The two Beasts of Revelation 13 Identified

It is reasonaable to pray to the kFather Eternal in the name of Jesus Christ, though they are the same. We pray by means of the indwelling Holy Spirit which also is God's Presence in each of us. No, we are not God, but we will be just as Jesus is now one day.

AWhen God told Moses He would manifest Himself as He willed, this is not an explanation to him or to us, it is simply one of the aspects of our Father's all capable being. Too many here are attempting to diminish what and wwho our Maker is because of their own lack and limitation of understanding.

Believe God and you will have no problem. Invent youw veryown manner of teaching others, and ydou are already in problem city. God will be whatever He chooses, and hatever He chooses is fantastic in my humble esteem.

I would offer Christians could be under the laws of men. . called a law of the fathers, kings, princes as a Catholic tradition and see no evil in doing so . But it would be a dark place. The light of the gospel is dim if any.

In that way you described that Catholisicim somehow became one of the many sects. We are informed that there must (not a option) be heresies as opinions of men as that which make up sects or denominations. From that alone is to be in disagreement with those who serve another gospel. Catholicism considers other sects as motherless children, bastards. . not having the same fleshly mother as queen of heaven .

Catholicism flat out denies there must be heresies saying. . there must not be.

1 Corinthians 11:19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

The kingdom does not come by observation looking at the temporal things seen . There does seem to be one heresy that is damnable or judgable, by which we could distinguish if one has the gospel, as it is written (sola scriptura) or are they following another Christ as a man seen ?

2 Peter 2:1But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction

Catholisicim, clearly does despite to the fulness of Christ grace that works in us not of us. They say in respect to the words it id finished that Mary alone received the fulness grace the rest a unknown remnant to be worked out personally after their corrupted spirit leaves the body and suffers in a unknow place called purgatory, mixed with limbo for a unknown amount of time or severity of punishment. Remove the one called a daysman (Pope) in Job 9 working with the antichrist the spirit of lies. Then gospel of truth (sola scriptura) is revealed. Sola scriptura is all thing written in the law and the prophets .It is the reforming authority in any sect or person or generation .

Make the gospel as it is written (sola scriptura) the focus not the men who offer it in various ways. They can aid but never be the source as God's witness

As apologist's we defend it as it is written as that which defends us putting on the Armor and working to keep it on. Like some say no armor for the back. He is the rear guard and the leading light.

Good day Daniel,

We are told who the beasts of Daniel represent which are the kingdoms of Babylon, Medo Persia, Greece and Rome.

Rome when it was in power, is represented by the legs of iron. The ten-toed kingdom, which is still future, will be a revised or extension of Rome, being of partly iron and partly clay, which we are told infers that this kingdom will not have the strength that it did when it was pure iron.

There are going to be ten kings over that one-world kingdom who will give their power and authority to the beast. The coming beast and Rome who rides her, will be center stage during end-time events.

The beast not only represents a kingdom, but also represents and individual. The second beast represents the false prophet. Both will be working concurrently with each other.

I've studied this subject for 45 years, so I know what I believe about it.

Do you believe that last kingdom, iron mixed with miry clay, are the sons of God mingled with the daughters of man? Giants ruling again as in the days of Noah?

43 And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay.

Your comparison is not reflecting the Roman Catholic issue, as being a false religious system. Scripture states:

"But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be under a curse! As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be under a curse! "

That said, the committing of sins that you mention above, is not comparable to a religious system that is preaching and practicing things that are not supported by scripture. When you put all of the practices and beliefs of Roman Catholicism together, it becomes very clear that it is not of Christ, but a counterfeit. So it is not a matter of committing say, the sin of adultery, or murder, but has to do with the entire religious system of Roman Catholicism and what they are practicing and teaching. And Roman Catholicism is definitely preaching another gospel!

However, there are those within Roman Catholicism who belong to God and He is calling them to come out of her so that they will not partake in her future plagues and destruction. Because the Vatican headquarters which sits on seven hills is going to be completely destroyed so that no one will be able to inhabit that city ever again. By the what the scripture says, it sounds like the beast and the ten kings are going to nuke that city sometime during the last 3 1/2 years of that seven year period.

