Can homisexuals be saved?

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AndrewMorgan

Active member
Jul 10, 2022
375
81
28
#81
mark my words:

as hardcore as Anderson is towards homosexuals, watch what happens to his own sons. there's a couple already that look like they prefer dolls over sports. wonder what Anderson will do when they finally come out of the closet? 10 years from now, homosexuals will be so prominent Anderson won't be able to stop it if it does happen.

Many have asked Anderson "What if one of your children turn out gay?" He replied that it'll never because he's brought them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord. It does
You seem to be of the wrong impression that Sodom's only sin was homosexuality, but it wasn't.

For example, the Lord himself said in relation to Sodom:

Ezekiel chapter 16

[49] Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.
[50] And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good.

Granted, the "committed abomination before me" part most likely included the sin of homosexuality, but, even then, it came on the heels of such sins as pride and haughtiness. Furthermore, it seems rather obvious that not everyone who was destroyed in Sodom was a homosexual.

For example, we read the following about Sodom some time before their destruction:

Genesis chapter 13

[12] Abram dwelled in the land of Canaan, and Lot dwelled in the cities of the plain, and pitched his tent toward Sodom.
[13] But the men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before the LORD exceedingly.

God acknowledged that the men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before him exceedingly before Lot ever moved there, but there were also definitely WOMEN in Sodom and, in all likelihood, children in Sodom as well.

Prior to Sodom's destruction, four kings made war against the kings of Sodom and Gomorrah (Gen. 14:1-2).

Here's what eventually happened:

Genesis chapter 14

[11] And they took all the goods of Sodom and Gomorrah, and all their victuals, and went their way.
[12] And they took Lot, Abram's brother's son, who dwelt in Sodom, and his goods, and departed.
[13] And there came one that had escaped, and told Abram the Hebrew; for he dwelt in the plain of Mamre the Amorite, brother of Eschol, and brother of Aner: and these were confederate with Abram.
[14] And when Abram heard that his brother was taken captive, he armed his trained servants, born in his own house, three hundred and eighteen, and pursued them unto Dan.
[15] And he divided himself against them, he and his servants, by night, and smote them, and pursued them unto Hobah, which is on the left hand of Damascus.
[16] And he brought back all the goods, and also brought again his brother Lot, and his goods, and the women also, and the people.
[17] And the king of Sodom went out to meet him after his return from the slaughter of Chedorlaomer, and of the kings that were with him, at the valley of Shaveh, which is the king's dale.
[18] And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the most high God.
[19] And he blessed him, and said, Blessed be Abram of the most high God, possessor of heaven and earth:
[20] And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And he gave him tithes of all.
[21] And the king of Sodom said unto Abram, Give me the persons, and take the goods to thyself.
[22] And Abram said to the king of Sodom, I have lift up mine hand unto the LORD, the most high God, the possessor of heaven and earth,
[23] That I will not take from a thread even to a shoelatchet, and that I will not take any thing that is thine, lest thou shouldest say, I have made Abram rich:
[24] Save only that which the young men have eaten, and the portion of the men which went with me, Aner, Eshcol, and Mamre; let them take their portion.

Abram/Abraham returned "the persons" to the king of Sodom, and these "persons" include "the women also".

Were these "women" homosexuals?

They were apparently among those who were ultimately destroyed in Sodom's overthrow.

And what about Lot's sons-in-law?

Were they homosexuals?

Picking up where your "quote" ended, we read:

Genesis chapter 19

[12] And the men said unto Lot, Hast thou here any besides? son in law, and thy sons, and thy daughters, and whatsoever thou hast in the city, bring them out of this place:
[13] For we will destroy this place, because the cry of them is waxen great before the face of the LORD; and the LORD hath sent us to destroy it.
[14] And Lot went out, and spake unto his sons in law, which married his daughters, and said, Up, get you out of this place; for the LORD will destroy this city. But he seemed as one that mocked unto his sons in law.

Again, not everyone in Sodom was a homosexual, and God couldn't find even 10 righteous among them or else he wouldn't have destroyed the city (Gen. 18:32).

Anyhow, Steven Anderson is a HATE-FILLED HERETIC...and you're apparently one of his disciples.

I'd repent of that if I were you.
appear, 'though, that he's had trouble with a few of his sons, apparently involving a sexual element. I don't know the details, but I don't what effect this is having on him.
As for me being one of his disciples, that's utterly wrong. Just because I've seem some of his sermons, it doesn't mean I agree with him. I'll "repent" of what I see fit - NOT of something of which I'm not guilty.
 
