Poll: Do "One Taken/Other Left" Verses Refer To Secret Rapture or Second Coming?

A response in arrogance, my position and bible is right, your wrong

Mat 24:36 But of that day (what day= the coming of Jesus) and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
Mat 24:37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Noah's day is used to illustrate what it will be like. It will not be exactly the same because a world wide flood and the glory of Jesus's coming are not the same. but the point is that very few were prepared and most were lost as a result.

Mat 24:38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
Mat 24:39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Who got taken away by the flood......?? The unsaved. The unsaved will be taken away (killed) by the glory of Jesus.
When Noah entered the Ark, and the door was closed by God, Probation ended. Probation will end before the final flood comes. Probation will close before Jesus comes. We are in or out when it closes. Seven days before the flood probation ended.

Mat 24:40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Mat 24:41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Mat 24:42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

These verses are all in reference to the second coming. People don't know exactly which hour the Lord will come but some will be taken and some shall be left. Some shall be destroyed and some shall be saved.

Noah had to sit in the ark for seven days and ride the storm for many more but His faith endured and the ark kept him safe.

will your faith endure and is Jesus your ark in the storm? Or is it a road of peace and safety?

And who else was taken away by the flood? The people in the Ark.

It was they that entered the safety of the Ark before the flood came. Likewise in the sister story of Lot, it was Lot and his family that was taken by an angel to a place of safety while those left behind in the cities perished. The one taken is taken to or into a safe place while the one left suffers punishment and wrath.

Start with Matthew Henry's commentary on Exodus 23 and Adam Clarke's commentary on Jude 9 or read what John Calvin, Luther, Spurgeon and many, many others wrote. But, why not go directly to the Bible? For instance:

• Who was the "Angel of the Lord" in the burning bush? The God of the OT, Jesus appearing in the form of an Angel.

• Who was the "Angel of God" at the Red Sea Who went from before the Israelites and stood behind them as a cloud of thick darkness to the Egyptians but a light to Israel? Jesus, the God of the OT appearing in the form of an Angel.

• The same "Angel of the Lord" that let the Israelites in the wilderness and which they tempted in the wilderness was Jesus Christ (1 Corinthians 10:4 KJV), appearing in the OT in the form of an Angel.

• Who was the "Angel of the Lord" that appeared to Manoah and willingly accepted his worship (something ordinary angels refuse to accept per Revelation 19) and also told Manoah that His name was "secret", the same exact Hebrew word used in Isaiah 9:6 as the name "wonderful" for Jesus? Jesus, the God of the OT.

• Who was the "Captain of the armies of the Lord" that Joshua worshipped at Jericho, the same Captain of His angel army which fought against the devil and his angels? Jesus, appearing in the form of an Angel.

• Who was the "Angel of the Lord" that appeared to and fought with Jacob? Hosea 11 plainly says the Angel that Jacob had power over was God Himself - the God of the OT, Jesus...and Jacob himself said that he'd "seen God face to face and my life is preserved."

• Abraham saw 3 men come to him -- which we later find out were angels, two of which went to rescue Lot and the third Who was the God of the OT, Jesus, appearing in the form of an angel.

• Matthew 13 says Jesus will "send forth His angels" and Matthew 16 says "the Son of man shall come forth...with His angels" which both verses prove the angels belong to Jesus...yet Revelation 12 says "Michael and HIS angels fought with the dragon..." Jesus Christ is the "Archangel" because He is the "Ruler" of the angels.

• John 5:25 KJV says "the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God and live" but in 1 Thessalonians 4 Paul says the "voice of the Archangel" shall raise the dead. Can an ordinary angel's voice raise the dead? It's the Lord's shout (Jeremiah 25:30 KJV), it's the Lord's trumpet (Zechariah 9:14 KJV), and it's the Lord's voice, the voice of the Archangel Michael which will raise the dead.

• Daniel 9:26 KJV says "Messiah the prince" Jesus will come, but Daniel 12:1 KJV says, "Michael...the great prince which standeth for thy people..." Daniel 8:25 KJV says Jesus is the Prince of princes, which means Michael is either greater than Jesus Christ the Messiah or Michael IS the Messiah, right or wrong?

• The Angel of the Lord stood with Joshua the high priest and Satan stood to accusing him, "And the Lord said unto Satan, the Lord rebuke thee". Again, the Angel of the Lord rebuked Satan, the same Angel of the Lord which is Michael the Archangel which rebuked Satan for resisting the Lord concerning Moses in Jude.

• Even among the Jewish commentaries, Michael the Archangel is understood to be a manifestation of the Divine presence of God, as Rabbi Judah Hakkodesh states: "Where Michael is said to appear, the glory of the Divine Majesty is always to be understood." (Shemoth Rabba, Sec. 11, vol. 104, 3.)

So, when Jesus took the form of a man, He took the name "Jesus" upon Himself which means "God is Savior"...so why should it surprise anyone that prior to taking the form of a man, He took the form of an angel in the OT and took the name "MEE-CHI-El" which means "Who is as God"?

I'll tell you why: because of the fact that the lie so very often closely resembles the truth, when a certain church that knocks on doors began twisting this widely believed doctrine into the false doctrine that Jesus was just an ordinary angel and nothing more than a created being, lazy Christians preferred to just throw out the whole thing, rather than put forth the effort to understand where the line between truth and error lay.

Sorry. John says the dead "shall hear the voice of the Son of Man" and wake up, but in 1 Thessalonians, the voice that wakes the dead is "the voice of the Archangel".

It's the Lord's shout (Jeremiah 23:30 KJV), the Lord's trumpet (Zechariah 9:14 KJV), and the Lord's voice, the voice of the Archangel Michael Who is Almighty God Jesus, which wakes up the dead in Christ.