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With such violence the great city of Babylon will be thrown down, never to be found again.

The music of harpists and musicians, pipers and trumpeters, will never be heard in you again.

No worker of any trade will ever be found in you again.

The sound of a millstone will never be heard in you again.

The light of a lamp will never shine in you again.

The voice of bridegroom and bride will never be heard in you again.

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Sounds to me like something permeant is going to take place so that no one will be able to inhabit that city ever again. Nuclear contamination will do that.

All the materials making up the idol of Nebudchanezzar represent the nations and world powers from Babylon until the stone unhewn by human hands comes to destroy them all and replace them all with the Kingsome of our King, amen.

Not really, I have heard this teaching, but I believe that the verse is being stretched. Below is the verse in question:

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43As you saw the iron mixed with clay, so the peoples will mix with one another, but will not hold together any more than iron mixes with clay.

It is only the KJV from which they get the idea by the mentioning of the words "seed of men." But what it is talking about is that kingdom will be a mixture of people with a hint of intermarriage and because of this, that kingdom will be partly strong and partly brittle. It will not have the same strength as it did when it was pure iron, i.e. of the same people.

I would offer its always a matter of faith . . . the unseen eternal as to where it comes from. Can't have one without the other. Its comes from dynamic dual as one work of Christ's faith. . the father working in us to both will and perform his good pleasure or it comes from nothing.

1 John 2:22Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father "and" the Son.

They have neither the father or the Son. Making their fathers the temporal seen on earth as commandments of men . Even when commanded to not call men on earth fathers. They refused to hear the gospel in exchange for a law of the fathers, oral traditions of corruptible men .

They were men who made the sola scriptura without effect. Calling it heresy that is under their law of men

Matthew 23:9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

Jesus called it unthinkable. Having a faith that comes from seeing men the temporal rather than a faith generated from our father in heaven the unseen eternal Spirit of Christ.

They replaced our living unseen God after the corrupted flesh of Abraham the wrath of God that is being revealed to the whole world

Matthew 3:9 And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.

Catholics simply replace the name Abraham with Peter in the verse above.. Like we have Peter to our Holy Father in order to usurp the authority of our Father in heaven

The stones in view are made up of all the nations of the world living stones that do make up the spiritual unseen house of God the church

Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man (Abraham, Peter) , and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things Roman 1:22-23

It seems anyone who marries "outside" his or her family blood is intermarrying, and even within the blood, when thought out is the same when outside of siblings and parents.

Is the Beast out of the Sea the Antichrist and the Beast out of the Earth the False Prophet?

Maybe three personages are one because they share the same nature....

You previously refuted that they can't be one in the same since you say the Bible says they are not. Yet now you equate them as a unholy trinity, which would seem to infer that it is a 'trinity' the same as "Father, Son and Holy Spirit".


So if the Son and the his Father are one, then how can you argue that Satan and the beast are not one too, even thought they are two different personages considering the following passage:

Yes sir, that is correct. The beast out of the sea represents the beast and his kingdom.

We know that the 2nd beast is the false prophet, because of the following:

"He (2nd beast) exercised all the authority of the first beast on his behalf, and made the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose fatal wound had been healed. And he performed great signs, even causing fire to come down from heaven to the earth in full view of the people. - Rev.13:12-13

"Then I saw three impure spirits that looked like frogs; they came out of the mouth of the dragon, out of the mouth of the beast and out of the mouth of the false prophet.

"But the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who had performed the signs on his behalf. With these signs he had deluded those who had received the mark of the beast and worshiped his image. The two of them were thrown alive into the fiery lake of burning sulfur. - Rev.19:20

Here is an interpretation of the Beasts of Revelation that I found interesting...

http://mobilelaz.com/judgmentday/Rev-12-17.pdf

what do you think?

Below are some excerpts from the link you provided above:

There is nothing whatsoever to interpret the sun in Rev.12:1 as referring to the United States. To do is pure conjecture.

