once was, now is not, and yet will come

Where does this fit into the supposed 7 years of reign (or 3.5 years of reign) of the beast?

Revelation 17:8 - "The beast, which you saw, once was, now is not, and yet will come up out of the Abyss and go to its destruction. The inhabitants of the earth whose names have not been written in the book of life from the creation of the world will be astonished when they see the beast, because it once was, now is not, and yet will come."

But if the beast is but one man and is yet to the future, then he surely was not around before or during John's life.

This verse cannot be properly understood without the whole context of Revelation 17 as well as Daniel 7. Thus we really need to go back to Daniel 7 first.

THE ANTICHRIST'S REIGN FOR 3 1/2 YEARS, HIS ALLIANCES, AND HIS TOTAL DESTRUCTION

DANIEL'S VISION
After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns. I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things... (Dan 7:7,8)

THE INTERPRETATION OF DANIEL'S VISION
Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet; And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows. I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them; Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

THE KINGDOM OF THE ANTICHRIST WILL BE WORLDWIDE
Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.
TEN NATIONS FROM THE FORMER ROMAN EMPIRE WILL BE ALLIES OF THE ANTICHRIST
And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise:...
THE ANTICHRIST WILL SUBDUE THREE OF THOSE NATIONS
...and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings. [Note: thus we have 7 heads and 10 horns in Rev 17]
THE ANTICHRIST WILL BE THE ARCH BLASPHEMER OF GOD
...And he shall speak great words against the most High...
THE ANTICHRIST WILL MAKE WAR AGAINST THE SAINTS
and shall wear out the saints of the most High (I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them)
THE ANTICHRIST WILL SUBVERT THE EXISTING ORDER
...and think to change times and laws...
THE ANTICHRIST'S REIGN WILL BE LIMITED TO 3 1/2 YEARS
and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.
CHRIST WILL UTTERLY DESTROY THE ANTICHRIST AND HIS KINGDOM
But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. (Dan 7:19-26)

We can now examine Rev 17:8 & 11 and see what it means. But before we do that we need to understand that the Antichrist is energized, empowered, and possibly even possessed by Satan (who ascends out of the bottomless pit), in order to accomplish what he accomplishes.

THE ANTICHRIST IS THE LITTLE HORN OF DANIEL
The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is... And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

...another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things

Daniel speaks of ten horns, out of which three fell, leaving seven, and this little horn is therefore the eighth (as mentioned in Rev 17:11).

I did not ask for the entire dialogue of futurism.

I asked specifically where, "once was, now is not, and yet will come", fits into the futurism dialogue.

Please be specific and concise.

Just from what you asked... Satan could do all kind of lying wonders before Christ.. yet Christ came and all that stopped.. but hmm .. then a CAUGHT UP will happen.. and the restrainer will be taken out of the way and how odd THEN the lawless one comes out in the open and can again do lying wonders..

I don't think this is the answer but.. its a truth none the less lol. What was told to John just made me THINK of this.. bless you

ONE WORD: THE ANTICHRIST

So the antichrist will be, then will be not, then will come again?

Rev 12:3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

The crowns are on the heads, Satan in the spiritual realm deceiving people by the last 7 kingdoms before the beast.

Rev 13:1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
Rev 13:2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

The crowns are on the horns, Satan in the physical realm deceiving people by the man of sin, and the 10 horns is the world split in to 10 sections with a leader in each section.

The 10 horns are the physical dominion of the beast kingdom, which all nations came together but the plan is of the Roman Empire which is more extended than in the first century, and the power base of the beast as arms will stand on his part which America, Europe, and Russia, have very great military power.

Which it is the new age movement plan that they are trying to establish that interprets the Bible according to the occult, and evolution, and people are still evolving to be greater and spiritual provided by the New Age Christ, the beast, and no personal God above them, atheist, but spiritual, the God of forces, or the power of nature, the evolutionary process.

The Roman Empire has the physical dominion which they shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces, and the New Age Christ comes from the 10 horns.

With the ways of a lion, Babylon, the occult, human religion, the kingdom of man which the beast kingdom is Babylon in spirit, for Babylon, Medo-Persia, and Greece will never have physical dominion again, but their ways are still on earth.

With the ways of a bear, Medo-Persia, physical cruelty to take away everyone that opposes the beast kingdom.

With the ways of a leopard, Greece, human wisdom.

The kingdom of man in it's entirety with no input from God.

All 4 kingdoms have not fallen yet until Jesus hits the feet of the statue of a man in Daniel 2 then all 4 kingdoms are put down, for as long as their ways are still on earth they have not fallen yet.

Rev 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
Rev 17:9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.
Rev 17:10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.
Rev 17:11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

The 7 heads, kings are, 1.Egypt, 2.Assyria, 3.Babylon, 4.Medo-Persia, 5.Greece, the first 5 are fallen, 6.Roman Empire, one is, which the Roman Empire was the kingdom when John wrote Revelation, and one is to come, the 10 horn kingdom, which shall continue a short space, three and one half years.

The 8th king is the New Age Christ, the beast, which shall rule for three and one half years.

The 8th king is of the 7 kings for the devil influenced those kingdoms.

So the beast that was, and is not, and yet is, would be a reference to the devil who was before the beast, the man of sin appeared, and is not, for the devil will be punished, and yet is, that he is using the New Age Christ to deceive the world.

