Former pentecostal

Your mind is made up. It is not my job to make you see . Many far more gifted than you or I see very well.

When I was a Bible Quizzer, I memorized all those books except Ephesians, and I have read those books I do not know how many times. I never read any scripture that says a prophecy has to be about previously known information or something God already spoke to the listener for it to be genuine. If you have a verse reference I would be interested in seeing it. I am not talking about modern believers getting new doctrine in a prophecy btw.

This sort of thing is important. Those of us who teach the word should be careful not to just repeat stuff other preachers have said if it hasn't been revealed by God. Our doctrine..not just prophecies... needs to line up with scripture, including our doctrines about prophecy.

Someone who believes this might reject a genuine word he gets if he believes this teaching because part of the prophecy was something he did not know already.

But where does the Bible teach this, and why are there so many examples in scripture that contradict this doctrine?

you jumped CS1 over a response that ultimately dealt with a person, who was once Saved and full of the Holy Spirit but now believes God has left them.

that person was already addressed they do not need a Prophet because a Prophet would confirm to that person that God had NEVER left them. that they should stop thinking God left them. they should get alone and pray to God and renew what God wants to restore.


why do you stick your nose into business you clearly have no idea what is happening?

The word of God says to cast all our cares upon him, for he cares for us.
Every decision we make must be sought in Him and from his word and prayer.

No word from the Lord can come from a man that the Holy Spirit has already told you what you should do. Only confirmation of what is already known by you. Therefore God has told you what to do and you need to obey. There is only one choice. as I pray for you, the scripture that comes to mind is

Cast your cares on Him. Draw near to the Lord, and He will draw near to you. Avoid distractions and self-help schemes. Trust in the lord and his word, not seeking those who are "prophets" for a word. God desires to speak to you through prayer and HIS word; you are not hearing him because you are not listening because of a distraction.


May Lord bring clarity and discernment as you seek him.

LOl, you show me one example of scripture contradicting prophecy that should comfort, exhort, and edify, line up with the word of God Bring Glory to God and be a confirmation. You need to read the book of Jeremiah.

Those who prophesied from the flesh, and 1cor 14:3 says


3But he who prophesies speaks edification and exhortation and comfort to men. Here is one Biblical proof of what Prophesies is to do

Here is another.
4. He who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church.

5 I wish you all spoke with tongues, but even more that you prophesied; for he who prophesies is greater than he who speaks with tongues, unless indeed he interprets, that the church may receive edification.


29 Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others judge.

30 But if anything is revealed to another who sits by, let the first keep silent.
31 For you can all prophesy one by one, that all may learn and all may be encouraged. 32 And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets.


just in 1cor chapter 14 we repeatedly see the outcome for Propphesying as a normative that is to

Provide edification and exhortation and comfort to men.
edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church.
receive edification.
that all may learn and all may be encouraged.

These are the effects of one who is Prophesying or tongues and interpretation.

My comment was not meant to be insulting. I do know Hagin wrote this in one of his books (or it was transcribed into a book for his ministry.) The idea that prophecy has to be confirmation is also popular in the A/G and some other groups. But I can't find it in the Bible. It seems to be a reactionary teaching.



That's a straw man. If God tells you, "Never go to China" and someone else prophesies that you are to go to China... that's a different scenario. If you had never thought about going to China, and someone prophesies that you will one day do evangelism in China... the fact that you hadn't heard anything about it before doesn't prove the prophecy to be false.

When I was in college, a man who had been out of school a few years came to our Bible study. He'd been selling insurance, but he'd find himself sharing the gospel or praying with people during his sales calls. Years before, he'd gone to a meeting where a well-known Pentecostal pastor and evangelist had pointed him out and gave him a word that God had a call on his life, and about his ministry call. He'd been thinking abou that. He was a child, and from what I gather, I don't think he'd heard God say that about him.



What setting is irresponsible? Do you mean outside of church? I'm just guessing that is what you meant. I didn't mention a setting. 'Personal prophecies' happen in church meeting also, and they can happen outside of one-on-one altar call ministry as well. But even outside of church, the Bible does not forbid it. We read about probably one-on-one encounters with prophets. I was reading with my kids about Jeroboam and Adonijah the Shilonite yesterday. Did Agabus prophesy over Paul in a church meeting? Philip and his daughters might have been there. Was that 'in church.' It might be safer to get words in the assembly where others can judge, but that does not put a limitation on God.

Plenty of people who have been used in the prophetic for years give words one-on-one.



That doesn't make the prophets in the Bible wrong for prophesying over people who had no clue about what they were talking about before they got the prophecy, or for prophesying outside of church (or whatever your beef was in that previous paragraph.



I have known people who quote Hagin almost like his works are the Bible, young overzealous Rhema grads back in the day, and other fans. But I don't of anything someone could cite for the idea that it has to be confirmation besides Hagin. I can't find it in the Bible. Even if by confirmation one means 'it has to bear witness with my spirit'-- the validity of a prophecy is not dependent on the ability of the one hearing it to perceive it's genuineness.

If you prophesied over someone and they actually gave you some feedback, and said, "That one thing you prophesied about me that you said I would do, I had never thought of that before" would that make your prophecy false?


