Could Trump do anything to make you stop supporting him?
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I don't see Trump as a savior. In fact Trump said himself, "we need a savior, and it isn't me."So some of his hard core followers should listen to what he is saying.
Trump told people to peacefully rally. He didn't incite any more than any other politician did.
Eric Holder said " When they go low, we kick them.”
Rep. Waters said "“Let’s make sure we show up wherever we have to show up. And if you see anybody from that Cabinet in a restaurant, in a department store, at a gasoline station, you get out and you create a crowd. And you push back on them. And you tell them they’re not welcome anymore, anywhere."
Chuck Schumer (D-NY), speaking at a rally of pro-choice supporters in March 2020, threatened Supreme Court Justices Brett Kavanaugh and Neil Gorsuch and told them that they will "pay the price." I want to tell you, Gorsuch, I want to tell you, Kavanaugh, you have released the whirlwind and you will pay the price. You won’t know what hit you if you go forward with these awful decisions."
Kamala the VP asked for donations to help pay bail for protesters. It has not been divulged whether she herself gave. ( I know what my guess is)
So when I take all these things into account I think we can either say all are guilty, or none. But not one person. That's what we call being objective. If we take the summer of love and place it beside Jan 6 and being objective, look at both situations I think you can see that there are people who don't want Trump to run and will grasp at anything to stop him.
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1.) "We won this election, and we won it by a landslide."
Trump can say he is Heavenly Father in man form... and while some of his base might believe him, it isn't illegal or inciting violence to lie.
2.) "We will stop the steal."
So the argument isn't if there were fraudulent votes. The argument is if there was widespread fraudulent votes that would have effected the outcome of the election. Declaring his intentions to "stop the steal" is not illegal and IF it was happening, it would actually be his moral duty TO stop a steal from happening. The argument is if there really was a steal in place which is independent from the charge of inciting violence.
3.) "We will never give up. We will never concede. It doesn't happen."
His right to contest and question the legitimacy of an election does not make him guilty of inciting a crowd to raid the capital. Furthermore, not conceding the election isn't a new phenomenon nor is it illegal.
4.) "If you don't fight like hell you're not going to have a country anymore."
The word "fight" has a literal and figurative meaning. Literally, the word means a violent confrontation or struggle. Figuratively, it simply means to oppose a view or stance. Let's look at the rest of his speech to give even further context into how he means the word "fight".
5.) "Peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard" and "We're going to walk down to the Capitol and we're going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women, and we're probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them. "
Clearly from his emphasis on "peacefully" and "cheering on" he wasn't inciting violence or encouraging the crowd to raid the Capital. It can be concluded that the word "fight" in #4 was used figuratively. We can pick and choose what to read and point out if it fits a narrative, but that is being disingenuous. Worst case scenario, Trump is a liar... but that isn't illegal or inciting violence in my opinion.
Trump can say he is Heavenly Father in man form... and while some of his base might believe him, it isn't illegal or inciting violence to lie.
2.) "We will stop the steal."
So the argument isn't if there were fraudulent votes. The argument is if there was widespread fraudulent votes that would have effected the outcome of the election. Declaring his intentions to "stop the steal" is not illegal and IF it was happening, it would actually be his moral duty TO stop a steal from happening. The argument is if there really was a steal in place which is independent from the charge of inciting violence.
3.) "We will never give up. We will never concede. It doesn't happen."
His right to contest and question the legitimacy of an election does not make him guilty of inciting a crowd to raid the capital. Furthermore, not conceding the election isn't a new phenomenon nor is it illegal.
4.) "If you don't fight like hell you're not going to have a country anymore."
The word "fight" has a literal and figurative meaning. Literally, the word means a violent confrontation or struggle. Figuratively, it simply means to oppose a view or stance. Let's look at the rest of his speech to give even further context into how he means the word "fight".
