The battle of Gog and Magog before the Millennium?
- Thread starter Nehemiah6
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All you have to do is first study Revelation 19 (which has the battle of Armageddon BEFORE the Millennium ) and then study Revelation 20 (which has the battle of Gog and Magog AFTER the Millennium). This is not rocket science. There is NOTHING FIGURATIVE about the Millennium, and that is why "a" or "one" thousand years is mentioned six times in seven verses.
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I respect that idea, but what if Revelation 19 and 20 are separate visions. The last part of chapter 19 seems to be a figurative description of the victorious Jesus at his Second Coming, while Revelation 20 begins with Jesus' First Coming, Satan's confinement so that he can't impede the spread of the gospel all over the earth, his release (perhaps in our modern era), and the one Final Judgment like Jesus' description of it in Matthew 25.
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Additional info:
The main evidences are:
1. There are no NT examples of chilioi meaning more or less than exactly a thousand.
2. It (chilioi) still means exactly a thousand when paired with other numbers.
3. It's uses in the bible (chilioi) are of exactly a thousand every single time it appears.
4. When an unknown amount is used, the word used is G5505 chilias (not chilioi G5507), and it is used twice in a row.
5. G5507 chilioi is never used in this double fashion.
6. The double appearance of G5505 chilias is not found in Revelation 20.
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Revelation is as much literal as it is symbolic such as the letters to the churches and various warnings about this or that, saints being overcome and killed and armies going here or there.
Revelation also uses a Greek word that can mean an unknown amount based on the idea of a thousand and it also uses a Greek word that can only mean a thousand. That's why it is essential to study all the words used in Revelation that have some relation to a thousand.
Here is an example using English to show how something written can have a literal use of exactly a thousand and also use something that means much more than a thousand.
A man is selling a piece of art that is historically important and valuable. He is asked how much he wants and he says, "I'm not sure but certainly thousands." A buyer replies, "I agree it's valuable but your asking price is too high and incalculable so I offer a thousand dollars."
So here we have something using the word thousand which is an unknown amount while we also have an exact amount of a thousand. Revelation also has the same usages of something using the word thousand which is an unknown amount while it also has a word that is an exact amount of a thousand.
Here we have a Greek word G1367 dischilioi. "Dis" means two or twice and chilioi (G5507) means a thousand so this word means two thousand. Naturally then if there was one chilioi (G5507) (found in Revelation 20) it would be exactly a thousand just as it is in every occurrence of the word in the NT.
G1367 dischilioi means 2,000. It cannot mean 10,000. It cannot mean 1,000. It has a fixed meaning.
In order to use Greek and speak of an unknown number the use of chilias G5505 which means a thousand but when used twice, it represents "thousands and thousands" which is an unknown amount.
Back to the story above. Someone in the future might read the story and try to argue that the buyers offer was more than a thousand because in a different culture and different language and in a different religion, in a book written thousands of years before that art story, they used a thousand as a figurative number. Well, that is completely unrelated to the art story and it's language and culture.
The main evidences are:
1. There are no NT examples of chilioi meaning more or less than exactly a thousand.
2. It (chilioi) still means exactly a thousand when paired with other numbers.
3. It's uses in the bible (chilioi) are of exactly a thousand every single time it appears.
4. When an unknown amount is used, the word used is G5505 chilias (not chilioi G5507), and it is used twice in a row.
5. G5507 chilioi is never used in this double fashion.
6. The double appearance of G5505 chilias is not found in Revelation 20.
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Revelation is as much literal as it is symbolic such as the letters to the churches and various warnings about this or that, saints being overcome and killed and armies going here or there.
Revelation also uses a Greek word that can mean an unknown amount based on the idea of a thousand and it also uses a Greek word that can only mean a thousand. That's why it is essential to study all the words used in Revelation that have some relation to a thousand.
Here is an example using English to show how something written can have a literal use of exactly a thousand and also use something that means much more than a thousand.
A man is selling a piece of art that is historically important and valuable. He is asked how much he wants and he says, "I'm not sure but certainly thousands." A buyer replies, "I agree it's valuable but your asking price is too high and incalculable so I offer a thousand dollars."
So here we have something using the word thousand which is an unknown amount while we also have an exact amount of a thousand. Revelation also has the same usages of something using the word thousand which is an unknown amount while it also has a word that is an exact amount of a thousand.
Here we have a Greek word G1367 dischilioi. "Dis" means two or twice and chilioi (G5507) means a thousand so this word means two thousand. Naturally then if there was one chilioi (G5507) (found in Revelation 20) it would be exactly a thousand just as it is in every occurrence of the word in the NT.
G1367 dischilioi means 2,000. It cannot mean 10,000. It cannot mean 1,000. It has a fixed meaning.
In order to use Greek and speak of an unknown number the use of chilias G5505 which means a thousand but when used twice, it represents "thousands and thousands" which is an unknown amount.
Back to the story above. Someone in the future might read the story and try to argue that the buyers offer was more than a thousand because in a different culture and different language and in a different religion, in a book written thousands of years before that art story, they used a thousand as a figurative number. Well, that is completely unrelated to the art story and it's language and culture.
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Where did you get the idea that all Scripture is literal? Look at Revelation 12, the most obvious example. A dragon attacks a child born of a woman, Old and Testament people of God, and sweeps a third of the stars out of the heavens. Obviously, the dragon stands for Satan, who is not a literal one but is a rebel-angel. The stars are not literal celestial bodies but, of course, stand for the angels who followed him into the war against God. The child is obviously Jesus. The woman escapes into the desert, symbolic of the world short of the blessings of faith. Therefore, the Book of Revelation is like the many "apocalyptic" books of that same era, but inspired of God to comfort believers that he is still in charge.
Obviously, it depends on the type of literature a book is. Historical, prophetic, and teaching books are literal, but Revelation is not, though its figurative language points to real spiritual realities.
Obviously, it depends on the type of literature a book is. Historical, prophetic, and teaching books are literal, but Revelation is not, though its figurative language points to real spiritual realities.
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Why is it that people have such a hard time reading and believing Revelation in is plain LITERAL sense? Sure, there are many symbols in this book, but they are generally explained as to what they mean.
Why would Christ say that the ones who read it and "keep those things which are written thereinwill be blessed" if it were not to be taken literally? For the unsaved, it is a huge incentive to get saved. For the saved, it is a huge incentive to be positive in spite of all the judgments to come. Ultimately sin and death will be eradicated from the earth, and there will be New Heavens and a New Earth after the Millennium.
Why would Christ say that the ones who read it and "keep those things which are written thereinwill be blessed" if it were not to be taken literally? For the unsaved, it is a huge incentive to get saved. For the saved, it is a huge incentive to be positive in spite of all the judgments to come. Ultimately sin and death will be eradicated from the earth, and there will be New Heavens and a New Earth after the Millennium.
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You can even look at the wokism teachings and beliefs like transgender ideology of promoting gender doubt in children and then promoting the genital mutilation and chemical puberty blockers and other such hormone treatment that will in the future lead to many of these children having destroyed adult lives.. This is just one example of the plunge into insane thinking running riot though world societies.. Of course those who have their minds guarded by The Holy Spirit can see how this madness is infecting the people around us..
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