The Security Of The Believer
- Thread starter Romans34
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
@mailmandan
Okay, to get down to business:
You basically claim that works will always be evident of a true saving faith, but these works do not save. Here is my…
Short answer:
The point here is that a branch (believer) can be IN JESUS (which is by faith - Romans 5:1-2) and yet they did not bear fruit and thus… they are taken away. The result of being taken away is verse 6. Meaning, if they are taken away, they are no longer abiding in Christ because of fruitlessness and they are cast forth into the fire to be burned.
John 15:6 says,
Fruit is dealing with good deeds, see Luke 3:8-14. Also compare the words “meet for repentance” in Matthew 3:8 with Acts 26:20 that says, “works meet for repentance”. The branch being cast into the fire is a loss of salvation because there are other verses that teach a loss of salvation by a lack of work or fruit like the unprofitable servant being cast into outer darkness in the Parable of the Talents (See: Matthew 25:14-30).
Being saved once in the past by a one time moment of faith does not guarantee that we will forever endure to the end in our faith to be saved, either.
We are told:
We are told to:
So it’s not a one time moment of faith. Our faith continues, and it includes being faithful unto death, and continuing in His goodness, etcetera. While I do not deny there is a connection between God’s grace and works (Luke 7:36-50) (1 Corinthians 15:10) and a connection between faith and works (James 2:18), we also have to look at the whole counsel of God’s Word and realize that Jesus also said, “Every branch IN ME” and yet this branch did not bear fruit according to John 15:2, and this branch’s fate was being cast into the fire in John 15:6.
[Continued in my next post to you]:
Okay, to get down to business:
You basically claim that works will always be evident of a true saving faith, but these works do not save. Here is my…
Short answer:
John 15:6 says,
“If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.”
Fruit is dealing with good deeds, see Luke 3:8-14. Also compare the words “meet for repentance” in Matthew 3:8 with Acts 26:20 that says, “works meet for repentance”. The branch being cast into the fire is a loss of salvation because there are other verses that teach a loss of salvation by a lack of work or fruit like the unprofitable servant being cast into outer darkness in the Parable of the Talents (See: Matthew 25:14-30).
Being saved once in the past by a one time moment of faith does not guarantee that we will forever endure to the end in our faith to be saved, either.
We are told:
“...We are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end.” (Hebrews 3:13-14).
"Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life." (Jude 1:21).
"...be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life." (Revelation 2:10).
We are told to:
- Continue in the grace of God (Acts of the Apostles 13:43).
- Continue in the faith (Acts of the Apostles 14:22) (Colossians 1:23).
- Continue in his goodness, otherwise we can be cut off (just like the Jews were cut off) (Romans 11:21-22).
So it’s not a one time moment of faith. Our faith continues, and it includes being faithful unto death, and continuing in His goodness, etcetera. While I do not deny there is a connection between God’s grace and works (Luke 7:36-50) (1 Corinthians 15:10) and a connection between faith and works (James 2:18), we also have to look at the whole counsel of God’s Word and realize that Jesus also said, “Every branch IN ME” and yet this branch did not bear fruit according to John 15:2, and this branch’s fate was being cast into the fire in John 15:6.
[Continued in my next post to you]:
- In John 15:2, what has been taken away? The believers and his fruitless works.
- What happened to the believers and his fruitless works and who takes them away? Their lives were taken away by God the Father. V1. He prunes the vines by cutting them away which is a physical death to preserve the testimony of the other branches. These believers who were once having fruit were now fruitless and were cut off but nothing is said of them of the loss of salvation or they were in hell fire after they were taken away. Let’s continue.
- Does the word “fire” in the Bible always refer to Hell? No. The word “fire” is not always about “hell”. Lots of scriptural references were used to indicate a picture or symbol. It may also refer to the tongue as in James 3:6, as a way of purification in Numbers 31:23, God’s messenger as a fire Psalms 104:4, etc.
In Hebrews 3:13-14 Paul in the context speaks of “holy brethren” about the saved and he tells them that they were already partakers of the heavenly calling v 1. To be partakers of Christ is to be faithful, to be counted worthy, to be more honourable vv 2-3, and to hold a good testimony v.5. It has nothing to do with the loss of salvation.