Also, there are three symbols list, which is the sun, moon and twelves stars. God gives us the answer to the symbolism in Genesis 37:9-10 regarding Joseph's dream:

"Then Joseph had another dream and told it to his brothers. “Look,” he said, “I had another dream, and this time the sun and moon and eleven stars were bowing down to me.”

He told his father and brothers, but his father rebuked him and said, “What is this dream that you have had? Will your mother and brothers and I actually come and bow down to the ground before you?”

Sun = Jacob

Moon = Wife(s)

Eleven Stars = Jacob's eleven son's, with Joseph making it twelve stars

The woman then in Revelation 12 who is clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and wearing a crown of twelve stars, is figurately representing the nation Israel.

The woman/Israel giving birth to a male child and the dragon/Satan and the stars/angels being cast down to the earth, are both future events which will take place in the middle of that last seven years. The last time that the church is mentioned, is at the very end of chapter 3. After that the word church never appears again until Rev.19:6-8 as the bride at the wedding of the Lamb. And the next time we actually see the word "church" again, is in Rev.22:16 in the epilog.

The reason for this, is because the church is caught up to heaven as represented in Rev.4:1. The voice that sounds like a trumpet was identified as being the Lord in Rev.1:10. This is the same voice that sounds like a trumpet in Rev.4:1 which says "come up here." After this, the word "church" is never used again.

The other reason that the woman cannot be representing the church, is because all of this, the woman giving birth, Satan and his angels being cast down to the earth and the fleeing into the wilderness, all take place during the time of God's wrath which the church is not appointed to suffer and that because Jesus already suffered God's wrath on behalf of every believer.

In addition, the woman/Israel, flees out into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she will be cared for 1260 days, which is the last 3 1/2 years of that seven year period. This fleeing is the same as mentioned in Matt.24:15-22 which will be caused by the abomination being set up in the holy place.

The seven heads also represent seven hills upon which the woman sits, which is referred to as a city. It is Rome's headquarters, the Vatican. You are correct in that, the seven heads also represent a succession of seven kings. At the time that John was receiving this information from the angel, he was told that five of those kings had fallen and that king number six was currently ruling. King number seven had not yet come but when he did, he would only remain a short while. Then there is an eighth king, which is that future beast who will come up out of the Abyss.

"The woman you saw is the great city that rules over the kings of the earth.”

At the time that John was receiving this information from the angel, Rome was that great city that ruled over the kings of the earth.

Since the woman was previously identified as a city, then the woman as city sits on seven hills. Rome was built on and is famous for her seven hills.

A past succession of kings:
"They are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; but when he does come, he must remain for only a little while. The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction."

The seven kings above were a succession of seven kings, with the eighth king being that angel/beast who comes up out of the Abyss. All seven kings have already come and gone from John's time period.

Ten future kings who will rule in conjunction with the beast:
"The ten horns you saw are ten kings who have not yet received a kingdom, but who in a short time will be appointed as kings along with the beast. They have one purpose and will give their power and authority to the beast.

The seven kings have already come and gone. The eighth king/beast is future.

The ten kings are future kings who will rule concurrently with the beast.

The head that receives the mortal wound is that eighth king who belonged to the seven in the past during John's time.

A fatal/mortal wound is not something that can be survived, which is why the inhabitants of the earth are in awe and follow after him. The deception continues with the false prophet who will perform miracles, signs and wonders, for the purpose of deceiving the inhabitants of the earth into believing that the beast who received the fatal wound is God.

The saints in the verse above, is referring to that group wearing white robes which no man can count, who will come out of the great tribulation introduced in Rev.7:9-17. This is not the church, but are those who will have become believers in Christ after the church as been caught. The beast makes war against them because they will keep the testimony of Jesus and the word of God. They will have not worshiped the beast, his image nor received his mark.

The reason that it is the number of a man, is because antichrist will be a man. Paul referred to him as "the man of lawlessness." When the beast/angel comes up out of the Abyss, he will be the power behind the antichrist who will be a man.

I'm done here. Most of what I have read in that document, is pure conjecture, i.e. there is no foundation to prove any of those things. It's kind of like, just make it up as they go. I deal with the details of scripture, not guessing or arbitrary assignments.

