Sheep, Wolves, and Shepherds

This thread is to discuss what the Bible teaches about "wolves in sheep clothing" and admonishes christians to protect themselves from needless harm.

You bring up some really useful topics. I’d like to see where this thread goes.

I want to delve into the issue of overall safety-- making sure you and your loved ones and friends are safe-- for those who don't want to make mistakes in that department. I also want to share how wolves or predators prey on people and in christian circles.

Someone said that there are only three types of people in the world (this is just one area of 'types of people'):

1.) Sheep. This group makes up most of the world's population. Sheep just live life and don't scheme and plot against others; they're basically harmless. You therefore have 'sheep organizations' as well: eg. grocery stores, clothing stores, the average business, volunteer organizations, etc.

2.) Wolves. This group makes up the second largest group. Wolves are looking to take advantage of and use people and things; they recognize human weakness and are eager to pounce on it. Not all criminals are wolves, but all wolves are criminals. This group must cause harm and exploit because it's in their nature to do so. You therefore have 'wolf organizations': gangs, trafficker groups, crime families (eg. mafia), cartels (eg. Mexican, Columbian), etc.

3.) Shepherds. This group has the lowest population of the three groups. Shepherds recognize the vulnerabilities in sheep and want to protect them from inevitable and eventual harm. Shepherds and wolves are natural enemies and are at enmity with each other. And since shepherds exist, you have shepherd organizations: law enforcement, law groups, child and other advocacy groups, the military, etc.

The Bible tells christians to be aware. But many christians disregard that admonition because being aware doesn't allow you to feel as free as you would like to be. Being watchful, as the Bible says, stifles the need to do whatever we want to. But this thread is for the christians who really want to know some of the things to be aware of so they can be better attuned to potential harm as well as potential blessings.

If "law enforcement, law groups, child and other advocacy groups, the military, etc." are "shepherd organizations" then we also have wolves in shepherd's clothing. Sadly, many police and military organizations, child advocacy groups, etc. are corrupt and wicked to the core. I've dealt with the latter personally, and seen the former in video.

The biblical passage refers to people pretending to be Christians who are teaching things inconsistent with the truth of Scripture. We even have some as regulars on this site. Many are themselves deceived, some are willfully ignorant, and a few are downright evil.

For sheep, the way to avoid wolves is to develop and maintain a close relationship with the true Shepherd. "My sheep know My voice." That is both literal (knowing what God "sounds" like") and figurative (knowing the word of God so well that the enemy can't deceive you).

Yes, I use blanket terms and statements and generalize a lot because details are too numerous to get into. I said sheep are 'harmless' but that's just when compared to wolves (as I said, "not all criminals are wolves"). And yes, law enforcement is a shepherd organization with very few shepherds in contrast with wolves. The FBI is basically not an American entity and works for elite occultists and does their bidding. There is a long history of this. It is one of many stories where the FBI helped to silence, kill, assault, threaten/intimidate, and jail innocent victims and their advocates who were on the trail of corrupt elite occultists. YouTube pulls a lot of videos about certain topics and has pulled this video many times, so they had to put an age restriction on it. You have to watch it on YouTube and can't watch in on this site:


So just because it's listed under one of those three groups doesn't mean it's carrying out its function. Afterall, Wayfair as a home goods store and so falls under 'sheep organizations', but they've been caught in and implicated for national child trafficking-- for selling children on their own websites through the use of code words that only pedophile networds understand (this also happens on Craigslist, etc.).

Wolves aren't only 'teachers'. On his blog about christian narcissists, Pastor Dave Orrison writes, "Churches and volunteer organizations are poorly prepared to deal with predators of any kind." https://graceformyheart.wordpress.com/2013/03/22/the-christian-narcissist/.

Predators of any kind. So, wolves or predators don't just teach. Far from it. Every predator knows that christian circles are the best and easiest places to prey because christians are 'trained' to be syrupy sweet and super nice. As Orrison writes, "christian behavior is easy to fake and many in the church are naïve and gullible and are particularly vulnerable to the manipulations and deceit of the narcissist. The church is a prime hunting ground for [predators], with little real accountability and significant opportunity for attention and promotion."