2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

2Th 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
2Th 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming.

Dan 8:23 And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up.

Rev 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition.

Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
Rev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

The devil is on a leash right now, and can only influence the world so much, and what withholds the man of sin from appearing claiming to be God is the condition of the world in response to the truth.

Which the nations will come together and work for peace on earth according to the ways of people, and stop the preaching of the Gospel world wide for three and one half years, which is the time the world will not want to hear the truth of the Bible but want to hear it according to the new age movement, evolution is religion.

Controlled conflict brings about controlled change.

The 10 horn kingdom failed at providing peace on earth, but it was planned out so they will accept the New Age Christ, and at the end of the three and one half years it is the falling away first, when the transgressors are come to the full, and then the world accepts the New Age Christ as the solution to have peace on earth.

Which the beast ascends from the bottomless pit, which the devil is off his leash concerning the wicked, and the man of sin deceives all people who do not love God to follow him, and when they do then salvation is no longer available to them, and God will end sin on earth.

Then the devil is back in the bottomless pit, back on a leash during the millennial reign of Christ, but the devil does not influence the world at all, and then at the end of the millennial reign the devil is released out of his prison, and deceives the heathen that Jesus and the saints rule over, and they go against them and God devours them with fire, and the millennial reign is over, and Satan goes to the lake of fire.

For God spared some people when He went against the world so Jesus and the saints could rule over them, but they still had punishment coming for taking the mark of the beast, and following the man of sin, but God postponed their judgment until the end of the millennial reign.

Are you saying the devil in the bottomless pit is the beast is not? But the beast was already throw into the lake of fire in Chp. 19 when devil goes into bottomless pit in Chp 20.
Not sure what you are stating. Can you summarize your view on this to a few sentences? What view does fall into? futurist? historicist...? thx

You are confusing the Original Roman Empire, mentioned in Daniel with a future Roman Empire that is based on false prophecy conjured up by Dispensationalism. Why did they conjure it up? Because the Reformers revealed the Papacy is Antichrist. And the Jesuits deceived people into thinking he was yet future. And Dispensationalism came from this lie.

Satan copies God. Right now many would think of Jesus as once was, now is not, and is yet to come.

The Dragon head with a mortal wound that is healed is Satan's imitation of Christ's death, and resurrection. Like Christians wait for Jesus to return Anti-Christ wants to be waited on.

Two saviors two resurrections and two coming again.

Anti-Christ Wil come first to destroy the Christian Church.

Warning: If it's a Church that is perceived as a work of antichrist, those perceiving that will see their scriptures being fulfilled. They will see Jesus destroying the antichrist with the breath of His mouth.

The one to appear First will present a strong temptation to believe that there is no other coming. This will set up those who with antichrist hate the Church antichrist attacks. They won't be waiting for another to come because they have fallen for Satan's deception. When all seems lost for the true Church Christ comes and destroys the antichrist.

Well the Reformers were SERIOUSLY MISTAKEN. But then again, they were not necessarily focused on Bible prophecies. Their primary goal was to bring the Scriptures and the Gospel to the forefront and establish the Five Solas.

The papacy or the pope cannot possibly be the Antichrist for the simple reason that God limits the reign of the Antichrist to just 3 1/2 years, 42 months, or 1260 days.

Funny how the saved written in the book of life will be astonished when they SEE THE BEAST rise up.....must be a miracle because according to MOST and the imminent return THEORY, the saved will not be here to see the beast rise up...........!!!!! And if they have been "Raptured" and are before the GOD OF HEAVEN why would they me amazed or astonished at the beast rising up if they are not here??????

Now watch the tap dancing commence!!!!

So what is the beast? This thread is asking question about the beast.

OK, so I am in the historicist camp, but that doesn't mean we are in agreement on these things.

I am talking about the beast. You and others keep talking about the antichrist.

So There is "man of lawlessness", and there is "the false prophet" and there is "the beast", and there is "the antichrist". The "false prophet" and the "beast" are two separate entities as depicted in Rev 19:20

I believe the "man of lawlessness", "the antichrist" and "the false prophet" are synonymous. OK, they are the papacy. I don't disagree with this.

But the beast is not the false prophet, or the man of lawlessness, or the antichrist.

So what is the beast? This thread is asking question about the beast.

I have my own stance on what the beast is, but would like yours.

Dave L, let us chat some more.

Nice point! I like your point!! ---no tap dancing, please--

Simple question: So what is the beast?

I can only go by the language and possibilities given in the word...

A. When John pens Revelation in the late 1st century A.D....the beast...

1. that was <-past tense (already been)

2. is not <-present tense (at that time not present or alive)

3. Shall ascend OUT OF THE PIT<-FUTURE TENSE (yet future advent after being once, then gone)

Only two entities have the title THE (definite article) Son of Perdition

The beast that shall come (man of sin) and JUDAS ISCARIOT that was alive (past tense) IS NOT (present tense) when Revelation penned and with a POSSIBLE FUTURE ADVENT (ascension from the pit, his current location)

NOT SAYIN it is Judas, but the language does fit and I cannot ignore the Greek definite article -->THE

That beast is Israel and their religion. It was until Jesus came and then it wasn’t, and now it’s here again.

OK, the beast is a people or better yet a government. Thanks for chiming in.

Gotta love how people ignore personal pronouns and definite articles to come to foolish conclusions....!! Geesh