Israel The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed

Israel The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed.

Galatians 3:26-30KJV
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

There are (Two) Israel's seen below.

1. Ethnic Israel Of The Flesh

2. Israel The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed.

Gods word clearly states below, the children of the flesh (Ethnic Jews) they are not the children of God

Gods words below are very clear, and easy to understand.

Roman's 9:6-8KJV
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

Read Romans 9:7&8 together:

Roman's 9:7-8KJV
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for

Verse 7: Abraham had the seed of his two children Ishmael and Isaac. But God's covenant promises was to the seed of Isaac, the second-born, and to his second-born Jacob/Israel and to the fullness of the Gentiles in Israel, through Jacob's son Joseph's second-born Ephraim.
Verse 8: Isaac (and Israel his offspring) was the child of the promise of God, Ishmael the firstborn, was Sarai's attempt of man-making God's promises to fulfilment by giving her slave Hagar to Abraham, to bear God's promised offspring

Roman's 9:6KJV
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Verse 6: Some of Israel are not of Israel, to which the promises to Israel is counted for.


Micah 2 (ESV)

12 I will surely assemble all of you, O Jacob; I will gather the remnant of Israel; I will set them together like sheep in a fold, like a flock in its pasture, a noisy multitude of men.

Galatians Chapter 3 does NOT show how a believer becomes an Israelite. It shows how a Gentile who believes into Jesus becomes eligible for the Promises given to Abraham. Abraham was not an Israelite. He was a Syrian Gentile.

There are NOT TWO ISRAEL's in Romans 9:6-8. Romans 9:6 reads;

"Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel"

This verse shows TWO PEOPLES, one of which was "OF Israel" but are now NOT Israel. These TWO PEOPLES are revealed in verse 8.
(i) Those who were born to Israel (Jacob) but then had another birth by the Holy Spirit and were transformed into the "children of God. (ii) Those who were born to Israel and did NOT believe, and so remain Israel - children of the flesh (not the Spirit)

Romans Chapter 9 to 11 answer the question that must arise when Paul establishes over 5 Chapters that ALL men are concluded under sin and death. Chapter 6 establishes a solution to the flesh of a believer. Chapter 7 establishes the status of the flesh of a man under Law. And Chapter 8 establishes the solution to men under Law - to be a believer and have the Spirit of God dwelling in you. Since Israel do NOT accept Christ, the solutions to the flesh under sin and under Law cannot apply to them. Added to this, they had a much better foundation than the Gentiles by God giving them the Covenants, the Oracles of God and by dwelling in their midst. So strickly speaking, if Israel have done all these terrible things, AND they refuse the solutions, WHAT HOPE IS THERE FOR THEM???

This in turn provokes another, and more serious problem - God's honor. God has PROMISED Israel the Land of Canaan by a Covenant and an oath made to Abraham, Issac and Jacob and their SEED. If God does not do something wonderful, Israel are doomed and God was unable to keep His Promise. So Paul sets forth (i) Who Israel are, (ii) Who of Israel are NOT Israel (anymore), and (iii) the legal and judicial foundation for God to have Mercy on Israel without them BELIEVING. The end result is NOT salvation like we Christians are saved, but salvation from the effects of the Law which drove them ut of Canaan. I is not a change in Nature like the Christian, but a RECOVERY OF THEIR ORIGINAL NATIONAL STATUS UNDER DAVID. The foundation for this RECOVERY is Christ, and because of Christ's Work, God may have mercy on who He likes (9:15).

We will disagree,the scripture is self explanatory,Israel the Church,children of the promised seed

Read It In Big Bold Red Below

Romans 9:8KJV
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

Ben you (Falsely) try to create the Remnant Jew being the (Exclusive) Israel seen, your wrong

All Christian's are Abraham's seed (All) both Jew and Greek

Galatians 3:26-30KJV
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

There is Jew and there is Gentile.

1. Ephraim are among the Gentiles
2. Ephraim are among the Jews

Which do you chose as being correct above, 1 or 2?

Ben were right back where we started pretty much?

My claim is Israel, children of the promised seed as seen in Roman's 9:8 below is the entire church, not just Jews, you suggest this represents just ethnic Jews?

Israel The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed.

Galatians 3:26-30KJV
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

There are (Two) Israel's seen below.

1. Ethnic Israel Of The Flesh

2. Israel The Church, Children Of The Promised Seed.

Gods word clearly states below, the children of the flesh (Ethnic Jews) they are not the children of God

Gods words below are very clear, and easy to understand.

Roman's 9:6-8KJV
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

Hi Truth, you: "My claim is Israel, children of the promised seed as seen in Roman's 9:8 below is the entire church, not just Jews, you suggest this represents just ethnic Jews?"

No I do not. What I'm saying is: Israel, children of the promised seed as seen in Roman's 9:8 is the entire church, not just Jews, but the grafted-in ones, among the Jews and Gentiles, ie. ALL of ISRAEL that IS ISRAEL (Judah AND Ephraim).

There is Jews and Gentiles.

