Real believers have a new identity in Christ. Embrace your new identity, and don't be labeled by accusers

I just asked. He keeps switching and I haven't been able to keep up.
One time he is in a documentary singing the praises of Chuck Smith and the Calvary Chapel movement, next he is excoriating the same in a Strange Fire Conference.

I can't even reason with you if you think that I said anything like that.

Addictions are idolatry. They are an attempt to find one's comfort, satisfaction, and pleasure in something other than God. Mankind was created to find his ultimate comfort, satisfaction, and pleasure in God. If he is substituting something else, he is an idolater.

Everyone, at some level is an idolater because he has not fully put to death all his false gods.

It is a failure to take personal responsibility if one is claiming that addictions are a disease, and not the sin of idolatry.

Maybe he likes their movement in one sense, and dislikes it in another.

Calvary Chapel attempts to base its' beliefs on the Bible, but they are also wrapped up in charismatic stuff that I wouldn't agree with.

I attended one in the early 2000's. Some lady stood up and gave a prophesy. That opens the door for kooky stuff.

In addition, the Calvary Chapel guys have made comments on Reformed theology I don't care for, so they shouldn't be surprised if Reformed people don't like their charismatic behavior. But they are way better than most charismatics. One of my best friends attends a Calvary Chapel. I don't agree with some of his biblical understanding but he isn't totally weird or anything

Maybe you are saying that drugs or alcohol can make someone physically sick if they overindulge. I would agree with that.

The issue is whether addiction is a sickness, or if it is idolatry. My conviction is that it is idolatry. The person who is indulging is trying to find his ultimate satisfaction in the substance instead of a closer relationship with God. The substance will never fulifill him, so he keeps trying to fulfill himself in it, but he never can.

No they are not it’s a gathering of people how have the same experience, then some of them gather at a church to praise God. regardless they are there to stop the sin of being a drunkard among other people have stopped it’s a step forward. seem strange you want to bash a place that helps people to get clean makes no since.

Yes your right but the addiction even after stopping the idolatry, the effects of it can last the rest of their lives, shakes, mood swings, anxiety disorders a whole range of things that never go away.

Idolatry can be come full blown sickness, where a person can’t even function literally without a drink because the brain is misfiring all over the place, yes it starts as a idolatry and is idolatry plain and simple but the idolatry can become a physical dependence and sometimes that will lead them to a non Christian organization called a hospital

Wow all these hoopla for something that is not the same

Galatians 5
19The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, and debauchery;20idolatry and sorcery; hatred, discord, jealousy, and rage; rivalries, divisions, factions, 21and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

I Got sucked into this crap, idolatry has nothing to do with being addicted to a substance that’s garbage.

They have no fixed theology. They allow people to choose any God that fits any persons understanding. The original Cambridge group was Christian but The founders of AA/NA were anti organized religion so they decided to allow members to choose any God that they could come to believe in. They did not have a religious agenda. Sort of like the political parties. You don't have to be a Christian to vote. They just wanted to help folks get and stay clean and/or sober. However in the process of looking for a god to believe in, many, many have come to Christ!

There are Christian 12 step groups like Celebrate Recovery, Partners in Hope and CRA here. Salvation Army in fact used to publish a NKJ version of the bible with 12 step study helps about 20 years ago.

Unfortunately they started taking money from the government and could no longer require consumers (beneficiaries) to attend Christian services or read the Bible. I find it very sad because the Salvation Army used to be the inter-city missionary arm of the Methodist church. It has almost become agnostic.

The 12 steps came from the Bible.

Loving anything more than God is idolatry. That includes politics, sports, relationships, ( sex, porn. & Gambling) economics and man made religions like science. The world and the universe were created. Faith in the created more than the creator is idolatry. Most of us were Idolaters before being saved and the blood of Christ covers our sins. We did/do not instantly become angelic.

You got a good point, and at the looks of it we all still indulge it, computer science is idolatry what we are doing right now is idolatry.

I probably should stop doing stuff likes this and keep it to a bare miminium like work only stuff I have to do too. probably indulging in chat rooms no matter the topic rather Christian chat or not is idolatry plain and simple.

I was self reflecting. The program teaches to keep it personal and I was talking to and about people who did not come from christian homes, that made the decision to follow the Lord after becoming adults and studied a little first to figure out who or what to believe in. guess what? in Isaiah 55; vs 10 & 11 it says;

You have a point too. I don't think we can over worship God.

I'm not bashing them but I wouldn't fellowship with non-believers in a context of dealing with a given sin, when there are programs like Celebrate Recovery. In fact, I have heard some participants say that they have met their best drinking buddies or sex partners at such meetings.

Personally, I favor close fellowship groups at church rather than some secular recovery group organization. The context of relationships doesn't have to be specific to one's particular sin. Fellowship in general leads to growth.

I struggled with a particular sin before being saved. After being saved, I was in close fellowship with a group of friends for twelve years. I had NO incidences of problems with this particular sin during the twelve years. I believe it is because I was in communion with believers AND with God, and the sinful desires did not flourish in such an environment. However, after the church broke up, I went through over a decade of problems with the particular sin until I got back into a healthy church. During most of this decade, I was not in close fellowship. I believe fellowship makes a difference, but not fellowship with a bunch of unbelievers who are struggling with the same issue.

Now, there may be some small benefit, but I am still persuaded that normal fellowship at a sound church (small groups for example) is where it's at.

We were all idolaters prior to salvation, because you can't help being an idolater if you don't have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.

Man was made to worship, and until the person is joined with Jesus, they are an idolater whether they know it or not. Something else fills the void in man's being, that was designed for a relationship with God."

And, I think we still have deep down idols that are hard to kill.

I don't deny that.

Sometimes God delivers from those things too, though.

I am also reformed! But I got no problem with someone standing up and giving a prophecy, THATS BIBLICAL. But thats neither HERE nor THERE. I do agree there is some WEIRD STUFF going on in many of these charismaniac churches. WORLDLY stuff!

You are a solid man

Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa used to have a concert 1 night a week every week. The also had a 12 step Bible study called New Wine that predated Celebrate Recovery. I often went in the 80's. It (New Wine) also had 2 meetings a week at Melodyland Christian Center. The Salvation Army had closed in house meetings also.

Calvary Chapel aligned itself with no other mainstream religion and there was tolerance so Baptists, Catholics and Pentecostals (AG's), Friends (Quakers) were all welcome They tried to be a neutral zone to praise the Lord and study the Lord together. However they did have ushers that would 'council' people occasionally about orderly worship. There were after glow groups that would meet after the main worship service and They would pray and lay hands etc... Those choices were available but optional. Bring your own bible was recommended and translations were compared also. Melodyland was very anti LDS, JW and COG as pseudo Christian cults more than any thing but their members can still get saved Through hearing or reading, (now days), the word of God. It does not return to him void.