How do you get saved?

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Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
#521
Dec 18, 2021
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#521
Wansvic said:
Since you disagree. Please tell me what this scripture means if not what it says:

"Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls." Acts 2:36-41
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1. You must study the word.
2. Lets see what Peter said.

Repent This is written in 2nd person plural. in other words. the command is given to everyone

And let every one of you be baptized - written in 3rd person singular. So this is not only a separate command, but is not even given to the same people

for the remission of sin, This is the object of the command be baptized, in other words. Because you received remission of sin be baptized.

And ye shall recieve the gift of the spirit, again, this goes 2nd person plural. so this is the object of the first commend, repent.

in other words. this can be interpreted as the following

repent and you shall receive the gift of the spirit,. and let every one of you (who repented) be baptized on the fact you have received remission of sin (proven by the fact you have already received the spirit)

and this is proven by the next words.

And they who GLAD:LY RECIEVED (repented) were baptized.. Just Like peter commanded them to be.. Not to be saved, but because they were saved.
 
E

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
#522
Dec 18, 2021
5,938
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#522
mailmandan said:
The only proper conclusion when properly harmonizing scripture with scripture is that faith in Jesus Christ "implied in genuine repentance" (rather than water baptism) brings the remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit. (Luke 24:47; Acts 2:38; 3:19; 5:31; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 15:7-9; 16:31; 26:18) *Perfect Harmony*

Hence, "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
" 2 Tim 2:15
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sadly. some can not get out of their own way
 
fredoheaven

fredoheaven

Senior Member
#523
Nov 17, 2015
4,110
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#523
Wansvic said:
Context...
Man did nothing to deserve God's willingness to make a way of salvation. It is up to man whether to accept or reject God's established plan as detailed in the word. (Acts 2:4-42, 8:12-18, 9:17-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-7, 22:16)

Titus 3:3-6
For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.
But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
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Salvation is the work of the Holy Ghost. Water Baptism is the work of man.
 
Lamar

Lamar

Active member
#524
May 21, 2023
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#524
mailmandan said:
Once again, if water baptism is absolutely required for salvation, then we would expect Jesus to mention it in the following verses. (3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26) Yet what is the 1 requirement that Jesus mentions 9 different times in each of these complete statements *BELIEVES. *What happened to baptism? *Hermeneutics.

John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who (is not water baptized? - NO) does not believe is condemned already, because he has not (been water baptized? - NO) because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Your argument is with John 3:18 and not with me.

There are a handful of alleged prooftexts which are often cited by water-salvationists in an effort to prove that the Bible makes baptism mandatory for salvation. Yet a careful examination of each of these texts in context will show that none of them prove that baptism is absolutely required for salvation, though they do prove that baptism was an assumed initiatory response to the gospel of salvation. In other words, these texts only prove that baptism is associated with salvation, rather than absolutely required for salvation.
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Once again, if faith alone is the absolutely only thing required for salvation, then we would expect Jesus to mention alone or only in the following verses. (3:15,16,18; 5:24;6:29,40,47; 11:25,26) Yet what is the one 1 word that Jesus does not mention 9 different times in each of these complete statements "Alone." What happened to only faith?

Mark 16:16 - Whoever believes (believes only? NO) and is baptized shall be saved but he who does not believe will be condemned.

Your argument is with Mark 16:16 and not with me.

Many will present general verses about the need for faith as proof texts for non-obedience salvation in a effort to force the mandatory allegiance to faith alone regeneration theology. These are the modern day Pharisees that cherry pick generalities and label them as definitive. Branding anyone who disagrees as a works-salvationist. Any high school English student can see the forced understanding of such a notion. No one presents an argument based on general statements masquerading them as explicit all-encompassing commands. In other words, these texts only prove that faith is one of the associated requirements for salvation, rather than the absolutely only thing needed for salvation.
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#525
Jul 3, 2015
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#525
Acts 10:43 All the prophets testify about Him (Jesus) that all who believe in Him receives forgiveness of sins through His Name.
 
B

Beckworth

Active member
#526
May 15, 2019
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#526
Magenta said:
Acts 10:43 All the prophets testify about Him (Jesus) that all who believe in Him receives forgiveness of sins through His Name.
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I don’t know what version you are using but the NKJ version uses a different verb in Acts 10:43. You used the word”receives” which is present tense, but it actually uses the verb “will receive” which is future tense. God is precise with His meanings. For example, He makes an argument based on the SINGULAR form of the noun and NOT the plural in Galations 3:16. I know that a common belief is salvation by faith only; but that contradicts James 2:24 that says we are NOT saved by “faith only. AS I have said before, scripture does not contradict scripture. If our conclusion contradicts other scriptures then our conclusion is wrong. The fault is with US—not God’s Word.
Yes, belief is the first step, and it is that belief that causes us to do ALL JESUS says in Mark 16:16. Only believers will be baptized. Psalms 119:160 says we have to take the “SUM” of God’s word—put it all together to get the truth. So, Acts 10:43 cannot contradict the very plain words of Jesus in Mark 16:16. Put those two verses together with the right verb and you can see that believers “WILL RECEIVE” forgiveness of sins when they are baptized like Jesus says in Mark 16:16 and this is just exactly what Peter said in Acts 2:38-“… be baptized in the name of JESUS FOR THE FORGIVENESS OF SINS. THUS, Mark 16:16, Acts 10:43, and Acts 2:38 and James 2:24 all harmonize with each other. There is no contradiction or confusion. AND…Cornelius and his house in Acts 10 were the believers who were baptized when Peter COMMANDED them to.
 