1. Ephraim are Gentiles
2. Ephraim are Judah ( / Jews)

Of the above, which do you view as correct, 1 or 2?

After all the pulling and straining at scripture, it boils down to a question of whether God loves and cares for all His creation, or does God mostly care for Israel? If you only go by scripture, it tells us that God sees all humans as the same. If God loves and guides Israel, then God wants to guide and love all people the same.

Scripture often speaks of directing that scripture to Israel, but there is not one time it tells us "Israel only". In fact scripture goes out of its way, in verse after verse, to explain God means for it to be to anyone who accepts Him.

To make this clear to us, there are passages saying we are of Abraham's seed if we love Him. And YET people reject scripture based on it isn't directed to them!!!

I dont get your Ephraim deal

My bible speaks of a Remnant Jew in the New Testament in Rom 11, they will be grafted back in to the olive tree Jesus and become the Church

When the last Soul is written in the Lambs book of life, (All Israel Will Be Saved) the Church.

Your Ephraim this and thatus confusing, I dont track with it, smiles

God dosent have any person based on race (Jew) it's a false teaching, mainly seen in dispensationalism, Christian Zionism

2/3 of the Jews will die in Jerusalem in the future zech 13:8-9, that's judgement, not love

The vast majority of Jews in Judaiism hold the Rabbinical Talmud above scripture, they are into Occultism of the Kabbalah

God has one covenant people, Israel. If you are not born of Israel, and you love God, you are adopted into Israel's promises, and you and your posterity, who chose to love God, become Israel.


Exodus 12 (ESV)

37 And the people of Israel journeyed from Rameses to Succoth, about six hundred thousand men on foot, besides women and children. 38 A mixed multitude also went up with them, and very much livestock, both flocks and herds.


Ruth 1 (ESV)

16 But Ruth said, "Do not urge me to leave you or to return from following you. For where you go I will go, and where you lodge I will lodge. Your people shall be my people, and your God my God.


Hosea 1 (ESV)

4 And the Lord said to him, "Call his name Jezreel, for in just a little while I will punish the house of Jehu for the blood of Jezreel, and I will put an end to the kingdom of the house of Israel. 5 And on that day I will break the bow of Israel in the Valley of Jezreel." 6 She conceived again and bore a daughter. And the Lord said to him, "Call her name No Mercy, for I will no more have mercy on the house of Israel, to forgive them at all. 7 But I will have mercy on the house of Judah, and I will save them by the Lord their God. I will not save them by bow or by sword or by war or by horses or by horsemen." 8 When she had weaned No Mercy, she conceived and bore a son. 9 And the Lord said, "Call his name Not My People, for you are not my people, and I am not your God." 10 Yet the number of the children of Israel shall be like the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured or numbered. And in the place where it was said to them, "You are not my people," it shall be said to them, "Children of the living God."

John 11 (ESV)

47 So the chief priests and the Pharisees gathered the council and said, "What are we to do? For this man performs many signs. 48 If we let him go on like this, everyone will believe in him, and the Romans will come and take away both our place and our nation." 49 But one of them, Caiaphas, who was high priest that year, said to them, "You know nothing at all. 50 Nor do you understand that it is better for you that one man should die for the people, not that the whole nation should perish." 51 He did not say this of his own accord, but being high priest that year he prophesied that Jesus would die for the nation, 52 and not for the nation only, but also to gather into one the children of God who are scattered abroad. 53 So from that day on they made plans to put him to death. 54 Jesus therefore no longer walked openly among the Jews, but went from there to the region near the wilderness, to a town called Ephraim, and there he stayed with the disciples.


Romans 11 (ESV)

26 And in this way all Israel will be saved, as it is written, "The Deliverer will come from Zion, he will banish ungodliness from Jacob"; 27 "and this will be my covenant with them when I take away their sins."

Acts 1 (ESV)

6 So when they had come together, they asked him, "Lord, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?" 7 He said to them, "It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by his own authority. 8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth."


Revelation 21 (ESV)

9 ..."Come, I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb." 10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God, 12 It had a great, high wall, with twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and on the gates the names of the twelve tribes of the sons of Israel were inscribed— 13 on the east three gates, on the north three gates, on the south three gates, and on the west three gates. 14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the twelve names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. 24 By its light will the nations walk, and the kings of the earth will bring their glory into it, 25 and its gates will never be shut by day—and there will be no night there. 26 They will bring into it the glory and the honor of the nations. 27 But nothing unclean will ever enter it, nor anyone who does what is detestable or false, but only those who are written in the Lamb's book of life.

I agree, except I feel strongly that we are to keep our hearts and mind strictly away from judging Jews. That is the work of the Lord, not us, and the Lord has promised never to forsake them. We are allowed to judge that it is wrong for them to deny that Christ is the Messiah, but with the understanding that it is the work of the lord to blind their eyes to that. God can be trusted to treat that with justice.