In Jude 1:21, we are told saints are responsible for abiding in His love and keeping themselves in the love of God, but they are not responsible for keeping their salvation.
Revelation 2:10 talks of faithfulness for rewards, not salvation
Jesus had made a long winded sermon. It’s called the Sermon on the Mount (See Matthew 5-7).
Stephen had made a long winded sermon, and He was killed because of it (See: Acts 7).
So just because somebody speaks God’s Word for a lengthy amount of time does not automatically equate with it being unbiblical.
The Bereans were more noble because they searched the Scriptures to see whether those things be so or not (Acts 17:10-11).
Well, you are not doing that. You have given no indication to me here that you are going to look at the verses I presented.
First, I’ve already explained key verses in Romans 4 (See again here).
Paul is fighting against “Circumcision Salvationism” as was brought up by the council of believers in Acts 15.
So if somebody thought they had to FIRST be saved initially by circumcision, then they would be by-passing God’s grace through faith in Jesus in their Initial Salvation. It’s why Paul makes his whole point about whether Abraham believed first before he was circumcised (a work). Granted, we do not have to be circumcised. That is Old Covenant. The point was to illustrate the order of things. We are to first believe in Jesus for our salvation and not partake of circumcision to be initially saved. Paul makes the illustration of Abraham and his belief coming first before he did a work (circumcision). This is a parallel to our faith (Which has different instructions under the New Covenant).
Ephesians 2:8-9, Titus 3:5, and Romans 11:6 are all clearly in context to Initial Salvation (See again here).
Nothing is said in these verses about how we can continue in sin so that grace may abound.
Second, I also have demonstrated clear verses in Scripture that teach works (or works of faith) are a part of our salvation (See again here). Granted, this is only AFTER we are saved by God’s grace. But you cannot change the plain child like reading of all the works for salvation verses in the Bible. So you either have to ignore these verses or you have to come up with a “work around” to explain them away. Take for example of the Parable of the Talents in Matthew 25. The unprofitable servant is cast into outer darkness where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth. Yet, those who were faithful over a few things were told to enter the joy of their Lord. The Parable does not end with admonishing us to have more faith in Jesus as our Savior or to believe more on the gospel message as a remedy to being more fruitful. The Parable is only concerned with you doing something or you are not going to make it into God’s Kingdom. There are of course many more examples of these kinds of verses you would have to either ignore or change because they do not agree with your current belief.
While a believer must cooperate with God and walk with Him, works are ultimately done by Him doing the good work through us when we fully surrender to Him. It’s why the 24 elders cast down their crowns before Jesus. So all praise and glory is given to God for His working in us (Philippians 2:13). We are not looking to pat ourselves on the pat as you incorrectly assume.
You want “Perpetual Belief Alone Salvationism” to be true but you set up a contradiction by saying that a genuine saving faith will always produce good works to some degree. This sounds like Calvinism but in reverse order. As if you are turned intoWhy all the warnings in Scripture to be fruitful or to do good works if it was all just automatic to having faith? Again, I am not denying that God’s grace and mercy can help us to be fruitful like in 1 Corinthians 15:10, and Luke 7:36-50. But we are also told to affirm works constantly to others (Titus 3:8) so that they will not be unfruitful (Titus 3:14).
Your belief is a contradiction (i.e., it is confusion).
Hand #1. (On the one hand you say): “Works do not save.”
Hand #2. (On the other hand you say): “Works will always be present to show a true saving faith.”
In order to TRULY BELIEVE Hand #1, you have to claim that you can have no works and still be saved by a belief alone without works. That is the only consistent way for your statement by Hand #1 to actually work.
If you hold to Hand #2, then you must claim that works is a part of the salvation equation because you cannot ever have a faith lived out without any kind of works. Therefore, you would have to believe like I do in that works are necessary as a part of God’s plan of salvation. Why? Because you are saying that a true saving faith (belief alone) will always have works or fruit to show itself to be true.
This is why your belief is a contradiction and it is confusion.