Jesus said His sheep know His voice; but He is talking about mature sheep, not just any follower of His. His sheep learn to know His voice. Elihu brought up this important topic of knowing God's voice. Speaking to Job, Elihu rebuked him for accusing God of not answering Job's prayers and then stated what, to me, is the most direct verse in the Bibe that God does in fact speak often and that the hearing problem lies with people (I will give an example of this in my own life). Elihu said to Job, "Why do you say of Him that He answers none of man's words? For God does speak-- now one way, now another-- though man does not perceive it" (Job 33:13-13).

I once attended a church for a Bible study. The previous Sunday, the church was full; but during Bible study, there were only three people present: me, another guy, and the pastor. As pastors always do, this pastor began 'the program'... but there was no movement in the spirit. I started to talk about things that are actually on God's heart (that's what it means to be gathered together in His Name-- with Him as the focus and the One who steers the direction of the gathering). The pastor allowed the change of topic, probably because there wasn't a big enough audience there that made him feel the need to stick to the regular script. He also looked tired (which he was). As I talked about the things on God's heart (which never have to do with how to keep the electric on in the church building or neighborhood evangelism or feeding the homeless-- all the often minute and superfluous things churches like to focus on), Jesus appeared between me and the other man and facing the pastor. Long story short, the other man later told me the church was struggling with a decision (they had three or four choices and didn't know which one to choose) and had four different committees that had been praying but hadn't heard from God about their decision. I was puzzled that God hadn't spoken to anyone on any of four different committees. But I didn't even pray about it (I wasn't a church member): while standing their dazed that God hadn't spoken to any of them, God spoke to me and told me what they should do. When I told them, their response made me understand why they hadn't heard God: God had indeed been speaking to all of them, but beyond the distractions in their lives, they did not want to do what God was telling them to do, therefore, they couldn't hear Him. Jesus told the people that the one who sincerely wants to do God's will, God will also learn to recognize and distinguish His voice from other voices when He speaks. He said, "If anyone desires to do [God's] will, he [will eventually know it]" (John 7:17).

It takes a period of time to start recognizing God's voice, especially because the enemy also speaks, posing as God, otherwise learning to recognize God's voice wouldn't take as long. Since this is the case, christians must practice to discern God's voice. God speaks and we hear; but if we can't discern His voice, then hearing it doesn't help. Learning some of satan's tactics helps christians distinguish those from God's operations which helps them discern/hear God better.

Jesus also said that his sheep will flee from a stranger.

so, when one is lead by the Good Shepard , they are far less likely to be led astray by a wolf...

Saying His sheep know His voice is referring to not only maturity but also to devotion or faithfulness. This is particular where "The voice of a stranger they will not follow" comes in.

Jesus talked about hirelings vs. genuine shepherds. The implication (obviously) is that sheep follow the voice of a hireling (while the real shepherd isn't around) though the hireling-- one could say-- is basically a wolf since he "cares nothing for the sheep" (abandons the sheep and doesn't protect them) when it comes down to it. So, what is Jesus really saying in that His sheep know His voice and won't follow a stranger?

This is better seen when looking at a husband and his wife: "My wife is faithful to only me and will not give herself in any way to another man." At the foundation or summary of things, that is what Jesus is saying in the passage.

It takes christians time to learn to discern Jesus's voice from other voices. He is saying they will not willingly follow (permanently) a stranger though a christian can indeed be deceived into 'following' (temporarily) another voice. There's more going on in the Bible than meets the eye. All the popular passages used for just one thing are stocked with tons and tons of gems and other meanings. (Eg. John 3:16, Psalm 23, 1John 4:18, etc.) You'll have a hard time finding any place in the Bible where it says something and it is only saying one thing. God's Word is alive (or relevant) which means that it is and can be applied many different ways.

The best defense i know against Wolves in sheep's clothing is reading the Holy Bible,, IN FULL ... And Yes along with that pray to God for His inspiration to understand the message that we need to understand...

Yeah, that doesn't do it, otherwise there would be fewer churches with predators in them. It would be nice though, wouldn't it? If we don't understand the Bible we can see (read), how will we be able to discern the things we can't see?

