Was sex Adam and Eve part of the curse

Burn1986 said:

In Gen 1:28 Then God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.”

This command was before the fall, yet they didn’t have sex until after the fall.

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Unless they had children while in the garden but I do not believe that is true.

Genesis 2:1
And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.

Eve could of been pregnant while in the garden but I do not believe that is true.

Which I believe when Adam and Eve were ousted from the garden that is when Adam knew Eve which means they had sex.

It could be that they were not in the garden long before they sinned not having time to have sex.

It could of been the day after God commanded Adam not to eat of the tree that they sinned.

If they were in the garden for a while before sinning why didn't they get going on the repopulate the earth.

It could be they were not supposed to have children while in the garden with Eve being a help mate for Adam but not having children yet.

For God said replenish the Earth but if they had not sinned they probably would of been assigned to the garden and not ventured out.

For the garden was made for them to live in that habitat not in the habitat of the world.

So God knew they would sin and be ousted from the garden where they would then fulfill the mission repopulate the earth.

Which God did know they would sin for Jesus is the beginning of creation, and without the plan of God to come in the future in flesh He would of not created anything He created, and the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world.

So God already had the plan of salvation for mankind before He created Adam and Eve so He knew they would fall.

It could be before the fall being in the garden having children was not part of the plan and not going to happen in that environment.

That is what makes sense to me that while they were in the garden in that setting they would of been confined to the garden and would of not ventured outside the garden.

So having children in the garden was not a part of their lifestyle yet until they were ousted from the garden and put in the world then they could have children in that setting and repopulate the Earth.

The garden was only for Adam and Eve not their offspring and they did not go out in the world.

When they sinned and went out in the world then they could have children fulfilling the command repopulate the world.

Having children in the garden did not apply for they were not in the world.

God said replenish the earth not replenish the garden.

The garden was a stand alone place only meant for Adam and Eve and children was not part of the plan there.

Sexual desire isn't the result of the fall.Seed comes in the image of Jesus.That's why the serpent deceived Eve before she bore children.Instead of being in the image of God their offspring became in the image of the serpent.

Adam and eve didn't have iphones to look up porn and feminism.
Sexual desire isn't a curse, it's part of a bondong ritual where two people become one.

Think back to your parents and their parents and their great grandparents. How would you apply the idea that it's a curse to them?

Burn1986 said:

In Gen 1:28 Then God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.”

This command was before the fall, yet they didn’t have sex until after the fall.

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Genesis 1:28 is a mandate, not a timeline, and nothing in Scripture says Adam and Eve “didn’t have sex until after the fall”; that idea comes from retroactive moral overlay — reading later theological assumptions back into the text.
Genesis simply gives the command in 1:28, then narrates the fall in chapter 3, then narrates conception in 4:1; the order of narration is not the order of obedience.
Scripture never says, hints, implies, or suggests that sexual union began after sin.
In fact, Genesis 2:24 (“the two shall become one flesh”) is pre‑fall marital union language, and Jesus cites it as pre‑fall design.
The only reason people assume “they didn’t have sex until after the fall” is because they treat the narrative sequence as a chronological prohibition — but the text never says “they waited,” never says “they refrained,” never says “they could not,” and never says “they did not.” Genesis 4:1 is simply the first recorded conception, not the first sexual act.

Burn1986 said:

Well, the hymen would’ve been shedding of blood, which wouldn’t have happened till after the fall. The point was that even if they would’ve had sex before the fall, it wouldn’t have been cursed like after the fall.

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There isn't always blood when virginity is broken, even nowadays.

Burn1986 said:

In Gen 1:28 Then God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.”

This command was before the fall, yet they didn’t have sex until after the fall.

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Yes, the Fall happened first and probably immediately; Satan probably did not waste any time before tempting them.
IOW, God's command created MFW.

GWH said:

Yes, the Fall happened first and probably immediately; Satan probably did not waste any time before tempting them.
IOW, God's command created MFW.

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Genesis never says, hints, or implies that “God’s command created MFW,” and it never says Adam and Eve waited until after the fall to have sex; that entire claim is built on narrative order, not on anything the text actually states.

OMC said:

Genesis never says, hints, or implies that “God’s command created MFW,” and it never says Adam and Eve waited until after the fall to have sex; that entire claim is built on narrative order, not on anything the text actually states.

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I realize that logic is not your gift, but those who have that gift can discern that commanding someone NOT to do something implies that they CAN do such. Ditto re sex.

GWH said:

I realize that logic is not your gift, but those who have that gift can discern that commanding someone NOT to do something implies that they CAN do such. Ditto re sex.