But God is not the author of confusion. I am able to easily reconcile both the grace through faith without works verses by the apostle Paul, and being justified by works by James. This is something that your belief cannot allow.
Again, the burden of proof is on you to demonstrate this with Scripture instead of making claims with no biblical backing.
Again, I already told you that Catholics do not believe in the first aspect of salvation correctly in that we are saved by a belief alone.
One Catholic told me they see water baptism as a belief alone and that works will follow after. They see baptism as the entrance gate to salvation. But baptism is a ritual or work. So we do not exactly agree. The RCC also holds to many traditions (works) that are not found in Scripture. I believe we are FIRST saved by a BELIEF ALONE in the gospel message in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 in that Christ died for our sins, He was buried, and risen the third day. This is the gospel. It’s how you GET saved. It is also something we must continue to believe in as a part of salvation (See: 1 Corinthians 15:1-4). If we later one day choose to stop believing the gospel we will not be saved. But that is not our only instructions from the Lord in the New Testament as part of entering the Kingdom. You must take the next step of faith in Sanctification, which is a part of salvation (2 Thessalonians 2:13) (Romans 8:13) (Galatians 6:8-9) (1 Timothy 5:8). For a person can deny God by being reprobate unto every good work (Titus 1:16). People who deny God are not saved.
Not true. I have already shown to you that you are ripping the verse out of context in relation to James 1, and James 2 in my post #1169.
You also to do back flip twists through hoops of fire with poodles biting on your finger tips to avoid the many works for salvation verses I have already shown here. Explanations on at least 2-3 of them would be helpful. But I am not expecting that because we both know you cannot explain away Scripture without it sounding odd or silly.
Stephen had made a long winded sermon, and He was killed because of it (See: Acts 7).
So just because somebody speaks God’s Word for a lengthy amount of time does not automatically equate with it being unbiblical.
The Bereans were more noble because they searched the Scriptures to see whether those things be so or not (Acts 17:10-11).
Well, you are not doing that. You have given no indication to me here that you are going to look at the verses I presented.
First, I’ve already explained key verses in Romans 4 (See again here).
Paul is fighting against “Circumcision Salvationism” as was brought up by the council of believers in Acts 15.
So if somebody thought they had to FIRST be saved initially by circumcision, then they would be by-passing God’s grace through faith in Jesus in their Initial Salvation. It’s why Paul makes his whole point about whether Abraham believed first before he was circumcised (a work). Granted, we do not have to be circumcised. That is Old Covenant. The point was to illustrate the order of things. We are to first believe in Jesus for our salvation and not partake of circumcision to be initially saved. Paul makes the illustration of Abraham and his belief coming first before he did a work (circumcision). This is a parallel to our faith (Which has different instructions under the New Covenant).
Ephesians 2:8-9, Titus 3:5, and Romans 11:6 are all clearly in context to Initial Salvation (See again here).
Nothing is said in these verses about how we can continue in sin so that grace may abound.
Second, I also have demonstrated clear verses in Scripture that teach works (or works of faith) are a part of our salvation (See again here). Granted, this is only AFTER we are saved by God’s grace. But you cannot change the plain child like reading of all the works for salvation verses in the Bible. So you either have to ignore these verses or you have to come up with a “work around” to explain them away. Take for example of the Parable of the Talents in Matthew 25. The unprofitable servant is cast into outer darkness where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth. Yet, those who were faithful over a few things were told to enter the joy of their Lord. The Parable does not end with admonishing us to have more faith in Jesus as our Savior or to believe more on the gospel message as a remedy to being more fruitful. The Parable is only concerned with you doing something or you are not going to make it into God’s Kingdom. There are of course many more examples of these kinds of verses you would have to either ignore or change because they do not agree with your current belief.
While a believer must cooperate with God and walk with Him, works are ultimately done by Him doing the good work through us when we fully surrender to Him. It’s why the 24 elders cast down their crowns before Jesus. So all praise and glory is given to God for His working in us (Philippians 2:13). We are not looking to pat ourselves on the pat as you incorrectly assume.