Jun 20, 2022
6,460
1,330
113
#82
Many have asked Anderson "What if one of your children turn out gay?" He replied that it'll never because he's brought them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord. It does appear, 'though, that he's had trouble with a few of his sons, apparently involving a sexual element. I don't know the details, but I don't what effect this is having on him.
he has no say whatsoever how any person, let alone his own children will turn out. they will make their own choices and the more he hammers them the more they will rebel. he's as bright as a burnt out lightbulb.
 

Live4Him3

Jesus is Lord
May 19, 2022
1,383
639
113
#83
As for me being one of his disciples, that's utterly wrong. Just because I've seem some of his sermons, it doesn't mean I agree with him. I'll "repent" of what I see fit - NOT of something of which I'm not guilty.
My comments weren't addressed to you, so I'm not sure why you're defending yourself against something that you weren't even accused of.
 

AndrewMorgan

Active member
Jul 10, 2022
375
81
28
#84
My comments weren't addressed to you, so I'm not sure why you're defending yourself against something that you weren't even accused of.

I simply thought they were. The mistake may well have been mine. Some of my posts have been sent to the wrong place or the wrong person.
I try to follow the "rules", but evidently I sometimes make mistakes.
 
Sep 13, 2022
90
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#87
I've come across differing views on this and would like to see others' biblical evidence one way or another, if any would like to comment.
Go to search and look for the thread "What does God's word have to say about homosexuality" and your question will be answered by scripture.
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,396
1,204
113
#90
I Corinthians chapter 6

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.
11 Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

P.S.

I've personally been involved in the conversions of two former lesbians, and I personally know former homosexuals who are now Christians.

I am afraid that you are misinterpreting this scripture, by not recognising what "the kingdom of God" is. It is one of the names of Christ's visible church. There are no degrees of sin. Looking upon another person with lust on your mind is as bad a sin as those sins that these verses have reference to. There are many that have been redeemed from their sins by Christ's death on the cross, that the visible church will not accept as members.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
56,787
26,641
113
#91
There are no degrees of sin.
Jesus answered, “You would have no authority over Me if it were not given to you
from above. Therefore the one who handed Me over to you is guilty of greater sin.”
 

montana123

Well-known member
Oct 9, 2021
795
273
63
#93
I've come across differing views on this and would like to see others' biblical evidence one way or another, if any would like to comment.
Lev 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Lev 18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

Some people will say but this is the Old Testament but this is a moral law not a physical law and we do not go by the physical laws but we always have to obey the moral laws.

Which Paul said the law is spiritual, holy, just, and good, which are the moral laws, laws of love, which the 10 commandments are moral laws which they cover love God and love people, so the 10 commandments are spiritual laws.

Gen 18:1 And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;
Gen 18:2 And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground.

Gen 18:20 And the LORD said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous;
Gen 18:21 I will go down now, and see whether they have done altogether according to the cry of it, which is come unto me; and if not, I will know.
Gen 18:22 And the men turned their faces from thence, and went toward Sodom: but Abraham stood yet before the LORD.
Gen 18:33 And the LORD went his way, as soon as he had left communing with Abraham: and Abraham returned unto his place.

God appeared in flesh with two of His angels in flesh and talked to Abraham.

The two men went to Sodom to test the city to see if there was any righteous there.

Gen 19:3 And he pressed upon them greatly; and they turned in unto him, and entered into his house; and he made them a feast, and did bake unleavened bread, and they did eat.
Gen 19:4 But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:
Gen 19:5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.
Gen 19:6 And Lot went out at the door unto them, and shut the door after him,
Gen 19:7 And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly.
Gen 19:8 Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.
Gen 19:9 And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door.
Gen 19:10 But the men put forth their hand, and pulled Lot into the house to them, and shut to the door.
Gen 19:11 And they smote the men that were at the door of the house with blindness, both small and great: so that they wearied themselves to find the door.
Gen 19:16 And while he lingered, the men laid hold upon his hand, and upon the hand of his wife, and upon the hand of his two daughters; the LORD being merciful unto him: and they brought him forth, and set him without the city.

The two angels got to Sodom and Lot let them stay at his house.

The men of the city surrounded the house and said bring out those men that we may know them which means they wanted to have sex with them which is testified by Lot offering his two daughters to the men and said leave these men alone.

The men pressed on the door because they wanted to have sex with the men and that was the deciding factor that there were none righteous in the city for the all the men were at Lot's house for it says young and old and from all quarters of the city and not one person spoke up and said men let us not do this wicked deed but they were all supporting the act of having sex with the men.

That is when the two angels took Lot, and his wife, and his daughters, and led them out of the city and destroyed Sodom.

Jud 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Which God warns us not to do the same wickedness of Sodom and Gomorrah.

It was homosexuality that was the deciding factor to overthrow the cities and the two angels tested the city to see if there were any righteous by the way they treated the two men which they wanted to have sex with them all supporting it.

Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
Rom 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
Rom 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
Rom 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
Rom 1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
Rom 1:31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
Rom 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

People who do not like to retain God in their knowledge after a while God does not work in their life to cause them to come to the truth but they only go by the flesh which in the flesh dwells no good thing.

This states that homosexuality is wrong and the more people that do not believe in God the more the rise of homosexuality.

Homosexuality is an immoral act for it goes against the way God created the natural world to operate.

The homosexuals go against the physical world as well as the spiritual world.

They believe science when it comes to not believing in a God but then ignore biology concerning a man and a woman.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
11,873
6,392
113
#94
Lev 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Lev 18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

Some people will say but this is the Old Testament but this is a moral law not a physical law and we do not go by the physical laws but we always have to obey the moral laws.

Which Paul said the law is spiritual, holy, just, and good, which are the moral laws, laws of love, which the 10 commandments are moral laws which they cover love God and love people, so the 10 commandments are spiritual laws.

Gen 18:1 And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;
Gen 18:2 And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground.

Gen 18:20 And the LORD said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous;
Gen 18:21 I will go down now, and see whether they have done altogether according to the cry of it, which is come unto me; and if not, I will know.
Gen 18:22 And the men turned their faces from thence, and went toward Sodom: but Abraham stood yet before the LORD.
Gen 18:33 And the LORD went his way, as soon as he had left communing with Abraham: and Abraham returned unto his place.

God appeared in flesh with two of His angels in flesh and talked to Abraham.

The two men went to Sodom to test the city to see if there was any righteous there.

Gen 19:3 And he pressed upon them greatly; and they turned in unto him, and entered into his house; and he made them a feast, and did bake unleavened bread, and they did eat.
Gen 19:4 But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:
Gen 19:5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.
Gen 19:6 And Lot went out at the door unto them, and shut the door after him,
Gen 19:7 And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly.
Gen 19:8 Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.
Gen 19:9 And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door.
Gen 19:10 But the men put forth their hand, and pulled Lot into the house to them, and shut to the door.
Gen 19:11 And they smote the men that were at the door of the house with blindness, both small and great: so that they wearied themselves to find the door.
Gen 19:16 And while he lingered, the men laid hold upon his hand, and upon the hand of his wife, and upon the hand of his two daughters; the LORD being merciful unto him: and they brought him forth, and set him without the city.

The two angels got to Sodom and Lot let them stay at his house.

The men of the city surrounded the house and said bring out those men that we may know them which means they wanted to have sex with them which is testified by Lot offering his two daughters to the men and said leave these men alone.

The men pressed on the door because they wanted to have sex with the men and that was the deciding factor that there were none righteous in the city for the all the men were at Lot's house for it says young and old and from all quarters of the city and not one person spoke up and said men let us not do this wicked deed but they were all supporting the act of having sex with the men.

That is when the two angels took Lot, and his wife, and his daughters, and led them out of the city and destroyed Sodom.

Jud 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Which God warns us not to do the same wickedness of Sodom and Gomorrah.

It was homosexuality that was the deciding factor to overthrow the cities and the two angels tested the city to see if there were any righteous by the way they treated the two men which they wanted to have sex with them all supporting it.

Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
Rom 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
Rom 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
Rom 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
Rom 1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
Rom 1:31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
Rom 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

People who do not like to retain God in their knowledge after a while God does not work in their life to cause them to come to the truth but they only go by the flesh which in the flesh dwells no good thing.

This states that homosexuality is wrong and the more people that do not believe in God the more the rise of homosexuality.

Homosexuality is an immoral act for it goes against the way God created the natural world to operate.

The homosexuals go against the physical world as well as the spiritual world.

They believe science when it comes to not believing in a God but then ignore biology concerning a man and a woman.

as the country { america} and the world believe less in God, the more the slide to debauchery goes.
 

Franc254

Active member
Oct 7, 2022
167
36
28
#95
I'm happy that you see my point, so let me expound upon it a bit.

Romans chapter 1

[20] For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
[21] Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
[22] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
[23] And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
[24] Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
[25] Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
[26] For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
[27] And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

For what cause?

Well, just read the verse IN CONTEXT.

Paul was talking about those who "were without excuse" or those "who knew God", and then "became vain in their imaginations" or those who "changed the truth of God into a lie".

Again, do you HONESTLY believe that this describes all homosexuals?

Of course, it doesn't.

Context is everything.

Steven Anderson is a hate-filled heretic.