5.) "Peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard" and "We're going to walk down to the Capitol and we're going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women, and we're probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them. "
Clearly from his emphasis on "peacefully" and "cheering on" he wasn't inciting violence or encouraging the crowd to raid the Capital. It can be concluded that the word "fight" in #4 was used figuratively. We can pick and choose what to read and point out if it fits a narrative, but that is being disingenuous. Worst case scenario, Trump is a liar... but that isn't illegal or inciting violence in my opinion.
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Why is it a crime to question the election? Do a full audit, if it proves that Biden got 81 million votes not only will Biden be vindicated but you will have humiliated Trump and put him in his place.
So far all the courts have determined that this is not for them to decide, it is for the state legislatures to do their job.
Dominion has argued that we are not allowed to see inside the machines tabulating the votes because the software is proprietary! Think about that, the software is supposed to be doing the simplest math, adding 1+1+1, etc. We have had calculators for 50+ years. Why do they need "proprietary" software to add up the votes? But who cares, if we can't audit them then throw the bums out.
Do a complete canvass. That means if we got 25 mail in votes with the same address we need to know we had 25 registered voters at that address. Also it means removing all the dead people and those who have moved out of the country.
Do this for the whole country, it could cost $100 million. That is less than 0.1% what we have sent to Ukraine. In fact it will probably be less than 0.05% of what we send to Ukraine by the end of this year.
This is how you put an end to the "cult" behavior, the fighting, and the name calling. Today on MSNBC they were saying that people who vote for Trump are not as well educated as those who vote for Biden. This stuff has to stop, you are pushing the country to a civil war.
So far all the courts have determined that this is not for them to decide, it is for the state legislatures to do their job.
Dominion has argued that we are not allowed to see inside the machines tabulating the votes because the software is proprietary! Think about that, the software is supposed to be doing the simplest math, adding 1+1+1, etc. We have had calculators for 50+ years. Why do they need "proprietary" software to add up the votes? But who cares, if we can't audit them then throw the bums out.
Do a complete canvass. That means if we got 25 mail in votes with the same address we need to know we had 25 registered voters at that address. Also it means removing all the dead people and those who have moved out of the country.
Do this for the whole country, it could cost $100 million. That is less than 0.1% what we have sent to Ukraine. In fact it will probably be less than 0.05% of what we send to Ukraine by the end of this year.
This is how you put an end to the "cult" behavior, the fighting, and the name calling. Today on MSNBC they were saying that people who vote for Trump are not as well educated as those who vote for Biden. This stuff has to stop, you are pushing the country to a civil war.
No, its not.
all the evidence in the world will never convince a flat earther he's wrong. he'll just claim the evidence was faked.
every audit and recount in every state Trump contested showed the same results and zero evidence of any widespread fraud. Jeanna Ellis admitted in court she lied about election fraud. fox lost a huge defamation lawsuit against dominion voting machines.
none of this changes the cultic narrative - they have alternative facts, it's their way of life.
all the evidence in the world will never convince a flat earther he's wrong. he'll just claim the evidence was faked.
every audit and recount in every state Trump contested showed the same results and zero evidence of any widespread fraud. Jeanna Ellis admitted in court she lied about election fraud. fox lost a huge defamation lawsuit against dominion voting machines.
none of this changes the cultic narrative - they have alternative facts, it's their way of life.
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75 million people voted for Trump, it is an insult to compare them to Flat Earthers.
When 60% of the country feels the election will be stolen in 2024 you have to respond to that to build up the trust in the system.
No one denies that the voter rolls are a mess, it will not be a waste of money to clean up those rolls.
I have already said, if dominion will not allow the US voters to see inside the tabulator machines then get rid of them. we don't need them counting our votes for us.
This attitude of yours that 75 million Americans cannot be convinced is the problem.
In 2020 they estimate that 1 million Americans went to the January 6th Rally at most. That would be less than 1% of those that voted in the election. Today 60% of Americans, not just Republicans but also independents and democrats, say they think the election in 2024 will be stolen or they are worried that it will be.