S

Shilohsfoal

Banned
#527
Dec 27, 2018
1,642
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#527
Beckworth said:
I don’t know what version you are using but the NKJ version uses a different verb in Acts 10:43. You used the word”receives” which is present tense, but it actually uses the verb “will receive” which is future tense. God is precise with His meanings. For example, He makes an argument based on the SINGULAR form of the noun and NOT the plural in Galations 3:16. I know that a common belief is salvation by faith only; but that contradicts James 2:24 that says we are NOT saved by “faith only. AS I have said before, scripture does not contradict scripture. If our conclusion contradicts other scriptures then our conclusion is wrong. The fault is with US—not God’s Word.
Yes, belief is the first step, and it is that belief that causes us to do ALL JESUS says in Mark 16:16. Only believers will be baptized. Psalms 119:160 says we have to take the “SUM” of God’s word—put it all together to get the truth. So, Acts 10:43 cannot contradict the very plain words of Jesus in Mark 16:16. Put those two verses together with the right verb and you can see that believers “WILL RECEIVE” forgiveness of sins when they are baptized like Jesus says in Mark 16:16 and this is just exactly what Peter said in Acts 2:38-“… be baptized in the name of JESUS FOR THE FORGIVENESS OF SINS. THUS, Mark 16:16, Acts 10:43, and Acts 2:38 and James 2:24 all harmonize with each other. There is no contradiction or confusion. AND…Cornelius and his house in Acts 10 were the believers who were baptized when Peter COMMANDED them to.
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Adolf Hitler was Baptised in water with a priest saying the words in the name of the father and of the son and of the holy spirit.
I don't think Adolf was a believer.
 
R

rogerg

Well-known member
#528
Jul 13, 2021
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#528
Beckworth said:
that contradicts James 2:24 that says we are NOT saved by “faith only. AS I have said before, scripture does not contradict scripture. If our conclusion contradicts other scriptures then our conclusion is wrong. The fault is with US—not God’s Word.
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Where in James 2:24 does it mention whose faith and whose works it is that justifies a man?
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#529
Jul 3, 2015
60,136
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#529
Beckworth said:
I don’t know what version you are using but the NKJ version uses a different verb in Acts 10:43. You used the word”receives” which is present tense, but it actually uses the verb “will receive” which is future tense. God is precise with His meanings. For example, He makes an argument based on the SINGULAR form of the noun and NOT the plural in Galations 3:16. I know that a common belief is salvation by faith only; but that contradicts James 2:24 that says we are NOT saved by “faith only. AS I have said before, scripture does not contradict scripture. If our conclusion contradicts other scriptures then our conclusion is wrong. The fault is with US—not God’s Word.
Yes, belief is the first step, and it is that belief that causes us to do ALL JESUS says in Mark 16:16. Only believers will be baptized. Psalms 119:160 says we have to take the “SUM” of God’s word—put it all together to get the truth. So, Acts 10:43 cannot contradict the very plain words of Jesus in Mark 16:16. Put those two verses together with the right verb and you can see that believers “WILL RECEIVE” forgiveness of sins when they are baptized like Jesus says in Mark 16:16 and this is just exactly what Peter said in Acts 2:38-“… be baptized in the name of JESUS FOR THE FORGIVENESS OF SINS. THUS, Mark 16:16, Acts 10:43, and Acts 2:38 and James 2:24 all harmonize with each other. There is no contradiction or confusion. AND…Cornelius and his house in Acts 10 were the believers who were baptized when Peter COMMANDED them to.
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My apologies, as I was on my phone and could not copy and paste from Biblehub's Berean Study Bible...


Ephesians 4:5-6
:)
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#530
Jul 3, 2015
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#530
Beckworth said:
I don’t know what version you are using but the NKJ version uses a different verb in Acts 10:43. You used the word”receives” which is present tense, but it actually uses the verb “will receive” which is future tense.
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Both can be future tense. I am sending a package to your house. Anyone who
receives it has to sign for it. Not sure why you make a non-effectual distinction.
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

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#531
Apr 7, 2014
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Lamar said:
Once again, if faith alone is the absolutely only thing required for salvation, then we would expect Jesus to mention alone or only in the following verses. (3:15,16,18; 5:24;6:29,40,47; 11:25,26) Yet what is the one 1 word that Jesus does not mention 9 different times in each of these complete statements "Alone." What happened to only faith?

