What translation has the exact words of God preserved for English speakers?

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JohnR7

JohnR7

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#321
Dec 30, 2019
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Micaiah-imla said:
Never once mentioned anything regarding Hebrew letters...
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The Hasidic teaching is based on the Kabbalah which is based on the oral tradition. This goes back at least to Moses if not Abraham if not Adam. Of course they develop this over the years. The idea that the letters fit into the Star of David could not go back before David. This teaching really does not make sense until a person has been a christian for 40 years. If you were born a Christian then you understand when you are 40. For me I did not get saved until my 20's so it was in my 60's that I began my study what the Hasidic Rabbi's were teaching. They are the ones that do not trim the beard. They let their face hair grow wild.

The idea that they want to add to the teachings of Moses is something I have problems with. When I ask them about it they do not say anything so they do not give me an answer. They have 613 commandments they follow and Jesus said it was enough to follow the teachings of Moses and do not add to that.

"So practice and observe everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. They tie up heavy, burdensome loads and lay them on men’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them." (Matthew 23:4)
 

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Micaiah-imla

Banned
#322
Feb 29, 2020
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#322
JohnR7 said:
Rabbi Trubman has some very nice, brief, short lesson on YouTube about the Hebrew letters. We can learn a lot from that.
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Getting into things like this sounds like what the scriptures warn about; that we shouldn’t divert our time away from the sound doctrine in the scriptures:

1 Timothy 1:3-7
[3] As I urged you ...charge some that they teach no other doctrine, [4] Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do. [5] Now the end of the commandment is love out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned: [6] From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling; [7] Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.

1 Corinthians 2:4-5
[4] And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power: [5] That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.
 
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John146

Senior Member
#323
Jan 13, 2016
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Chester said:
That quote fits the KJV only movement exactly.

I believe God has carefully preserved His Word in many good translations in many languages throughout the world. He is the authority, not me. KJV sets a group of translators up as "inspired by God" 1500 years after the New Testament was already written.
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A “good translation” is not the word of God. A good translation has errors, God’s word is perfect and without error.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#324
Jan 13, 2016
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Angela53510 said:
This is utter nonsense. Paul did not write in Hebrew. Hebrew was a dead language in the first century, it was only read in the synagogue. Yes, Paul studied Hebrew, but Greek and Aramaic were the common languages. In fact, the Septuagint was translated in the 3rd century BC, because once Alexander conquered the world, he replaced all languages with Greek. People could no longer understand Hebrew, so it was translated into Greek, so it was accessible again. That's 300 years BEFORE Christ.

There are NO extant manuscripts of the NT books in Hebrew found anywhere. There are 4 schools of Greek manuscripts, and we have over 6000 parts or whole texts dating from the 2nd century to about the 15th century. Luke was a Greek physician. He wrote to another Greek - Theophilus for Acts and Luke. Why on earth would he have used Hebrew? The only possible book in the NT that could possibly have been written in Hebrew was Matthew, who wrote to the Jews. Yet, no copies have ever been found in Hebrew, because they didn't exist. As I said earlier, the Hellenization of the world worked - and everyone spoke Greek.

A single language spoken in the world, was also a sign of the coming of the time of Christ. It made the spread of the gospel much easier. Everyone spoke Greek, including the Romans. It was the best time in history for the gospel to be shared in the known world!

So, no, Luke did not write in Hebrew, and it is doubtful any of the NT writers did, or surely there would be copies? Even the Jews were losing their Hebrew totally later on. So, the Masoretic OT was not written until the 8th-10th century AD. Because the Hebrew pronunciations were getting lost, they figured out the Nicky dot vowels to put above, below and beside the consonants, so the sounds and the various verb forms would not be lost.