The more they hold to this attitude saying these people will not believe us if we do a full audit the more people believe they have something to hide. This approach is not working, it is only making the division worse. It is arrogant to say "shut up, you are too stupid, we are the smart ones and we have told you that you are wrong". That is essentially what they were saying on Morning Joe this morning.
When 60% of the country feels the election will be stolen in 2024 you have to respond to that to build up the trust in the system.
No one denies that the voter rolls are a mess, it will not be a waste of money to clean up those rolls.
I have already said, if dominion will not allow the US voters to see inside the tabulator machines then get rid of them. we don't need them counting our votes for us.
This attitude of yours that 75 million Americans cannot be convinced is the problem.
In 2020 they estimate that 1 million Americans went to the January 6th Rally at most. That would be less than 1% of those that voted in the election. Today 60% of Americans, not just Republicans but also independents and democrats, say they think the election in 2024 will be stolen or they are worried that it will be.
The more they hold to this attitude saying these people will not believe us if we do a full audit the more people believe they have something to hide. This approach is not working, it is only making the division worse. It is arrogant to say "shut up, you are too stupid, we are the smart ones and we have told you that you are wrong". That is essentially what they were saying on Morning Joe this morning.
Exactly.
If you ask a liar to prove they aren't lying they will attack you, insult you, threaten you, and come up with a thousand reasons why they can't give you the proof. Right now our government is walking like a liar and quaking like a liar.
People who are honest welcome an opportunity to prove that, only liars give every excuse imaginable why they can't do that.
We have asked for a complete audit of the Dominion machines, and if Dominion refuses to get rid of them. They are not helping us count votes. It used to be we could count the votes by 12 midnight, now it is taking us a week to get the final vote count. Countries like France that use paper ballots can still do it in one day and get the result that night.
Everyone admits the voter rolls need to be cleaned up, there are dead people still on them and people who have moved are also still on them. So let's clean that up.
Everyone also admits that the easiest way to commit fraud in an election is with mail in ballots, so let's do a canvass to make sure the addresses they were sent from have registered voters living in them.
If you ask a liar to prove they aren't lying they will attack you, insult you, threaten you, and come up with a thousand reasons why they can't give you the proof. Right now our government is walking like a liar and quaking like a liar.
People who are honest welcome an opportunity to prove that, only liars give every excuse imaginable why they can't do that.
We have asked for a complete audit of the Dominion machines, and if Dominion refuses to get rid of them. They are not helping us count votes. It used to be we could count the votes by 12 midnight, now it is taking us a week to get the final vote count. Countries like France that use paper ballots can still do it in one day and get the result that night.
Everyone admits the voter rolls need to be cleaned up, there are dead people still on them and people who have moved are also still on them. So let's clean that up.
Everyone also admits that the easiest way to commit fraud in an election is with mail in ballots, so let's do a canvass to make sure the addresses they were sent from have registered voters living in them.
There will always be a very small minority of outliers. The command in the Bible is to be at peace with all people as much as it is possible.
You can easily be at peace with 74 out of the 75 million by simply doing a complete audit of the election process.
1. Canvass -- check that the addresses on mail in ballots correspond to where registered voters live, and that those that live there actually mailed in a ballot in the 2020 election.
2. Voter rolls -- clean up the voter rolls of all dead people and people who have moved out of the state.
3. Get rid of the machines. Paper ballots are considered the safest and most reliable and in France they were able to get a result within hours of the election ending, whereas the 2020 election took us days to get a result.
4. Examine and investigate the 2,000+ affidavits of alledged voter fraud in the 2020 election.
5. Geotagging can confirm or exonerate people accused of fraud.
You can easily be at peace with 74 out of the 75 million by simply doing a complete audit of the election process.
1. Canvass -- check that the addresses on mail in ballots correspond to where registered voters live, and that those that live there actually mailed in a ballot in the 2020 election.