You want “Perpetual Belief Alone Salvationism” to be true but you set up a contradiction by saying that a genuine saving faith will always produce good works to some degree. This sounds like Calvinism but in reverse order. As if you are turned intoWhy all the warnings in Scripture to be fruitful or to do good works if it was all just automatic to having faith? Again, I am not denying that God’s grace and mercy can help us to be fruitful like in 1 Corinthians 15:10, and Luke 7:36-50. But we are also told to affirm works constantly to others (Titus 3:8) so that they will not be unfruitful (Titus 3:14).
Your belief is a contradiction (i.e., it is confusion).
Hand #1. (On the one hand you say): “Works do not save.”
Hand #2. (On the other hand you say): “Works will always be present to show a true saving faith.”
In order to TRULY BELIEVE Hand #1, you have to claim that you can have no works and still be saved by a belief alone without works. That is the only consistent way for your statement by Hand #1 to actually work.
If you hold to Hand #2, then you must claim that works is a part of the salvation equation because you cannot ever have a faith lived out without any kind of works. Therefore, you would have to believe like I do in that works are necessary as a part of God’s plan of salvation. Why? Because you are saying that a true saving faith (belief alone) will always have works or fruit to show itself to be true.
This is why your belief is a contradiction and it is confusion.
But God is not the author of confusion. I am able to easily reconcile both the grace through faith without works verses by the apostle Paul, and being justified by works by James. This is something that your belief cannot allow.
Again, the burden of proof is on you to demonstrate this with Scripture instead of making claims with no biblical backing.
Again, I already told you that Catholics do not believe in the first aspect of salvation correctly in that we are saved by a belief alone.
One Catholic told me they see water baptism as a belief alone and that works will follow after. They see baptism as the entrance gate to salvation. But baptism is a ritual or work. So we do not exactly agree. The RCC also holds to many traditions (works) that are not found in Scripture. I believe we are FIRST saved by a BELIEF ALONE in the gospel message in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 in that Christ died for our sins, He was buried, and risen the third day. This is the gospel. It’s how you GET saved. It is also something we must continue to believe in as a part of salvation (See: 1 Corinthians 15:1-4). If we later one day choose to stop believing the gospel we will not be saved. But that is not our only instructions from the Lord in the New Testament as part of entering the Kingdom. You must take the next step of faith in Sanctification, which is a part of salvation (2 Thessalonians 2:13) (Romans 8:13) (Galatians 6:8-9) (1 Timothy 5:8). For a person can deny God by being reprobate unto every good work (Titus 1:16). People who deny God are not saved.
Not true. I have already shown to you that you are ripping the verse out of context in relation to James 1, and James 2 in my post #1169.
You also to do back flip twists through hoops of fire with poodles biting on your finger tips to avoid the many works for salvation verses I have already shown here. Explanations on at least 2-3 of them would be helpful. But I am not expecting that because we both know you cannot explain away Scripture without it sounding odd or silly.
-
1
- Show all
According to one source on the internet, it says:
Just because I post criticism in a debate that relates to the thread topic, and offer lots of information with Scripture does not mean I am meeting the criteria as mentioned above that would be defined as “trolling.”
I have seen this trolling thing before on other Christians forums before. Some Christians have posted pictures of trolls and other believers would laugh, etcetera. But this is not how things should be amongst believers. Jesus says we are to love our enemies. Even if a person was trolling, we should show them love. Saying that I am “trolling” when I was clearly not doing so is a false accusation. You may disagree with my belief strongly, but that does not mean I am trolling. Dan and I have discussed this topic at length on another forum. Like in other debates between Christians, they can offer lots of verses to defend their position. This does not mean they are trolling because they share lots of verses. You have no actual proof that I was actually trolling (Which fits the actual definition of what trolling actually is). I care for you deeply in Jesus Christ, and I only want only good things from our Lord to be upon you. So I am not wishing any ill will or bad upon you or anyone here. I am just sharing God’s Word. You and or others here can either take it or leave it.
