Does God choose your spouse or do you with God's guidance?

ANE anthropology is definitely different than today...and we tend to think of their current practices as restrictive.

But obviously Leah was veiled and likely Jacob a bit tipsy from the wedding party.
But the next morning would have been way too late to do anything about it. At the wedding party the night before...that would have been the time.
And where was Rachel during all of this? Jacob's personal attendants? Obviously they weren't exactly where they should have been.... obviously didn't say anything to Jacob until it was too late.
Jacob knew better but didn't do better.

good question ....where was Rachel?
If it was me and my intended had got married to my sister I am not sure if I would have then married him as well!

or I would have had a talk with them and got them to do an annulment since they married under false pretences. Unfortunately Jacobs twin brother Esau was already married...Rachel could have matchmaked him with Leah...

If you want to believe that women are the source of all evil be my guest...

I don't...and I explained how they aren't. You can choose to believe or not. But what I explained is most certainly plausible for an English reader.
If you read Hebrew then you would know. And I don't have the patience or wherewithal to be a Hebrew instructor. So guess what?

Its in the metaphoric language of Hebrew... Adam was right there with her the whole time. She led the actions but he wanted it too. And he was going to watch her to see if she died first before he ate.

A lot of nuances don't translate well when dealing with metaphoric languages and English often has nothing equivalent...it's the poorest receptor language of the scriptures.

You make it sound so secret and esoteric. I looked up a website that promotes the idea.

The idea, in this interpretation, is that 'with her' means they were together.

Genesis 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

This doesn't look like anything that is secret in the Hebrew and cannot come through in translation. IF we assume that he was with her when she ate, maybe he was letting her try it first. But if he was off tending the garden while she was talking to the serpent, she ate, and then she was with him and then went and found him and was with him and gave him a bite, then it doesn' t apply.

This is speculation, and I don't consider not wanting women to be the source of evil as reason to think I must accept this interpretation, nor do I think seeing this interpretation necessitates seeing women as the source of evil. Traditional Christian interpretation has the Devil falling into sin before Eve, anyway.

good question ....where was Rachel?
If it was me and my intended had got married to my sister I am not sure if I would have then married him as well!

or I would have had a talk with them and got them to do an annulment since they married under false pretences. Unfortunately Jacobs twin brother Esau was already married...Rachel could have matchmaked him with Leah...

Esau's wives really annoyed Isaac and Rebecca.

And yeah...if you were Rebecca and your sister is about to marry your husband to be...
Wouldn't that sibling rivalry come out like only a family feud could? There would be some hair pulling and claw scratching like there was no tomorrow.

And an annulment wouldn't be possible...her hymen had been broken. Jacob would have had to pay for her (the bride price) regardless of gaining the wife or not.
Marriages were regularly consummated during the wedding party. The groom would toss a bloody rag at the best man standing at the door to show everyone that everything is fine. For the issue of not marrying a true virgin. But he is also supposed to guard the room and make sure that the woman who enters is the intended bride too. (Obviously he didn't do right)

Esau's wives really annoyed Isaac and Rebecca.

And yeah...if you were Rebecca and your sister is about to marry your husband to be...
Wouldn't that sibling rivalry come out like only a family feud could? There would be some hair pulling and claw scratching like there was no tomorrow.

And an annulment wouldn't be possible...her hymen had been broken. Jacob would have had to pay for her (the bride price) regardless of gaining the wife or not.
Marriages were regularly consummated during the wedding party. The groom would toss a bloody rag at the best man standing at the door to show everyone that everything is fine. For the issue of not marrying a true virgin. But he is also supposed to guard the room and make sure that the woman who enters is the intended bride too. (Obviously he didn't do right)

The sibling fights came later, when they argued who would get to have him at night. 😉
And he was so complacent about it. Like, "oh? I'm with you tonight cause you traded your sis a pomegranate? *shrug* Ok."

You make it sound so secret and esoteric. I looked up a website that promotes the idea.

The idea, in this interpretation, is that 'with her' means they were together.

Genesis 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

This doesn't look like anything that is secret in the Hebrew and cannot come through in translation. IF we assume that he was with her when she ate, maybe he was letting her try it first. But if he was off tending the garden while she was talking to the serpent, she ate, and then she was with him and then went and found him and was with him and gave him a bite, then it doesn' t apply.

This is speculation, and I don't consider not wanting women to be the source of evil as reason to think I must accept this interpretation, nor do I think seeing this interpretation necessitates seeing women as the source of evil. Traditional Christian interpretation has the Devil falling into sin before Eve, anyway.

thats abit gross who does that now

It was rachel not rebecca. Rebecca was pretty much kidnapped to be Isaacs wife. They just took her and she went with a whole bunch of jewellery and she didnt go back home.

So I think we established that its actually the mum or dad who chooses the spouse for their son or daughter not God and not the son and daughter. They can say yes or not but its really the parents who want them married off and do the whole matchmking.

eg Ruth was put up to marry Boaz by Naomi who wanted grandchildren.

didnt they just all sleep together in one bed. Jacob would have been in the middle.

didnt they just all sleep together in one bed. Jacob would have been in the middle.

didnt they just all sleep together in one bed. Jacob would have been in the middle.

So I think we established that its actually the mum or dad who chooses the spouse for their son or daughter not God and not the son and daughter. They can say yes or not but its really the parents who want them married off and do the whole matchmking.

eg Ruth was put up to marry Boaz by Naomi who wanted grandchildren.

Nope. I'm pretty sure in that culture, in that time, each woman had her own, private tent.
They didn't share a bed.

Even today those that engage in polygamy have separate rooms or, if they're rich enough, separate houses for their multiple wives.
They don't all share the same bed.

And now I'm going to go scrub my mind.
Ew, ew, ew!

No. Rebecca wasn't kidnapped , she agreed to go. In fact, her father and brother wanted her to stay 10 days and when Eliezer argued with them, they said they'd bring Rebecca out and ask her what she wanted to do. She came out and said she would go. Genesis 24:58

She probably recognized a good thing when she saw it. A wealthy man wanting to marry her? Who wouldn't accept such an offer in that time era and culture? She'd be set for life!

So I think we established that its actually the mum or dad who chooses the spouse for their son or daughter not God and not the son and daughter. They can say yes or not but its really the parents who want them married off and do the whole matchmking.

eg Ruth was put up to marry Boaz by Naomi who wanted grandchildren.

Yes. Naomi was Jewish but in reality Ruth was not. Naomi needed a kinsman redeemer. Ruth couldn't qualify for one without Naomi.