Women Pastors

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Mar 7, 2024
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I agree with you. God can use everyone. I believe God puts us all in places to help people who are struggling or who are lost.
God loves all 🥰
The risen Christ appeared to woman first.
I have been to four Good Friday church services since finding Jesus and I have never heard anyone deliver Gods message like this woman pastor. She had such a genuine love and passion for Jesus. After the service on Good Friday she picked up a wooden cross and marched through the town preaching Gods word and the whole church followed her. Some people carried on their way but so many people stopped and were listening some even joining in the march. It was amazing to watch what God was doing. It was like he was using this woman to round his children up.
The Bible doesn't say that a woman can't preach smoothly and eloquently, that's not disputed by anyone. It's only the authority to preach and teach the Church, that's forbidden by God.

We could talk about all kinds of things that go on in Churches, which seem harmless to us. But God doesn't see things our way. God's Word tells us that there's a way that seems right to man, but it leads to death. So even things which seem bonnie and harmless to man lead to destruction and damnation.

It's extremely dangerous to changes Gods order, to accommodate progressive ideologies.
 

posthuman

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The curse put on women included two things: pain in childbirth as a REMINDER that her husband must rule over her.
Almost correct. The childbirth pain and husband ruling over wife are separate and independent curses;


Adam and Woman were not cursed

Satan was cursed, and the ground was cursed for Adam's sake.

both Adam and Woman confessed their sins and were given the gospel, covered with the sacrifice of a lamb, and believed. the way to the garden is kept / preserved by cherubim and The Sword.
 
Mar 7, 2024
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I pulled out just these ^ two parts of your post, to ask you a question regarding your perspective, if you don't mind :)


What is your understanding of the following passage (esp the part with the bold emphasis, and in view of its context):

Acts 18 -

24Now a certain Jew named Apollos, a native of Alexandria, came to Ephesus, being an eloquent man, mighty in the Scriptures. 25He was instructed in the way of the Lord. And being fervent in spirit, he was speaking and was teaching earnestly the things concerning Jesus, knowing only the baptism of John. 26And he [Apollos] began to speak boldly in the synagogue. But Priscilla and Aquila having heard him, took him to them and [they] expounded the way of God to him more accurately [/more perfectly].


My question: do you believe it was "wrong" of Priscilla to be involved in this "expounding" to Apollos (which surely involved explaining so that he would have a better understanding than he previously had to that point)?
Is it your view that Priscilla should have remained completely "silent" (since it involved "expounding" to him, a fellow-believer) and not been at all involved, other than to sit "silently" beside Aquila while he alone spoke to Apollos?




Just wondering your perspective on this, given your quotes above. Thanks. :)
Apollos never claimed to be a Church Minister, he was an Egyptian who studied scripture so he had a good knowledge of old testament scripture. But he wasn't a born again baptized Christian Minister.

Apollos was speaking about Jesus to the Jews in the Synagogue, not as an ordained Christian Minister so it was OK for the ladies to share their knowledge about Jesus with him. He wasn't offended by the women correcting him as he was still learning about Christianity.
 

posthuman

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Apollos never claimed to be a Church Minister, he was an Egyptian who studied scripture so he had a good knowledge of old testament scripture. But he wasn't a born again baptized Christian Minister.

Apollos was speaking about Jesus to the Jews in the Synagogue, not as an ordained Christian Minister so it was OK for the ladies to share their knowledge about Jesus with him. He wasn't offended by the women correcting him as he was still learning about Christianity.
i should point out that Aquila is a man and Apollo is a Jew, and that there was no such thing as 'ordained ministers' in the sense the word is used today.
 

TheDivineWatermark

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Apollos never claimed to be a Church Minister, he was an Egyptian who studied scripture so he had a good knowledge of old testament scripture. But he wasn't a born again baptized Christian Minister.