2. Voter rolls -- clean up the voter rolls of all dead people and people who have moved out of the state.
3. Get rid of the machines. Paper ballots are considered the safest and most reliable and in France they were able to get a result within hours of the election ending, whereas the 2020 election took us days to get a result.
4. Examine and investigate the 2,000+ affidavits of alledged voter fraud in the 2020 election.
5. Geotagging can confirm or exonerate people accused of fraud.
No, you are confusing two completely different things.
20 ballots are mailed in using one address. A canvass goes to the address and confirms that in 2020 there were 20 registered voters at that address.
You have to confirm that the address and the registered voters were both valid on the date in question.
20 ballots are mailed in using one address. A canvass goes to the address and confirms that in 2020 there were 20 registered voters at that address.
You have to confirm that the address and the registered voters were both valid on the date in question.
Hey, we're back in this part of the forum again! lol I'm not going to call myself overly intelligent, but I'm not so stupid as to simply "follow the leader". I have done some traveling in my life, I have fellowshipped with many people in all walks of life, with people of all denominations. Where I wouldn't call myself overly intelligent, I would definitely say I am not a follower of people. So when someone throws out an judgement call, an opinion, and say anyone who follows Trump is part of a cult, I find that a tad bit insulting. Or I would, if I considered opinion fact. Luckily I know opinion when I see it and fact when I see it.
What I have noticed is all the red herrings thrown out to distract from the common sense way to resolve all this.
1. They accuse the 60% of Americans concerned about the 2024 election being stolen as being "flat earthers", a "cult" and impossible to reason with. When you call them on that they dodge and weave and essentially lie. Pretending that the comment was not about the 60%.
2. They try to confuse or conflate a census with a canvass.
3. They confuse an "audit" with a "recount".
So let's reiterate how to avoid a civil war and the country splitting. The Blue states need to wake up, the red states don't need them, they need the red states.
Let's do a complete audit of the election process.
1. Canvass -- check that the addresses on mail in ballots correspond to where registered voters live, and that those that live there actually mailed in a ballot in the 2020 election.
2. Voter rolls -- clean up the voter rolls of all dead people and people who have moved out of the state.
3. Get rid of the machines. Paper ballots are considered the safest and most reliable and in France they were able to get a result within hours of the election ending, whereas the 2020 election took us days to get a result.
4. Examine and investigate the 2,000+ affidavits of alleged voter fraud in the 2020 election.
5. Geotagging can confirm or exonerate people accused of fraud.
1. They accuse the 60% of Americans concerned about the 2024 election being stolen as being "flat earthers", a "cult" and impossible to reason with. When you call them on that they dodge and weave and essentially lie. Pretending that the comment was not about the 60%.
2. They try to confuse or conflate a census with a canvass.
3. They confuse an "audit" with a "recount".
So let's reiterate how to avoid a civil war and the country splitting. The Blue states need to wake up, the red states don't need them, they need the red states.
Let's do a complete audit of the election process.
1. Canvass -- check that the addresses on mail in ballots correspond to where registered voters live, and that those that live there actually mailed in a ballot in the 2020 election.
2. Voter rolls -- clean up the voter rolls of all dead people and people who have moved out of the state.
3. Get rid of the machines. Paper ballots are considered the safest and most reliable and in France they were able to get a result within hours of the election ending, whereas the 2020 election took us days to get a result.
4. Examine and investigate the 2,000+ affidavits of alleged voter fraud in the 2020 election.
5. Geotagging can confirm or exonerate people accused of fraud.
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Yeah, I'm back. It's like the train wreck you can't help but look at 
. We seem to have a lot in common; I have traveled a lot myself, I too have fellowshipped with many people in all walks of life, with people of all denominations. Been in the mission field a tad. I'm not a follower either (that part should be obvious by now lol). I don't normally flaunt my intelligence, but when it is repeatedly questioned I have a right to set the record straight. I try not to judge, tho I will opine. And when God gives me a message to spread I spread it. Even when I'd rather not, which is kind of the case here. I've tried to walk away but no, He won't let me. So I get to play the unpopular guy, the astrobogulous voice in the desert calling out.
