"This Little Piggy Has an Inbox Full of Suitors... This Little Piggy Has None."

Hey Everyone,

The title of this thread is inspired the nursery rhyme, "This Little Piggy Went to Market" -- and particularly the lines:

"This Little Piggy Had Roast Beef ,
This Little Piggy Had None. "

We recently had a thread here asking why Christian men seem reluctant to pursue Christian women -- this, along with a conversation with a guy friend, made me think about when I was on Christian dating sites. It was a long time ago (and I have since moved on to other things in life,) but I was reminded of a particular conversation from that time.

I was talking to a guy who had written me, and he was very bitter about the fact that he sent out dozens of emails to women and never got a reply -- but he believed that women could just sit back with an inbox that was regularly full. He lamented that women could then just take their time selecting whomever they wanted from an entire catalog of suitors, then lead several guys on while trying to choose, while men either never heard back or else were given little crumbs of communication to keep them on the line.

I've heard this sentiment a few times and I certainly can't blame guys for feeling this way.

To me, this points out a huge dichotomy I've noticed in the world of Christian dating -- feminism is seen as being a root cause of breaking down relationships and the family unit. But at the same time, I've met many Christian men who, out of frustrationg, want women to turn the tide and go after them -- because they are tired of putting everything on the line and always being the ones who have to risk rejection.

I mention feminism because many of the Christian circles I've been around seem to believe that only men are to pursue, never women (Ruth was seen as a Biblical exception, but an anomaly,) so I'm guessing that this "new", "modern" belief that women should pursue men is also rooted in feminist beliefs? If not, where did it come from?

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

And so I sit back and watch the contrarian beliefs unfold that on one hand, some believe that men are to be the pursuers -- but on the other hand, many men are tired of the hassle, neglect, and rejection that it brings -- and so they want the women to start taking the risks instead.

Now of course, it's not always the case that "women are sitting back being pursued by a gaggle of men." I've known many wonderful single Christian gals -- and guys -- who aren't being pursued, and it seems unfair. But we all know the standards that affect even Christians -- people who are seen as beautiful or successful, from either gender -- will be more actively pursued that those of us who are just everyday plain Janes, whether men or women. I've seen many cases where Christian women go absolutely gaga, clawing and tearing at each other, when all competing for a charming, handsome, or successful Christian guy.

But where do you think the lines of Christian pursuit should fall?

* Is it fair that Christian culture seems to set up the very situation in which women might have several pursuers, while men have to endure waiting in line?

* Should this somehow be changed -- and if so, what changes should be made?

* Should women pursue men more often to "even things up"? Or should men continue to be the ones to "risk it all"?

* How can we uplift men who feel like they're just waiting in line, hoping that some woman will choose them?

If possible, let's try to keep the conversation informative and hopefully uplifting, for both guys and gals. The last thing I want is for this tobe a slug fest of bitterness or blame.

The whole goal of this thread is to discuss ways we can help both genders, and I'm looking forward to hearing your ideas of how to do so.

I don't know so much about women having a lot of choices and men being strung along... I hear a lot of girls complaining about the exact same thing. They feel like some men can get any girl they want, while other girls are just left in the dust or being strung along on tiny morsels of attention and affection, being kept as fallbacks in case the guy's primary object of affection leaves.

Years ago I wrote a thread about being "The Spare" -- the one who's put on the backburner and kept in someone's back pocket "just in case."

I might have to write an updated version of that thread.

I see a lot of this too, with either gender. Anyone, male or female, who has a lot of whatever society deems desirable -- usually has a flock of choices and a tier list of back-ups in case Most Desirable Person A doesn't work out.

Unfortunately, it's just part of the game and I'm sure a tale as old as time.

I think the little piggies of both genders should start ignoring the people they are trying to get the attention of and focus on the people who are also being ignored by others.

Unfortunately they would be ignored by even the people who are being ignored. You can't get somebody to go out with you when he is still pining for that pretty girl that he hopes will one day talk to him.

There was a study done in 2022 that found that women find 80% of men "below average" and unattractive meaning they would only consider dating less than 20% of men.

https://goodmenproject.com/featured-content/women-say-80-of-men-are-below-average/

Somewhere else they found that men found women 50% attractive and 50% unattractive.

I could be wrong about this, but I think the percentage of women that men find attractive is going down, and rapidly.

I remember when I used to write to prison inmates, one of them asked me if there were "as many hot women out in the world as he saw on TV," because if there were, he was feeling very optimisic about finding a wife among them.

I subscribe to a few YouTube channels about social issues. One popular topic circulating lately is of men talking about how disappointed they are when they meet women in real life (because they don't look like their filtered Instagram images,) and how disgusted they are when they see women without their makeup.

These men express anger over being "catfished" and lied to, because they expect the model-perfect images they've seen on social media. And of course, women can be the same way, especially when I hear all this ridiculousness about how men have to be at least 6'2", have an iPhone, and a 6-figure job.

I know not everyone is like this, praise God!

But it's concerning how unrealistic expectations -- for both genders -- is pretty much keeping society single.