I'm not against elders being in on the judging. it says 'let the other judge.'



That is a convenient dodge. Where is it 'it must confirm what is known' in the Bible? I'm a Bible teacher, myself, and I've done various types of ministry. I've also read the Bible for decades, did detailed word studies on prophecy, prophets, Ephesians 4:11 ministries, studied intently to learn how prophecy works according to scripture. I've never seen any scripture that says the prophecy has to be known by the listener for it to be true. I already mentioned some cases where it is extremely unlikely the listeners knew it.

I challenge you to support doctrinal point 5 from scripture. As for the rest, I agree with that, but I don't think point 2 means it has to be milk toast-- how I've heard some (not saying you) interpret it, since the book of Revelation is prophesy, and edifying, but not emotional-cotton-candy reading. Also, do you think the readers of the book of Revelation... for the first time... knew everything in it before the book of __prophecy__ was written?

It would be a relief if you would put another person who is in need of counsel ahead of yourself and what you believe.

you are not helping anyone in your insistence that what you think is what everyone should think.

This is a Bible discussion forum, and there is a tag feature. I don't think ongoing discussion in the thread hurts her.

Well it is all about what you think after all, isn't it then.

I pray Alisha can weed out words from someone who really cares and someone who is so selfish as to project themself even though another is hurting.

Now don't forget to correct someone else you do not know. After all, you have proven that you believe you are quite the most important person here.

And by the way, you know who wanted a go between for them and God? The Israelites who were continually disobedient, believed false prophets and made an idol the minute a real representative of God was out of sight.

We should not be running after people for a word from God.

Thanks presidente for your comments. Since the Bible says that the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy, I equate a believer sharing any testimony of Jesus as being called 'prophesy'. The dry bones in Ezekiel were told to hear the word of the Lord.

Ok

I see what is going on here. You have your own opinion, and mine contradicts yours, so you want to get on my case as if posting will hurt Alicia somehow and impugn my motives. But it's only selfish if I share some thoughts on the matter, but not if you do.

I don't think false doctrine will help her, so I see my posts as potentially beneficial. It is possible that she might run after a word from God, and God might give her one, and that could be an instrument for comfort, but that is up to the LORD. I wouldn't want her, or others, to be put under some man-made rules that could shut her, or someone else, down from receiving something God might do in her, or their, life.

In Deuteronomy 18, God specifically allowed Israelites to go to a prophet. They were allowed to ask for a word from the LORD. If they b weren't serving God, it might not be what they wanted to hear. Jeremiah had some people inquiring of the LORD through him who didn't like what He had to say.

You posted five points about prophecy. I disagreed with the 5th, that the information in the prophecy had to already be known or be 'confirmation.' You posted Bible verses to support other points you had made, not the one I disagreed with. It feels like a straw man argument, that you are pretending I disagreed with ideas I didn't disagree with.

The Bible has lots of examples of people who didn't know something who knew it later. Do you think the Israelites knew about Moses' burning bush experience before he told them? If the rebels in Korah's rebellion already knew the ground was going to open up and swallow them before Moses told them, why would they have rebelled? If the officer knew that grain was soon going to be sold for so cheap, why would he have expressed unbelief? The people of Nineveh did not know their right had from their left. They didn't know they were on the verge of destruction until Jonah prophesied.

I see what is going on here. You have your own opinion, and mine contradicts yours, so you want to get on my case as if posting will hurt Alicia somehow and impugn my motives. But it's only selfish if I share some thoughts on the matter, but not if you do.

I don't think false doctrine will help her, so I see my posts as potentially beneficial. It is possible that she might run after a word from God, and God might give her one, and that could be an instrument for comfort, but that is up to the LORD. I wouldn't want her, or others, to be put under some man-made rules that could shut her, or someone else, down from receiving something God might do in her, or their, life.

In Deuteronomy 18, God specifically allowed Israelites to go to a prophet. They were allowed to ask for a word from the LORD. If they weren't serving God, it might not be what they wanted to hear. Jeremiah had some people inquiring of the LORD through him who didn't like what He had to say.

There is no reason to think speaking in tongues has to be the exact languages listed in Acts 2. The difference is that in Acts 2, people present understood the language,

LOL OK here is something you failed to see with Ols Testament Prophets

1. they were sent to King , rulers, and the cities :
2. they spoke of obeying God and leaving false gods
3. they gave guidance for battle and if the Lord was with them( kings & judges) as they went to battle
4. they had the message repent or suffer judgment

What did they know before the Prophet spoke to the king's rulers and people?:

• War was about to happen
• worship of false gods was already happening
• Prophets spoke to kings and rulers

This prophet's office has changed in the New Testament. All Prophetic words are built from the words of Jesus who is the Chief Corner Stone. And the context of the application of what Prophetic words is and one who is prophesying is not always the same.

In addition, one who prophesies doesn't make them have the office of a Prophet.


That was explained some time ago.

Actually there's a very good reason they were exact languages. It says they heard them speaking in their own languages. It doesn't say they "heard their own languages," but heard them speaking their own languages. When was the last time you heard someone say they have the gift of hearing in tongues?

No one here has provided a false Doctrine. Just because you can't see it doesn't make it false. And calling everything false that doesn't agree with you is a big sign of immaturity.