predestination vs freewill
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Paul, like all of us, must learn as new Christians, how to walk according to the Spirit, rather than walking according to the flesh. Paul, in Romans 7 was recounting this process where he like all of us must learn to be led by the Spirit.
Remember, Paul spent some 17 years away from Jerusalem and the others, then returned and was eventually made an Apostle and sent out.
Now in the church that was at Antioch there were certain prophets and teachers: Barnabas, Simeon who was called Niger, Lucius of Cyrene, Manaen who had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul. As they ministered to the Lord and fasted, the Holy Spirit said, “Now separate to Me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them.” Then, having fasted and prayed, and laid hands on them, they sent them away. Acts 13:1-3
So you still don't believe Scriptures "That Matthias Replaced Judas As # 12"?:
Act 1:20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick LET ANOTHER TAKE.
Act 1:21 Wherefore of these men which have companied with us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us,
Act 1:22 Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.
Act 1:23 And they appointed TWO, Joseph called Barsabas, who was surnamed Justus, and Matthias.
Act 1:24 And they prayed, and said, Thou, Lord, which knowest the hearts of all men, shew whether of these two THOU Hast Chosen,
Act 1:25 That he may take part of this ministry and apostleship, from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place.
Act 1:26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and
he WAS NUMBERED With THE ELEVEN apostles.
Total TWELVE, Correct? NO "Paul HERE," no? Was THIS A MISTAKE of the ELEVEN?
Then WHY Would God Do This?:
Act 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Act 2:2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
Act 2:3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
Act 2:4 And they were ALL filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
God Makes NO mistakes, Correct?
Please Be Richly Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, and Edified!
God's Simple Will!
Act 1:20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick LET ANOTHER TAKE.
Act 1:21 Wherefore of these men which have companied with us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us,
Act 1:22 Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.
Act 1:23 And they appointed TWO, Joseph called Barsabas, who was surnamed Justus, and Matthias.
Act 1:24 And they prayed, and said, Thou, Lord, which knowest the hearts of all men, shew whether of these two THOU Hast Chosen,
Act 1:25 That he may take part of this ministry and apostleship, from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place.
Act 1:26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and
he WAS NUMBERED With THE ELEVEN apostles.
Total TWELVE, Correct? NO "Paul HERE," no? Was THIS A MISTAKE of the ELEVEN?
Then WHY Would God Do This?:
Act 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Act 2:2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
Act 2:3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
Act 2:4 And they were ALL filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
God Makes NO mistakes, Correct?
Please Be Richly Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, and Edified!
God's Simple Will!
I don't have a dog in this fight (so to speak) but it has caught my attention and maybe you've already covered this (and if so, sorry), so I hope you won't mind if I ask a question or two? If you're saying that Paul was not an apostle, then how would you understand these verses (I think there may even be more of them)?
[Rom 1:1 KJV]
1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called [to be] an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,
[Rom 11:13 KJV]
13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:
[1Co 1:1 KJV]
1 Paul, called [to be] an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes [our] brother,
[1Co 9:1-2 KJV]
1 Am I not an apostle? am I not free? have I not seen Jesus Christ our Lord? are not ye my work in the Lord?
2 If I be not an apostle unto others, yet doubtless I am to you: for the seal of mine apostleship are ye in the Lord.
[2Co 1:1 KJV]
1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timothy [our] brother, unto the church of God which is at Corinth, with all the saints which are in all Achaia:
[Rom 1:1 KJV]
1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called [to be] an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,
[Rom 11:13 KJV]
13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:
[1Co 1:1 KJV]
1 Paul, called [to be] an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes [our] brother,
[1Co 9:1-2 KJV]
1 Am I not an apostle? am I not free? have I not seen Jesus Christ our Lord? are not ye my work in the Lord?
2 If I be not an apostle unto others, yet doubtless I am to you: for the seal of mine apostleship are ye in the Lord.
[2Co 1:1 KJV]
1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timothy [our] brother, unto the church of God which is at Corinth, with all the saints which are in all Achaia:
I think you are missing the point of the text. God knows all that will come to faith in Christ Jesus. And those that do come to faith are predestined to be conformed to the image of Christ Jesus.
God, through creation or the gospel calls all men to Himself. Some reject the call others do not but all are called that is why man will have on excuse. Those that turn to God / Christ Jesus in faith are saved/justified and those that are justified will be glorified.
Remember God judges by the heart not by what we say. God is a loving God and if you worship the true God of creation i believe He will save you.
God, through creation or the gospel calls all men to Himself. Some reject the call others do not but all are called that is why man will have on excuse. Those that turn to God / Christ Jesus in faith are saved/justified and those that are justified will be glorified.
Remember God judges by the heart not by what we say. God is a loving God and if you worship the true God of creation i believe He will save you.
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Under God’s eternal plan, you Never will be conformed to the image of His Son unless you are called. So to be predestined to be conformed would mean that you would of necessity have to be called, and God foreknows that you will be called and conformed, unless you think you can be conformed to the image of Christ without being called and/or unless you have God choosing us and predestining us AFTER we are saved. But the Scripture never teaches that. If you claim it does, please provide scripture.
In fact, Romans 8:29-30 lists predestining BEFORE calling. So you are changing the order of the inspired text.
Why does God need to call us? Because it was His purpose that we be saved through the preaching of the cross.
In fact, Romans 8:29-30 lists predestining BEFORE calling. So you are changing the order of the inspired text.
Why does God need to call us? Because it was His purpose that we be saved through the preaching of the cross.
God foreknows who will believe therefore He knows who will be conformed to the image of His Son.
God does not have partial or imperfect foreknowledge, you know.
And the fact that we will be conformed to Christ’s image is because God willed it and purposed it.
God knows all who will believe and what He will do with them BEFORE they believe.
God does not have partial or imperfect foreknowledge, you know.
And the fact that we will be conformed to Christ’s image is because God willed it and purposed it.
God knows all who will believe and what He will do with them BEFORE they believe.
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Serious question…since God knew who will be saved before the foundation of the world, what makes you think and argue that He would not, could not, or did not predestine them before the foundation also?
Did He come up with that part later?
So God knew who would be saved but had no intention of conforming them to the image of His Son yet?
You do know what predestinate means, right?
Did He come up with that part later?
So God knew who would be saved but had no intention of conforming them to the image of His Son yet?
You do know what predestinate means, right?
For whatever it's worth:
[Jhn 6:36-40KJV]
36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
[Jhn 6:36-40KJV]
36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
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