Origin of the Cross?

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stonesoffire

stonesoffire

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I’ve always heard that crucifixion originated In Rome, but is this true? In reading Ezra this morning, I came across this scripture.

Ezr 6:7 Let the work of this house of God alone; let the governor of the Jews and the elders of the Jews build this house of God in his place.


Ezr 6:8 Moreover I make a decree what ye shall do to the elders of these Jews for the building of this house of God: that of the king's goods, even of the tribute beyond the river, forthwith expenses be given unto these men, that they be not hindered.


Ezr 6:9 And that which they have need of, both young bullocks, and rams, and lambs, for the burnt offerings of the God of heaven, wheat, salt, wine, and oil, according to the appointment of the priests which are at Jerusalem, let it be given them day by day without fail:


Ezr 6:10 That they may offer sacrifices of sweet savours unto the God of heaven, and pray for the life of the king, and of his sons.


Ezr 6:11 Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this.


Ezr 6:12 And the God that hath caused his name to dwell there destroy all kings and people, that shall put to their hand to alter and to destroy this house of God which is at Jerusalem. I Darius have made a decree; let it be done with speed.


This is the decree that Darius I made after searching for the order from the former King Darius. And finding the decree orders the Jews to continue the building of the temple, and the sacrifices.

Verse 11 in the Amplified Bible was a bit stronger.:

11. Also I make a decree that whoever shall change or infringe on this order, let a beam be pulled from his house and erected; then let him be fastened to it, and let his house be made a dung hill for this.

Jesus did destroy animal sacrifice, and made men’s Spirit the temple now of the Lord. Was it this decree that caused the Jews to crucify Him? Or the Romans by the pleadings of the Jews.

I found this interesting and see symbolism in this.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

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stonesoffire said:
Ezr 6:11 Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this.
Click to expand...
This is simply a reference to hanging, and in the book of Esther, a gallows was erected for hanging, but Haman ended up being hanged. This has nothing to do with crucifixion.
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

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You don’t see the possible history here Nehemiah? I was thinking that this decree might of been what the Jews were using as the base of accusation against Him. And it may be entirely wrong. Am going to do some search on this later.

Is nothing that adds or subtracts from salvation, is just curiosty on my part.
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

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Article Excerpt:

Who Invented Crucifixion?
While accounts of crucifixions are recorded by several ancient civilizations and cultures, the Persians are most often credited by historians as having invented the practice. The oldest record comes from Herodotus who noted that Darius crucified 3,000 inhabitants of Babylon.

Originating in Persia, crucifixion then spread to the Assyrians, Scythians, Taurians, Thracians, the people of India, the Germans, Celts, Britons, Numidians, and the Carthaginians. The Greeks and Macedonians are also believed to have learned the practice of crucifixion from the Persians.

Perhaps due to the gruesomeness of this horrible practice, detailed accounts of crucifixions by historians are few. The Jewish historian Josephus, who witnessed live crucifixions during Titus’ siege on Jerusalem, called it "the most wretched of deaths." Cicero (AD 106–43) described it as a "most cruel and disgusting penalty."

Another historian captured this attitude of the people in the ancient world toward crucifixion: "It was an utterly offensive affair, ‘obscene’ in the original sense of the word."

(here)

https://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0g...y-700749/RK=2/RS=gSFPL963s5CKjMX7cfH3SWr0Xgw-
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

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Dec 12, 2013
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stonesoffire said:
I’ve always heard that crucifixion originated In Rome, but is this true? In reading Ezra this morning, I came across this scripture.

Ezr 6:7 Let the work of this house of God alone; let the governor of the Jews and the elders of the Jews build this house of God in his place.


Ezr 6:8 Moreover I make a decree what ye shall do to the elders of these Jews for the building of this house of God: that of the king's goods, even of the tribute beyond the river, forthwith expenses be given unto these men, that they be not hindered.


Ezr 6:9 And that which they have need of, both young bullocks, and rams, and lambs, for the burnt offerings of the God of heaven, wheat, salt, wine, and oil, according to the appointment of the priests which are at Jerusalem, let it be given them day by day without fail:


Ezr 6:10 That they may offer sacrifices of sweet savours unto the God of heaven, and pray for the life of the king, and of his sons.


Ezr 6:11 Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this.


Ezr 6:12 And the God that hath caused his name to dwell there destroy all kings and people, that shall put to their hand to alter and to destroy this house of God which is at Jerusalem. I Darius have made a decree; let it be done with speed.


This is the decree that Darius I made after searching for the order from the former King Darius. And finding the decree orders the Jews to continue the building of the temple, and the sacrifices.

Verse 11 in the Amplified Bible was a bit stronger.:

11. Also I make a decree that whoever shall change or infringe on this order, let a beam be pulled from his house and erected; then let him be fastened to it, and let his house be made a dung hill for this.

Jesus did destroy animal sacrifice, and made men’s Spirit the temple now of the Lord. Was it this decree that caused the Jews to crucify Him? Or the Romans by the pleadings of the Jews.

I found this interesting and see symbolism in this.
Click to expand...
Was not Rome....Assyrians, Babylonians, Greeks and others crucified people long before the Romans adopted it.....
 
WithinReason

WithinReason

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Crucifixion was 'invented' by the devil long before any man ever thought of it (John 8:44), as a twisting of the ways of God (Psalms 77:13). In effect, it was spite against God's methods (2 Corinthians 2:11), and a slap in the face, a piercing of the heart using what was God's against Him.