“Trolling on the internet refers to the act of intentionally provoking, misleading, or harassing others online to evoke emotional reactions and disrupt conversations. Trolls typically engage in behavior that is meant to be inflammatory, offensive, or annoying. Their goal is often to create chaos, sow discord, or simply entertain themselves at the expense of others.
Common trolling tactics include posting inflammatory comments, spreading false information, engaging in personal attacks, and generally behaving in a disruptive or offensive manner. Trolls may target individuals, online communities, forums, or social media platforms.
It's important to note that trolling is distinct from legitimate, constructive criticism or debate. Trolls often operate with the intention of causing distress or annoyance rather than engaging in meaningful discussions”
Common trolling tactics include posting inflammatory comments, spreading false information, engaging in personal attacks, and generally behaving in a disruptive or offensive manner. Trolls may target individuals, online communities, forums, or social media platforms.
It's important to note that trolling is distinct from legitimate, constructive criticism or debate. Trolls often operate with the intention of causing distress or annoyance rather than engaging in meaningful discussions”
Just because I post criticism in a debate that relates to the thread topic, and offer lots of information with Scripture does not mean I am meeting the criteria as mentioned above that would be defined as “trolling.”
#1. I am not setting out to intentionally provoke others. I am using Scripture to discuss the topic.
#2. I am not posting inflammatory comments or harassing others here. I always strive to attack on the wrong belief and not the person and I use the Bible to do it.
#3. I never set out to make my posts to be overly offensive or annoying. I strive to keep things respectful and loving and stick with Scripture.
#4. I am also not seeking to sow discord so as to entertain myself at the expense of others. I realize that if I have not love in anything I do, it profits me nothing (1 Corinthians 13). In fact, I also realize that I am nothing and Christ is everything. I am just messenger of His Word. I did not write the Bible. God did. I am just telling folks what it says. If one disagrees, we can discuss it in a kind and respectful manner. That is why we are here, right? To discuss the Bible?
#5. Trolls seek to make personal attacks. I am not out to make it about any one person here. If a person does something wrong towards me, I will point out how they are not being fair with me. Disagreeing with a person’s belief or pointing out flaw in their position involving the Bible is not trolling. But I never set out to make it personal with anyone and I especially do not like to make personal attacks against anyone. My goal is to stick to the wrong belief and expose it with Scripture.
I have seen this trolling thing before on other Christians forums before. Some Christians have posted pictures of trolls and other believers would laugh, etcetera. But this is not how things should be amongst believers. Jesus says we are to love our enemies. Even if a person was trolling, we should show them love. Saying that I am “trolling” when I was clearly not doing so is a false accusation. You may disagree with my belief strongly, but that does not mean I am trolling. Dan and I have discussed this topic at length on another forum. Like in other debates between Christians, they can offer lots of verses to defend their position. This does not mean they are trolling because they share lots of verses. You have no actual proof that I was actually trolling (Which fits the actual definition of what trolling actually is). I care for you deeply in Jesus Christ, and I only want only good things from our Lord to be upon you. So I am not wishing any ill will or bad upon you or anyone here. I am just sharing God’s Word. You and or others here can either take it or leave it.
-
1
- Show all
If you were to pay attention to the context of Acts 20:30 of those who speak perverse things to draw away disciples after themselves, you would notice Paul mentions grievous wolves coming in among you not sparing the flock (Acts 20:29). How do we know what a wolf is? Jesus we will know these wolves by their fruits (Deeds) (See Matthew 7:15-16). So if a person does evil deeds, they are a wolf.
Anyway, my goal is to point people to the Bible and to obey it (Believing both the grace verses and the Sanctification verses). I did not write the Bible, and I am not looking for anyone to follow me but Jesus Christ and His Word. If they believe the Bible like I do, that would be great. But I know we are living in the last days. Granted, there will be a great revival during the Tribulation period, though.
In either case, I believe your assumptions about me are incorrect.
But we can agree to disagree in love and respect if you don’t want to engage on what I had written with Scripture.
Anyway, my goal is to point people to the Bible and to obey it (Believing both the grace verses and the Sanctification verses). I did not write the Bible, and I am not looking for anyone to follow me but Jesus Christ and His Word. If they believe the Bible like I do, that would be great. But I know we are living in the last days. Granted, there will be a great revival during the Tribulation period, though.
