Not By Works

GOD IS ALL KNOWING, HE GAVE SALAVATION to those who HE KNEW would not fall away, before time began.

2 Timothy 1:9 (HCSB)
9 He has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace, which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began.

Then God can not be trusted. And his “love” he claims to have is no love at all, and in reality God demands we love unconditionally when he himself does not follow through doing the same.

There is a whole thread for this one:

https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/apostasy-101.189485/

there may be another thread, but there is only one definition , that once again you reject.

you do understand that words have definitions, and those definitions are what words mean, whither you say so or not.


and, once again, I am NOT o.s.a.,s , I think one is saved as long as one believes.

but, since I accept what the word " believe " means, I understand salvation is NOT obtained nor maintained by works. you believe and push that lie. I never will.

Sounds like a lot of work to me, trying to make myself holy.... it does not work that way.
... I myself prefer to rest in the Lord who is Perfect. ... knowing His Perfection, living out His Perfection is my beginning and my end.
2 Corinthians 13:5, the apostle Paul asks the Corinthian believers a question: “Or do you not realize about yourselves that Jesus Christ is in you?”

but can you say to my question: are mental drugs only pharmakeia? or also painkillers

like if u get wisdom teeth removed you can still get painkillers for few days and its not pharmakeia in my opinion.

2 Peter 1
5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.
10 Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble; 11 for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

Eternal security in Christ is our hope.

Not by works of righteousness, Kept by the power of God.... having not our own righteousness but the righteousness of Christ which is by faith.... He shall lose nothing....

I am saved, therefore when I sin, GRACE out bounds my sin because I have been placed into a POSITION of GRACE......

God uses...

LOVE
Blessings
and a good old fashioned BUTT SPANK (chastisement)

To draw me back.......!!

However....MY salvation is eternally secure!

I understand fine how you cannot grasp the truth that faith is what God is looking for genius...and Abraham was justified by FAITH...carry on with your conflated false gospel pal....most already know you are off mark by a mile!

No I don't, CHRIST IS THE SURE THING, as IF IT ALREADY HAPPENED. HOPE THAT GOD MEANT WHAT HE SAID IS A SURE THING.

HE IS THE GUARANTEE THAT HOPE IS ETERNAL SECURITY:

Romans 5:1-11 (HCSB)
1 Therefore, since we have been declared righteous by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.
2 We have also obtained access through Him by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God.
3 And not only that, but we also rejoice in our afflictions, because we know that affliction produces endurance,
4 endurance produces proven character, and proven character produces hope.
5 This hope will not disappoint ⌊us⌋, because God’s love has been poured out in our hearts through the Holy Spirit who was given to us.
6 For while we were still helpless, at the appointed moment, Christ died for the ungodly.
7 For rarely will someone die for a just person—though for a good person perhaps someone might even dare to die.
8 But God proves His own love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us!
9 Much more then, since we have now been declared righteous by His blood, we will be saved through Him from wrath.
10 For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, ⌊then how⌋ much more, having been reconciled, will we be saved by His life!
11 And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ. We have now received this reconciliation through Him.

Titus 1:2 (HCSB)
2 in the hope of eternal life that God, who cannot lie, promised before time began.


OTHER VERSES THAT PROVE THIS HOPE IS ETERNAL SECURITY.


2 Timothy 1:9 (HCSB)
9 He has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace, which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began.

Titus 3:5-7 (HCSB)
5 He saved us— not by works of righteousness that we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit.
6 He poured out this ⌊Spirit⌋ on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
7 so that having been justified by His grace, we may become heirs with the hope of eternal life.

Romans 4:4-5 (NET)
4 Now to the one who works, his pay is not credited due to grace but due to obligation.
5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous, his faith is credited as righteousness.

Ephesians 2:4-5 (HCSB)
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love that He had for us,
5 made us alive with the Messiah even though we were dead in trespasses. You are saved by grace!

Ephesians 2:8-9 (NJB)
8 Because it is by grace that you have been saved, through faith; not by anything of your own, but by a gift from God;
9 not by anything that you have done, so that nobody can claim the credit.

Romans 5:8-11 (HCSB)
8 But God proves His own love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us!
9 Much more then, since we have now been declared righteous by His blood, we will be saved through Him from wrath.
10 For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, ⌊then how⌋ much more, having been reconciled, will we be saved by His life!
11 And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ. We have now received this reconciliation through Him.

1 Corinthians 15:10 (HCSB)
10 But by God’s grace I am what I am, and His grace toward me was not ineffective. However, I worked more than any of them, yet not I, but God’s grace that was with me.

1 Peter 1:3-5 (HCSB)
3 Praise the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. According to His great mercy, He has given us a new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead
4 and into an inheritance that is imperishable, uncorrupted, and unfading, kept in heaven for you.
5 You are being protected by God’s power through faith for a salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.

Romans 11:6 (NASB)
6 But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works, otherwise grace is no longer grace.

Philippians 1:6 (HCSB)
6 I am sure of this, that He who started a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.

2 Corinthians 3:5 (HCSB)
5 ⌊It is⌋ not that we are competent in ourselves to consider anything as coming from ourselves, but our competence is from God.

Philippians 2:13 (HCSB)
13 For it is God who is working in you, ⌊enabling you⌋ both to desire and to work out His good purpose.