The Cross was always the LORD God's (JEHOVAH Elohiym's) (Psalms 77:13), see the typologies and prophecies here:

https://ia601402.us.archive.org/17/...throughout the Bible and in the Sanctuary.pdf

























 
Benadam

Benadam

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Aug 14, 2019
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I'll bet hanging on a tree was alot like hanging on a cross.

Duet. 21:23
His body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God;) that thy land be not defiled, which the Lord thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.
 
JaumeJ

JaumeJ

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Jul 2, 2011
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It is written in the Old Testament, "cursed be any man who is hanged on a tree."
 
P

presidente

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May 29, 2013
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stonesoffire said:
I’ve always heard that crucifixion originated In Rome, but is this true? In reading Ezra this morning, I came across this scripture.

Ezr 6:7 Let the work of this house of God alone; let the governor of the Jews and the elders of the Jews build this house of God in his place.


Ezr 6:8 Moreover I make a decree what ye shall do to the elders of these Jews for the building of this house of God: that of the king's goods, even of the tribute beyond the river, forthwith expenses be given unto these men, that they be not hindered.


Ezr 6:9 And that which they have need of, both young bullocks, and rams, and lambs, for the burnt offerings of the God of heaven, wheat, salt, wine, and oil, according to the appointment of the priests which are at Jerusalem, let it be given them day by day without fail:


Ezr 6:10 That they may offer sacrifices of sweet savours unto the God of heaven, and pray for the life of the king, and of his sons.


Ezr 6:11 Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this.


Ezr 6:12 And the God that hath caused his name to dwell there destroy all kings and people, that shall put to their hand to alter and to destroy this house of God which is at Jerusalem. I Darius have made a decree; let it be done with speed.


This is the decree that Darius I made after searching for the order from the former King Darius. And finding the decree orders the Jews to continue the building of the temple, and the sacrifices.

Verse 11 in the Amplified Bible was a bit stronger.:

11. Also I make a decree that whoever shall change or infringe on this order, let a beam be pulled from his house and erected; then let him be fastened to it, and let his house be made a dung hill for this.

Jesus did destroy animal sacrifice, and made men’s Spirit the temple now of the Lord. Was it this decree that caused the Jews to crucify Him? Or the Romans by the pleadings of the Jews.

I found this interesting and see symbolism in this.
Click to expand...
I read the Babylonians also like to impail people in various ways.
 
Benadam

Benadam

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I think Romans knew all the ins and outs of crucifying someone. Knew how to crucify better, so to speak, than anyone. The way the crucified person died was manipulated to fit particular crimes. It became an art in Roman hands.
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

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presidente said:
I read the Babylonians also like to impail people in various ways.
Click to expand...
Probably in ways I’m squeamish to hear about. 😉

My quest though is....did the Jews call for this according to the decree of Darius 1 ? Because Jesus did change sacrifice and the temple worship. Perhaps when Jesus spoke eat my body, drink my blood, it so enraged the Jews that they demanded His death this way. That they understood what He was saying more than thought. Or at least that’s how I thought. Am not a theologian by any means.


Did they search the scrolls to see what to do?
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

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Benadam said:
I'll bet hanging on a tree was alot like hanging on a cross.

Duet. 21:23
His body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God;) that thy land be not defiled, which the Lord thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.
Click to expand...
I picture hanging on a tree to be instant with breaking the neck.
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

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WithinReason said:
Crucifixion was 'invented' by the devil long before any man ever thought of it (John 8:44), as a twisting of the ways of God (Psalms 77:13). In effect, it was spite against God's methods (2 Corinthians 2:11), and a slap in the face, a piercing of the heart using what was God's against Him.

The Cross was always the LORD God's (JEHOVAH Elohiym's) (Psalms 77:13), see the typologies and prophecies here:

https://ia601402.us.archive.org/17/items/michael-the-archangel-x-5-appendix-5-the-cross-throughout-the-bible-and-in-the-sanctuary/Michael the archangel [X5] - Appendix 5 The Cross throughout the Bible and in the Sanctuary.pdf

























Click to expand...
thank you for this post! There’s so much to see pictorially. This is why I love the Hebrew language. It paints pics when studied that our English doesn’t reveal.
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

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WithinReason said:
Crucifixion was 'invented' by the devil long before any man ever thought of it (John 8:44), as a twisting of the ways of God (Psalms 77:13). In effect, it was spite against God's methods (2 Corinthians 2:11), and a slap in the face, a piercing of the heart using what was God's against Him.

The Cross was always the LORD God's (JEHOVAH Elohiym's) (Psalms 77:13), see the typologies and prophecies here:

https://ia601402.us.archive.org/17/items/michael-the-archangel-x-5-appendix-5-the-cross-throughout-the-bible-and-in-the-sanctuary/Michael the archangel [X5] - Appendix 5 The Cross throughout the Bible and in the Sanctuary.pdf

























Click to expand...
Something I want to say here too about the vine on the “tree”.::

Ive always wondered how Jesus could be the Vine, and we the branches since branches are usually of the tree not the Vine.

Until....this.....I see us as branches in the tree of life, held securely by the Vine there in death to self, as dead, yet dying daily.


According to Revelation (the book) the leaves of the tree of life are “sprouts”. Christians were called sprouts
at some point early, and are the exact image of the tree. So we are for the healing of the nations.

These are the secret things that were lost in some way, but are now being revealed.

And just for an aside.....how can one get loose from the security of the Vine who holds us. Eternally.

Pure love lifted for the world to see.
 
J

jacob_g

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I just watched, Dr. Georgia Purdom, molecular geneticist and speaker at Answers in Genesis, presents at the Answers Easter Event, 2020. According to her expertise, the Persians invented crucifixion, but the Romans perfected it.
 
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