Catholicism vs Protestantism
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That correct, it prove Muslim god is not Christian god and ccc 841 is lie
841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."
Mankind's judge in the last day is jesus isn't it?
Did Muslim worship Jesus?
Muslim country is not one, in my country indonesia a lot of Muslim convert to Christian. They not go to jail.
Most of them disown by their family, some are tortured, but not by government, it done by their family.
There is a law not to insalt other religion, but tell people about jesus is not prohibit.
My ex neighbor was imam, when he covert, he talk to Muslim about how hyper sex mohammad was, have 11 wife and 10 girl friend. His ex Muslim student record this and send to his Muslim friend, he was thinking to convert his friends but it leak every where than he get 4 years sentenced, now free after 2 years discount
841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."
Mankind's judge in the last day is jesus isn't it?
Did Muslim worship Jesus?
Muslim country is not one, in my country indonesia a lot of Muslim convert to Christian. They not go to jail.
Most of them disown by their family, some are tortured, but not by government, it done by their family.
There is a law not to insalt other religion, but tell people about jesus is not prohibit.
My ex neighbor was imam, when he covert, he talk to Muslim about how hyper sex mohammad was, have 11 wife and 10 girl friend. His ex Muslim student record this and send to his Muslim friend, he was thinking to convert his friends but it leak every where than he get 4 years sentenced, now free after 2 years discount
Sure! Though it is possible, when two people see things differently, that one person is right and the other person is wrong.
I understand that it is illegal to attempt to convert Muslims in many Muslim countries.
I think sometimes God wants us to preach even when it is illegal, sometimes not.
Acts 4: 18 And they sent for them, and gave them orders not to make statements or give teaching in the name of Jesus. 19 But Peter and John in answer said to them, It is for you to say if it is right in the eyes of God to give attention to you more than to God: 20 For it is not possible for us to keep from saying what we have seen and have knowledge of.
I understand that it is illegal to attempt to convert Muslims in many Muslim countries.
I think sometimes God wants us to preach even when it is illegal, sometimes not.
Acts 4: 18 And they sent for them, and gave them orders not to make statements or give teaching in the name of Jesus. 19 But Peter and John in answer said to them, It is for you to say if it is right in the eyes of God to give attention to you more than to God: 20 For it is not possible for us to keep from saying what we have seen and have knowledge of.
1 John 4: 1 Beloved, don't believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit who confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God.
A thing that I notice first off is that the passage doesn't talk about knowing other people's intentions.
It speaks of believing or not believing spirits, and gives a specific test: what does the spirit confess?
Do Catholics confess that Jesus has come in the flesh? Yes.
Here's another test
1 Corinthians 12: 3 Therefore I make known to you that no man speaking by God's Spirit says, "Jesus is accursed." No one can say, "Jesus is Lord," but by the Holy Spirit.
Do Catholics say that Jesus is accursed? No (actually, I don't think Muslims say that, either).
Do Catholics say that Jesus is Lord? Yes.
A thing that I notice first off is that the passage doesn't talk about knowing other people's intentions.
It speaks of believing or not believing spirits, and gives a specific test: what does the spirit confess?
Do Catholics confess that Jesus has come in the flesh? Yes.
Here's another test
1 Corinthians 12: 3 Therefore I make known to you that no man speaking by God's Spirit says, "Jesus is accursed." No one can say, "Jesus is Lord," but by the Holy Spirit.
Do Catholics say that Jesus is accursed? No (actually, I don't think Muslims say that, either).
Do Catholics say that Jesus is Lord? Yes.
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R
Hi, I used to be catholic.
1. We prayed to Mary and asked her to pray for us.
2. We prayed to saints, in particular, the saint that we had chosen for our confirmation. (In my case, Theresa of Avila).
3. Our penance for sins (after confession) were prayers to Mary & The Lord.
4. We said the rosary ‘religiously’ which had more ‘hail mary’s per section Than The Lord’s Prayer.
5. The communion was ‘transubstatiated’ ie. bread and wine was turned into Christ’s literal body & blood.
6. We called the pope ‘most holy father’.
7. The stations of the cross were added to, and not as recorded in scripture.
8. There are statues in every rc church, of saints and Mary, with prayer stations below & candles to aid prayers.
9. Indulgences, prayers & masses said for the dead... In fact, Everything The Bible highlights as sin and idolatry
1. We prayed to Mary and asked her to pray for us.
2. We prayed to saints, in particular, the saint that we had chosen for our confirmation. (In my case, Theresa of Avila).