So your whole theory that translations are inspired is also nonsense. Certainly, the KJV, with all its mistakes and additions could never be considered as inspired in the way the original autographs in their languages were.
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Speaking of theories☝️☝️☝️
 
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lenna

Guest
#325
#325
John146 said:
A “good translation” is not the word of God. A good translation has errors, God’s word is perfect and without error.
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Even the original manuscripts have certain variations

The KJ has many errors. So does that make it NOT God's word? Rhetorical question to some but a genuine concern to others.
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#326
Jun 30, 2015
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JohnR7 said:
The word of God is anything but dead, so your talk is serpent talk. We have the Torah the first five books of Moses and we have the Red Letters or the word of Jesus. No one adds anything to what we receive from them. Paul is just helping us to understand the teachings of Jesus and Moses. Also Paul talks about the love that David has for God. Paul has authority but he does not give us anything new. We always need to go back to Moses or Jesus to see the original teaching.
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Miss the point much? Angela wrote, "Hebrew was a dead language", not, "The word of God is dead".

That you can mix those two up is baffling. That you slander her in the process just reveals what is in your heart.
 
Dino246

Dino246

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#328
Jun 30, 2015
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John146 said:
A “good translation” is not the word of God. A good translation has errors, God’s word is perfect and without error.
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Once again, your ignorance is your undoing. Here's an excerpt from the 1611 preface (with emphasis added):

Truly, good Christian reader, we never thought from the beginning that we should need to make a new translation, nor yet to make of a bad one a good one ...; but to make a good one better, or out of many good ones, one principal GOOD one....

So much for your theories.
 
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John146

Senior Member
#329
Jan 13, 2016
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lenna said:
Even the original manuscripts have certain variations

The KJ has many errors. So does that make it NOT God's word? Rhetorical question to some but a genuine concern to others.
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If the KJV has errors it cannot be the word of God. Fortunately, it has no errors.😉
 
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John146

Senior Member
#330
Jan 13, 2016
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Dino246 said:
Once again, your ignorance is your undoing. Here's an excerpt from the 1611 preface (with emphasis added):

Truly, good Christian reader, we never thought from the beginning that we should need to make a new translation, nor yet to make of a bad one a good one ...; but to make a good one better, or out of many good ones, one principal GOOD one....

So much for your theories.
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Opinions fall short of truth.
 
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lenna

Guest
#331
#331
John146 said:
If the KJV has errors it cannot be the word of God. Fortunately, it has no errors.😉
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Well, I guess that is still better than a deliberate lie.

But in the end, God will be the judge of that also. :giggle:
 
Dino246

Dino246

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#332
Jun 30, 2015
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John146 said:
If the KJV has errors it cannot be the word of God. Fortunately, it has no errors.😉
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Your constitutional inability to accept the presence of errors in the KJV has no bearing on the reality of their existence.
 
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John146

Senior Member
#333
Jan 13, 2016
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Dino246 said:
And you offer something better?

smh... the hypocrisy is getting thick around here...
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Look up the word hypocrite. I stand alone on the KJV and have not varied. You, my friend, claim you have God’s word, but then claim a translation cannot be perfect. Hmmmmmm....
 
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lenna

Guest
#336
#336
John146 said:
Look up the word hypocrite. I stand alone on the KJV and have not varied. You, my friend, claim you have God’s word, but then claim a translation cannot be perfect. Hmmmmmm....
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No no. You are not alone. There are others suffering from the same malady as yourself. ;)
 
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John146

Senior Member
#337
Jan 13, 2016
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#337
Dino246 said:
We aren't talking about opinions, but rather theories; which is the word you used. Don't try to change the focus to absolve yourself.
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I was quoting Angela...🤦‍♂️
 
Dino246

Dino246

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#338
Jun 30, 2015
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#338
John146 said:
Look up the word hypocrite. I stand alone on the KJV and have not varied. You, my friend, claim you have God’s word, but then claim a translation cannot be perfect. Hmmmmmm....
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As I don't hold to your invented standard and equivocation regarding the word of God, I am not a hypocrite.
 
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John146

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#339
Jan 13, 2016
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#339
lenna said:
No no. You are not alone. There are others suffering from the same malady as yourself. ;)
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How does it feel to be unsure what God has said? I wouldn’t even read a version knowing it contained errors. You might as well talk with the devil. He’ll give you most of the truth. See Eve. It’s the oldest deception in the Bible.
 
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