Is Open Theism Heresy?

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homwardbound

homwardbound

Senior Member
#81
Oct 24, 2012
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#81
Believer08 said:
If not, why not?
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heresy is Unbelief to the risen Son, that father raised from the dead for us to be given new life in the risen Son for us to love and Son did for that three and a half years, showing us the Exact image of God Father himSon did that first willingly went to death to save us in his risen Life for us to be new in the Holy Spirit we are called to love us all thank you
 
Mem

Mem

Senior Member
#82
Sep 23, 2014
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#82
No one can thwart God's plans. God creates a plan a carries it out. And since no one can exist without His design for you, and He builds you from the womb, then it's likely He also knows how we work. Did He equip us with some sort of technologically advance AI system? or something more? Did He put any sort of 'unpredictable' mechanism within man? Even so, this doesn't withstand His ability to apply a proficient mitigation as His contingency plan should anything should veer off and chance any derailment of His plan. But nonetheless, conceptually, plans are made beforehand concerning projects which are later set into motion.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#84
Jan 13, 2016
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#84
Dino246 said:
Presenting a false dichotomy as the only possible interpretation and telling people that “It’s that simple” irritates people. Once again you misrepresent the issue to pretend you’re in the right.

Stupid is not simple; it’s just stupid.
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Ok, I'm stupid. Let's hear choice #3. God didn't lie. God didn't change his mind.
 
maxwel

maxwel

Senior Member
#86
Apr 18, 2013
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#86
GWH said:
The charge of heresy should be made only when the a belief contradicts what a person must believe in order to satisfy God’s requirements for salvation. secondary details can be learned later.
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Heresy?
I think you may be using a non-standard definition of heresy ("non-essential for salvation" and "heretical" are not necessarily identical terms.)

But you do raise a good point, which is to consider that whether or not we can specifically label Open Theism as heresy simply depends on our definition of heresy.

Why this issue is serious:
1.) As Open Theism attacks the very NATURE OF GOD, which is the FOUNDATION of all theology (called theology proper), I'd probably go ahead and characterize it as heresy.
2.) But whether or not we give it the label of heresy, if we want to be Biblical, and if we want to stay within the understanding of thousands of years of orthodox theology... we would have to at least consider it incorrect.


Have a great day brother.

.
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#87
Jul 3, 2015
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#87
PaulThomson said:
By your logic, if God does not know what it feels like to rape a child, and to be raped as a child, He is not omniscient.
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Why would He not know these things?
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#88
Mar 1, 2022
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#88
John146 said:
And it's all found in scripture. We can read about how it's going to finish up.
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So I'll ask you...would God's works include casting people into hell and the lake of fire?
 
B

Believer08

Active member
#89
Jan 27, 2025
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#89
If open theism believes or teaches that God does not have the ability or cannot know the future until it happens, then that is direct denial of the Godhead being both omniscient (Psalm 139:1ff) and omnipotent (Rev 19:6). Why can He not know or doesn’t have the ability? I do not believe that. I believe He can know and has the ability to know. There is a monumental difference between Matthew 24:36 and Him not able or saying He cannot. Big difference.
 
L

lrs68

Active member
#90
Dec 30, 2024
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#90
Isaiah specifically made a point to mention in his writings that God is the only God who knows the {end from the beginning}. Therefore, any idealism that thwarts the concept of God not knowing how the future unfolds is not merely baseless but an outright lie. Isaiah is telling us that as we move beginning to end God is working end to the beginning.

Ever wonder how miracles work?

You live life and run into a crisis and unnaturally survive because God already has the miracle waiting for you.

God is not caught off guard.
We are but God never is.
 
Bob-Carabbio

Bob-Carabbio

Well-known member
#91
Jun 24, 2020
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#91
GWH said:
Yes but some theology contradicts or perverts the Gospel, which is a very big deal.
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Only if you confuse "Man's Theology" with God's word. IGNORANCE OF WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS renders you "Fair Game" for deception.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#94
Jan 13, 2016
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#94
Cameron143 said:
So I'll ask you...would God's works include casting people into hell and the lake of fire?
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Context according to the passage:

15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#95
Mar 1, 2022
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#95
John146 said:
Context according to the passage:

15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
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Sure, that's the context. Are you saying there is no other application other than this particular context?
 
G

GWH

Groovy
#96
Oct 19, 2024
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#96
maxwel said:
Heresy?
I think you may be using a non-standard definition of heresy ("non-essential for salvation" and "heretical" are not necessarily identical terms.)

But you do raise a good point, which is to consider that whether or not we can specifically label Open Theism as heresy simply depends on our definition of heresy.

Why this issue is serious:
1.) As Open Theism attacks the very NATURE OF GOD, which is the FOUNDATION of all theology (called theology proper), I'd probably go ahead and characterize it as heresy.
2.) But whether or not we give it the label of heresy, if we want to be Biblical, and if we want to stay within the understanding of thousands of years of orthodox theology... we would have to at least consider it incorrect.


Have a great day brother.

.
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No, no. I was saying that heresy is a belief/doctrine that contradicts beliefs that are part of GRFS.

(I am unfamiliar with Open Theism; my belief is biblical theism, especially NT Christianity :^)
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#97
May 23, 2012
13,166
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#97
John146 said:
That’s not in the scripture.

1. God sent Jonah to cry unto Nineveh that wicked city, “Yet forty days and Nineveh shall be overthrown.”
2. Nineveh believed God and repented of their evil. “9 Who can tell if God will turn and repent, and turn away from his fierce anger, that we perish not?”
3. God repented, “10 And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.”

Either God lied or he changed his mind.
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God sent Jonah to tell Nineveh to repent even though he knew they would not? If God told Jonah to go and preach, don't you see God's plan working, or do you see it failing? 1. God is not a man that HE should Lie your wrong there. 2. If God changed his mind, Nineveh would have been destroyed.

The text shows us 1. God sent Jonah 2. Nineveh repented. Right, there in the word of GOD. God knew they would, LOL.
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#99
May 23, 2012
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#99
PaulThomson said:
No. Open theism says that which future events will happen is not knowable until they happen. Some Open Theists (Dynamic Omniscience) believe God knows ALL future possibilities, but not which of those possibilities will occur, apart from some that He specifically decides He will make happen for some specific purpose.
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But we are talking about GOD, not someone who holds to open theism. In the Divine Nature of God, he is omniscience
the context to this Attribute is Omni" means "all" and "science" refers to knowledge, so "omniscience" literally translates to "all-knowing."

Fully and completely without Limitations. Human rationality cannot demolish GOD nature.
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#100
Jun 30, 2015
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#100
John146 said:
Ok, I'm stupid. Let's hear choice #3. God didn't lie. God didn't change his mind.
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Option #3 (the truth): God didn't reveal everything that He knew or had decided.

Proverbs 25:2a It is the glory of God to conceal a matter
 
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