Reuben, Gad, Asher, Naphtali, Manasseh, Simeon, Issachar, Zebulun, and Ephraim, collectively known as Ephraim, is ten of the twelve tribes of Israel, they are not Jews of Judah's tribes of Judah, Benjamin and Levi. Scattered among the Gentiles today, their names are also written on the gates of the new Jerusalem city, the Bride of Christ, no one goes in their unless their names are written in the book of life, of the Lamb that was slain, and the new Israel will be a light to the Gentile nations that are not of Israel's twelve tribes:

Revelation 21 (ESV)

9 ..."Come, I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb." 10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God, 12 It had a great, high wall, with twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and on the gates the names of the twelve tribes of the sons of Israel were inscribed— 13 on the east three gates, on the north three gates, on the south three gates, and on the west three gates. 14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the twelve names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. 24 By its light will the nations walk, and the kings of the earth will bring their glory into it, 25 and its gates will never be shut by day—and there will be no night there. 26 They will bring into it the glory and the honor of the nations. 27 But nothing unclean will ever enter it, nor anyone who does what is detestable or false, but only those who are written in the Lamb's book of life.

Jews as Judah had a partial hardening that came over them, so that all of Ephraim may be gathered into one Israel (Judah and Ephraim) at God's appointed time. Since 721BC Ephraim had a 2730 year captivity exile punishment sentence proclaimed over them by God, which punishment ended in 2009AC, from which time they are becoming aware of their Israel identity again, as scattered among the Gentile nations where they lost their identity. (Leviticus 26's sevenfold punishment, and Ezekiel 4's 390 days of sleep on one side for Ephraim, representing the number of years of captivity punishment : 7 x 390 years = 2730 years).


Romans 11 (Young's Literal Translation)

25 For I do not wish you to be ignorant, brethren, of this secret -- that ye may not be wise in your own conceits -- that hardness in part to Israel hath happened till the fulness of the nations may come in; 26 and so all Israel shall be saved, according as it hath been written, `There shall come forth out of Sion he who is delivering, and he shall turn away impiety from Jacob,


Genesis 48 (Young's Literal Translation)

19 And his father refuseth, and saith, `I have known, my son, I have known; he also becometh a people, and he also is great, and yet, his young brother is greater than he, and his seed is the fulness of the nations;'

Romans 11 (Young's Literal Translation)

25 For I do not wish you to be ignorant, brethren, of this secret -- that ye may not be wise in your own conceits -- that hardness in part to Israel hath happened till the fulness of the nations may come in; 26 and so all Israel shall be saved, according as it hath been written, `There shall come forth out of Sion he who is delivering, and he shall turn away impiety from Jacob,


Genesis 48 (Young's Literal Translation)

17 And Joseph seeth that his father setteth his right hand on the head of Ephraim, and it is wrong in his eyes, and he supporteth the hand of his father to turn it aside from off the head of Ephraim to the head of Manasseh; 18 and Joseph saith unto his father, `Not so, my father, for this [is] the first-born; set thy right hand on his head.'19 And his father refuseth, and saith, `I have known, my son, I have known; he also becometh a people, and he also is great, and yet, his young brother is greater than he, and his seed is the fulness of the nations;'

Big Smiles!

Gods words Judge (All) including Jews

Its Gods will that none should perish, but all should come to repentance, including Jews

Gods no respector of persons, including Jews

Modern Judaism is a wreck, in their Talmud & Kabbalah, Evil

No judgement, just the good ole truth!

Only the saved, those that have died in faith, of all the nations will walk in New Jerusalem.

Do you believe in a future Millennium, where Jesus Christ returns to earth, and takes a throne of David in Jerusalem, amongst moral humans?

Revelation 21:24KJV
24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.

"Do you believe in a future Millennium, where Jesus Christ returns to earth, and takes a throne of David in Jerusalem, amongst moral humans?"

After the great tribulation, the false Messiah, and the not-Ezekiel-40-temple:

Revelation 20 (ESV)

2 And he seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years, 3 and threw him into the pit, and shut it and sealed it over him, so that he might not deceive the nations any longer, until the thousand years were ended. After that he must be released for a little while. 4 Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5 The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years. 7 And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea.


Ezekiel 37 (ESV)

24 "My servant David shall be king over them, and they shall all have one shepherd. They shall walk in my rules and be careful to obey my statutes. 25 They shall dwell in the land that I gave to my servant Jacob, where your fathers lived. They and their children and their children's children shall dwell there forever, and David my servant shall be their prince forever. 26 I will make a covenant of peace with them. It shall be an everlasting covenant with them. And I will set them in their land and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in their midst forevermore. 27 My dwelling place shall be with them, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 28 Then the nations will know that I am the Lord who sanctifies Israel, when my sanctuary is in their midst forevermore."


Ezekiel 38 (ESV)

2 "Son of man, set your face toward Gog, of the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him 3 and say, Thus says the Lord God: Behold, I am against you, O Gog, chief prince of Meshech and Tubal. 4 And I will turn you about and put hooks into your jaws, and I will bring you out, and all your army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed in full armor, a great host, all of them with buckler and shield, wielding swords.