There has to be something in scripture to support the claims that are being made, of which there is none.

Yes the Sun represents the righteousness and glory of God. The previous chapter signifies it is the end of time. The last trump has sounded. The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord.. . forever and ever. The temple of the Lord was opened the need of the Sun and moon where no longer needed time is are shown under the feet she is clothed with the brightness of the Sun the righteousness of God As that which Galatians 4 calls the mother of us all , using Paul to signify the responsibility of the His bride to plant the seeds of Christ faith and pray he cause the growth if any. A picture of His wife the church in labor to birth to a incorruptible body . The former things will not be remembered or ever come to mind. The gospel!

Note. . . (purple in parenthesizes) signs that time has come to a end.

And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned. And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail. Revelation 11: 16-19 plus Revelation 12:1-2 All one thought

And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: And she (Christ bride) being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered. Revelation 12:1-2

Galatians 4:19 My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,

Simply a pictrue of the church the bride.

obama and clinton, but I could be wrong. 🤷‍♂️

I have to sign up for facebook, or whatever, to read it? No thank you.

As England in the 15th century grew weary of the teachings of John Wycliffe and the Lollards, kings, priests, and parliaments reacted with fire. In 1401, Parliament passed the De heretico comburendo act, which can be loosely translated as "Regarding the burning of heretics." Lollard persecution would continue for over a hundred years in England. The Fire and Faggot Parliament met in May 1414 at Grey Friars Priory in Leicester to lay out the notorious Suppression of Heresy Act 1414, enabling the burning of heretics by making the crime enforceable by the Justices of the peace. John Oldcastle, a prominent Lollard leader, was not saved from the gallows by his old friend King Henry V. Oldcastle was hanged and his gallows burned in 1417. Jan Hus was burned at the stake after being accused at the Roman Catholic Council of Constance (1414–18) of heresy. The ecumenical council also decreed that the remains of John Wycliffe, dead for 30 years, should be exhumed and burned. (This posthumous execution was carried out in 1428.) As a note England was under the Roman Catholic Church until its supposed breaks in 1532 and 1534.

Many heretics were given a chance to recant their beliefs before being burned. At the place of execution, Jan Hus knelt down, spread out his hands, and prayed aloud. The executioner undressed him, tied his hands behind his back, and bound his neck with a chain to a stake around which wood and straw had been piled up so that it covered him to the neck. At the last moment Hus refused to recant and thus save his own life.

It must be noted that in the book of Daniel those who refused to worship the golden image that Nebuchadnezzar set up in Babylon were given a chance to recant and worship the image before they were thrown into the fiery furnace. Babylon is widely considered to be one of the beasts of Daniel. Likewise the middle ages Roman Catholic Church also used fire to execute those who would refuse to worship the image in which it set up – the crucifix.

Summary:
Babylon set up an image for all to worship and burned those who refused to do so.
The middle ages Roman catholic church set up an image for all to worship and burned those who refused to do so.

If Babylon is one of the beasts in Daniel, then it is plausible for Roman Catholic Church of the middle ages to be one of the beasts in Revelation.

Good day Nebuchadnezzer,

I agree with you, as in a previous post I cited the pope's and the church of Rome's part in the inquisitions and those they imprisoned, property confiscation, tortured and many burned. I also agree that Rome is that fourth beast which is represented by the belly and thighs of iron, also represented by that fearsome beast with the iron teeth. However, it is that future ten-toed kingdom, which will be made up of partly iron and partly baked clay, which is an extension of or revived Rome which is coming.

I would also point out that the scriptures are not pointing to the literal city of Babylon, but "mystery," Babylon the Great. And the meaning of "mystery" is that most of Roman Catholicism's beliefs and practices stem from the pagan religions of Babylon, ergo, mystery, Babylon the great. We could start with that Mitre hat that the pope and the bishops wear which closely resembles the fish hat that the priests of Dagon wore. We could also mention that pagan obelisk brought over from Hierapolis Egypt which sits out in the middle of St. Peter's square, the worship of Mary, Purgatory, the teaching of transubstantiation and many, many more.