Apollos was speaking about Jesus to the Jews in the Synagogue, not as an ordained Christian Minister so it was OK for the ladies to share their knowledge about Jesus with him. He wasn't offended by the women correcting him as he was still learning about Christianity.
Okay, so you are saying that it was perfectly okay for this husband and wife (Aquila and Priscilla) to speak to this man (Apollos), with both the husband and the wife "expounding" to him (so that, Priscilla did not have to remain "silent" with regard to this "expounding").


("2 And found a certain Jew named Aquila, born in Pontus, lately come from Italy, with his wife Priscilla...")




Okay, the way I was reading your post was that women should remain "silent" in more instances than just within an assembly setting.

Such as "teaching OTHER CHRISTIANS" anywhere (outside of the assembly meetings).

Charlie_2024 said:
But no woman is allowed to teach Christians.
11Let a womana learn in quietness, in all submissiveness. 12But I do not permit a woman to teach, nor to use authority over a man,b but to be in quietness.

I apologize if I've misunderstood your viewpoint.
 

Dino246

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Eve was created to be his "helper" to do all she can do to make his job easier.
I strongly suggest you do some homework on the Hebrew word translated "helper"... look particularly at the subject of that noun in all its uses, then come back and review this passage.

b. The curse put on women included two things: pain in childbirth as a REMINDER that her husband must rule over her. (This is because her sin was that she blatantly acted against what Adam had told her that God required of them both
You seem to be fond of adding to Scripture in order to support your presuppositions. God did not curse Eve or Adam; He cursed the serpent and the ground.

He declared to the man and woman what the consequences of their sin would be. If you think that women need a reminder that men must rule over them, then by extension you must also believe that men need thorns and thistles to remind them that their labour must be painful and hard. I'm quite certain that you haven't given this adequate thought.

Phoebe was a deaconess, as is plainly stated in Romans 16:1-2 (says she was a “servant” in a church – G1249 in Strong’s Greek Dictionary - attendant, servant or deaconess), which actually uses the Greek word "Deaconess." That this was an official office is clear by the clause, "of the assembly in Cenchrea."

Deaconesses were given responsibilities of assisting the female members, including counseling, etc., especially in things where male leadership would not be appropriate, such as one-on one instruction. And like Phoebe, some Godly women held enormous responsibilities regarding finances of the assembly. In this passage, she was sent from her home assembly to another assembly on "business." She was therefore no doubt the "treasurer" of that assembly, and could conduct finances in their name.
Now apply that (extrabiblical) logic to 1 Timothy and Titus. If a woman is a deacon, then the qualifications for deacons must apply for women as well as men.
 
Dec 3, 2023
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Absurd theory.
Christians His Bride shows that every Christians Are all women's identities,Every Christian can't call himself a pastor.
So women in the Bible can't teach.It means that only one person can teach us that is Jesus.
Many pastors Taught Wrong theory Different from what Jesus taught.
They are those "women" who should not teach.
 

SunshineGirl

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The Bible doesn't say that a woman can't preach smoothly and eloquently, that's not disputed by anyone. It's only the authority to preach and teach the Church, that's forbidden by God.

We could talk about all kinds of things that go on in Churches, which seem harmless to us. But God doesn't see things our way. God's Word tells us that there's a way that seems right to man, but it leads to death. So even things which seem bonnie and harmless to man lead to destruction and damnation.

It's extremely dangerous to changes Gods order, to accommodate progressive ideologies.
You said that woman can't preach or teach the church but aren't the children part of the church?
As I read it Jesus loves children and had a go at his disciples for stopping the children coming to him. He actually goes on to tell them that the kingdom of heaven belong to such as these.
 
Mar 7, 2024
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You said that woman can't preach or teach the church but aren't the children part of the church?
As I read it Jesus loves children and had a go at his disciples for stopping the children coming to him. He actually goes on to tell them that the kingdom of heaven belong to such as these.
No, children cannot be a part of the Church. The requirement for Church membership is a genuine conversion evidenced by the persons way of life and then they need to be Baptized.

