10 Questions about OSAS
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THAT'S IT! 
if one is always concerned about losing salvation, where's the focus? me, me, me, me, me. such a person may engage in doing good, but wouldn't it be for oneself in the ultimate sense?
once we understand Christ has settled the horizontal forever (our standing and relationship to God)
we are free to look about us vertically to see what others need.
you're a genius.
if one is always concerned about losing salvation, where's the focus? me, me, me, me, me. such a person may engage in doing good, but wouldn't it be for oneself in the ultimate sense?
once we understand Christ has settled the horizontal forever (our standing and relationship to God)
we are free to look about us vertically to see what others need.
you're a genius.
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THAT'S IT!
if one is always concerned about losing salvation, where's the focus? me, me, me, me, me. such a person may engage in doing good, but wouldn't it be for oneself in the ultimate sense?
once we understand Christ has settled the horizontal forever (our standing and relationship to God)
we are free to look about us vertically to see what others need.
you're a genius.
if one is always concerned about losing salvation, where's the focus? me, me, me, me, me. such a person may engage in doing good, but wouldn't it be for oneself in the ultimate sense?
once we understand Christ has settled the horizontal forever (our standing and relationship to God)
we are free to look about us vertically to see what others need.
you're a genius.
vertical first, then horizontal. i'ma go take a nap.
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In Hebrews 3:14, we read - For we have become [past tense Greek verb, meaning we have become already] partakers of Christ, (demonstrative evidence) if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end.
Notice that this is essentially a repeat of verse 6, where we read: but Christ was faithful as a Son over His house - whose house we are, (demonstrative evidence) if we hold fast our confidence firm to the end.
*Notice that the wording is not - "and you will become partakers of Christ (future indicative) if you (future indicative) hold the beginning of your confidence steadfast to the end. It is rather - "you have been, and now are, partakers of Christ, (demonstrative evidence) if in the future you hold fast the beginning of your confidence steadfast to the end.
What about the faltering Hebrews who end up departing from God after beginning with some level of confidence and profession of loyalty, but then later? Future perseverance is proof of genuine conversion.
Notice that this is essentially a repeat of verse 6, where we read: but Christ was faithful as a Son over His house - whose house we are, (demonstrative evidence) if we hold fast our confidence firm to the end.
*Notice that the wording is not - "and you will become partakers of Christ (future indicative) if you (future indicative) hold the beginning of your confidence steadfast to the end. It is rather - "you have been, and now are, partakers of Christ, (demonstrative evidence) if in the future you hold fast the beginning of your confidence steadfast to the end.
What about the faltering Hebrews who end up departing from God after beginning with some level of confidence and profession of loyalty, but then later? Future perseverance is proof of genuine conversion.
Here's a dilemma OSAS can't deal with: IF OSAS is true, then we're all going to Heaven who have called on the Lord for salvation, period.
But that's not good enough for them, they have to keep insinuating that those that don't believe OSAS aren't saved to begin with.
Well, that amounts to up to 2/3 or more of CC membership!
Slice it any way you want, 70/30, 60/40. even 40/60, that's still a lot of people who pray, read their Bibles, as well as go to church & live holy lives with the fruit to prove it.
So what's the real deal here? "I'm right & you're wrong."
A "one & done" isn't good enough for them; they also want their opponents to go to Hell.
IF they were right, everybody can go & all of us can live in peace. But noooo, they have to fight to the end.
If it was me, I would just say, "I'm sure glad we're all going. It doesn't really matter".
But let's all keep reading & see what they do.
But that's not good enough for them, they have to keep insinuating that those that don't believe OSAS aren't saved to begin with.
Well, that amounts to up to 2/3 or more of CC membership!
Slice it any way you want, 70/30, 60/40. even 40/60, that's still a lot of people who pray, read their Bibles, as well as go to church & live holy lives with the fruit to prove it.
So what's the real deal here? "I'm right & you're wrong."
A "one & done" isn't good enough for them; they also want their opponents to go to Hell.
IF they were right, everybody can go & all of us can live in peace. But noooo, they have to fight to the end.
If it was me, I would just say, "I'm sure glad we're all going. It doesn't really matter".
But let's all keep reading & see what they do.
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1
- Show all
THAT'S IT!
if one is always concerned about losing salvation, where's the focus? me, me, me, me, me. such a person may engage in doing good, but wouldn't it be for oneself in the ultimate sense?
once we understand Christ has settled the horizontal forever (our standing and relationship to God)
we are free to look about us vertically to see what others need.
you're a genius.
if one is always concerned about losing salvation, where's the focus? me, me, me, me, me. such a person may engage in doing good, but wouldn't it be for oneself in the ultimate sense?
once we understand Christ has settled the horizontal forever (our standing and relationship to God)
we are free to look about us vertically to see what others need.
you're a genius.