Stereotypes exist for a reason. And yes there are exceptions to every stereotype. Not everyone who supports trump is a deplorable. Actually, most of them are normal working want 3 hots and a roof kinds of people who just want an alternative to what the left is shoveling. And sadly most of them believe they have no choice but to hold their noses and vote for the lesser evil.
Trouble is, there is no lesser evil. It exists fully on the left and on the right. But the evil on the right portrays itself as an angel of light. And far too many who seek the light are being deceived by it's brightness. That part really troubles me. Jesus told us that many will be deceived and turn away from Him, I don't want that happening to anyone I know. Not on my watch.
The very definition of deception is that those who are falling to it don't know it is happening. And it takes someone with the gift to see causal relationships where others don't, to detect it. I mean, if common intellect could see these relationships, then deception would never happen, right?
My message is not about trump, it is about the deception. trump is just the head of the snake, so he gets more attention.
And I don't mean to render judgment on anyone who follows him. It's not judgment, it's a warning.
. We seem to have a lot in common; I have traveled a lot myself, I too have fellowshipped with many people in all walks of life, with people of all denominations. Been in the mission field a tad. I'm not a follower either (that part should be obvious by now lol). I don't normally flaunt my intelligence, but when it is repeatedly questioned I have a right to set the record straight. I try not to judge, tho I will opine. And when God gives me a message to spread I spread it. Even when I'd rather not, which is kind of the case here. I've tried to walk away but no, He won't let me. So I get to play the unpopular guy, the astrobogulous voice in the desert calling out. Stereotypes exist for a reason. And yes there are exceptions to every stereotype. Not everyone who supports trump is a deplorable. Actually, most of them are normal working want 3 hots and a roof kinds of people who just want an alternative to what the left is shoveling. And sadly most of them believe they have no choice but to hold their noses and vote for the lesser evil.
Trouble is, there is no lesser evil. It exists fully on the left and on the right. But the evil on the right portrays itself as an angel of light. And far too many who seek the light are being deceived by it's brightness. That part really troubles me. Jesus told us that many will be deceived and turn away from Him, I don't want that happening to anyone I know. Not on my watch.
The very definition of deception is that those who are falling to it don't know it is happening. And it takes someone with the gift to see causal relationships where others don't, to detect it. I mean, if common intellect could see these relationships, then deception would never happen, right?
My message is not about trump, it is about the deception. trump is just the head of the snake, so he gets more attention.
And I don't mean to render judgment on anyone who follows him. It's not judgment, it's a warning.
There are people who don't want to see Trump in office again because they want to hold on to power and control. Why didn't they do something before now to Trump? It is because he is running again, and this is their way of stopping him. Biden is a liar he is not protecting We The People from illegals. There could have been Keystone Pipeline, but as soon as he came into office he put a stop to that. The border should not be open we have inflation everywhere we go everything cost more. He is not fit to be our President. Seriously, does anyone believe Trump has committed 91 felonies?
History repeats itself, first time as a tragedy, second time as a farce.
WW2 started with weak Neville Chamberlain being replaced by that lunatic Winston Churchill.
WW3 starts with an elderly man with dementia being replaced by the jawbone of an Ass.
Pearl Harbor was a big loss to the US because the man in charge of the radar office decided that the 45 minute warning he got of the attack was probably not japanese warplanes. He didn't want to disturb the entire fleet on Sunday morning.
Anyway, don't worry, just go back to sleep.
WW2 started with weak Neville Chamberlain being replaced by that lunatic Winston Churchill.
WW3 starts with an elderly man with dementia being replaced by the jawbone of an Ass.
Pearl Harbor was a big loss to the US because the man in charge of the radar office decided that the 45 minute warning he got of the attack was probably not japanese warplanes. He didn't want to disturb the entire fleet on Sunday morning.
Anyway, don't worry, just go back to sleep.