A child is not able to make a profession of faith, until they're mature enough understand what it means. The Biblical Church does not baptize babies as some non Biblical Churches do, we don't consider them to be legitimate Churches because they don't adhere to Gods design.
Jesus chastised His disciples for trying to stop the children from coming to Him, because He wanted to demonstrate they they are loved by God and they are not to be treated as unworthy to be in the company of the Lord.

Jesus was reminding His disciples of what He said in Matthew 18:3-5 when He said;

“Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven. Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

We see in the above verses, that Jesus was teaching His disciples the importance of humility. The disciples suffered the old "holier than thou" syndrome which is very prevalent today. Whereby seasoned Christians look down on new converts. Jesus put them in their place by saying the humble will be the greatest in heaven.

All Christians go to heaven but everyone will be rewarded according to his works, so those who promoted themselves as the elite will find themselves at the bottom of the pecking order in heaven.
 

posthuman

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No, children cannot be a part of the Church. The requirement for Church membership is a genuine conversion evidenced by the persons way of life and then they need to be Baptized.

A child is not able to make a profession of faith, until they're mature enough understand what it means. The Biblical Church does not baptize babies as some non Biblical Churches do, we don't consider them to be legitimate Churches because they don't adhere to Gods design.
Jesus chastised His disciples for trying to stop the children from coming to Him, because He wanted to demonstrate they they are loved by God and they are not to be treated as unworthy to be in the company of the Lord.

Jesus was reminding His disciples of what He said in Matthew 18:3-5 when He said;

“Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven. Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

We see in the above verses, that Jesus was teaching His disciples the importance of humility. The disciples suffered the old "holier than thou" syndrome which is very prevalent today. Whereby seasoned Christians look down on new converts. Jesus put them in their place by saying the humble will be the greatest in heaven.

All Christians go to heaven but everyone will be rewarded according to his works, so those who promoted themselves as the elite will find themselves at the bottom of the pecking order in heaven.
in Luke 2, how old was Jesus when He was dialoging the scribes and teachers in the temple?
12 - a year before the Jewish coming-of-age.

now, as an human He is extraordinary - a man in which there is no sin, the likes of which was never seen since Adam - but why do you suppose He put in His book this record? why is it there specified He is still a child?

there are any number of things we as adults do not understand, but still believe. perhaps all things, ha!
so i would not be so quick to dismiss children in the way you have.
 

p_rehbein

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Sep 4, 2013
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Did you know that God's Word teaches that only men can be anointed / called to be pastors, deacons, church leaders?
Woman can assist and help in ministry, but the are not called by the Lord to be church leaders.

It's in the new testament for all the see:
Did you know that in the entire Bible, Old and New Testaments, there is not one Scripture where God says women can not have authority over men? Did you know that? Hmm...
 

Evmur

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What was a "prophetess"?

A prophetess was one through whom God spoke. But this has nothing to do with holding an office in the assembly.
What about Christian or spiritual books written by Christian women. Should I not read a book on spiritual topics if it's written by a woman?

Older Christian women should be teaching younger women, and then only those things that relate to what God commands of women. That does not all have to be "religious." There is a lot of practical teaching that godly older Christian woman can teach to the younger and less experienced. Here is what the Lord said thru the Apostle Paul:

1 Timothy 2:8-15
8 I desire therefore that the men pray everywhere, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting;
9 in like manner also, that the women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with propriety and moderation, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or costly clothing,
10 but, which is proper for women professing godliness, with good works.
11 Let a woman learn in silence with all submission.
12 And I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, but to be in silence.
13 For Adam was formed first, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression.
15 Nevertheless she will be saved in childbearing if they continue in faith, love, and holiness, with self-control.

Titus 2:1-5
1 But as for you, speak the things which are proper for sound doctrine:
2 that the older men be sober, reverent, temperate, sound in faith, in love, in patience;
3 the older women likewise, that they be reverent in behavior, not slanderers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things--
4 that they admonish the young women to love their husbands, to love their children,
5 to be discreet, chaste, homemakers, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God may not be blasphemed.