We pray for the Spirit of Wisdom and Revelation. The tragedy of much Christianity is that people just accept whatever the pastor tells them. If the pastor gets deceived or goes astray, the people follow. Also, some Christians recognise problems but are not brave enough to speak up. I started off bold but paid a price. So I shut up and ended up paying a bigger price. There is a time to speak and a time to refrain. Wisdom is knowing what to do, how to do it and, importantly, when to do it. Or to speak.

God is only too willing to equip us with what we need to live a victorious and overcoming life. Paul rebuked the Corinthians for turning a blind eye to problems in the church.

Yes. God's armour for us includes the belt of Truth that holds everything else together. The only weapon we have is the Living word of God, the sword of the Spirit. It is enough.

I can talk somewhat freely because I'm passing through, like stopping at a town on your way home from a work trip and you chat with people at the town diner before you get back on the road home.

God called Moses to lead 'a rebellious and stiff-necked people'. The modern churches are rebellious and stiff-necked. In early 2004 when a friend of mine told me that God has limited Himself to working through christians, I told her that God should change that plan because christians, as a whole, are the last people group on the planet to want to do and to do God's will. (There are biblical examples and explanations for why this is so as well as psychological explanations: eg. Hebrews 3:7-19, spoken to the [current] churches.)

When Jesus told Peter to 'feed His sheep and lambs', He was not telling Peter to look after a chicken run. Modern christian circles are often like a chicken run surrounded by wolves who manage them, but very few know and very few care. Thankfully, God has not called me to look after chicken runs or to wrestle with the hard-hearted and stiff-necked (I'm not pentecostal but I'm on the verge of shouting hallelujah here). He has, however, called some others to the rebellious-- to warn them of error, usually to no avail but for the salvation of a few. He gives each person Grace for their task. Most christians are like children in a nursery who want to stay there perpetually and never grow up. This attitude compromises anyone who wants to grow up and progress.

I have written about ten posts on this site that were 'moderated out' and not allowed to post. If you had read those posts, you might wonder why they would not be allowed to post. I have just re-written three of them:

1. Thrones and Dominions, Pt. 1: https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/thrones-and-dominions.217243/.

2. Part 2: https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/thrones-and-dominions-ii.217244/.

3. Part 3: https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/thrones-and-dominions-iii.217245/.

Those are 'under moderation' (my posts began to be closely moderated right after I posted about the high-profile and heavily-suppressed occult ritual abuse McMartin Preschool case: https://christianchat.com/conspirac...cmartin-preschool-occult-ritual-abuse.217091/). It's only a matter of time before I'm banned. If the above links/posts don't post again, well that's just life. Lol. If christians only knew. But as I have no fellowship and spiritual brethren now, I will share and partake here where I can. Anyone who benefits from it, cheers. Anyone who doesn't, thank God. I'm not here to beg and plead or to get an audience or be popular.

I just realized I started this particular thread-- 'Sheep, Wolves, and Shepherds'-- because my post titled 'Occulstists in the Churches' was not allowed to post. In it, I described some of the ways that occultists are assigned to all churches and how they infiltrate all christian circles and even start christian organizations, churches, ministries, and social groups (eg. dating sites, websites, etc.). Within christian circles, occultists can better and more closely watch and monitor christians, chritian behavior, and monitor the 'movings of the Holy Spirit' so they can keep the 'higher ground' of control in christianity and in society.

I had to make a friendlier thread-- 'Sheep, Wolves, and Shepherds'-- and, unlike I ever do, start with just one 'friendly' sentence. I have started with one 'friendly' sentence for the three re-posts about 'Thrones and Dominions' as well. It didn't matter how much time and effort went into writing those posts; they were blocked and I was given no reason why. Let's see if the new ones post.

Praying for oneness of the Church

I have heard that there is strife and division in the church and I am inclined to believe it. Apparently there are political wranglings between one party and another being played out in the congregation as well as strife and dispute being stirred up over many issues on social media. I am not on Facebook, so I miss everything that goes on there, but I am on this forum where they debate over whether or not Christians should be for Trump or not.