Well one thing we probably should mention is the phenomenon of extended adolescence. Successful people don't want to marry people who still think like kids and there are more and more people who live like kids during the years people used to get married. And plenty of these adult children would love to find someone who will take care of them so they never gave to grow up

Excellent point.

In another conversation with friends, the point was made that in our grandparent's time, it wasn't unusual for people to marry as early as age 16 -- but society was different then, and I think the young people then were more geared towards having to live adult lives than young people now.

Of course, there are a slew of other factors -- like modern costs of living and lack of jobs to support independent living -- but the fact that people seem to be "growing up later", or possibly never, definitely plays into this.

Oops I didn't read that last sentence. I always have to read your posts in sections because my attention span is only about 15 seconds. Young men have always had to deal with a lot of rejection, but now men also know that a lot of women see men as toxic so that gives them another reason to be discouraged. Maybe women should start pursuing men just to dispel the negative notions that the feminists have created.

I’m glad I’m too old for this.

Too old to find a guy and get married? Or too old to frantically feel like you have to find a guy or you will die?

The opposite sex runs the opposite way whenever I'm walking, just make my peace with it and embrace my own company turns out it's not all that bad

If I ever thought I was somehow entitled to a woman's attention, that would say substantially more about me, than it ever would about any woman who passed up the chance to get to know me. That attitude is symptomatic of the malignant and blinding bitterness which permeates the dating game as a consequence of floundering over the inevitable knock-backs that come with the territory.

It's all well and good blaming feminism for dating being a mare's nest, but I know some women who continue to show deference when they're in the presence of biblical manhood, because it draws out their femininity to wholly emanate, whether they're consciously aware of it or not.

When a male takes rejection like a man, he takes possession of his soul through patience, which forges a character that will make an impression on those he touches shoulders with in the grace of life. I consider that a surefire approach for a favourable outcome.

Hmm...

Seems to me like, if you ask a girl out, the worst she can do is politely say no. That's not so...

What's that? That's not the worst she could do?

True, she could say no in a much more rude fashion. But that's actually a GOOD thing. If she turns you down rudely, you know that you have dodged a bullet. You don't want to go out with rude people like her anyway.

If she turns you down politely, that means that is a nice person and you will not get her. That is much worse than being turned down rudely.

Of course the same goes for girls asking guys out. If he's a jerk and insults you while he is turning you down, be glad you didn't go out with such a dipwad.

The latter.

As for me, I wasn’t really noticed by the opposite sex. I was pursued by 2 guys. First time I was 22. Second time I was 32. I married that guy lol.

Gonna step in, just cause you raise a good point and you all have been good about marrieds giving an opinion. I have fought back very hard against this "toxic masculinity" foolishness. I actually had a full blown argument with my cousins wife on Facebook for all to see. She's very liberal and started talking that nonsense and I flat out told her I wasn't having it. I said there are as many toxic women as toxic men and that you don't hold everyone accountable for one persons failures. I said " I have nephews, and I don't want them raised believing there is something wrong with them simply because they are born males and are white". Needless to say she hasn't spoken to me since then.

People are spending too much time on social media and it's giving them a false idea of what attractive is, what love is, what a good man is. I always tell the story of my friend who is a sweet girl, she's not movie star good looking (but who is). When I was still in ministry she asked me one day to "find her a man." I guess because I traveled a lot she figured I could reel one in for her like a fish. So I asked what she was looking for and she said " You know the Rock?" I said " the actor, Dwayne Johnson?" She said " yes, I want one like him". Now the fact that she probably hadn't visited a gym in her life didn't change her ideal. I looked at her for a moment and realized she was serious! I sort of laughed and said something like a don't see a lot of them running around anywhere.

The problem wasn't just that she wasn't "Hollywood" ready. Or that she didn't seem to understand that the actor probably spends hours of his life to look that way. But as a Christian, I was surprised at her ideals. Of course we all have a person that we find attractive. But maybe I was older and so when I met my husband I was looking for different things. The first thing I noticed when I met my husband was his smile. And that smile has reassured me, lifted me up when I was down, helped to go on when I thought I couldn't. Then the next thing I noticed were his mannerisms. He pulled out my chair, he let me speak, he was friendly to our servers, said please and thank you. He wore a Blue-jays hat because he knew I was from Canada. lol As we continued to date he was good to my parents, he loved my nephews as much as I did, and he was willing to go to church with me. To this day I feel so blessed when he sits beside me in church and if we miss a Sunday he's reminding me we need to get back again.

I didn't mean to write this much but people need to stop being so shallow. Hubby lost his job for two years, and it was a struggle. Now God blessed him with a great job, he has a Christian boss and gets paid well. We aren't rich, there are times we can't buy what we want but God has always made sure we had our needs covered. I can't speak for men, but when I hear women being so shallow and having a 20 page list of what a man must be to date her I think " you're missing so many wonderful people just be being shallow". We have had a really rough year with my parents health, 5 hospital visits between them. And the only thing besides prayer that got me through was my husband, telling me it was going to be ok and that he was praying for me. I feel blessed every day that God sent him into my life and I wasn't too shallow or stupid to see what a wonderful person he was.