In either case, I believe your assumptions about me are incorrect.
But we can agree to disagree in love and respect if you don’t want to engage on what I had written with Scripture.
-
1
- Show all
I believe the King James Bible is just fine. I believe it is the Word of God that the church believed for hundreds of years long before the Modern Translation movement began with Westcott and Hort.
Anyway, to know Jesus Christ is to keep His commandments (See: 1 John 2:3-4).
So if we are not keeping His commands we are not abiding in the Lord Jesus.
Nobody can have eternal life by not abiding in Christ (See: 1 John 5:12, and 2 Corinthians 13:5).
Anyway, to know Jesus Christ is to keep His commandments (See: 1 John 2:3-4).
So if we are not keeping His commands we are not abiding in the Lord Jesus.
Nobody can have eternal life by not abiding in Christ (See: 1 John 5:12, and 2 Corinthians 13:5).
-
1
- Show all
In Matthew 25:14-30, the Parable of the Talents makes it clear that being unprofitable is a salvation issue. The unprofitable servant was cast into outer darkness where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth. Galatians 6:8-9 and 1 Timothy 5:8 actually teach works for salvation by the apostle Paul himself. Titus 1:16 says we can deny God by being reprobate unto every good work. A person denies God is not saved.
-
1
- Show all
We have had our book length discussion on another forum before. So it is nothing new, my friend.
He has also offered book length replies to me before.
Past tense. A one time event in our faith. We are told to continue in the faith, and to continue in God’s grace.
So his grace is not forever enforced upon us if we do not continue in the faith.
Titus 2:11-12 says God’s grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world.
Paul condemns the idea that we are to continue in sin so that grace may abound.
Read Titus 3:5 in context. It’s talking about ”Initial Salvation” because it says we are saved by the washing and regeneration of the Holy Ghost. This happened when we were born again spiritually, which was when we first got saved.
Uh, no. Ephesians 5:25-27 is not referring to a one time event, but a continual washing. It says washing of the water of the Word. It is also in context to one loving their wife. This would be in action and not by a belief alone or with words alone. One loves their wife by their actions in being faithful to her. If they are unfaithful to their wife, they are not loving towards her.
But the children of the kingdom will be cast into outer darkness (See: Matthew 8:12). So just being a child of the Kingdom guarantees nothing of your entrance into the Kingdom by any means (See: Matthew 13:41-42, and the compare it with John 8:34-35).
He has also offered book length replies to me before.
Past tense. A one time event in our faith. We are told to continue in the faith, and to continue in God’s grace.
So his grace is not forever enforced upon us if we do not continue in the faith.
Titus 2:11-12 says God’s grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world.
Paul condemns the idea that we are to continue in sin so that grace may abound.
Read Titus 3:5 in context. It’s talking about ”Initial Salvation” because it says we are saved by the washing and regeneration of the Holy Ghost. This happened when we were born again spiritually, which was when we first got saved.
Uh, no. Ephesians 5:25-27 is not referring to a one time event, but a continual washing. It says washing of the water of the Word. It is also in context to one loving their wife. This would be in action and not by a belief alone or with words alone. One loves their wife by their actions in being faithful to her. If they are unfaithful to their wife, they are not loving towards her.
But the children of the kingdom will be cast into outer darkness (See: Matthew 8:12). So just being a child of the Kingdom guarantees nothing of your entrance into the Kingdom by any means (See: Matthew 13:41-42, and the compare it with John 8:34-35).
-
1
- Show all
It says this
Matthew 8:12 in Other Translations12 while the sons of the kingdom will be thrown into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth." 12 But many Israelites—those for whom the Kingdom was prepared—will be thrown into outer darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.”
It's says The sons in this translation
God even relates to fallen angels as being sons are you sure you have it completely right that this means saved children or Christians ?
Matthew 8:12 in Other Translations12 while the sons of the kingdom will be thrown into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth." 12 But many Israelites—those for whom the Kingdom was prepared—will be thrown into outer darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.”