Michael isn't mentioned in any of those verses. You are using eisegesis to force the name Michael into that last one. The voice of the archangel (who he is is not mentioned) does not raise the dead and that voice is actually the angel sounding the trump. That is known as the voice of a trumpeter in scripture.

This is what happens. The angel sounds the 7th trump which is the voice of the archangel, that signals the second coming to begin and for the dead to be raised.

Sounds like the false doctrine of 7th Day Adventist (Ellen G. White) in (Soul Sleep)

Are You 7th Day Adventist?

Jesus has appeared and been described as "The Angel of The Lord" That doesn't make him Michael.

He has appeared as an angel (messenger) of God but he has never been Michael.
Michael is not God. He is a created spirit who has remained faithful to God.

Making Michael a christophany is basically saying (2+2=5) It's Heresy.

Perhaps they can claim Gabriel is Jesus to, and start a new doctrine on the trinity of Jesus

Michael being Jesus, is the false doctrine of (Ellen G. White) in 7th Day Adventism, add (Soul Sleep) to it also.

The foolish were virgins= pure and undefiled

They had oil and light and were waiting on Jesus.

Oh yeah
The heathens " always" have those components. So clear like you say.

yes
Michael is NOT Jesus.

Watchtower used to claim that Jesus is Michael
Maybe they still do

BEFORE THE FLOOD.
NOAH entered the ark ( a type of heaven) BEFORE the flood.

You completely skipped it.

Pssssst postrib rapture doctrine needs Jesus and lot DELIVERED/ RAPTURED AFTER the flood...AFTER Sodom burned.

But no
Jesus said BEFORE THE FLOOD " one taken / left."

Normal activities
Gods people removed
Judgement AFTER REMOVAL.

Impossible to reinvent that.

yea what about “ Jesus view “ rather than dismissing what he said let’s just consider

“Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:

Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.

And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. Behold, I have told you before.

Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭24:16-25, 29-31‬ ‭KJV‬‬



Where is the ore tribulation rapture ? Why is Jesus preparing them to endure the things he’s talking about ? Because there is no removal of the church during the tribulation they are being prepared to go through the tribulation and being told as soon as it’s over Jesus will return and gather them just before destroying everything

again look at marks version

“For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be earthquakes in divers places, and there shall be famines and troubles: these are the beginnings of sorrows.

But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten:

and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be published among all nations.

But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death. And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:

And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house: And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment.

And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter. For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.

And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.

And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not: For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.

But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things.

But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.

And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory. And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭13:8-16, 18-27‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I’m not sure where anyone ever came up with the different rapture and times but Jesus word is true if we want to understand his second coming , our gathering and the end of the world he explained it and the apostles offered revelation into it

what no one ever taught is that the church would not endure the tribulations of the world even those in the end will go through those terrible times and those who keep faith will be saved

as far as what he said about Noah and lot errr it’s plain

“And as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.

Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭17:26-30‬ ‭

look to the story of lot to understand God had instructed him to leave , he heartened and left, the moment he was clear total destruction came upon those cities that’s how it will be in the end for those left alive the moment Jesus takes them into the air destruction is coming

the tribulations are what leads up to that moment and the gospel is our warning from God

Maybe I just can't see it where you actually got honest and read " before the flood"

Jesus CHANGES THE SETTING AND TIME.
NOW HE IS ON THE RAPTURE.

You omit that over and over.
You cleverly omit the rapture.

Re read it honestly.
BEFORE THE FLOOD
READ IT.
read it again

It says WHEN Noah went into the ark.
It is the SETTING AND TIME Jesus is now using.
Lot is a prejudgement deliverence as is Noah.

You can not possibly change that.

To top it off ,the one taken/ left is in that "BEFORE THE FLOOD" DYNAMIC.
Then.... " watch and be ready"

But nah....i already told all of you that.
You are NOT going there or even look at it.

More one liners without scriptural support, a standard

5 virgins were saved, 5 virgins were unsaved, it's that simple

Virginity has absolutely nothing to do with accepting Jesus Christ as savior and his atonement on Calvary.

As the scripture clearly states, the 5 virgins were unsaved (I Know You Not)

(The 5 Unsaved Virgins)

Matthew 25:11-12KJV
11 Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.

"...with the voice of the archangel..." 1 Thess. 4:16 KJV
"...Michael the archangel..." Jude 9

Come again?

Nothing in 1 Thessalonians 4:16 even hints that (The Lord) is (The Archangel)

It clearly shows the hierarchy of Gods, as is seen in Matthew 13:39 the Angel's are the reapers,gathering the church, and the Archangel is their boss,and the Lord is over all.

1 Thessalonians 4:16KJV
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Matthew 13:39KJV
39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.

No Michael Isnt Jesus Christ, As False Prophetess Ellen G. White and 7th Day Adventis Teach,

When was this supposed divine revelation given to Ellen, in her claimed 2,000+ visions and dreams?

Why call it "secret Rapture/caught up". Its not secret 1st Thes 4:17. Man calls it a secret and escape AMEN to escape lol. Its written as I just posted and Christ 2nd coming is also written and will happen. When matters not to me. WHY worry get stuck on tomorrow when I was never promised it? Today I live for Him. Today I know expect Him. Today I am ready and watching

Any ignorant layman can throw around words like "false doctrine".....the intellectual distinguishes himself by his ability to offer Biblical arguments along with such bold criticism. Are able to explain why the soul doesn't "sleep the sleep of death" as David says in Psalm 13, or will you just stand on the sidelines shouting weak insults at those who have the courage to enter the arena of Biblical ideas?