So then let's look at how the Bible says to make peace. It requires a peace offering which can be a bull, that is a very expensive offering.

So let's apply that to the church. In 2020 there were many people in this country who thought the election was stolen and wanted to do an audit of the process. Polls showed that as much as 30% of the country thought the election had been stolen by fraud. I felt that this greatly undermined the trust in our process and so I was for doing the audit. On the other hand there were some who felt it was not right to do an audit for just the states that had the closest votes for Biden. I agreed with them, I felt we could do audits on all 20 swing states or even do an audit of all 50 states. Many complained that to do an audit on all 50 states would cost $100 million. I felt this was a worthwhile expense to restore trust in the system. (If sending $160 billion to Ukraine didn't even require a debate it seems $100 million is really a small price to pay to bring peace to the US). But they never did the audits. Sometimes they did a "recount". This is like giving the people who were concerned the middle finger. An audit would verify that every name on the voter registration still lived in the state and was alive. It would verify that the addresses that mailed in ballots would confirm that they had indeed mailed in that many ballots and they had that many registered voters. Some addresses had 20 ballots that had come from them. But no one did an audit, the message to those who had an issue was "just shut up and do what you are told". That was not a message that led to peace. Today the most recent polls show that 50% of the country thinks the election was stolen and 70% thinks there was some fraud. The problem did not go away, it got worse. You can't claim to "love and care for someone" and then when they have an issue you just tell them to shut up and ignore them. The Christian churches represent 50% of the US population, they could have stood strong on this issue and some pastors did, but most kept silent.

You can argue that this was politics and the church and state are separate. OK, but then no doubt that is what you argued when they mandated the vaccine and shut down churches. You stood strong and said it is unconstitutional for the Federal government to shut down the churches. You can hold meetings online for any members afraid to go to the church, you can have hand sanitizer and take the temperature of people who come to the meeting, but if you are standing strong for separation of church and state why do you let the state lock your doors? They claimed it was a health crisis. I lived in NYC, about three miles from the church I met at was a casino, they never shut down the casino. They never shut down Costco or Walmart. Many people were forced to lose their jobs because they didn't take the vaccine. I am not anti science, I was a HS science teacher and I am not anti Vaxx I had all my shots that were required to teach in NYC. But I had legitimate questions about this vaccine, it was experimental and they violated the laws involving mandating experimental vaccines. They were behaving like criminals and liars, so it was reasonable to ask questions. But when anyone did they were insulted, mocked, and told to shut up and do what you are told. Where were the pastors, the shepherd of the sheep? If they had all stood up and stood strong there is no way this would have gone on, but instead many did nothing. They stood by while people were fired over this or forced against their will to get the vaccine. We now know that 17 million people died as a result of that vaccine and that is the most conservative number and does not include all the other health issues involved with the vaccine.

Yes, we should all be one in Christ. But in Acts when there were legitimate concerns about how the church was dealing with issues they didn't tell people to shut up and do what you are told. They appointed brothers like Stephen to deal with it, and this was not a hired hand that fled when he saw the wolves, he stood strong even if it cost him his life.

We don't have Stephens today.

There are too many issues in life and aspects to life to deal with things from the top down. It's best to deal with life and people from the bottom up or from the foundation up. The Church is to be built on. There's a foundation and the rest of it functions from the [good or bad] foundation. The churches are messed up for 'a' reason. What are the reasons that churches, pastors, and christians behave uniformly in a bad or ungodly way? That truly should be your focus if you want to understand what is going on and make sense of what is happening. Every moment in the present is a child of a moment in the past. What you see and observe now originated somewhere. Let me share a really brief vision Jesus gave me in 2016 to start indicating some roots and origins rather than fighting with the problems when they're already fully-grown.