So, here is the nuts and bolts of it:

1. Women are to act and dress very modestly, not wearing clothing jewelry, or anything that is not "modest." Modesty does not ONLY means covering up the private and semi-private parts. It also means "plain" -- the opposite of glamorous, bold, attention seeking, expensive, etc.

2. She is to adorn herself with "good works." That is not defined as preaching, or writing books, or being the star of the show, or a celebrity. It is being a servant to other individuals, particularly those within her own assembly, those who have a need.

3. She is not allowed to teach in mixed company, the reasons are as follows (all being theological not cultural)
a. God created Adam to be the leader, teacher, provider, and protector of his family, and Eve was created to be his "helper" to do all she can do to make his job easier.

b. The curse put on women included two things: pain in childbirth as a REMINDER that her husband must rule over her. (This is because her sin was that she blatantly acted against what Adam had told her that God required of them both, circumventing his God-given authority and role). So, you can ask Joyce Meyer if she had any pain during childbirth (or had to take medication to help ease the pain), and if she did, then she is under this curse which required her to be obedient to her husband in all things. And according to Paul, her not being allowed to teach in mixed company stems from this as well.

4. Women do have a role to play in teaching their children. But when they become "empty-nesters" they are to graduate to teaching adult Christian women. And the thing they are to teach is what they have themselves been practicing and have become proficient at -- how to successfully raise a family, honor and take care of her husband and, how to make her home and household prosper . IN other words, she should already be an expert at this, and already have a good track-record and reputation among the assembly as having lived out these things in her home life successfully. The thrust of her teaching is not theology, except as it relates to the above.

So, if you want to read Joyce Meyer or any other similar teacher, just brace yourself for being deceived by her. When Eve decided to go beyond the boundaries God established for women, Satan was very eager to to seize the opportunity to exploit her. And it is no different today. That does not mean she is not a good teacher, or might not have some good solid teachings. But if her LIFE does not reflect these things, she is disobedient to the Word, which negates anything good she might have to say.

Women were not allowed to hold any office in the assembly that involved teaching men or exercising any kind of authority over the men, (which would place her over her own husband in the assembly). However, the NT supports the role of woman serving in the office of "Deaconess," the female version of "Deacons."

Phoebe was a deaconess, as is plainly stated in Romans 16:1-2 (says she was a “servant” in a church – G1249 in Strong’s Greek Dictionary - attendant, servant or deaconess), which actually uses the Greek word "Deaconess." That this was an official office is clear by the clause, "of the assembly in Cenchrea."

Deaconesses were given responsibilities of assisting the female members, including counseling, etc., especially in things where male leadership would not be appropriate, such as one-on one instruction. And like Phoebe, some Godly women held enormous responsibilities regarding finances of the assembly. In this passage, she was sent from her home assembly to another assembly on "business." She was therefore no doubt the "treasurer" of that assembly, and could conduct finances in their name.
what if the men won't step up?
 

Evmur

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I believe you meant "apostles" and yes all the apostles were men. The issue of "capability" does not come up in this regard. God did have prophetesses, but it was not their capability but the Holy Spirit speaking through them.

However when it comes to spiritual leadership in the home and in the local church, God has clearly demarcated the roles of men and women. When it comes to salvation and the Body of Christ, there are no distinctions whatsoever. All are children of God by faith in Christ, and all may be saved by grace through faith.
Prophetesses, wimmin can preach and they can pray

... I can't think of anything more anyone, male or female could desire.
 

Evmur

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Did you know that God's Word teaches that only men can be anointed / called to be pastors, deacons, church leaders?
Woman can assist and help in ministry, but the are not called by the Lord to be church leaders.

It's in the new testament for all the see:

Qualifications for Ministry

1 Timothy 3:1-13
This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desires a good work.
A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behavior, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
One that rules well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
(For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.


Bishop - Strongs G1985
a superintendent, i.e. Christian officer in genitive case charge of a (or the) church (literally or figuratively): KJV -- bishop, overseer.

