the corrupted flesh, the flesh of the Son of man.
As in all thing mixing faith in what is seen or hears(Hebrew4:1-4) indicates a person has heard the gospel that gives us rest.2
The 20/20 prescription, in all things which is needed to "mix faith' ….understand God not seen.
Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.
Walk by faith the eternal. . not but what the eyes see the temporal
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