The town we lived in was owned by satanists. (Some towns are.) Genuine prophets had prophesied about the town's importance to satan; false prophets were set up by satanists in the town to promote a false Jesus. (The 24-Day Fast for revival I spoke about before took place in the prayer center of this town, and the center was headed by a man who just wanted to hear prophecies about how great he was, a man whom the satanists had given that position.) I noted that every christian in that town who genuinely desired God was really struggling in life while everyone else was prospering. Two of my coworkers wanted to see revival come to that town. One of them had a pastor's heart; the other had a prophet's heart. The prophet would constantly tell the pastor not to just pray without waiting on God to lead the prayer. The pastor never listened. One day we got together with a few others and the pastor began to pray that God would bless the town. As he prayed this, Jesus began to show me a three-part vision to indicate where prayer efforts should be focused rather than telling Him to do what He already wanted to do (ie. bless the town):

1.) In the first vision, I saw an ocean or sea, and the entire body of Christ underwater while all the pastors were above water. The members of the body of Christ were sitting in chairs underwater looking up at the pastors who were above water. But I didn't see the pastors because they were invisible. Then Jesus explained that this is the current pastoral ministry and that the pastors have tied the hands of church members by not allowing them to function freely in their gifts and callings, etc. Jesus said this made the body of Christ as useless as human beings are when we're underwater.

2.) In the second vision, I saw seven men in a prison cell which was underground. They were all dressed like I was in the Bible days, in robes that were brown, cream, black, etc. They quietly walked around in the cell, praying softly and patiently waiting for Jesus to come and release them. Then Jesus explained to me that these seven men represented the coming (genuine) prophetic ministry and that they are currently 'bound' but are patiently waiting for Him to release them so they can in turn go release the body of Christ.

3.) In the third vision, I was standing inside a tomb like they had in ancient times (the type Jesus was buried in), and I saw a solitary man sitting to my left on that platform that a dead body is laid on (I forgot the correct term). He was sitting quietly and deep in thought. (He wasn't praying, He was thinking.) As I was looking at him, I was transported outside the tomb and now I was looking at the tomb with a circular stone rolled across the entrance. As I was looking, Jesus walked up from my right, placed His hands on the tombstone, rolled it to the left away from the entrance, and sat on it. Then He explained to me that the solitary man represented the coming (genuine) apostolic ministry and that satan wants this ministry bound in the grave (ie. dead) because it's important to release it first so it can in turn release the prophetic and therefore release the body of Christ.

How does the vision apply to what I'm saying? Two ways:

A.) Rather than praying for revival (or whatever God wants to give), it's important to ask Him how to pray or/and to pray for Him to release those in whom He has invested revival (or whatever you're asking Him for).

B.) Jesus showed me the coming apostolic ministry, the coming prophetic ministry, and the current body of Christ; but He did not show me the current pastoral ministry. Why? Because He doesn't value them. It's important to say here that this doesn't apply to every last pastor; it applies to pastors in a general way the same way Jesus, in addressing the religious leaders (Pharisees, lawyers, Sadducees, etc.), always said that they all were godless though He knew a few of them weren't.

So. Do you expect people whose custom it is to not obey Jesus to do the right thing concerning anything else? The root or origin of why pastors and churches are compromised or not doing what God calls them to is because it is not their culture nor in their tradition (way of living) to do the right thing or to obey God. It is a foreign concept. Look closely for yourself and you'll see. Even in the Bible, God often spoke forthrightly while Jesus often spoke in riddles, especially regarding negative things (eg. "Woman, has no one condemned you... Neither do I condemn you"). When Jesus is cutting a whole segment of the church out of the picture, it's His gentle way of saying they are of no use or don't matter. It might sound farfetched but look into it for yourself. The Holy Spirit will bear witness of the truth to those who want the truth.

And false teachers who dressed as sheep seek to raise the alarm against wolves that are but shadows of their imagination.

I expect that the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds; 5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ; 6 And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled.

God always has people, His Gideon's 300, a small number of faithful believers (sometimes called 'the remnant') who will do what He told everyone else to do but they wouldn't. Unfortunately He always brings out and serves and saves His first and best last. But nothing to worry about. The Bookkeeper and the Accountant will eventually open the records, then everyone will be paid for their work.

It has always done it for me.. I came to be a Christian while reading The Bible and i have avoided getting into cults because of it.. And yeah it is nice to stand on soild ground and not to be swayed by supposed preachers who are not real preachers..

The reason why there is so many false preachers out there is that the majority of ""Christians"" Don't read their Bibles..