Sabbath

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Grandpa

Senior Member
#3,421
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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#3,421
laymen said:
Oh bless you,

Grandpa! Its a sign of love not Justification. <<<<<<<I will highlight this time.
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Its a sign of love to show God how disgusting you are compared to His Holiness?

Is that how you show love to your wife? Show her how disgusting you are, as much as possible?

If so, its probably time to stop. You can tell her I said she's welcome, its the least a Christian could do.


Romans 3:19-22
19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
 
DavidTree

DavidTree

Banned
#3,422
Aug 2, 2021
7,317
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#3,422
laymen said:
Oh bless you,

Grandpa! Its a sign of love not Justification. <<<<<<<I will highlight this time.
Click to expand...
12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.

Uh, did you miss this.........

James said faith in God produces works - do you know what works??? i do

This is not works through the Law.
The Letter of the Law is death, it is a barren tree that no man, but One, could bear the fruits of Righteousness Pleasing to God.
Therefore God sent His Son to nail that Law to the Cross - It is Finished
And thus the Scripture says: You are estranged from Christ, you who desire to keep the law..........
 
DavidTree

DavidTree

Banned
#3,423
Aug 2, 2021
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#3,423
Grandpa said:
Wouldn't you assume that your understanding is lacking before you try to show Christians that the Lord Jesus failed in what He came to do and also mis-spoke or was blatantly wrong about anything?

Some peoples children...:ROFL:
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i am agreeing with you and laughing with you when you said - 'f ullfill'
i thought that was brilliant and funny - you did great
 
TMS

TMS

Senior Member
#3,424
Mar 21, 2015
3,945
1,268
113
Australia
#3,424
Did Jesus come to destroy the law?

Mat 5:17-20
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Till heaven and earth pass the law will not change.
 
G

Grandpa

Senior Member
#3,425
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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#3,425
DavidTree said:
There is only One Sabbath we must find Rest in. It is not Saturday and it is not Sunday and it is not any other day of the week.

All things have been entrusted to Me by My Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal Him.
Come to Me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me; for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.
For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.”
Matthew 11
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Hebrews 4:1-11
1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.

2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.

6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:

7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.

8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.

9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
 
DavidTree

DavidTree

Banned
#3,426
Aug 2, 2021
7,317
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#3,426
Grandpa said:
Hebrews 4:1-11
1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.

2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.

6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:

7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.

8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.

9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
Click to expand...
AMEN AMEN AMEN - i rejoice in My Savior who gives me His Rest - JESUS is the Sabbath Rest of God.
 
DavidTree

DavidTree

Banned
#3,427
Aug 2, 2021
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#3,427
TMS said:
Did Jesus come to destroy the law?

Mat 5:17-20
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Till heaven and earth pass the law will not change.
Click to expand...
That's right - Jesus fulfilled the law because there is no way you or anyone else can.

Leave the fulfilled letter of the law on the Cross, where it was fulfilled and put to death.

Lay hold of His Salvation that is RISEN in Newness of LIFE and of the SPIRIT - and not the letter of the law.
 
TMS

TMS

Senior Member
#3,428
Mar 21, 2015
3,945
1,268
113
Australia
#3,428
DavidTree said:
12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.

Uh, did you miss this.........

James said faith in God produces works - do you know what works??? i do

This is not works through the Law.
The Letter of the Law is death, it is a barren tree that no man, but One, could bear the fruits of Righteousness Pleasing to God.
Therefore God sent His Son to nail that Law to the Cross - It is Finished
And thus the Scripture says: You are estranged from Christ, you who desire to keep the law..........
Click to expand...
Righteousness by the law is death.
The person that keeps the laws or does works to be righteous is going to fail.

Faith in Jesus is the only way we attain righteousness.

So it is death if we try to obey it to save ourself.
But if we obey it because we want to follow the the character of Jesus and reflect the glorly of God, Is that wrong?
Paul said not to make void the law.

Can you understand the difference between keeping the to be saved (earning your own salvation). And keeping the law because you are saved (love Jesus and want to be like Him)
 
M

MalikB

Banned
#3,429
Aug 8, 2021
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#3,429
Grandpa said:
So which jots and tittles had to be removed from the Law in order for the physical covenant with its physical penalties to no longer apply?


Why is this so difficult for you? It should be extremely simple.

If one jot or one tittle was removed from the Law then what did Jesus do? Starts with an F... Ends with a ulfill...

Not at some distant second coming. When the Lord said He would fulfill it the first time.
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Like I said before... the word "fulfill" (which you still don't understand) is not in the same verse as the "jot or tittle" being removed.

In Mat 5:17 where it does use the correct word "fulfill", again means to make it whole by carrying out what it says.... It does not mean to remove it or replace it.

In verse 18 where it is speaking about the law actually going away, the same Greek word that was in verse 17 for "fulfill" is not used. The word that was used means "come to pass". This same word is used in Revelation 21:6 where most bible versions translate it as "It is done". In verse 1 (of Revelation 21) you will also find "heaven and earth disappearing" which you continue to ignore from Mathew 5:18 and Luke 16:17.
 
M

MalikB

Banned
#3,430
Aug 8, 2021
620
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#3,430
DavidTree said:
That's right - Jesus fulfilled the law because there is no way you or anyone else can.

Leave the fulfilled letter of the law on the Cross, where it was fulfilled and put to death.