I do not hold to "once saved always saved" and to be blunt - the idea that I might be losing my salvation is not even on my radar - I have no worries about that at all -- I am absolutely certain and I know that I will never make heaven on my own efforts or abilities -- I NEED NEED NEED the precious Lamb of God and the blood of Jesus and the power of His resurrection! That is my life-line and I am hanging onto that and not letting go! Yell at me, scream at me, threaten me, torture me, kill me -- it doesn't matter - I will not let go of my faith in Jesus Christ.
Now, on the other hand if I accepted OSAS as a doctrinal belief, I fear my assurance of salvation would be greatly affected? Why? Because if I don't do enough good works, or if I start to falter and do some evil works, then my OSAS friends would look at me and say - "Well, he was never saved in the first place!" Hence to keep assurance of salvation I would need to continue in good works.
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Here's a dilemma OSAS can't deal with: IF OSAS is true, then we're all going to Heaven who have called on the Lord for salvation, period.
But that's not good enough for them, they have to keep insinuating that those that don't believe OSAS aren't saved to begin with.
Well, that amounts to up to 2/3 or more of CC membership!
Slice it any way you want, 70/30, 60/40. even 40/60, that's still a lot of people who pray, read their Bibles, as well as go to church & live holy lives with the fruit to prove it.
So what's the real deal here? "I'm right & you're wrong."
A "one & done" isn't good enough for them; they also want their opponents to go to Hell.
IF they were right, everybody can go & all of us can live in peace. But noooo, they have to fight to the end.
If it was me, I would just say, "I'm sure glad we're all going. It doesn't really matter".
But let's all keep reading & see what they do.
But that's not good enough for them, they have to keep insinuating that those that don't believe OSAS aren't saved to begin with.
Well, that amounts to up to 2/3 or more of CC membership!
Slice it any way you want, 70/30, 60/40. even 40/60, that's still a lot of people who pray, read their Bibles, as well as go to church & live holy lives with the fruit to prove it.
So what's the real deal here? "I'm right & you're wrong."
A "one & done" isn't good enough for them; they also want their opponents to go to Hell.
IF they were right, everybody can go & all of us can live in peace. But noooo, they have to fight to the end.
If it was me, I would just say, "I'm sure glad we're all going. It doesn't really matter".
But let's all keep reading & see what they do.
Perhaps that's your perception, but I have never met any who even implied that. They are victims of false prophets who have MIXED works ( self righteousness) with grace (faith in the only truly righteous One).
Our righteousness is like a pile of smelly diapers. Regardless, it's taught that Jesus is not enough. We must toss filthy rags our filthy rags to God and tell Him our behavior trump's His Son. He knows you and I failed all of our lives. He doesn't except the few rags that are cleaner and call that pile good to go. They aren't ever going to be washed clean by you,.....EVER, no matter how hard you try. We are as an unclean thing. We are an Unacceptable sacrifice. Jesus was the Acceptable Sacrifice without spot or blemish.
When someone tells you that your doomed to hell for putting any of your faith in a dirty rag, they are not wanting you to go there friend. They are warning you and telling you that you must get saved through faith in Christ alone and not the deeds of the law.
But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.
Isaiah 64
He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
John 3:18,36
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Frankly Chester, what you describe here sounds like the LOSAS (Losers of Savior and Salvation) belief.
I don't know anybody in the Eternal Security camp that thinks good or bad deeds affects Salvation post conversion.
However if you no longer believe Jesus Christ is God in the flesh, that died for your sin debt, and rose again, then I absolutely would believe you were never saved in the first place.
I don't know anybody in the Eternal Security camp that thinks good or bad deeds affects Salvation post conversion.
However if you no longer believe Jesus Christ is God in the flesh, that died for your sin debt, and rose again, then I absolutely would believe you were never saved in the first place.
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we know the Biblical term for to ABIDE means to REMAIN.
4 abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abide in the vine, so neither can you, unless you abide in me.
5 I am the vine, you the branches. He that abides in me and I in him, he bears much fruit; for without me you can do nothing.
6 If any one abide not in me, he is cast out as the branch and withers, and they gather it and throw it into the fire, and it is burned.
This states:
if WE ABIDE/REMAIN in GOD, we bear much fruit
but, IF we do not ABIDE or REMAIN in God...we get cast into HELL
SHOW ME, where GOD, is the ONE forcing us to ABIDE or REMAIN in HIM?
because, Verse 6, shows that it is OUR DUTY to Abide or REMAIN and if we do not, Hell is where we're headed.
4 abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abide in the vine, so neither can you, unless you abide in me.
5 I am the vine, you the branches. He that abides in me and I in him, he bears much fruit; for without me you can do nothing.
6 If any one abide not in me, he is cast out as the branch and withers, and they gather it and throw it into the fire, and it is burned.
This states:
if WE ABIDE/REMAIN in GOD, we bear much fruit
but, IF we do not ABIDE or REMAIN in God...we get cast into HELL
SHOW ME, where GOD, is the ONE forcing us to ABIDE or REMAIN in HIM?
because, Verse 6, shows that it is OUR DUTY to Abide or REMAIN and if we do not, Hell is where we're headed.
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