Ephesians 1:11-14 (HCSB)
11 We have also received an inheritance in Him, predestined according to the purpose of the One who works out everything in agreement with the decision of His will,
12 so that we who had already put our hope in the Messiah might bring praise to His glory.
13 When you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and when you believed in Him, you were also sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.
14 He is the down payment of our inheritance, for the redemption of the possession, to the praise of His glory.

2 Timothy 2:19 (HCSB)
19 Nevertheless, God’s solid foundation stands firm, having this inscription: The Lord knows those who are His, and Everyone who names the name of the Lord must turn away from unrighteousness.

John 10:27-28 (HCSB)
27 My sheep hear My voice, I know them, and they follow Me.
28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish—ever! No one will snatch them out of My hand.

2 John 1:2 (HCSB)
2 because of the truth that remains in us and will be with us forever.

the greek word for apostasy - apostasia- only used 2 times in N.T.

meaning- defection, a revolt, a departure from previous standing.

in other words, a purposeful turning away, as in one at one point believing , then turning away from believing .]

so, a willful act. no losing salvation, no salvation being taken away.

like most Bible thumpers, you toss around words with no clue as to what they actually mean.

maybe take a break from empty threats of loss of salvation and learn some theology...

Your contribution to salvation is your believing.
Not your works, your believing.

Hebrews 6
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 [c]if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.

Made it a big font for you.

It's bitterly ironic that the Sabbath-rest for the people of God would sound like a lot of work to you. Or that waiting upon Him and allowing Him to have the initiative in our lives would seem to you like trying to make one's self holy. As if. But having been sanctified - set apart to Him by His choice - this is the life we live, a life led by the Holy Spirit with Christ Jesus Himself as Head.

The reason that you and I are not one, as Jesus prayed we would be, is that we have different heads. Jesus is mine and you are yours. You have come in to the sheep pen by a different way than I did. Your "knowing His perfection, living out His perfection is my beginning and my end" rings as hollow as a straw for what I write is that very thing and you can't understand it for you are not of His sheep.

"There remains then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from His. Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will fall by following [Israel's] example of disobedience." Hebrews 4:10,11

"'This is the resting place, let the weary rest'; and, 'This is the place of repose' - but they would not listen." So then the word of the Lord has become to you as gibberish. Isaiah 28:12,13

"Whoever claims to abide in Him must walk as Jesus did", 1 John 2:6. "When you life up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am He, and I do nothing on My own initiative, but I speak these things as the Father taught Me. And He who sent me is with Me; He has not left Me alone, for I always do the things that are pleasing to Him." John 8:28,29.

Don't be a branch that is cut off, gathered and burned. You cannot be his disciple if you do not give up everything you have, Lk14:33. You can be a Christian and a church member without doing that but being those things does not save. Salvation is free but it's not cheap. Our lives have to be laid down in sacrifice; we deny our souls, take up our crosses and follow Him. Your cross is where your will and God's will cross. And because this is not being done is why we are not one. And because we are not one, the world does not believe that the Father sent the Son. John 17:20-23

This is the way, the truth and the life.

No disagreement here. Thank God for His faithfulness

But now that our salvation is secure, the next thing to address is what we’re going to do with it. I want to receive everything that Jesus died to give me. But my laziness or distraction or whatever, may cause me to neglect the gift God has given me, so there is a need to be dilligent

Not to retain salvation, but so that God is glorified in us and our joy may be full. I know you know that, but just speaking to everyone in general.

Believing is not a contribution.
But a work salvationist has to interpret it that way.

To my knowledge those that preaches a faith without works doctrine even unto maturity is preaching a Gospel of unaccountability and stagnation, and dead faith.

As someone who was in the service myself seeing someone with a service uniform preaching a doctrine of unacoutability seems to be hypocritical.

If the individual has not been preaching a Gospel that does not include works then i can apologize for slandering him. However if that is not the case my comment still stands.

Do you believe there are strings attached to salvation?
Just curious.

You would be "hard pressed", in even trying to get these people in defining what "works" means!

Let alone, in trying to get them to explain "which works and WHEN" works are futile, and when and what works are "fruitful" in the becoming "Spiritually mature!"

I use the word "tenure!"
But? UNACCOUNTABILITY, means the same thing!
Jude
8 Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.
10 But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.
12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds (shifty sand); trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;
18 How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.

Nah! These (I use the word loosely) "people" have not the "knowledge of God."
And work feverishly, in their bullying those who even try in their gaining "knowledge of God!"
Because, if they "possessed" such "knowledge?" They would not "mock and scoff", and freely hand out "monikers!"
Yet? Being "wise in their own eyes?" They do!
Enoch "knew" who these (I use the word loosely again) "people" were, and that they "infiltrated" "man" via "woman!"
BOOK OF ENOCH
[Chapter 16]
1 From the days of the slaughter and destruction and death of the giants, from the souls of whose flesh the spirits, having gone forth, shall destroy without incurring judgement -thus shall they destroy until the day of the consummation,
3) "You have been in heaven, but ALL the mysteries had not yet been revealed to you, and you knew worthless ones, and these in the hardness of your hearts you have made known to the women, and through these mysteries women and men work much evil on earth.

Actually? A pretty pitiful bunch!

Powerful? Yeah? Pretty powerful, and too many times? Under-estimated!

But? Just AS "pitiful", as they are powerful!

"BOOK 'EM, Dan-O!"