3. Our penance for sins (after confession) were prayers to Mary & The Lord.
4. We said the rosary ‘religiously’ which had more ‘hail mary’s per section Than The Lord’s Prayer.
5. The communion was ‘transubstatiated’ ie. bread and wine was turned into Christ’s literal body & blood.
6. We called the pope ‘most holy father’.
7. The stations of the cross were added to, and not as recorded in scripture.
8. There are statues in every rc church, of saints and Mary, with prayer stations below & candles to aid prayers.
9. Indulgences, prayers & masses said for the dead... In fact, Everything The Bible highlights as sin and idolatry
No, I do not admit that.
What I said was that Muslims "think that the God who created heaven and earth also wrote the Quran. But they are wrong."
Jackson, my brother, when you read the sentence
Christians and Muslims worship the same God.
Does that mean the same thing in your mind as
The God that Christians talk about is the same god that Muslims talk about.
Because those two sentences do not mean the same thing!
What I said was that Muslims "think that the God who created heaven and earth also wrote the Quran. But they are wrong."
Jackson, my brother, when you read the sentence
Christians and Muslims worship the same God.
Does that mean the same thing in your mind as
The God that Christians talk about is the same god that Muslims talk about.
Because those two sentences do not mean the same thing!
Hi Reformyourself, welcome to CC!
I know it's a common story, for people to grow up Catholic and end up leaving and just "reading the Bible" or something like that.
I know of several people who grew up in "bible-believing" churches and decided to become Catholic or Eastern Orthodox in order to find a deeper relationship with God.
Whatever gives a person a deeper relationship is good, imo!
I know it's a common story, for people to grow up Catholic and end up leaving and just "reading the Bible" or something like that.
I know of several people who grew up in "bible-believing" churches and decided to become Catholic or Eastern Orthodox in order to find a deeper relationship with God.
Whatever gives a person a deeper relationship is good, imo!
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Good point!
Some common objections I've heard to that line of reasoning are:
The Jewish scriptures say that it's the same God, so that counts as Jews worshiping the same God.
The Jews are currently blinded, so it doesn't matter what they say, it's still the same God.
To me, neither of those objections hold much water.
But in my experience, if a person is highly motivated to say that Christians and Jews worship the same God, but Muslims worship a different God, they will often bring up one of those objections.
Some common objections I've heard to that line of reasoning are:
The Jewish scriptures say that it's the same God, so that counts as Jews worshiping the same God.
The Jews are currently blinded, so it doesn't matter what they say, it's still the same God.
To me, neither of those objections hold much water.
But in my experience, if a person is highly motivated to say that Christians and Jews worship the same God, but Muslims worship a different God, they will often bring up one of those objections.
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The people alive during the Old Testament had to believe in the coming messiah and follow rules such as circumcision, etc.
The New Testament mandate stipulated everyone had to believe the gospel: That Jesus was the promised Messiah who paid the price for the sin of all humanity through His death, was buried and resurrected. And after believing in the finished work of Jesus Christ they were instructed to repent, be water baptized in Jesus' name and receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. (Acts 2) The New Testament began when the Holy Ghost was poured out at Pentecost and applies to all those who have lived and died since then and until Jesus' second coming.
The following scriptures indicate that obedience to the gospel is not possible after death:
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: Heb 9:27
And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. John 5:27-29
Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest. Eccl 9:10
And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them. Rev 14:13
The New Testament mandate stipulated everyone had to believe the gospel: That Jesus was the promised Messiah who paid the price for the sin of all humanity through His death, was buried and resurrected. And after believing in the finished work of Jesus Christ they were instructed to repent, be water baptized in Jesus' name and receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. (Acts 2) The New Testament began when the Holy Ghost was poured out at Pentecost and applies to all those who have lived and died since then and until Jesus' second coming.
The following scriptures indicate that obedience to the gospel is not possible after death:
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: Heb 9:27
And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. John 5:27-29
Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest. Eccl 9:10
And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them. Rev 14:13