Mark 16:16 - Whoever believes (believes only? NO) and is baptized shall be saved but he who does not believe will be condemned.

Your argument is with Mark 16:16 and not with me.

Many will present general verses about the need for faith as proof texts for non-obedience salvation in a effort to force the mandatory allegiance to faith alone regeneration theology. These are the modern day Pharisees that cherry pick generalities and label them as definitive. Branding anyone who disagrees as a works-salvationist. Any high school English student can see the forced understanding of such a notion. No one presents an argument based on general statements masquerading them as explicit all-encompassing commands. In other words, these texts only prove that faith is one of the associated requirements for salvation, rather than the absolutely only thing needed for salvation.
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There are many passages of scripture which make it clear that we are saved through belief/faith "apart from additions or modifications." (John 1:12; 3:15,16,18,36; 6:40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 13:39; 16:31; 26:18; Romans 1:16; 3:22-28; 4:5; 5:1; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; Galatians 2:16; Ephesians 2:8; Philippians 3:9; 2 Timothy 3:15; 1 John 5:13 etc..).

You don't need to add the word "alone" next to "belief/faith" in each of these passages of scripture above in order to figure out that the words, "belief/faith" stand alone in connection with receiving eternal life/salvation. Do these many passages of scripture say belief/faith "plus something else?" Plus works? NO. So then it's faith (rightly understood) in Christ alone.
 
B

Beckworth

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May 15, 2019
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#532
Shilohsfoal said:
Adolf Hitler was Baptised in water with a priest saying the words in the name of the father and of the son and of the holy spirit.
I don't think Adolf was a believer.
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I don’t know whether he was or not but his case has nothing to do with what the Bible says. How people RESPOND To its message is up to the individual and between them and God.
 
B

Beckworth

Active member
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May 15, 2019
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#533
Magenta said:
Both can be future tense. I am sending a package to your house. Anyone who
receives it has to sign for it. Not sure why you make a non-effectual distinction.
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I understand that the context of that sentence talks about something in the future, but that does not make the verb “receives” future tense. To be in future tense it would need to say you will be receiving a package tomorrow. Please give me proof or a source that says the word “receives” is a future tense verb. I don’t believe it can be.
It definitely makes a difference in the meaning of the passage. Tenses are used to convey meaning and avoid confusion.
The false doctrine of salvation at the time of belief, needs the present tense verb to support its doctrine. Even John 3:16, which most use to promote this doctrine is not “present tense” but says those who believe SHOULD NOT perish. Not that they won’t perish but they shouldn’t perish. Why? Because true believers should obey whatever God says. God says He that believes and is baptized will be saved. True believers are willing to obey what He says because they believe. A person may CLAIM to believe but if they aren’t willing to obey God then they are NOT true believers. Jesus said those that love Him, obey Him. That’s one way Jesus knows who loves Him and who do not love Him.
 
B

Beckworth

Active member
#536
May 15, 2019
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#536
rogerg said:
Where in James 2:24 does it mention whose faith and whose works it is that justifies a man?
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I’m not sure I understand your question. Verse 22 of James 2 says that “faith” and “works” work together. It’s not one or the other. It’s not one without the other . It’s both working together. It’s pretty simple; if it’s not by faith only (verse 24) and He says faith and works work together then the proper conclusion is it’s BOTH— working together, just like verse 22 says. Regardless, of what kind of works He is talking about—it still says NOT BY FAITH ONLY.. To say we are saved by faith only is to blantenly contradict God.
 
fredoheaven

fredoheaven

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Nov 17, 2015
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#538
Lamar said:
Once again, if faith alone is the absolutely only thing required for salvation, then we would expect Jesus to mention alone or only in the following verses. (3:15,16,18; 5:24;6:29,40,47; 11:25,26) Yet what is the one 1 word that Jesus does not mention 9 different times in each of these complete statements "Alone." What happened to only faith?

Mark 16:16 - Whoever believes (believes only? NO) and is baptized shall be saved but he who does not believe will be condemned.

Your argument is with Mark 16:16 and not with me.

Many will present general verses about the need for faith as proof texts for non-obedience salvation in a effort to force the mandatory allegiance to faith alone regeneration theology. These are the modern day Pharisees that cherry pick generalities and label them as definitive. Branding anyone who disagrees as a works-salvationist. Any high school English student can see the forced understanding of such a notion. No one presents an argument based on general statements masquerading them as explicit all-encompassing commands. In other words, these texts only prove that faith is one of the associated requirements for salvation, rather than the absolutely only thing needed for salvation.
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Mark 16:16 doesn’t teach baptismal regeneration here my friend. It is the preaching of the Gospel that saves. The baptism here mentions results from belief in Christ and his gospel. The conjunction “and” is used to mean “before”, introducing a consequence, actual or predictive, hence the word “baptized” is dropped in the second clause. As a consequence of "belief", in the Gospel is salvation, then getting water baptized is a sign of your belief.
 
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