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yes, commands imply capacity — but you cannot use that principle to invent a pre‑fall prohibition or a post‑fall timeline the text never gives. The text says what it says, and it doesn’t say what you’re trying to make it say.

Burn1986 said:

Okay, so here’s the game. I post something and then yall try and disprove it. Then, if you get enough guys who agree with you then Im wrong, regardless if there’s any reasonable possibility. This will be so much fun.

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You were wrong when you wrote the opening post. If it’s fun for you when others tell you that you are wrong, so be it.

GWH said:

I realize that logic is not your gift, but those who have that gift can discern that commanding someone NOT to do something implies that they CAN do such. Ditto re sex.

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Based on the few dozen posts of his that I have read, I would conclude that he is very adept at logic. Demeaning others to make a weak point only makes you look weak.

Dino246 said:

Based on the few dozen posts of his that I have read, I would conclude that he is very adept at logic. Demeaning others to make a weak point only makes you look weak.

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I discern that you deny MFW rather than explain how y'all tulipists have the gift of discerning implications in Scripture.
That lack is why you will make it thru the pearly gate as your heresy is burned (1Cor. 3:13-15), so be grateful for not having that gift;
otherwise you would be guilty of intentionally blaspheming the Holy Spirit's omnilove and justness per John 3:16, 1John 4:7-12, Rom. 5:8, Matt. 5:44&48, Gal. 5:6&14, Eph. 3:17b-19, Eph. 5:2 and 1Tim. 2:3-4; 2Thes. 1:6a, cf. Rom. 3:25-26 & 9:14, Deut. 32:4, Psa. 36:6, Luke 11:42, Rev. 15:3.

GWH said:

I discern that you deny MFW rather than explain how y'all tulipists have the gift of discerning implications in Scripture.
That lack is why you will make it thru the pearly gate as your heresy is burned (1Cor. 3:13-15), so be grateful for not having that gift;
otherwise you would be guilty of intentionally blaspheming the Holy Spirit's omnilove and justness per John 3:16, 1John 4:7-12, Rom. 5:8, Matt. 5:44&48, Gal. 5:6&14, Eph. 3:17b-19, Eph. 5:2 and 1Tim. 2:3-4; 2Thes. 1:6a, cf. Rom. 3:25-26 & 9:14, Deut. 32:4, Psa. 36:6, Luke 11:42, Rev. 15:3.

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All your love‑texts — John 3:16; 1 John 4:7–12; Rom 5:8; Matt 5:44–48; Gal 5:14; Eph 3:17–19; Eph 5:2; 1 Tim 2:3–4; 2 Thess 1:6; Rom 3:25–26; Rom 9:14; Deut 32:4; Ps 36:6; Luke 11:42; Rev 15:3 — prove God’s omnilove and justness, but none of them teach that humans possess autonomous MFW; Scripture says the flesh cannot produce God‑pleasing response (Rom 8:8), cannot seek God (Rom 3:11), and faith itself is enabled by God (Phil 2:13), so your charge that rejecting autonomous MFW equals “blaspheming the Spirit’s omnilove” has no textual anchor, and 1 Cor 3:13–15 is about works, not about rejecting your model; the divide is simple — either faith is self‑generated or grace‑enabled, and the text only affirms the second.

GWH said:

I discern that you deny MFW rather than explain how y'all tulipists have the gift of discerning implications in Scripture.
That lack is why you will make it thru the pearly gate as your heresy is burned (1Cor. 3:13-15), so be grateful for not having that gift;
otherwise you would be guilty of intentionally blaspheming the Holy Spirit's omnilove and justness per John 3:16, 1John 4:7-12, Rom. 5:8, Matt. 5:44&48, Gal. 5:6&14, Eph. 3:17b-19, Eph. 5:2 and 1Tim. 2:3-4; 2Thes. 1:6a, cf. Rom. 3:25-26 & 9:14, Deut. 32:4, Psa. 36:6, Luke 11:42, Rev. 15:3.

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I disagree with you on one minor point, and you “discern” something completely unrelated about me? That is not discernment; it’s snowflake jackassery.