Deacons - Strongs G1249
from an obsolete diako (to run on errands; compare 1377); an attendant, i.e. (genitive case) a waiter (at table or in other menial duties); specially, a Christian teacher and pastor (technically, a deacon): KJV -- deacon, minister, servant.

Titus 1:6-9
If any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly.
For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not self willed, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre;
But a lover of hospitality, a lover of good men, sober, just, holy, temperate;
Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.


1 Timothy 2:12,13
I do not allow a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
For Adam was first formed, then Eve


Paul bases his viewpoint on creation. In v. 13 he says, "For Adam was first created, then Eve." In the least, this argument shows that Paul is not restricting his treatment to the church; it's a matter that is grounded in the constitutional differences between men and women, or at least in the order of authority that God had ordained.

In Gen 2-3, we see an interesting phenomenon relevant to 1 Tim 2. God teaches man, man teaches woman, the devil is out of the picture. That's Gen 2. But in Gen 3, we see the devil teaching woman, woman teaching man, and God is out of the picture. And this is Paul's argument: there is a divinely ordained order to things that, if disturbed, would bring deception and ruin due to not following the ways of the Lord.

1 Timothy 2:12 - Almost every commentator says that women should not pastor or teach over men. The argument the Apostle Paul gives for his statement "I do not permit a women to teach or to exercise authority over a man" is found in the following 2 verses. His argument is actually not from culture as some claim but from creation.

The validity of his argument and the weight of this statement plants its roots in the creation order. Which means that the statement he makes regarding women not teaching over men (essentially pastoring) stands for all-time and to all cultures everywhere, because he doesn’t appeal to culture for his reasons but the creation ORDER which is simply honoring the way God decided to create.
I recommend to you our sister Phoebe, a deaconess of the church at Cenchreae that you may receive her in the Lord as befits the saints and help her in whatsoever she requires of you for she has been a helper of many and of me also.
Romans 16 1. 2
verse 3. Greet Prisca and Aquila my fellow workers in Christ Jesus.
 

2ndTimeIsTheCharm

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Feb 17, 2023
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No, children cannot be a part of the Church. The requirement for Church membership is a genuine conversion evidenced by the persons way of life and then they need to be Baptized.

A child is not able to make a profession of faith, until they're mature enough understand what it means. The Biblical Church does not baptize babies as some non Biblical Churches do, we don't consider them to be legitimate Churches because they don't adhere to Gods design.
Jesus chastised His disciples for trying to stop the children from coming to Him, because He wanted to demonstrate they they are loved by God and they are not to be treated as unworthy to be in the company of the Lord.

Jesus was reminding His disciples of what He said in Matthew 18:3-5 when He said;

“Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven. Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

We see in the above verses, that Jesus was teaching His disciples the importance of humility. The disciples suffered the old "holier than thou" syndrome which is very prevalent today. Whereby seasoned Christians look down on new converts. Jesus put them in their place by saying the humble will be the greatest in heaven.

All Christians go to heaven but everyone will be rewarded according to his works, so those who promoted themselves as the elite will find themselves at the bottom of the pecking order in heaven.

This makes me wonder. Do you think children who haven't reached the age of accountability will not go to heaven if they die before that or won't be raptured when Jesus returns?

Either way, I think it's important for mothers to teach their children about Jesus at the earliest age possible. (Infants can hear their mother around the 26th week for example so it would be good if they hear Mom pray to Jesus aloud and read the Bible out loud to them regularly while the fetus is developing). Young children are more accepting of Jesus and His ways at early ages.

The way you talk about your church, even if you don't see the children of church members as being part of the church, you do STILL teach them about Jesus right???


what if the men won't step up?

God will raise up willing women to do what God wants. His work won't be stopped just because no man will step up. That should shame the men! I think feminization of the church has also encouraged the men to become lax.


🍇
 

Dino246

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Chapter and verse please
It's rather thoughtless to ask for "chapter and verse" after being told plainly that the relevant information is not in Scripture.
 
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