Read that chapter again
 

AndrewMorgan

Active member
Jul 10, 2022
375
81
28
#96
I am afraid that you are misinterpreting this scripture, by not recognising what "the kingdom of God" is. It is one of the names of Christ's visible church. There are no degrees of sin. Looking upon another person with lust on your mind is as bad a sin as those sins that these verses have reference to. There are many that have been redeemed from their sins by Christ's death on the cross, that the visible church will not accept as members.

You say "There are no degrees of sin. Looking upon another...is as bad a sin...". I find that baffling. Is telling a "white lie" as bad as mass murder? If that's the case, why is Job called "a righteous man" and Judas Iscatiot called "the Son of Perdition"?
I see nothing in the Bible to support this oft-stated view.
 

AndrewMorgan

Active member
Jul 10, 2022
375
81
28
#97
Go to search and look for the thread "What does God's word have to say about homosexuality" and your question will be answered by scripture.

I've searched as you suggested and have been answered that my question was too long. I therefore searched using different words and got results which didn't answer the question - biblically or otherwise.
I'm therefore repeating the question, hoping I'll get biblically-based answers.
Can homosexuals be saved?
 

AndrewMorgan

Active member
Jul 10, 2022
375
81
28
#99

The issue is:- Is it ever too late in this life to be saved?
Consider Rom1 - Paul talks of certain people going so far that God gives them (up/ over) to a reprobate mind and becoming open to vile affections - men lusting after men; women lusting after women.
Some consider this to mean that their chance is over - God has given them up for good. I'm not sure whether this is the case, by this chapter alone.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,782
2,952
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I don't know about others, but I was dead in my sins before God saved me! I was wicked, a drunk, and a very self centered person. I was basically abandoned by my parents, when I was 3, and my younger brother was born with a birth defect. I always accepted that they thought he might die of water on the brain, but after cutting his skull open from ear to ear, he didn't have it at all. He either developed it in utero, which is what the doctors told my mom in the 1950s, blaming her for getting sick with the flu in her third month, although she protested she hadn't been sick for one day in her entire pregnancy. He likely had one of 10 gene defects which caused it. At any rate he didn't die, but he had no falling reflex, and he was clumsy. He used to fall, and required stitches after every fall. A lot of attention every day. Add a mother, taking car of a bleeding toddlers is more important than giving some attention to a lonely 4 year old. And later, the abuse got worse!

I don't believe I was abandoned, but certainly I was neglected emotionally. My brother was overprotected, & grew up to be a bitter, angry person. My father wouldn't let him go, my mom berated him for everything. He was spoiled & lazy. I just saw him this week, and since getting out in his own (our mom is in long term care!) he has changed into a kind, caring, normal person. At 65! So he was damaged, too!

When I reached my teens, my parents were so controlling. I ran away from home, for good at 17! I did a lot of bad things. Then a revival started among the hippies where I lived! The power of God was amazing. Many people were called to ministry & the mission field, Then, God miraculously saved me. I changed instantly, by the power of the Holy Spirit! I never had another drop of alcohol-since May 1980! God did that, I had tried many times & failed.

I was joyously saved, but I did have a lot of inner conflicts & depression. As I read through the Bible yearly, God ministered to me! For 30 years! I was very angry! God showed me anger was a sin in my second year as a Christian. In the sin list In Galatians 5:19-21, "fits of anger" was there with drunkenness and sexual immorality are both on that list. In law, a list like that means all the items are equal! My anger, was as bad as sexual immorality, which includes homosexuality. So although Paul starts Roman's 1 with a tirade about how bad homosexuality is, in Galatians, he makes the case that those sins are equal. Just to clear up the poor theology that homosexuality is the biggest sin. In fact, blaspheming God is much worse.

Lots of people saying a bad childhood resulted in them turning to homosexuality. I'm not saying that is wrong. Certainly neglect and abuse hurt me! But the root of sin, is that we are born sinners. If not homosexuality, then drunkedness or idolatry or anger is the result of Genesis 3, the fall! We are not born beautiful and perfectly innocent. Even as babies, before we learn about sin, a baby is still a sinner, by inheritance.

And what is the cure for sin? Jesus, of course! We have a man in our church who seems flamboyantly gay. But he was married to a beautiful woman, who died last year of Rheumatoid Lung Disease, for over 30 years. Joe repented of his sins, avoided temptation and changed his life, with the Holy Spirit. He's a sinner, saved by grace!

I'm glad I wasn't veering in that direction. But I was still a sinner, too! God ONLY saves sinners. Because there is no one righteous, no, not one! (Roman's 3:10) we are saved by grace, and that includes homosexuals, adulterers, prostitutes and every other sexual immorality! Every type of sin!

"As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2 in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this worldand of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient." Ephesians 2:1-2

"But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved" Eph 2:4-5

"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do." Eph 2:8-10

So, yes, a homosexual can repent and become a Christian, just like the rest of us!!