OMC said:

All your love‑texts — John 3:16; 1 John 4:7–12; Rom 5:8; Matt 5:44–48; Gal 5:14; Eph 3:17–19; Eph 5:2; 1 Tim 2:3–4; 2 Thess 1:6; Rom 3:25–26; Rom 9:14; Deut 32:4; Ps 36:6; Luke 11:42; Rev 15:3 — prove God’s omnilove and justness, but none of them teach that humans possess autonomous MFW; Scripture says the flesh cannot produce God‑pleasing response (Rom 8:8), cannot seek God (Rom 3:11), and faith itself is enabled by God (Phil 2:13), so your charge that rejecting autonomous MFW equals “blaspheming the Spirit’s omnilove” has no textual anchor, and 1 Cor 3:13–15 is about works, not about rejecting your model; the divide is simple — either faith is self‑generated or grace‑enabled, and the text only affirms the second.

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What I affirm:

I DO say that MFW is God-given and actualized via His commands.

MFW only exists when there is the possibility of choosing between two qualitatively opposite moral options that we call good and evil. These options are opposites because of essentially different consequences for choosing them. Choosing good results in blessing, life and heaven; and choosing evil results in cursing, death and hell (Deut. 30:19). This is why hell as well as heaven exists. It is the just consequence for choosing evil rather than God. The Spirit of God is good: love, peace and joy (Gal. 5:22-23). Therefore, whoever rejects the Lord is spiritually separated from Him (Isa. 59:2) and thereby chooses the evil or satanic spirit of hatred, strife and misery and reaps the just consequence called “hell” in the afterlife (Gal. 6:7-9, Heb. 9:27-28).

These options were illustrated by A&E as eating or not eating the forbidden fruit (Gen 3:1-5), presented by Moses to the Israelites (Deut. 30:19), and by Jesus in terms of a fish or egg versus a snake or scorpion (Luke 11:11-13). Life… or Curse? (Gen. 3:24, Rev. 22:1-2)

God created theoretical evil or the possibility of rejecting Him as an option that actualizes MFW/free human personality. As such it is necessary and even good (Gen. 1:31). Of course, it was wrong for Satan (1John 3:8) and humanity beginning with A&E (cf. Rom. 5:12) to make evil actual by choosing to Sin or reject Faith in God’s Lordship. Sin: ignoring God/God’s Word.

Other truths I affirm include:

Right reasoning is divine logic and the mind of Christ.
God is love and Spirit-filled Christians reflect divine love to the world.
God and Truth are One, so individual truths are part of the whole truth.
Enough of God's love and truth are revealed to all people in all cultures in all of the world per Rom. 1:20,
so that they are without excuse for choosing atheism/I-dolatry/tulipism.

I also affirm that God-offered grace is resistible, because God-given MFW can be wrongly used to believe/serve Satan.
Do not falsely accuse me of YOUR straw men built with imported terms such as "autonomous".

GWH said:

What I affirm:

I DO say that MFW is God-given and actualized via His commands.

MFW only exists when there is the possibility of choosing between two qualitatively opposite moral options that we call good and evil. These options are opposites because of essentially different consequences for choosing them. Choosing good results in blessing, life and heaven; and choosing evil results in cursing, death and hell (Deut. 30:19). This is why hell as well as heaven exists. It is the just consequence for choosing evil rather than God. The Spirit of God is good: love, peace and joy (Gal. 5:22-23). Therefore, whoever rejects the Lord is spiritually separated from Him (Isa. 59:2) and thereby chooses the evil or satanic spirit of hatred, strife and misery and reaps the just consequence called “hell” in the afterlife (Gal. 6:7-9, Heb. 9:27-28).

These options were illustrated by A&E as eating or not eating the forbidden fruit (Gen 3:1-5), presented by Moses to the Israelites (Deut. 30:19), and by Jesus in terms of a fish or egg versus a snake or scorpion (Luke 11:11-13). Life… or Curse? (Gen. 3:24, Rev. 22:1-2)

God created theoretical evil or the possibility of rejecting Him as an option that actualizes MFW/free human personality. As such it is necessary and even good (Gen. 1:31). Of course, it was wrong for Satan (1John 3:8) and humanity beginning with A&E (cf. Rom. 5:12) to make evil actual by choosing to Sin or reject Faith in God’s Lordship. Sin: ignoring God/God’s Word.

Other truths I affirm include:

Right reasoning is divine logic and the mind of Christ.
God is love and Spirit-filled Christians reflect divine love to the world.
God and Truth are One, so individual truths are part of the whole truth.
Enough of God's love and truth are revealed to all people in all cultures in all of the world per Rom. 1:20,
so that they are without excuse for choosing atheism/I-dolatry/tulipism.

I also affirm that God-offered grace is resistible, because God-given MFW can be wrongly used to believe/serve Satan.
Do not falsely accuse me of YOUR straw men built with imported terms such as "autonomous".

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either faith is self‑generated or grace‑enabled, which is it? If grace‑enabled then we agree.