Lay hold of His Salvation that is RISEN in Newness of LIFE and of the SPIRIT - and not the letter of the law.
Click to expand...

Let me leave this for you as well...


Like I said before... the word "fulfill" (which you still don't understand) is not in the same verse as the "jot or tittle" being removed.

In Mat 5:17 where it does use the correct word "fulfill", again means to make it whole by carrying out what it says.... It does not mean to remove it or replace it.

In verse 18 where it is speaking about the law actually going away, the same Greek word that was in verse 17 for "fulfill" is not used. The word that was used means "come to pass". This same word is used in Revelation 21:6 where most bible versions translate it as "It is done". In verse 1 (of Revelation 21) you will also find "heaven and earth disappearing" which you continue to ignore from Mathew 5:18 and Luke 16:17.
 
M

MalikB

Banned
#3,431
Aug 8, 2021
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#3,431
TMS said:
Righteousness by the law is death.
The person that keeps the laws or does works to be righteous is going to fail.

Faith in Jesus is the only way we attain righteousness.

So it is death if we try to obey it to save ourself.
But if we obey it because we want to follow the the character of Jesus and reflect the glorly of God, Is that wrong?
Paul said not to make void the law.

Can you understand the difference between keeping the to be saved (earning your own salvation). And keeping the law because you are saved (love Jesus and want to be like Him)
Click to expand...
Yes... Why we are doing what we do makes all the difference. The spirit of the law is the reason we follow it. Paul was differentiating following the law out of faith and love as opposed to doing it for salvation.

He wasn't saying the law no longer applies and we don't have to follow it (can sin), he was saying that following it in order to gain something holds no value. Those people are missing the spiritual component needed to make the law complete.
 
DavidTree

DavidTree

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#3,432
MalikB said:
Yes... Why we are doing what we do makes all the difference. The spirit of the law is the reason we follow it. Paul was differentiating following the law out of faith and love as opposed to doing it for salvation.

He wasn't saying the law no longer applies and we don't have to follow it (can sin), he was saying that following it in order to gain something holds no value. Those people are missing the spiritual component needed to make the law complete.
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Nope. The spirit of the law is why we follow Christ and NOT the letter of the law which brings death.

Get it Right and you are on the path to Salvation.

Hold unto that which God says, 'you can't handle it, you will get burned if you try.'
Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God.
Therefore no one will be justified in His sight by works of the law. For the law merely brings awareness of sin.
 
M

MalikB

Banned
#3,433
Aug 8, 2021
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#3,433
DavidTree said:
Nope. The spirit of the law is why we follow Christ and NOT the letter of the law which brings death.

Get it Right and you are on the path to Salvation.

Hold unto that which God says, 'you can't handle it, you will get burned if you try.'
Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God.
Therefore no one will be justified in His sight by works of the law. For the law merely brings awareness of sin.
Click to expand...
I did not say anyone was justified by works of the law alone. Paul was speaking to people that were trying to follow the law in order to gain justification, not people who's works were a result of their faith.... Big difference.
 
DavidTree

DavidTree

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#3,434
MalikB said:
I did not say anyone was justified by works of the law alone. Paul was speaking to people that were trying to follow the law in order to gain justification, not people who's works were a result of their faith.... Big difference.
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You have this part right = "Paul was speaking to people that were trying to follow the law in order to gain justification"

Faith in Christ results in His working in you and through you by Faith in Him - No death by letter of the law added.

this is called doing the 'twister' friend. Go tango with the law and try and add Christ to it - you will get burned.
 
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MalikB

Banned
#3,435
Aug 8, 2021
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#3,435
DavidTree said:
You have this part right = "Paul was speaking to people that were trying to follow the law in order to gain justification"

Faith in Christ results in His working in you and through you by Faith in Him - No death by letter of the law added.

this is called doing the 'twister' friend. Go tango with the law and try and add Christ to it - you will get burned.
Click to expand...
Actually its much more of a "twister" to avoid all of the verses that say the law still applies and how our actions effect our rewards and penalties after the death of the body.
 
DavidTree

DavidTree

Banned
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#3,436
MalikB said:
Actually its much more of a "twister" to avoid all of the verses that say the law still applies and how our actions effect our rewards and penalties after the death of the body.
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Christ before me
the Holy Spirit with me
the law behind Me
Amen
 
M

MalikB

Banned
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#3,437
DavidTree said:
Christ before me
the Holy Spirit with me
the law behind Me
Amen
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The law should be "behind us"... having our backs in case we loose track of how we should be living...

...and ultimately representing our faith.
 
DavidTree

DavidTree

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#3,438
MalikB said:
The law should be "behind us"... having our backs in case we loose track of how we should be living...

...and ultimately representing our faith.
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Does that give you comfort and hope?
 
DavidTree

DavidTree

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#3,440
MalikB said:
It's not about me or how I feel... its always been about Truth and going the right thing.
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The Right thing is Jesus Christ and Him alone - His Grace is sufficient for me.

The Wrong thing is = For if you are trying to make yourselves right with God by keeping the law, you have been cut off from Christ! You have fallen away from God’s grace. Galatians 5:4
Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. Therefore no one will be justified in His sight by works of the law. For the law merely brings awareness of sin. Romans 3: 19-20

The Right thing is = But now, apart from the law, the righteousness of God has been revealed, as attested by the Law and the Prophets. And this righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no distinction, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.
Romans 3: 21 -24
 
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