It's says The sons in this translation
God even relates to fallen angels as being sons are you sure you have it completely right that this means saved children or Christians ?
-
1
- Show all
It is written,
In addition, would you believe me if I told you about my life? Well, trust needs to be earned. I confide in those who believe the Word of God as I do. Furthermore, it does not matter if most of the whole world was not living correctly. God's Word is still the standard and the standard is not my life alone. God destroyed an entire world with a global flood except for eight people. We walk by faith and not by sight. I am not above God's Word in what it says anymore than you are. If the Bible tells me to be ye holy, that is something I have to accept (Whether I like it or not). Hebrews 12:14 says without holiness, no man shall see the Lord. Will I make it into God’s Kingdom? According to Scripture, God is the one who can make His servant to stand or fall. I choose to fight the good fight and lay hold on eternal life as 1 Timothy 6 says. But most Christians today do not even belief they have to fight.
5 "Trust ye not in a friend, put ye not confidence in a guide: keep the doors of thy mouth from her that lieth in thy bosom.
6 For the son dishonoureth the father, the daughter riseth up against her mother, the daughter in law against her mother in law; a man's enemies are the men of his own house." (Micah 7:5-6).
In addition, would you believe me if I told you about my life? Well, trust needs to be earned. I confide in those who believe the Word of God as I do. Furthermore, it does not matter if most of the whole world was not living correctly. God's Word is still the standard and the standard is not my life alone. God destroyed an entire world with a global flood except for eight people. We walk by faith and not by sight. I am not above God's Word in what it says anymore than you are. If the Bible tells me to be ye holy, that is something I have to accept (Whether I like it or not). Hebrews 12:14 says without holiness, no man shall see the Lord. Will I make it into God’s Kingdom? According to Scripture, God is the one who can make His servant to stand or fall. I choose to fight the good fight and lay hold on eternal life as 1 Timothy 6 says. But most Christians today do not even belief they have to fight.
-
1
- Show all
There is no Jew or Gentile in Christ (Galatians 3:28).
Plus, Matthew 8 is in context to the Centurion who had great faith, whereby Jesus marveled.
Besides, the phrase, “children of the kingdom“ is also used in Matthew 13:38 and it refers to the good seed at the Judgment.
If you were to read Matthew 13:41-42, it says that the Son of Man (JESUS) will send forth His angels and they will gather out of HIS KINGDOM all who do iniquity and they will be cast into the furnace of fire (i.e., the Lake of Fire).
The prodigal son was said to be dead when he was living it up with prostitutes by his own father (Luke 15).
The parable is speaking in spiritual terms because the prodigal son did not die physically. The parable teaches that the son was dead and he became “alive AGAIN” spiritually. This same truth is taught in James 5:19-20.
Plus, Matthew 8 is in context to the Centurion who had great faith, whereby Jesus marveled.
Besides, the phrase, “children of the kingdom“ is also used in Matthew 13:38 and it refers to the good seed at the Judgment.
If you were to read Matthew 13:41-42, it says that the Son of Man (JESUS) will send forth His angels and they will gather out of HIS KINGDOM all who do iniquity and they will be cast into the furnace of fire (i.e., the Lake of Fire).
The prodigal son was said to be dead when he was living it up with prostitutes by his own father (Luke 15).
The parable is speaking in spiritual terms because the prodigal son did not die physically. The parable teaches that the son was dead and he became “alive AGAIN” spiritually. This same truth is taught in James 5:19-20.
-
1
- Show all
God called Isreal his first born
Refering to them as sons before Jesus was born and before the holy spirit was given
Then God told us in Jeremiah many in Isreal in those days will be treacherous. Was God refering to those sons being saved when he said this .
You was quoting from the faith of a centurion. The centurion was saved to me. Jesus was talking to him about other sons
Refering to them as sons before Jesus was born and before the holy spirit was given
Then God told us in Jeremiah many in Isreal in those days will be treacherous. Was God refering to those sons being saved when he said this .
You was quoting from the faith of a centurion. The centurion was saved to me. Jesus was talking to him about other sons
